What is the purpose of Grace?

[amigo de christo]

It doesn't always come from a pure heart. It can come from the flesh too......motives need to be sifted and sanctified/purified.

notice the words special dispensation .
And now a w ord
How often i have heard words of the like
and always under a banner of higher learning , special knowledge
ONLY TO FIND OUT it was all but a highly deceptive lie
that only exalted the pride in oneself and utter rebellion to GOD , HIS CHRIST , HIS words
of Truth which do so easily expose this so called higher Learning and higher walk .

 

[shepherdsword]

And i beheld A harlot who sat over many waters and by her cup had filled rebellion
and fornication to the full upon the nations , tribes , false religions and even much of christendom .
And unto all who did drink they saw her cup as a cup of the time of love and of merger as one .
IT is but a delusion sister that must and shall run its course and all who are not in the lambs book of life
will surley drink of her cup .

The harlot is not just the RCC... it also includes many protestant churches as well.

 

[Lizbeth]

Do you think your walk with God is deeper and more intimate that any of the mystics you criticize?

This was your only answer to my question and post, which didn't address my question but was a way of jumping down my throat in defense of something. If you agreed in principle with what I wrote you failed to say so for some reason. I wasn't criticizing "the mystics" not knowing enough about them whether to critique them or not. I was simply asking and laying out my concern. And now you are wrongly assuming that I am judging and condemning the souls who are held captive by the RCC. I judge them to be in error, but only God is worthy and equipped to judge each soul in the ultimate sense.

Episkopos and his followers have all exposed themselves as humanistic, self righteous, virtue signalling and proud. Well, I've seen enough now, the conclusion of the matter as far as I'm concerned, and I'm sorry for you all...you are going down a wrong path.....humanism.

 

[Lizbeth]

The harlot is not just the RCC... it also includes many protestant churches as well.

How many times do we have to say so? But the RCC is head of them all. They are having more and more in common with HER.

And I will add she is ACTIVELY engaged in trying to recruit the protestant realm back under her rule.

 

[shepherdsword]

This was your only answer to my question and post, which didn't address my question but was a way of jumping down my throat in defense of something. If you agreed in principle with what I wrote you failed to say so for some reason. I wasn't criticizing "the mystics" not knowing enough about them whether to critique them or not. I was simply asking and laying out my concern. And now you are wrongly accusing me of judging and condemning the souls who are held captive by the RCC.

You have a way of demanding answers to your questions while you dodge mine. I am not "jumping down your throat" I am just making an observation.

Episkopos and his followers have all exposed themselves as humanistic, self righteous, virtue signalling and proud. Well, I've seen enough now, the conclusion of the matter as far as I'm concerned, and I'm sorry for you all...you are going down a wrong path.....humanism.

I don't "follow" Epi. However, I do think that he issues some warnings that should be heeded. As far as your "humanism" label goes...you need to study up a bit more on it's definition.

 

[Lizbeth]

You have a way of demanding answers to your questions while you dodge mine. I am not "jumping down your throat" I am just making an observation.

I don't "follow" Epi. However, I do think that he issues some warnings that should be heeded. As far as your "humanism" label goes...you need to study up a bit more on it's definition. View attachment 89163

I'm talking about religious humanism, or perhaps we would call it humanistic religion....under a Christian banner, in Christian guise. It thinks it knows better than the Lord God Almighty.

You may be more like Epi and his followers than you realize. I would not be drinking from this fountain if I were you. Way too much MIXTURE here. Unclean in other words. Talking about mechanical thinking........he is always dividing and chopping up things that need to remain whole in my view. That is not in the same vein as Jesus or the apostles.

 

[Lizbeth]

I remember, a few years after my conversion, I had the desire to go into a monastery, just to be alone with God trying to find out what happened to me. Of course I could not, I was married in the between time and we had our first daughter. So I do understand the spiritual need and I won't judge people who have that need. But like you said yourself, be careful.

God bless you sis.

I have a hunch that it is God's good wisdom that we encounter all the things that we encounter in living this life, that one wouldn't have to encounter ensconced in a monastery or convent. We learn so much and are changed by the challenges of life and things we go through, even or sometimes maybe especially, by the mistakes that we make as well.

 

[amigo de christo]

The harlot is not just the RCC... it also includes many protestant churches as well.

oh i know . And now in this late and last hour
she has brought her inclusive solution by which to unite AS ONE mind and ONE HEART
ALL of the decieved within christendom as well as the false relgions .
And all merged as one under her inclusive god satan . The deceptoins of the many
Have led them NOW to the final solution by which all shall unite under one common love and one common god
and one common peace plan . And all of it OF satan who has prepared them all
unto the beast who by means of a highliy powerful AI digital system
WILL rage war against the few true saints WHO WOULD NOT conform to the image of its inclusive god .
YEAH many are being duped real bad now .

 

[amigo de christo]

How many times do we have to say so? But the RCC is head of them all. They are having more and more in common with HER.

And I will add she is ACTIVELY engaged in trying to recruit the protestant realm back under her rule.

they know not nor do they understand that the very inclusivism more and more cling too
CAME OF THE HARLOT . And she has spread this net far and wide and with many
slightely differeing webs by which to captivate each one .
Many who often war against what they THINK is the one world govt and one world religoin
HAVE NO idea SHE HAS THEM ALREADY under her spell as well .
The spell of doctrine dont matter , let just love and unite and find and have our common ground .
And all of it , A d elusion , and all of it is the snare . And it will take ever last soul
not in the lambs book of life , TO the very one lie they shall indeed agree upon as one mind and one heart .
AND if ya said it has to do with HAVING to bELIEVE ON JESUS , YEP . THAT BE THE ONE
they ARE OMITTING to have to BELIEVE IN ..........
And that is YOUR LIE right there . we got some teaching pikcing up crosses without BELIEF
to others preaching ecumeincalism , to others still reaching their group in its own way .
BUT THE LIE IS THE SAME . HAS GOD really said YE MUST BELIEVE ON CHRIST JESUS ......................
NAY NAY it says SURELY ye dont have to beleive .............IT says ........
ONLY I DONT HEED IT . I HEED GOD and HIS CHRIST the SAVOIR of the world
WHO SAID YE HAD TO BELIEVE ON HIM . cause HE speaks TRUTH . The devil is a liar .

 

[Episkopos]

I'm talking about religious humanism, or perhaps we would call it humanistic religion....under a Christian banner, in Christian guise. It thinks it knows better than the Lord God Almighty.

A lot of weeds growing here in my short absence.

A lack of humanity is not godly. It's about loving others as oneself. It's about having mercy on those whom God shows very CLEARLY are objects of His mercy...namely the meek and pure-hearted. Because you have no room for mercy in all your self-seeking, it just SEEMS like people who realize that God wants mercy and not sacrifice...are being unbalanced...whereas the unbalance lies with the religious bigotry that is being promoted by self-seekers. In order to FEEL saved some will feel the need to condemn others...in a blanket way. There are 1.2 billion Catholics...and you are other theorists want to consign them all to hell? Meanwhile Stalin only condemned 100 million or so. Jesus didn't die for just Protestants....in fact the reformation brought an affront to the truth in many ways. Thousands of private interpretations that are not grounded in Christ. The solution to understand what I teach is to go to God and receive Christ.

You may be more like Epi and his followers than you realize.

I am a follower of Christ. And there is a unity of the Holy Spirit in those who love God and the truth. What you feel is just a human indignation...the kind that made Caiphas the high priest rip his garment. Was such a deep emotion the Holy Spirit? Well, to a religious pretender any and all emotions are attributable to a spirit..just not the Holy Spirit.

I would not be drinking from this fountain if I were you. Way too much MIXTURE here.

People who RIGHTLY divide the word arrive at the truth. Separating what if of the soul from the Spirit. Separating what is of the ego (self-seeking) and what God requires.

Unclean in other words.

You are in no position to determine what is clean and what is filthy, or what is of a pure heart and what is deceitful.

Talking about mechanical thinking........he is always dividing and chopping up things that need to remain whole in my view. That is not in the same vein as Jesus or the apostles.

Remaining whole is not by the covenant of God. One CUTS a covenant with God. You resist the Covenant and dilute the word that is meant to cut through the flesh as a sharp double edged sword. It's better to be cut (circumcised) and be separated from the flesh than be whole and be cast into the lake of fire. But that SOUNDS to you and others here as being unnecessary or even something to treat as being hostile to the feel-good theories you think are saving you. The truth goes directly against the overly humanistic views you hold. And this is by design. If it's for you you embrace humanism....if it's for others the same mercy you expect for yourself is non existent for others.

The power of the cross brings salvation to those who allow God to cut the sin nature from them. The cross is not a defense of the flesh....of those who want to enter the kingdom in their fallen state....flesh and all. Repent from your filthiness and be cleansed by allowing God's word to be received without the self-interest and obfuscations.

 

[Lizbeth]

They fought from the inside by keeping a holy walk and godly testimony that those around her would have missed if she walked out

Who is jumping down your throat?

I agree that the RCC is a Babylonian idol. I am just not prepared to damn everyone to hell that is trapped by her.

Why do so many think they have the ability to determine who is saved and who is not? I would be careful about that.

I follow the Lord Jesus Christ.

Now answer my question...do you think you are closer to God than Guyon? Don't evade it...yes or no

Why are you assuming that I am determining who is saved and who is not? (Other than salvation is only by faith in Christ....I do not believe that anyone who doesn't know the Lord is saved. ) Do you think I believe that Guyon was not saved? The poem she wrote while in the dungeon struck me in a way that convinced me that she was walking in victory, so I think she knew the Lord. But that doesn't mean I would sit at her feet and imbibe everything she was teaching. I dont' agree with the "quietism" part, what I know of it....we are to be led by the Spirit in prayer and often there may be fertile times of quietly waiting on the Lord in His presence and focused on Him. But I dont' believe in "methods" or formulas or rituals because the Spirit blows where it willeth. People go astray following other people.....because no person is perfect in their knowledge and understanding at best to start with, at least not since the apostles, and also spiritual experience is not necessarily a qualification or spiritual gift to teach.

I already told you I'm not going down a road of comparing myself to someone else. Your question is inappropriate. Think it's okay as a rhetorical question if you are trying to make a point, but it's unseemly and inappropriate to insist on an answer to that kind of question.

 

[Lizbeth]

A lot of weeds growing here in my short absence.

A lack of humanity is not godly. It's about loving others as oneself. It's about having mercy on those whom God shows very CLEARLY are objects of His mercy...namely the meek and pure-hearted. Because you have no room for mercy in all your self-seeking, it just SEEMS like people who realize that God wants mercy and not sacrifice...are being unbalanced...whereas the unbalance lies with the religious bigotry that is being promoted by self-seekers. In order to FEEL saved some will feel the need to condemn others...in a blanket way. There are 1.2 billion Catholics...and you are other theorists want to consign them all to hell? Meanwhile Stalin only condemned 100 million or so. Jesus didn't die for just Protestants....in fact the reformation brought an affront to the truth in many ways. Thousands of private interpretations that are not grounded in Christ. The solution to understand what I teach is to go to God and receive Christ.


I am a follower of Christ. And there is a unity of the Holy Spirit in those who love God and the truth. What you feel is just a human indignation...the kind that made Caiphas the high priest rip his garment. Was such a deep emotion the Holy Spirit. Well, to a religious pretender any and all emotions are attributable to a spirit..just not the Holy Spirit.


People who RIGHTLY divide the word arrive at the truth. Separating what if of the soul from the Spirit. Separating what is of the ego (self-seeking) and what God requires.

You are in no position to determine what is clean and what is filthy, or what is of a pure heart and what is deceitful.

Remaining whole is not by the covenant of God. One CUTS a covenant with God. You resist the Covenant and dilute the word that is meant to cut through the flesh as a sharp double edged sword. It's better to be cut (circumcised) and be separated from the flesh than be whole and be cast into the lake of fire. But that SOUNDS to you and others here as being unnecessary or even something to treat as being hostile to the feel-good theories you think are saving you. The truth goes directly against the overly humanistic views you hold. And this is by design. If it's for you you embrace humanism....if it's for others the same mercy you expect for yourself is non existent for others.

The power of the cross brings salvation to those who allow God to cut the sin nature from them. The cross is not a defense of the flesh....of those who want to enter the kingdom is their fallen state....flesh and all. Repent from your filthiness and be cleansed by allowing God's word to be received without the self-interest and obfuscations.

And you are the judge of who is humble, meek and righteous are you..? By what measure?.......by your own measure of outward impressions, goosebumps and emotions? That is humanistic. Me I just believe, and have grown to understand, what the bible says about fallen humanity......and I was once one of them. The heart is deceitfully wicked, who can know it? GOD knows it. The humble meek and righteous are those who receive Christ when He comes calling....He will reckon them so, both the good and bad who receive Him. All who are foreknown by Him and appointed to eternal life will believe and be saved through faith, not apart from it.

The rain falls on the just and the unjust alike, we are to be merciful to all. But sadly that doesn't mean all will inherit eternal life.

 

[Triumph1300]

ProDeo it has nothing to do with the subject of this thread, but I saw this on the internet.
This is in your town, I thought you might be interested.

 

[marks]

I hope everyone will guard their hearts. It is troubling to me when I see precious holy things being talked about as casually as one would discuss and pick apart the workings of their new car. And people who are holy don't boast in their experiences, they step away and let the Lord receive all the glory. They let the fruits speak for themselves, and let God confirm them, not the people themselves......

Thank you for speaking this so clearly!

Much love!

 

[ProDeo]

ProDeo it has nothing to do with the subject of this thread, but I saw this on the internet.
This is in your town, I thought you might be interested.View attachment 89173

Thank you my friend

 

[Laurina]

AND in the case of an anointing in power, a SUBMERSION (baptism) into grace by the spirit. This anointing DRAWS out the life that is in the inner man when we are first baptized in the Spirit.


Being FILLED with the Spirit is like a river of life flowing outward from the source within us, Christ in us. Christ in the empowered inner man. Sin isn't possible in this case. It's like a flowing river. You can't introduce anything into a hose that is under pressure...the water gushes out. So no sin can enter in as long as the flow (blood of Christ) continues. And this power is by the cross of Christ that keeps the outer man sin nature out of the way...so that nothing in us is a source of sin. We are back like Adam in the garden. We follow God by faith and our will to obey Him alone. The magnetic power that keeps us stuck fast to Christ is the power of the cross...that separates us from the world in order to cleave to God.

This is excellent! I have experienced this to a smaller degree but am watching and praying for a full infusion. It cost all but the return is well worth it. The refreshing coolness of God's presence is all we need.

(have to put a scriptural reference for those with a mechanical understanding)

Jn 7:37-38
If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink. He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.

You "have" to put a scriptural reference for those with a "mechanical" understanding......?

I understood why he said this. You didn't? It was bdavidc who keeps asking (insisting) for scriptural references. You'd think on a Christian site that people would know their bibles so that you wouldn't need the references, but that is not always the case. And, sometimes, a new perspective is opened up to some because of scripture they hadn't considered!

David being a man after God's own heart CHERISHED the word of God. And God Himself esteems His word over all His name.

Who's NOT cherishing the word of God??
And being a man after God's heart, David's words were added to (are a part of) scripture. I'm speaking of the Psalms...I love how David shared his heart, definitely one of my favorite books.

I hope everyone will guard their hearts.

From....all the negativity that is spoken here?? Yeah, "Christian" behavior isn't so Christ-like is it? Too much judging and not enough loving...love is what again......???? (See 1 Corinthians 13:4-7)

It is troubling to me when I see precious holy things being talked about as casually as one would discuss and pick apart the workings of their new car.

Would this opinion not be through the eyes of the reader? Why would you say they are casually spoken of? Are you not interested in the workings of God's ways? Why are you on this particular thread if it's not to understand holiness, (why you claim to follow Epi around). Have you not considered that the problem could be in your own heart?
Titus 1:5
"Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled."

And people who are holy don't boast in their experiences, they step away and let the Lord receive all the glory.

We are participating on (in) a Christian forum. Everyone has a testimony. IF or WHEN a testimony is shared, WHY would YOU call that boasting?? The whole new testament is made up of people's testimonies! It's stories of their experiences of Jesus Christ in or touching their lives. WHAT is your problem with that? How do you NOT SEE that God IS getting the glory?? It's HIS work in the people's lives. People wouldn't have these testimonies WITHOUT GOD! It is GOD'S WORK and to HIM BE THE GLORY!

They let the fruits speak for themselves, and let God confirm them, not the people themselves.

IF people didn't speak (fruit), this wouldn't be much of a forum.

.....see how Jesus spoke of Himself in John 5.

There is more than one perspective in John 5. There are as many perspectives as there are people in the story (the narrator, the impotent man who was healed, Jesus, the Jews, and God the Father through Jesus). What perspective grabs your eye? What perspective do you relate to??

I've seen this sort of thing before and know it to be a wrong way....I was going down that road once and found myself missing JESUS, because He WASN'T IN IT.

What sort of thing?? What is wrong for one person is not necessarily wrong for another. IF it is wrong for YOU, then DON'T do (participate in) it, because it would be wrong.

Oftentimes a change of heart is the difference between right and wrong.

One must ALWAYS SEEK THE LORD. (And btw, this has ALWAYS been Episkopos' message from the beginning. SEEK THE LORD, SEEK HIS FACE. Epi's message has NEVER changed.)

If something is from God it will be in SPIRIT.

Yes, but (I know you love "yes, but's" ;) ) then there's the question of discernment. Who has discernment? It's a spiritual gift.

That is the only difference between the real and the counterfeit. The real things are in Spirit, the counterfeit is those very same things being in the flesh.

Well, there are all sorts of spirits, that's why we say "holy spirit" because there are others that are not holy (deceiving, evil,....).

We are not to touch the holy things (ark) with hands of flesh.

Agreed

 

[amigo de christo]

And you are the judge of who is humble, meek and righteous are you..? By what measure?.......by your own measure of outward impressions, goosebumps and emotions? That is humanistic. Me I just believe, and have grown to understand, what the bible says about fallen humanity......and I was once one of them. The heart is deceitfully wicked, who can know it? GOD knows it. The humble meek and righteous are those who receive Christ when He comes calling....He will reckon them so, both the good and bad who receive Him. All who are foreknown by Him and appointed to eternal life will believe and be saved through faith, not apart from it.

The rain falls on the just and the unjust alike, we are to be merciful to all. But sadly that doesn't mean all will inherit eternal life.

keep in mind that are some here who have never repented of this gospel of UNBELEIF IN JESUS .
For if even I myself , any other , even an angel preaches any other gospel unto you THAN THE ONE LEFT US IN SCRIPTURE ,
let them be accursed . That would include even myself if i were to preach another gospel sister .
KEEP that in mind . Because as i said , I NEVER once seen one repent of that other gospel sister . But
can still use certain truths and appearances of holiness .

 

[Lizbeth]

I understood why he said this. You didn't? It was bdavidc who keeps asking (insisting) for scriptural references. You'd think on a Christian site that people would know their bibles so that you wouldn't need the references, but that is not always the case. And, sometimes, a new perspective is opened up to some because of scripture they hadn't considered!

It was patronizing and unnecessary to say what he said. The message that came across loud and clear was that if you need to have the scripture posted you must be "lesser than". Not to mention sounding like it is too menial and boring to "have" to post scripture for the benefit of anyone. And wanting to know the scriptures that someone is basing their post or comments is not a sign that someone is engaged in mechanical/carnal thinking.

I'm not going to get into dissecting and explaining with the rest. It's kind of like with the telling of a joke, if you try to explain it, it takes away the punch. Suffice to say that some things people do or say can be vanity, in both senses of the word.

 

[amigo de christo]

It was patronizing and unnecessary to say what he said. The message that came across loud and clear was that if you need to have the scripture posted you must be "lesser than". Not to mention sounding like it is too menial and boring to "have" to post scripture for the benefit of anyone. And wanting to know the scriptures that someone is basing their post or comments is not a sign that someone is engaged in mechanical/carnal thinking.

I'm not going to get into dissecting and explaining with the rest. It's kind of like with the telling of a joke, if you try to explain it, it takes away the punch. Suffice to say that some things people do or say can be vanity, in both senses of the word.

you ever notice what one used to do to a certain sister of ours every TIME she simply brought the scriptures .
THERE is a reason as to why some do as they do . The scrips would expose what they do .
Thus in order to make it seem as what they do is correct they can often use excuses such as these .
TRUTH . THE TRUTH IS the SCRIPTURES easily expose what SOME who puttey HIC are really doing sister .
Its why such excuses are often made . They aint fooling the sheep sister .
BECAUSE JESUS HAS HIS SHEEP and his words BE OUR MEAT . HIC is NOT OF HIM nor DO IT GLORIFY HIM for all
that HE DID . UNBELIF will never give the SON , nor the FATHER THE GLORY .
And i sure see a lot of UNBELIEF being sold by HIC .

 

[amigo de christo]

It was patronizing and unnecessary to say what he said. The message that came across loud and clear was that if you need to have the scripture posted you must be "lesser than". Not to mention sounding like it is too menial and boring to "have" to post scripture for the benefit of anyone. And wanting to know the scriptures that someone is basing their post or comments is not a sign that someone is engaged in mechanical/carnal thinking.

I'm not going to get into dissecting and explaining with the rest. It's kind of like with the telling of a joke, if you try to explain it, it takes away the punch. Suffice to say that some things people do or say can be vanity, in both senses of the word.

to some here sister ..........
to some here , they see us as the weeds , as the crows , as the t ares .
the inclusive god is leading them by many diverse and differing ways to the same conclusion .
That conclusion is UNBELEIF IN JESUS IS OKAY and that anyone who reminds of the absolute dire necessity
for to beleive on HIM , IS ONLY IN THE WAY of their peace . And in their hearts the darkness will only grow sister
until it leads them to the only possible solution for to attain peace n safety on earth .
ANY GUESSES , my near and dear sister , on what that solution WILL BE .
TO RID THE EARTH OF ALL who conformed not to the image of their all inclusive god .
Might seem hard to beleive , but sister , BELIEVE IT . tribulations and persecutions are not at all new
to the saints . And often there have been times of greater persecutions .
THIS PERSEcUTION will be greater than has any tribulation ever been at any hour during all ages
since the birth of the true church . THEY GONNA BLEIEVE sister and when i say
BELIEVE i mean Beleive they do GODS WILL when saints are rounded up and even killed .
But woe unto them . FOR though it is true that many saints will be killed
and while it is true these inclusivians who bowed the knee to the all inclusiv e god
WILL seem to have it easy in this life , WAIT TILL JESUS DAY when the TABLE GETS FLIPPED OVER
and its they who scatter for the hills . NOW seeing i dont desire their destruction
THAT IS WHY I AM reminding all , OF THE ABSOLUTE DIRE NEED TO BELEIVE ON JESUS and then teach all things HE DID teach .