"Raise the dead"

[VictoryinJesus]

Matthew 25:43 KJV
[43] I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.


Luke 7:20-23 KJV
[20] When the men were come unto him, they said, John Baptist hath sent us unto thee, saying, Art thou he that should come? or look we for another? [21] And in that same hour he cured many of their infirmities and plagues, and of evil spirits; and unto many that were blind he gave sight. [22] Then Jesus answering said unto them, Go your way, and tell John what things ye have seen and heard; how that the blind see, the lame walk, the lepers are cleansed, the deaf hear, the dead are raised, to the poor the gospel is preached. [23] And blessed is he , whosoever shall not be offended in me.

Why did Jesus not do the work of going to visit John in prison?

I am just now learning what "apologetics" mean. State what you believe and then defend it. Christ words were about the Spiritual and not the physical. Jesus' miracles demonstrated His deity through signs of the physical which were put on display in the visible.

Christ ministry was not about the physical prison John was held in.Every promise the Lord made He has kept:

When someone is drawn to Salvation and life in Christ: the dead are raised. When someone hears God speak: the deaf hear. When some one sees the light of truth: the blind see. When a non-believer is converted and translated into the Kingdom of God: the sick(wounded) are healed.The lame walk. The dumb speak.Those captive and in prison are set free.

Acts 26:8 KJV
[8] Why should it be thought a thing incredible with you, that God should raise the dead?

It happens every day.
The dead are raised.
The blind receive sight.
The deaf hear.
The dumb speak.
The naked are clothed with righteousness. The hungry are fed. The fearful (like Legion) receive a sound mind. We walk by faith and not by sight. It is spiritual. To say these promises do not happen every single day and give God the glory, is to focus on the physical and not what is unseen.The flesh is offended and we doubt. It is a lie. We walk by faith, not by sight.

Matthew 11:5-6 KJV
[5] The blind receive their sight, and the lame walk, the lepers are cleansed, and the deaf hear, the dead are raised up, and the poor have the gospel preached to them. [6] And blessed is he , whosoever shall not be offended in me.

 

[bbyrd009]

nice!

I am just now learning what "apologetics" mean. State what you believe and then defend it.

understand that this is unscriptural, ok, no where in Scripture are you called to defend your faith to strangers, that is not who you even have available to "witness" to, even if you wanted to for some odd reason

 

[BreadOfLife]

nice!
understand that this is unscriptural, ok, no where in Scripture are you called to defend your faith to strangers, that is not who you even have available to "witness" to, even if you wanted to for some odd reason

Wrong.

We read the Greek term, "Apologia" in 1 Pet. 3:15 . . .
Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have.

That's where we get the word "Apologetics".

 

[bbyrd009]

so, i'm not denying that there won't be occasions in which a stranger might ask you--well one, prolly not you i guess--why you have apparently chosen to hate your life, ok, and you might prepare the ground, plant a seed, or even water a seed, but you give a prepared defense to ppl who have called you to account, and this obviously is not strangers, 36Your enemies will be right in your own household!' which should prolly be expanded to what we would call peer group today, your familiars iow, which may also excuse you, dunno there

i say not you bc i'm not sure that Catholics even believe this, you guys seek enemies without, i guess?
Which will necessarily cause an apologetics model to arise, i guess
that most Protestants maybe also pile in with, don't get me wrong,
oppressing Muslims is a profitable and enjoyable pastime for most Christians too right
but i guess you won't find too many pastors who passed on the Contract for Jesus teaching Apologetics i bet

 

[DPMartin]

Matthew 25:43 KJV
[43] I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.


Luke 7:20-23 KJV
[20] When the men were come unto him, they said, John Baptist hath sent us unto thee, saying, Art thou he that should come? or look we for another? [21] And in that same hour he cured many of their infirmities and plagues, and of evil spirits; and unto many that were blind he gave sight. [22] Then Jesus answering said unto them, Go your way, and tell John what things ye have seen and heard; how that the blind see, the lame walk, the lepers are cleansed, the deaf hear, the dead are raised, to the poor the gospel is preached. [23] And blessed is he , whosoever shall not be offended in me.

Why did Jesus not do the work of going to visit John in prison?

I am just now learning what "apologetics" mean. State what you believe and then defend it. Christ words were about the Spiritual and not the physical. Jesus' miracles demonstrated His deity through signs of the physical which were put on display in the visible.

Christ ministry was not about the physical prison John was held in.Every promise the Lord made He has kept:

When someone is drawn to Salvation and life in Christ: the dead are raised. When someone hears God speak: the deaf hear. When some one sees the light of truth: the blind see. When a non-believer is converted and translated into the Kingdom of God: the sick(wounded) are healed.The lame walk. The dumb speak.Those captive and in prison are set free.

Acts 26:8 KJV
[8] Why should it be thought a thing incredible with you, that God should raise the dead?

It happens every day.
The dead are raised.
The blind receive sight.
The deaf hear.
The dumb speak.
The naked are clothed with righteousness. The hungry are fed. The fearful (like Legion) receive a sound mind. We walk by faith and not by sight. It is spiritual. To say these promises do not happen every single day and give God the glory, is to focus on the physical and not what is unseen.The flesh is offended and we doubt. It is a lie. We walk by faith, not by sight.

Matthew 11:5-6 KJV
[5] The blind receive their sight, and the lame walk, the lepers are cleansed, and the deaf hear, the dead are raised up, and the poor have the gospel preached to them. [6] And blessed is he , whosoever shall not be offended in me.

you are on the right track when you look to the Lord as speaking spiritually.

even when James quotes the OT here talking about religion:

Jas_1:27 Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.
Deu_10:18 He doth execute the judgment of the fatherless and widow, and loveth the stranger, in giving him food and raiment.
Deu_27:19 Cursed be he that perverteth the judgment of the stranger, fatherless, and widow. And all the people shall say, Amen.



the Lord mentions His Judgements on the matter at least 11 times in Deuteronomy and rest assured this is good, but is it what man thinks it to be? the US is run by secular rule and it feeds houses and provides healthcare to the poor. that makes it up-right in behavior but not a proof of God is with them.

so, if one looks at what the Lord says here in spiritual terms, who is the fatherless but those without God the Father and who is the widow but one who is betrothed or married to death and not Christ. and who are the poor but the poor in Spirit.

though in the world in worldly terms yes its true, but in spiritual terms in relationship to the Kingdom of Heaven it is also true.

consider just what Jesus meant by "feed my sheep" when He said it to Peter on the beach after His resurrection. and also when Jesus made comment about those who grouped around Him after He feed the thousands that He perceived they sot more free meals. feed the belly and its hungry again tomorrow, feed the soul with the Bread of Life and the cup runeth over.

 

[amadeus]

nice!
understand that this is unscriptural, ok, no where in Scripture are you called to defend your faith to strangers, that is not who you even have available to "witness" to, even if you wanted to for some odd reason

In addition to the verse our friend, @BreadOfLife so kindly provided, consider another very commonly quoted verse:

"Thou preparest a table before me in the presence of mine enemies: thou anointest my head with oil; my cup runneth over." Psalm 23:5

The cup running over is speaking I believe of that which Jesus spoke here:

"The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly." John 10:10

Not only did He bring us Life, but he brought it "more abundantly". Even as David spoke of having enough for self and enough share with others Jesus spoke of the same thing. Our defense does not need to be purposely prepared in order to defend, but in our preparation to be like Him, we are preparing or being prepared to defend as Jesus defended. Jesus did not really look for people to attack with his words, but he was always fully prepared to defend when someone attacked His Father. The preparation of such a defense is certainly scriptural even if not spelled more literally than that.

Has no one ever heard the expression: soldiers of Christ? Likely it is NOT to be found in the scriptures, but what are the following verses telling us to do?

"Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil.
For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand.
Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness;
And your feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace;
Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked.
And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God:
Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints;" Eph 6:11-18

 

[BreadOfLife]

so, i'm not denying that there won't be occasions in which a stranger might ask you--well one, prolly not you i guess--why you have apparently chosen to hate your life, ok, and you might prepare the ground, plant a seed, or even water a seed, but you give a prepared defense to ppl who have called you to account, and this obviously is not strangers, 36Your enemies will be right in your own household!' which should prolly be expanded to what we would call peer group today, your familiars iow, which may also excuse you, dunno there

i say not you bc i'm not sure that Catholics even believe this, you guys seek enemies without, i guess?
Which will necessarily cause an apologetics model to arise, i guess
that most Protestants maybe also pile in with, don't get me wrong,
oppressing Muslims is a profitable and enjoyable pastime for most Christians too right
but i guess you won't find too many pastors who passed on the Contract for Jesus teaching Apologetics i bet

After reading this nonsense it is glaringly apparent that you don't even understand what Apologetics is.
That's why you claim that it is an "unbiblical" practice.

I suggest you study Scripture a little harder . . .

 

[bbyrd009]

After reading this nonsense it is glaringly apparent that you don't even understand what Apologetics is.
That's why you claim that it is an "unbiblical" practice.

I suggest you study Scripture a little harder . . .

ah, you have me confused, i am not claiming anything. i have posted the Hermen thingy twice, maybe three times, and all you got is blather, let's tell it right k. You got nothin, zip, zero, nada, except a bloodthirsty pope assuring "Christian Soldiers" that they need to Fight Satan, and it's obvious bc you would have covered the page in bad translations and ignorant interpretations by now if you did have something, right, i mean c'mon, you don't have to lie to kick it bro, you paid to be here lol i already know

 

[BreadOfLife]

ah, you have me confused, i am not claiming anything. i have posted the Hermen thingy twice, maybe three times, and all you got is blather, let's tell it right k. You got nothin, zip, zero, nada, except a bloodthirsty pope assuring "Christian Soldiers" that they need to Fight Satan, and it's obvious bc you would have covered the page in bad translations and ignorant interpretations by now if you did have something, right, i mean c'mon, you don't have to lie to kick it bro, you paid to be here lol i already know

Thank you for that insane rant.
Didn't YOU say, in post #2 that apologetics was "unscriptural"??

"understand that this is unscriptural, ok, no where in Scripture are you called to defend your faith to strangers, that is not who you even have available to "witness" to, even if you wanted to for some odd reason"

Hmmmm, I thought that was you . . .

 

[bbyrd009]

Didn't YOU say, in post #2 that apologetics was "unscriptural"?

ya, gotta stand by that for now, might change tho, dunno.

Strikes me as satanic, from where i'm at right now tho, yes. Apologetics is sin, imo
if God can be made logical to someone, they have not found God at all

 

[101G]

Addressing the OP

Why did Jesus not do the work of going to visit John in prison? ........ Christ ministry was not about the physical prison John was held in

you're correct, there are many prisons, many just don't have iron bars.

Peace in Christ Yeshua.

 

[BreadOfLife]

ya, gotta stand by that for now, might change tho, dunno.

Strikes me as satanic, from where i'm at right now tho, yes. Apologetics is sin, imo
if God can be made logical to someone, they have not found God at all

Then Sacred Scripture is "Satanic" to you??
Good luck trying to convince the Author of that . . .

 

[aspen]

Apologetics seems devisive if it values doctrine over the people it is supposed to be freeing. Presented by an ass, it is more than likely received as loud, powerless, self serving, braying.

 

[Helen]

Apologetics seems devisive if it values doctrine over the people it is supposed to be freeing. Presented by an ass, it is more than liking received as loud, powerless, self serving braying.

As soon as "religious doctrine" is involved I run a mile!

I hate legalism ...anyone who says " This is what I believe is true"
Or -" this is what I believe God has shown me in my studies..."
I am interested. As soon as it becomes:- " This is what this only is what this really means" I then back up three paces!!

 

[BreadOfLife]

Apologetics seems devisive if it values doctrine over the people it is supposed to be freeing. Presented by an ass, it is more than liking received as loud, powerless, self serving braying.

As soon as "religious doctrine" is involved I run a mile!

I hate legalism ...anyone who says " This is what I believe is true"
Or -" this is what I believe God has shown me in my studies..."
I am interested. As soon as it becomes:- " This is what this only is what this really means" I then back up three paces!!

Sooooo, you guys think that doctrine is useless??

The doctrine of the Trinity is useless??
The doctrine of the deity of Christ is useless??
The doctrine of the omniscience of God is useless??
The doctrine of the inerrancy of Scripture is useless??
The doctrine of Ex Nihilo (creation out of nothing) is useless??
The doctrine of Virgin Birth is useless??

These and many more are essential Christian doctrines and precepts.
You both use "legalism" and "doctrine incorrectly . . .

 

[aspen]

Sooooo, you guys think that doctrine is useless??

The doctrine of the Trinity is useless??
The doctrine of the deity of Christ is useless??
The doctrine of the omniscience of God is useless??
The doctrine of the inerrancy of Scripture is useless??
The doctrine of Ex Nihilo (creation out of nothing) is useless??
The doctrine of Virgin Birth is useless??

These and many more are essential Christian doctrines and precepts.
You both use "legalism" and "doctrine incorrectly . . .

Of course it is useless if it is reduced to words, which are only pronounced to defend and support ego. Completely useless. Shouting down people is counterproductive

 

[BreadOfLife]

Of course it is useless if it is reduced to words, which are only pronounced to defend and support ego. Completely useless. Shouting down people is counterproductive

Who is "shouting down" anybody over doctrine??

Forums like this are places for people to discuss the very things you abhor. The only thing that is "useless" is for a person like YOU to hang out in a place that offends him so much.

Here's a little advice: Maybe a discussion forum isn't the best place for you to be spending your time . . .

 

[aspen]

Who is "shouting down" anybody over doctrine??

Self absorb much?

Forums like this are places for people to discuss the very things you abhor.

Like?

The only thing that is "useless" is for a person like YOU to hang out in a place that offends him so much.

What am I like?

Here's a little advice: Maybe a discussion forum isn't the best place for you to be spending your time . . .

You’re funny

 

[bbyrd009]

As soon as "religious doctrine" is involved I run a mile!

I hate legalism ...anyone who says " This is what I believe is true"
Or -" this is what I believe God has shown me in my studies..."
I am interested. As soon as it becomes:- " This is what this only is what this really means" I then back up three paces!!

i was struck by the "fourth stage civilization" thing, where "beliefs are not taken into account" or whatever, in connection here. The "1" is really a 4 onsite, i don't feel like fixing it

1. The fourth stage of natural state formation is like the third with as main distinction that it has no central government. The citizens of a fourth stage state operate by means of a shared conviction. The actions and development of a fourth-stage state are not culled by the opinions or visions of a single governing body but are rather cultivated by a defining constitution much like the DNA of a multi-cellular organism. Among animals fourth stage states are common: bees and ants and the likes operate like that (like a "super-organism"), and in the human world perhaps the international "science-world" could be viewed as a fourth stage state (not based on what it knows but on how it works), and nowadays, of course, the Internet and most spectacularly blockchain technology. In literature this stage is celebrated as the Body of Christ, a.k.a. Ecclesia, or the New Jerusalem, obviously not to be confused with any formal church or religion. A fourth stage state can only be sustained when it is based on natural law; a law that doesn't change and is not affected by anybody's beliefs.

The amazing name Abraham: meaning and etymology

 

[bbyrd009]

Sooooo, you guys think that doctrine is useless?

ah, no, way worse than that, misdefined

The doctrine of the Trinity is useless??
The doctrine of the deity of Christ is useless??
The doctrine of the omniscience of God is useless??
The doctrine of the inerrancy of Scripture is useless??
The doctrine of Ex Nihilo (creation out of nothing) is useless??
The doctrine of Virgin Birth is useless??

These and many more are essential Christian doctrines and precepts.
You both use "legalism" and "doctrine incorrectly . . .

or someone does, ya; see, Paul's definition of doctrine is just not your definition of doctrine, he did not mean "laws that i have my wife needlepoint up and put in a frame, after the church has made them mando beliefs."

The doctrine of the deity of Christ is
fine in principle, but made into a bludgeon to DQ any seeker who does not conform to the lexicon, see, just like you are doing right now, "you can't be seeking Christ because you are not saying it like i am,"

and etc. Two Greeks came to worship Jesus, and He hid from them