BAPTISM SAVES, FOR THE REMISSION OF SINS"

[Jane_Doe22]

I am not proselytizing. I am revealing FALSE the proselytism of @ScottA which is what scripture tells us we are supposed to do.

Is you gaol on here to connive other people to become Catholic?
If the answer is "yes" then you are proselytizing and having the exact opposite of your desired effect.

 

[Marymog]

Is you gaol on here to connive other people to become Catholic?
If the answer is "yes" then you are proselytizing and having the exact opposite of your desired effect.

The Apostles proselytized and when the people of the town didn't accept the Truth they shook the dust off their feet and moved on. Jesus didn't go running after the Jews who walked away from Him them when he gave them the Truth that was a hard message for them to receive.

But since you are a scholar of scripture, you knew this already?

I am no better than the Apostles or Jesus. My goal isn't to connive (did you mean convince?) other people to become Catholic. It is to give them the Truth. They can walk away as the Jews did or ignore it as the people of the town did. I job is to preach the Truth.....not make Jane Doe happy.

Isn't your goal to give others the glory of the Truth???

Bible Study Mary

Definition of CONNIVE

 

[mjrhealth]

At least you have enough honesty to acknowledgment that your post make no sense....Just like the FACT that you choose the doctrines of your own simple mind.

Mary

BTW....Scripture also told us to look out for you and your ilk (Matthew 7:15 and 2Peter 3:16)

I ll make it simple for you Mary so that even a child can understand, do you know what a women is called when she sleeps with another woman, well we are supposed to be the Bride of Christ" but you have chosen to wed a Harlot Church, no only does that make you an adulterer but,

Rom 1:21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
Rom 1:22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
Rom 1:23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
Rom 1:24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
Rom 1:25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
Rom 1:26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
Rom 1:27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
Rom 1:28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
Rom 1:29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
Rom 1:30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
Rom 1:31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:
Rom 1:32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

and again

1Co 6:15 Know ye not that your bodies are the members of Christ? shall I then take the members of Christ, and make them the members of an harlot? God forbid.
1Co 6:16 What? know ye not that he which is joined to an harlot is one body? for two, saith he, shall be one flesh.
1Co 6:17 But he that is joined unto the Lord is one spirit.

you chose the Harlot, your doing not His

 

[Jane_Doe22]

The Apostles proselytized and when the people of the town didn't accept the Truth they shook the dust off their feet and moved on. Jesus didn't go running after the Jews who walked away from Him them when he gave them the Truth that was a hard message for them to receive.

But since you are a scholar of scripture, you knew this already?

I am no better than the Apostles or Jesus. My goal isn't to connive (did you mean convince?) other people to become Catholic. It is to give them the Truth. They can walk away as the Jews did or ignore it as the people of the town did. I job is to preach the Truth.....not make Jane Doe happy.

Then move on, Mary! Thus far you haven't: you keep coming back here to proselytize to those who have no interest in Catholicism.

 

[Marymog]

I ll make it simple for you Mary so that even a child can understand, do you know what a women is called when she sleeps with another woman, well we are supposed to be the Bride of Christ" but you have chosen to wed a Harlot Church, no only does that make you an adulterer but,

Rom 1:21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
Rom 1:22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
Rom 1:23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
Rom 1:24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
Rom 1:25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
Rom 1:26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
Rom 1:27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
Rom 1:28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
Rom 1:29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
Rom 1:30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
Rom 1:31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:
Rom 1:32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

and again

1Co 6:15 Know ye not that your bodies are the members of Christ? shall I then take the members of Christ, and make them the members of an harlot? God forbid.
1Co 6:16 What? know ye not that he which is joined to an harlot is one body? for two, saith he, shall be one flesh.
1Co 6:17 But he that is joined unto the Lord is one spirit.

you chose the Harlot, your doing not His

At least you have enough honesty to acknowledgment that your post make no sense....Just like the FACT that you choose the doctrines of your own simple mind instead of the doctrines of The Church spoken of in scripture.

Mary

 

[Marymog]

Then move on, Mary! Thus far you haven't: you keep coming back here to proselytize to those who have no interest in Catholicism.

Sooooo you think I should let someone twist scripture, lie about the Catholic Church and just move on like it didn't happen???? Maybe that is the kind of Christian you are but I am not. I refuse to let someone lie about and twist scripture.

Jesus and the Apostles walked away from those who wouldn't accept the Truth. On the other hand they corrected or tried to explain to those who lied about or didn't understand the Truth. That is my goal also.....to be just like them. Isn't that your goal???

2nd time asking: Isn't your goal to give others the glory of the Truth???

2nd time asking: Are you ever going to apologize???

Curious Mary

 

[Jane_Doe22]

Sooooo you think I should let someone twist scripture, lie about the Catholic Church and just move on like it didn't happen???? Maybe that is the kind of Christian you are but I am not. I refuse to let someone lie about and twist scripture.

Jesus and the Apostles walked away from those who wouldn't accept the Truth. On the other hand they corrected or tried to explain to those who lied about or didn't understand the Truth. That is my goal also.....to be just like them.

Christ saw people lie about Him and the Truth all the time. And sometimes His response was to walk away, or even be killed because of these false charges. Sometimes you got to walk away.

 

[Marymog]

Christ saw people lie about Him and the Truth all the time. And sometimes His response was to walk away, or even be killed because of these false charges. Sometimes you got to walk away.

Sooooo you would walk away from someone twisting scripture and telling lies about what you believe???

Or would you call them a heretic and state that their teachings are un-biblical???

Oh, wait....You have already done that.....sooooo you are asking me to do what you won't do yourself.....Hmmmmmm.....

Stop being a hypocrite and thinking sooooo highly of yourself and let us get back to the subject at hand: BAPTISM SAVES, FOR THE REMISSION OF SINS

Mary

 

[Jane_Doe22]

Sooooo you would walk away from someone twisting scripture and telling lies about what you believe???

Or would you call them a heretic and state that their teachings are un-biblical???

Oh, wait....You have already done that.....sooooo you are asking me to do what you won't do yourself.....Hmmmmmm.....

Stop being a hypocrite and thinking sooooo highly of yourself and let us get back to the subject at hand: BAPTISM SAVES, FOR THE REMISSION OF SINS

Mary

I routinely encounter people who blantenly twist scripture, tell lies about what I believe, and mock me personally. And in the (very likely) event his person doesn't want to get their facts straight, I walk away, as Christ did. I am encouraging you to likewise follow His example.

 

[Marymog]

I routinely encounter people who blantenly twist scripture, tell lies about what I believe, and mock me personally. And in the (very likely) event his person doesn't want to get their facts straight, I walk away, as Christ did. I am encouraging you to likewise follow His example.

You have blatantly said that my Catholic beliefs are anti-biblical and Martin Luther, who held ALOT of Catholic teachings, was a false teacher sooooo why haven't you walked away from me and others on this site that uphold those teachings????

As a matter of fact.....You keep re-engaging with me. That makes you look like a hypocrite in my eyes.

Let us get back to the subject at hand: I agree that BAPTISM SAVES, FOR THE REMISSION OF SINS

Mary

 

[Jane_Doe22]

You have blatantly said that my Catholic beliefs are anti-biblical and Martin Luther, who held ALOT of Catholic teachings, was a false teacher sooooo why haven't you walked away from me and others on this site that uphold those teachings????

As a matter of fact.....You keep re-engaging with me. That makes you look like a hypocrite in my eyes.

Let us get back to the subject at hand: I agree that BAPTISM SAVES, FOR THE REMISSION OF SINS

Mary

Mary, I have never tried to convince you to be anything but Catholic. I only give my opinion on Catholic beliefs when you press the matter. Likewise I do not try to convince anyone else on here to be anything but their respective belief groups. I have zero interest in prosylizing (giving or receiving) as I've said many times. My engagement here is not motivated by prosylizing at all.

 

[mjrhealth]

At least you have enough honesty to acknowledgment that your post make no sense....Just like the FACT that you choose the doctrines of your own simple mind instead of the doctrines of The Church spoken of in scripture.

Mary

They only make no sense to those who refuse the truth, but since you claim to be led by the Spirit and have the same bible as us, you are now without excuse.

Rom 1:18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
Rom 1:19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
Rom 1:20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

i do hope you understand that,

 

[Carl]

I do not believe that baptism saves so a person who physically can't would not be an issue. In those cases you have to do what you have to do. But for able people fully immersed is the only mode. I believe that the early Christians and Apostles knew that baptism was suppose to be fully immersed. Being "BURIED" is to be FULLY immersed.

Was Jesus' baptism one of pouring?

I am fully aware of the verses that use the idea of burial but it has nothing to do with that of water baptism, in fact burial has to signify that of death and what death did Christ have to experience to save those who he had planned to save ?

It is very noteworthy that John the Baptist already knew about water baptism and yet the N.T. had not even begun to be written, that is to say all that John had was the O.T. and so if immersion was in view surely it would have been written somewhere in the O.T. We do read about washing as in washing certain parts of the body or even the whole body, which symbolized a spiritual cleaning one needs to become saved. Yet the Bible also uses the word sprinkling extensively as in the sprinkling of the blood and the sprinkling of water and these too also pointed to cleansing.

Now just because we read the statement that sat says Christ came up out of the water gives no clue as to immersion, he could have been waist deep, knee deep...etc and the afterwards came up out of the water. In Acts 8:32 we know that Phillip was reading to him from the book of Isaiah 53 and in all likely hood parts of Isaiah 52 which are a prelude to that of Christ and to that of chapter 53. we could also surmise that he also read to him Ezekiel 36.

I would like to draw your attention to that of Acts 8:38, which is a popular verse to use for immersion.

And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him.

Notice that if going down into the water has to signify immersion as many have said, then whatever happened to the Eunuch also happened to Phillip, because it says they "both" went down into the water and so the action here would imply that they both had become water baptized or we could say immersed. I would say that the evidence would point more to that of sprinkling rather than that of immersion. But in the end Water Baptism does not save a person because it is a work that one does and we know from Eph. 2 and other parts of the Bible that our works cannot save us.

 

[Marymog]

Mary, I have never tried to convince you to be anything but Catholic. I only give my opinion on Catholic beliefs when you press the matter. Likewise I do not try to convince anyone else on here to be anything but their respective belief groups. I have zero interest in prosylizing (giving or receiving) as I've said many times. My engagement here is not motivated by prosylizing at all.

Ummmmm...... when you tell someone their belief is un-biblical that isn't proselytizing??? What is that???? Your opinion???? That HORRID accusation is an opinion???

PLEASE stop this game you are playing and the twisting of your own words let alone mine. Telling me how I should respond to someone and telling me that my approach is wrong and you are great at this.....That isn't proselytizing???? Seriously????

Let us get back to the subject at hand: I agree that BAPTISM SAVES, FOR THE REMISSION OF SINS

Mary

 

[Jane_Doe22]

Ummmmm...... when you tell someone their belief is un-biblical that isn't proselytizing??? What is that????

When you point-blank ask and push the matter repeatedly, that's me simply answering your repeated question. Again, I'm not interested in proselytizing and am not trying to convince you to be anything but Catholic. And yes, in your own Catholic beliefs and post here you've stated how Christ walked away from some situations.

If at the end of the day you are Catholic- or even a more Christ-like Catholic, I'm a happy camper. I have zero interest in convincing you not to be Catholic.

 

[epostle]

That's the problem with you - you don't understand that those prophecies were not about "earthly kingdoms."

Only because your force them to mean the opposite of what they say.

Jer. 33:17 does not say "spiritual David" , invisible heavenly throne of the heavenly only House of Israel. Dan. 2:44 does not say– in the time of the spiritual kings...
Your Gnosticism, spiritualizing everything in sight, is glaring and you cannot defend this heresy. You support Gnosticism all over this board. When challenged to produce evidence, or an explanation of your EVIL insults, you change the subject or run and hide. If you hate the Catholic Church, you hate Jesus. Period.

 

[ScottA]

Okay - so NOW we're getting somewhere . . .

- The Early Church Fathers were the ones who passed the Christian faith down from the Apostles
- The Early Church Fathers were the ones who were butchered by the Romans for their beliefs. They were the Early Martyrs of the Church.
- The Early Church Fathers were the ones who compiled and declared the NT Canon of Scripture that YOU and ALL Protestants adhere to.
- The Early Church Fathers ALL taught the Real Presence in the Eucharist - which YOU say is a "perversion" of the Gospel.

According to the Bible - those who teach FALSE doctrines are guilty of leading people to perdition and it wold be better for them had they never been born.

HOWEVER - the Early Church Fathers - the martyrs - are spoken of as being in HEAVEN, according to Rev. 6:9 . . .
Rev. 6:9
When the Lamb broke the fifth seal, I saw underneath the altar the souls of those who had been slain because of the word of God, and because of the testimony which they had maintained; and they cried out with a loud voice, saying, "How long, O Lord, holy and true, will You refrain from judging and avenging our blood on those who dwell on the earth?"

Ergo - they did NOT pervert the Gospel and their UNANIMOUS belief and teaching on the Real Presences which THEY attributed to the Apostles is correct.

Indeed, we are getting somewhere, just not where you think.

We have come to confirm just "As it is written: “There is none righteous, no, not one;"...not even the early church fathers, or the martyrs. Be they apostles, fathers, or martyrs, does not prove them correct in all things. Nonetheless, just as it was with Israel, their imperfection has contributed to "work all things together for good to those who love God, to those who are the called according to His purpose."

 

[ScottA]

Dear Scott,

I prayed, and understanding was given me; I called upon God, and the spirit of wisdom came to me.

That understanding that God gave me and that spirit of wisdom that God has reveled to me is that you are a false builder and you twist scripture to your own destruction.

Mary

For which you will receive the wages and stripes of a false witness.

 

[ScottA]

I am not proselytizing. I am revealing FALSE the proselytism of @ScottA which is what scripture tells us we are supposed to do.

So said those who crucified Christ.

 

[ScottA]

Only because your force them to mean the opposite of what they say.

Jer. 33:17 does not say "spiritual David" , invisible heavenly throne of the heavenly only House of Israel. Dan. 2:44 does not say– in the time of the spiritual kings...
Your Gnosticism, spiritualizing everything in sight, is glaring and you cannot defend this heresy. You support Gnosticism all over this board. When challenged to produce evidence, or an explanation of your EVIL insults, you change the subject or run and hide. If you hate the Catholic Church, you hate Jesus. Period.

You obviously have me mixed up with someone else, I say just the opposite, and I confront you.

But I see you hate spiritualizing everything. Me, I love it! Go figure, God is spirit.