I don't say that. The Bible says that in Romans 11:25:
King James Bible
For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel,
until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
New International Version
I do not want you to be ignorant of this mystery, brothers and sisters, so that you may not be conceited: Israel has experienced a hardening in part
until the full number of the Gentiles has come in,
Holman Christian Standard Bible
So that you will not be conceited, brothers, I do not want you to be unaware of this mystery: A partial hardening has come to Israel
until the full number of the Gentiles has come in.
Well...two things here. This verse is talking about God bringing in large numbers of unsaved Jews into the Church (the body of believers in Christ), and it seems that that will happen when God has finished, largely, with the "Gentile Nations". This in no way, shape or form speaks to the separation of entities (the church and Israel) or to the fact that the Church must be 'absent' from planet earth when he does this. After all, national Israel is still here while he's been focusing on the Gentile nations. So, that idea does not stack up, biblially.
Secondly, in relation to our conversation, we're talking about timing, right? You think a time will come that necessitates the "end" of the Church, when she will be whisked away. But, my point is that still leaves us with a time period where, by any other definiton...certainly by biblical definition, people are still becoming "the body of Christ", with the full attributes of it....as per the verses I quoted to you. So...if, in the "tribulation period" people...both Jews and Gentiles are still coming to Jesus for salvation, still being filled with the Holy Spirit, still being washed clean by his blood, how, by every definition in the NT, are they NOT the Church? And what, then, does that do to your doctrines and so called verses saying that the church is not present then? Unless people stop coming to Christ before his second coming, people will be entering into his "body" right up until that moment. And unless you are willing to subscribe to "second-rate" "body" members, which the bible gives no bible support for, this doctrine becomes very hard to support.
So it is God who says that there is a specific *full number* of the Gentiles which will become a part of the Church, and then He will resume His direct dealings with Israel (the 12 tribes). See Romans 11:26-36. If you don't believe this, it is your problem, since God has spelled it out in plain English.
I have no problem believing this. What I have a problem believing, probably because it's not actually in the text, is the demand that the "church" has to be gone when God starts drawing national Israel to Christ. I also don't see Paul talking about the 12 tribes, just unbelieving Israel that, if they start to believe in Jesus, will be grafted back in. You make a simple idea complicated. There is a single tree...Jesus is the root, believing Gentiles and Jews are the branches now...the Church. National Israel, if she believes, when she believes, will be grafted back on before Christ's return at the end. That's what the text says. It does not give you leave to insert any more detail than that.
The Church -- by definition -- is all redeemed Jews and Gentiles in the Body of Christ UNTIL THE RAPTURE. No matter if you believe in a Pre-tribulation Rapture. The fact of the Rapture is incontrovertible.
I very much believe in a Rapture. But when I read my bible I see it clearly saying that it's at Christ's second coming.
Let's look at some of the more important Rapture passages and see what they say:
1 Cor 15. It clearly talks of the Rapture. "Twinkling of an eye"...we shall all be changed! The passage is talking about our change and the resurrection of the dead at Christ's coming.
In this passage, when it talks of Christ's "coming", it uses the word "parousia" παρουσία. But more, it says "at the" coming. ἐν τῇ. Not "a" coming, "the".
What about 1 Thess 4:15? "We who are alive shall be caught up!" How is this "coming" talked about? This too is "parousia" παρουσία, and again "the" τὴ.
But what about the verses Dispensationalists say are about the second coming, not the Rapture?
In 1 Thess 3:13 you say that Christ comes "with" his Saints, so it must be the second coming, rather than the Rapture. But, really? The very same word is used to describe it: "parousia" παρουσία. "At the" ἐν τῇ.
In fact, Dispensationalists tend to use the terms "parousia", "apokalupsis" (revelation) and "epiphaeia" (appearing) for both pretribulational rapture and the second coming. And, if both events share the same designation, grammatically, then there really isn't the slightest hint, biblically, of there being two events. Especially not when numerous other verses show simultaneous things happening at the same time when Christ does make his second coming.
And when the Church is Raptured, that is the end of the Church and the Church Age. And yes, the Bible also says that the Holy Spirit will be *taken out of the way* which means that the Holy Spirit will return to Heaven with the Church.
King James Bible
For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth
will let, until he be
taken out of the way.
English Standard Version
For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work. Only he who now restrains it will do so
until he is out of the way.
Berean Study Bible
For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work, but the one who now restrains it will continue
until he is taken out of the way.
Sadly, this is nothing more than reading what you want to into the text. It most certainly does not say that the Holy Spirit will be taken out of the way. You are assuming that the "restrainer" is the HS. Could he be? Yes. But again, it is only an assumption that if he is, he must be withdrawn from the world in the shape of the Church before the Man of Sin can be revealed. Too many assumptions here for sound biblical exegesis.
And the "End of the Age"...that comes at Christ's second coming, not before. I challenge you to find any scripture that mentions the end of the 'Church Age' 7 years prior to that.
This does not mean that there will be no saints (saved men and women) during the Tribulation, the Great Tribulation, or after that. It simply means that Jews and Gentiles in one Body will remain as the Church in the New Jerusalem. But all the Tribulation saints will be martyred. And after the Millennium is established, the believing remnant in Israel will be regenerated saints on earth, surrounded by the saved nations. But these people will not be a part of the Church.
I see a very messy "system", made up from many verses that...might...perhaps...implicitly (if that) suggest some of these things (but probably don't), when in fact Paul spends a lot of time in the NT to make it all very, very simple. We have one life to repent in. You get up to the day you die, and that's it. Be in Jesus, or not. If you're in Jesus, you're in the Church, you've been grafted in to the root that is Christ. When he returns, that's it. Simple.
The problem is that those who believe in Replacement Theology simply can't get their heads around the fact that God has a plan for the Church as well as a plan for Israel (redeemed and restored).
And again with the label. You do know what I'm toting is not
replacing Israel, right? For goodness sakes, you guys admit just as strongly that National Israel is NOT saved yet, and to be saved they have to come to Christ. And the Jews that ARE saved are the ones who are "in the Church"! We are the same!! The ONLY difference between us is that you think the bible teaches this bizarre Jewish sect after the Church vanishes...although no one seems to be able to say why they won't be any different to the Church, since they have to be exactly like the Church to be, what is in essence, the Church. Go figure. But, you know, just as long as it doesn't happen while we're here, because if it does, then we're horrible anti-semites! No...it's much better to think that the Church needs to be safe and happy in heaven while the Jews go through hell on earth to become the Church that way. Go Jews! That's much more loving.
And God's plan for the Jews? It was Jesus.
And, he kind of came. So...any time they feel like being grafted back on in, it's a "go". No real need for us to fly on away...no need at all. Certainly no biblical one.