Calvinism is a Cult

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Anthony D'Arienzo

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And my options are here
1) To get out my pitchfork and torch to join the mob trying to lynch Calvinists.
2) Spend the time to civilly actually ask a Calvinist what they believe, listen, and come out with a better understanding and love for that person.

I am trying extremely hard to go with option #2. I am a person of peace and try to truly understand/love other people. But you are making this course extremely difficult and aggravating, and I'm pretty close to giving up on #2 in this case.
All real Christian's are Calvinists, but many do not realize it yet.
Some have been poorly taught, or are novices sitting under a defective ministry.
Some see the teaching but resist on an emotional or philosophical basis. Those who come back to scripture eventually are allowed to welcome it.
 

CoreIssue

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Not at all. Here is the definition as given in Strong's and Thayer's. It simply means to know beforehand.

Strong's Concordance (4268)
prognósis: foreknowledge
Original Word: πρόγνωσις, εως, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: prognósis
Phonetic Spelling: (prog'-no-sis)
Definition: foreknowledge
Usage: foreknowledge, previous determination.


HELPS Word-studies
Cognate: 4268 prógnōsis (from 4267 /proginṓskō, "foreknow") – properly, foreknowledge. 4268 (prógnōsis) occurs twice in the NT, both times of "God's absolute foreknowledge." See 4267 (proginōskō).

Strong's Concordance (4267)
proginóskó: to know beforehand
Original Word: προγινώσκω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: proginóskó
Phonetic Spelling: (prog-in-oce'-ko)
Definition: to know beforehand
Usage: I know beforehand, foreknow.


Thayer's Greek Lexicon
STRONGS NT 4267: προγινώσκω
προγινώσκω; 2 aorist 3 person singular προέγνω; perfect passive participle προεγνωσμενος; to have knowledge of beforehand; to foreknow: namely,ταῦτα, 2 Peter 3:17, cf. 2 Peter 3:14, 16; τινα, Acts 26:5;οὕς προέγνω, whom he (God) foreknew, namely, that they would love him, or (with reference to what follows) whom he foreknew to be fit to be conformed to the likeness of his Son, Romans 8:29 (τῶν εἰς αὐτόν(Χριστόν) πιστεύειν προεγνωσμενων, Justin Martyr, dialog contr Trypho...

God knew beforehand -- even before creation -- who would believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and therefore predestined them to be perfected. That's how simple it is.

Absolutely.

We are predestined to glorification because of foreknowledge, not because of predetermination.
 

Jane_Doe22

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All real Christian's are Calvinists, but many do not realize it yet.
Some have been poorly taught, or are novices sitting under a defective ministry.
Some see the teaching but resist on an emotional or philosophical basis. Those who come back to scripture eventually are allowed to welcome it.
*sigh*
If you want people who believe differently than you to respect you, you got to be willing to show them that same respect.
Are you willing to do that?
 

Anthony D'Arienzo

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What's your point debating this issue when you believe it makes no difference on eternal consequences?
I do believe it has eternal consequences.
You made a claim You suggested Calvinists do not believe in the biblical God.
And yet when I offered a confessional statement on God, you have went silent, rather than contrasting that view with yours.
I believe your attempt would demonstrate your claim was bogus.
You cannot do it can you ?
Admit your OP. Is foolishness on display.:oops::oops::oops:
 
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CoreIssue

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I do believe it has eternal consequences.
You made a claim You suggested Calvinists do not believe in the biblical God.
And yet when I offered a confessional statement on God, you have went silent, rather than contrasting that view with yours.
I believe your attempt would demonstrate your claim was bogus.
You cannot do it can you ?
Admit your OP. Is foolishness on display.:oops::oops::oops:
I do believe it has eternal consequences.
You made a claim You suggested Calvinists do not believe in the biblical God.
And yet when I offered a confessional statement on God, you have went silent, rather than contrasting that view with yours.
I believe your attempt would demonstrate your claim was bogus.
You cannot do it can you ?
Admit your OP. Is foolishness on display.:oops::oops::oops:

I didn't see it.

The God of the Bible wants everybody to be saved and offers salvation via the blood of Christ. A free will choice to accept or reject.

You do not believe that

The God of the Bible is loving and just but your God is not. No matter how a person lives some are destined for heaven and some for hell per your belief with absolutely no Avenue to escape hell your thinking.They can pray in repentance every day but it doesn't matter.

So yes, you do not believe in the God of the Bible.
 

Anthony D'Arienzo

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I didn't see it.

The God of the Bible wants everybody to be saved and offers salvation via the blood of Christ. A free will choice to accept or reject.

You do not believe that

The God of the Bible is loving and just but your God is not. No matter how a person lives some are destined for heaven and some for hell per your belief with absolutely no Avenue to escape hell your thinking.They can pray in repentance every day but it doesn't matter.

So yes, you do not believe in the God of the Bible.
You are not answering posts 9,10.
You are making unbiblical assertions instead,as if that is valid .it is not.
 

Anthony D'Arienzo

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Are *you* willing to be respectful of a non-Calvinism viewpoint?
I'm interested in *your* thoughts here, so please use *your* own words.
I am not understanding you?you are not posting clearly. Are you suggesting that when cults deny Jesus is Lord, that is worthy of respect somehow?
If someone offers a man centered works gospel you think that is respectable?
 

Jane_Doe22

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I am not understanding you?you are not posting clearly. Are you suggesting that when cults deny Jesus is Lord, that is worthy of respect somehow?
If someone offers a man centered works gospel you think that is respectable?
If you want a non-Calvinist to respect your Calvinist viewpoint, you need to be willing to respect them as well.
Are you willing to do that?
 

Anthony D'Arienzo

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I didn't see it.

The God of the Bible wants everybody to be saved and offers salvation via the blood of Christ. A free will choice to accept or reject.

You do not believe that

The God of the Bible is loving and just but your God is not. No matter how a person lives some are destined for heaven and some for hell per your belief with absolutely no Avenue to escape hell your thinking.They can pray in repentance every day but it doesn't matter.

So yes, you do not believe in the God of the Bible.
The biblical God has commanded all men everywhere to repent.
The biblical God is a covenant keeping God who has accomplished redemption.
You do not believe that.
 

Anthony D'Arienzo

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If you want a non-Calvinist to respect your Calvinist viewpoint, you need to be willing to respect them as well.
Are you willing to do that?
Some people believe that Elohim fathered spirit children on the planet Kolub.
I do not have respect for that view because it is unbiblical and leads people to blaspheme the true and living God. They will perish if they fo not repent.
The only way to show respect to them is to proclaim the truth.
 

Jane_Doe22

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Some people believe that Elohim fathered spirit children on the planet Kolub.
I do not have respect for that view because it is unbiblical and leads people to blaspheme the true and living God. They will perish if they fo not repent.
The only way to show respect to them is to proclaim the truth.
I was not asking about that misrepresentation of the belief of the Church fo Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (a misrepresentation carried on by the exact "anti-cult" crowd you are fighting against here).

What I said is: if you want a non-Calvinist (which is >80% of Christians numerically, across many different groups) to respect your Calvinist (<20%) viewpoint, you need to be willing to respect them as well.
Are you willing to do that?
Or do you grab at pitchforks against others and hence invite them to do the same to you?
 

Mjh29

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Fine Anthony... My original purpose of my post was to clear up what Calvin actually said vs. What Calvinism says. It is a peeve of mine when anyone is misrepresented and I believe John Calvin is misrepresented by what Calvinism has become.

As for the teaching itself, I offered my opinion. In case you missed it I agree with the points of Calvinism at least up to a point. I could knit pick on a few things. But my problem with the whole concept is that it is useless in application. Knowing that God prdestinates some does us no good since he doesn't give us a roll call or roster. He only gives the plan and telks us if we follow it, we are his children.

I do agree that what is has become [ie hyper calvinism] does not represent what Calvin taught. However, Calvinism as explained in the canons of Dort does not go against Calvin's teachings. I assume by Calvin's works you are referring to the Institutes... might I ask what translator translated the copy you read?
 

Mjh29

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:p Ha! You like your graphics! I can't figure out how to post 'em here...I'm not super tech-y. Which is a shame, cause sometimes a good gif or meme just really...speaks...to the occasion!!

I agree! I do love my graphics! What I do is I google the graphic I want, save it to my laptop, and then upload it using the upload file option next to the post reply. It works for me, and I hope it helps!
 

FHII

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I do agree that what is has become [ie hyper calvinism] does not represent what Calvin taught. However, Calvinism as explained in the canons of Dort does not go against Calvin's teachings. I assume by Calvin's works you are referring to the Institutes... might I ask what translator translated the copy you read?
I have not read the canons of dorts. I have read Calvin... His books. I have read Institutes of Christian Religion as well as several of his Bible Commentaries.

As to the translator... I have no idea and sorry.... Don't really care. Reading folks like Calvin, Luther and the many early Christian philosophers is a hobby more about Christian history and almost nil about trying to gather doctrine from them. I go to the Bible for that.

Calvin did contradict himself at times but that is understandable. He was a mere man. A brillliant man, but not an annointed prophet or apostle. I can accept he was an annointed teacher, but he had his flaws.
 
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amadeus

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I think throwing around the word "cult" is downright destructive here-- all it's going to do is wedge walls between people and make communication near impossible.

I'm not saying I agree with Calvinism at all (nothing could be further from the truth), but the "cult" calling it just not productive.
A strong 'Amen' to this.
 
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