Trinity, A deeper look

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amadeus

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The Bible is God.

How you feel about it does not change that reality.

You want to spiritualize everything and forget the written word.
Your words confirm how little you understand about me... or more importantly as I see it, about God. God is much more concerned about how our hearts are directed than which doctrines we do or do not support.
 

CoreIssue

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I was referring to Matthew 28:19, when I said that and can be translated as even.

I was referring to Matthew 28:19; which was indeed written in Greek.
But your response was to my old testament posting.

I knew what you were referring to was the New Testament.

Your response was in reference to my Old Testament passage.

So yes, in the Greek that is one of the meanings, but not in the Hebrew.

Either way it is Trinity.

I told you what linguists said about meaning personages.
 

CoreIssue

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Your words confirm how little you understand about me... or more importantly as I see it, about God. God is much more concerned about how our hearts are directed than which doctrines we do or do not support.
This is not about you. It is about the Bible, Jesus and God.

Nowhere in the Bible can you tell show me where God is more concerned about your heart than the truth he gave us in the Bible. Nowhere.
 

Enoch111

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...another false assumption, "uni-plural"...
That is definitely not a false assumption except to people such as yourself who promote heresies about the Godhead.

1. GOD IS ONE -- There is only one true and living God.

2. GOD IS THREE PERSONS -- eternally existent as Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

3. The Father is not the Son nor the Spirit; the Son is not the Father nor the Spirit; the Spirit is not the Father nor the Son.

Thus Elohim (a plural term) shows that it is uni-plural.
 

justbyfaith

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Nowhere in the Bible can you tell show me where God is more concerned about your heart than the truth he gave us in the Bible. Nowhere.

1Co 8:1, Now as touching things offered unto idols, we know that we all have knowledge. Knowledge puffeth up, but charity edifieth.
1Co 8:2, And if any man think that he knoweth any thing, he knoweth nothing yet as he ought to know.
1Co 8:3, But if any man love God, the same is known of him.
 

justbyfaith

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But your response was to my old testament posting.

I knew what you were referring to was the New Testament.

Your response was in reference to my Old Testament passage.

So yes, in the Greek that is one of the meanings, but not in the Hebrew.

Either way it is Trinity.

I told you what linguists said about meaning personages.

You wrote:

Baptism is in the name of the father son and Holy Spirit. Three individual.

To which I responded:

The Greek word for and is kai, which can be translated even.

Therefore, I was clearly referring to Matthew 28:19 and not to anything you might have been saying about the Old Testament.
 

justbyfaith

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3. The Father is not the Son nor the Spirit; the Son is not the Father nor the Spirit; the Spirit is not the Father nor the Son.
The Father is not the Son.

However, the Spirit of the Son is the Father; and the Holy Ghost is in a sense the Father (while the Father is not the Holy Ghost). He receives a different title and begins to exist side-by-side with the Father in eternity after Jesus releases His Spirit (who is the Father) back to the Father (who inhabiteth eternity; and who could not vacate eternity in descending to take on the added nature of human flesh).
 

Enoch111

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However, the Spirit of the Son is the Father; and the Holy Ghost is in a sense the Father (while the Father is not the Holy Ghost). He receives a different title and begins to exist side-by-side with the Father in eternity after Jesus releases His Spirit (who is the Father) back to the Father (who inhabiteth eternity; and who could not vacate eternity in descending to take on the added nature of human flesh).
This is a good formula to CONFUSE YOURSELF and everyone else.
 

justbyfaith

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This is a good formula to CONFUSE YOURSELF and everyone else.
My friend, I am not confused in the slightest. I am planting the seeds of the truth so that when you finally see it in the word, you will know that what I am preaching is truth.
 

101G

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Try to explain that the theologians and linguists. See how far it get you.

What you posted is not a link, therefore not an address.
GINOLJC, to all.

first, I'm not after any theologians and linguists, that agree with us, for if they truly see the Lord Jesus, they would, and will hear his voice. for his sheep hears his voice. but we are after the Lost that want to be save. it is God, the Lord Jesus, the ONE TRUE Spirit, the Holy Spirit desire that all men, meaning (male and female) to be saved. which many ... not all are unsaved, including some theologians and linguists. supportive scripture, 1 Timothy 2:4 "Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

not all men have this knowledge of the truth, (hence why we're here... :D ) because some, not all, theologians and linguists have this knowledge. as the scriptures states, "He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches". Amen.

PICJAG.
 

101G

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That is definitely not a false assumption except to people such as yourself who promote heresies about the Godhead.

1. GOD IS ONE -- There is only one true and living God.

2. GOD IS THREE PERSONS -- eternally existent as Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

3. The Father is not the Son nor the Spirit; the Son is not the Father nor the Spirit; the Spirit is not the Father nor the Son.

Thus Elohim (a plural term) shows that it is uni-plural.
first thanks for the reply, second if so is the person in Isaiah 44:24 the same Person in John 1:3, YES or NO?

then we can see is God is uni-plural or not. your answer please.

PICJAG.
 

101G

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what Christians are missing is obedience to the Faith, meaning, the word of God. the Lord Jesus said, "MY SHEEP" hear my voice. ok, let's hear his voice.
Matthew 19:4 "And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made [them] at the beginning made them male and female". the "he" that the Lord Jesus was referencing to was the term "God". let's make sure, no assumptions.
Mark 10:6 "But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female".

the gospel of Matthews and Mark confirm that God is a "he" and not a them. which eliminates, and destroys any notions of God being any uni-plural "person or God.

another confirmation of this in Genesis 1:26 & 27 it's self. Genesis 1:26 "And God/'elohiym said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
Genesis 1:27 "So God created man in his [own] image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

the IMAGE of God is "another" of himself, just like Eve is "another" of Adam himself. they are one "MAN". God said let "us" make man in our IMAGE". STOP, what is the Image of God? another of himself mnifested in flesh that was to come. supportive scripture, John 1:14 "And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth". the Word was made flesh? ok, who is the WORD? answer John 1:1c "and the Word was God". the same God in Genesis 1:26 & 27 is made manifested in flesh. ok, good so far, but how did God, who in the beginning, is made flesh but yet was sent, or better yet came? answer, Philippians 2:6 "Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God":
the word "Form" here is nature, but Jesus has an "EQUAL" NATURE ... "WITH" God who is Spirit, notice the term "WITH", just as in John 1:2. but how do Jesus have a "EQUAL" Nature WITH GOD who is Spirit? answer, it's in the term "Form", it's root, here in Philippians 2:6. Form here is
G3444 μορφή morphe (mor-fee') n.
1. form.
2. (intrinsically) fundamental nature.
[perhaps from the base of G3313 (through the idea of adjustment of parts)]
KJV: form
Root(s): G3313

the ROOT word of G3444 μορφή morphe (mor-fee') is,
G3313 μέρος meros (me'-ros) n.
1. a portion (i.e. an amount allotted, a part of something).

what's another word for, or a word that is synonyms with "portion?" is, "share". the Lord Jesus is the equal "SHARE" of God the Spirit, or better stated, the Lord Jesus is the IMAGE of God himself in flesh. just as Eve is the another of Adam. the Lord Jesus is "another" of God ........ in flesh.

the Lord Jesus is the "another" of God that is the IMAGE or the "US" and the "OUR" in Genesis 1:26 & 27 that was to come. God
calleth those things which be not as though they were. what a mighty God we serve. calling the end from the beginning. supportive scripture, Isaiah 46:10 "Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times [the things] that are not [yet] done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:

that conusel that stood was the "US" and the "OUR"that is to come, God own IMAGE in flesh, the Messiah to come. this is the conusel of God in Christ Jesus. did not Isaiah say he's the Counsellor, the "Mighty God", ....... him.

and the NT confirm this doctrine of "Diversified Oneness" in the term "ANOTHER" G243 allos, the numerical difference of the SAME SORT, not a separate another, but the same another in flesh. him, he, I, like in "I AM".

PICJAG.
 

CoreIssue

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1Co 8:1, Now as touching things offered unto idols, we know that we all have knowledge. Knowledge puffeth up, but charity edifieth.
1Co 8:2, And if any man think that he knoweth any thing, he knoweth nothing yet as he ought to know.
1Co 8:3, But if any man love God, the same is known of him.
Jeremiah 17:9 New International Version (NIV)
9 The heart is deceitful above all things
and beyond cure.
Who can understand it?
 

CoreIssue

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You wrote:



To which I responded:



Therefore, I was clearly referring to Matthew 28:19 and not to anything you might have been saying about the Old Testament.
As I already said, linguist state in that usage whoever follows kai is an individual person.

But the topic is Trinity. And I gave it clear passage from the Old Testament showing Trinity.
 

101G

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It’s not amazing anymore as to how people can fall victim to the same lie. "uni-plural" is the same error of three person as one God, the trinity. For if they apply uni-plural to the term God, then one has 3 Gods, because God is “a”, 1, single Spirit. But they cannot do that, so it must reference to person of God, or person(s) within the one Spirit. So it just a fancy way of saying what they has always been saying God is three person trinity. Which means we have the same error with a new name. And one is right back at square one with 3 persons.

uni-plural is just a composite of many rather than a singular entity, shared or diversed.

Lets give clear example of a uni-plural that is a composite of many rather than a singular entity that is diverse of itself, vs a composite of itself.

uni-plural example …… the United states of America. “States” here is plural, but but one does not say, "The United States are going to war." One says, "The United States is going to war". this is one way a singular verb is uses with a plural noun. Here it is speaking of a collective Noun. get it .......

But here’s the problem with this definition concerning God. Not all the states are the same, "EQUAL" nor in size or people. Even the trinity has this problem. They say all the persons in the trinity are equal. If so why is the one called Father is the First and call the Father? remember we have only one Father, see Malachi 2:10. if they are Co-Equal as the doctrine claim all should be "Father". Two, when the so called second person took on flesh did not all take on flesh, since all is the SAME Spirit? Meaning having the ONE SAME Nature? Well.......

See, uni-plural is just a fancy name for the same error called trinity. Because it cannot be used for God nature, because that would be three Spirit/Gods. So it comes right back to "PERSONS" which the term “TRINITY” that say the same thing, but here with uni-plural, a new bow on the same package.

2 Corinthians 2:11 "Lest Satan should get an advantage of us: for we are not ignorant of his devices”.

PICJAG.
 

CoreIssue

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GINOLJC, to all.

first, I'm not after any theologians and linguists, that agree with us, for if they truly see the Lord Jesus, they would, and will hear his voice. for his sheep hears his voice. but we are after the Lost that want to be save. it is God, the Lord Jesus, the ONE TRUE Spirit, the Holy Spirit desire that all men, meaning (male and female) to be saved. which many ... not all are unsaved, including some theologians and linguists. supportive scripture, 1 Timothy 2:4 "Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

not all men have this knowledge of the truth, (hence why we're here... :D ) because some, not all, theologians and linguists have this knowledge. as the scriptures states, "He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches". Amen.

PICJAG.
Trying to talk around the facts.
 

101G

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Trying to talk around the facts.
facts speak for themselves. do you want to explain the one person in John 1:1-3 with the same One person of Isaiah 44:24? don't try to talk around that fact.

will be looking for your answer, or explanation of the scriptures stated

PS, please don't give that old excuse, "I already explain that". give it again for all to see.

PICJAG.
 

CoreIssue

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It’s not amazing anymore as to how people can fall victim to the same lie. "uni-plural" is the same error of three person as one God, the trinity. For if they apply uni-plural to the term God, then one has 3 Gods, because God is “a”, 1, single Spirit. But they cannot do that, so it must reference to person of God, or person(s) within the one Spirit. So it just a fancy way of saying what they has always been saying God is three person trinity. Which means we have the same error with a new name. And one is right back at square one with 3 persons.

uni-plural is just a composite of many rather than a singular entity, shared or diversed.

Lets give clear example of a uni-plural that is a composite of many rather than a singular entity that is diverse of itself, vs a composite of itself.

uni-plural example …… the United states of America. “States” here is plural, but but one does not say, "The United States are going to war." One says, "The United States is going to war". this is one way a singular verb is uses with a plural noun. Here it is speaking of a collective Noun. get it .......

But here’s the problem with this definition concerning God. Not all the states are the same, "EQUAL" nor in size or people. Even the trinity has this problem. They say all the persons in the trinity are equal. If so why is the one called Father is the First and call the Father? remember we have only one Father, see Malachi 2:10. if they are Co-Equal as the doctrine claim all should be "Father". Two, when the so called second person took on flesh did not all take on flesh, since all is the SAME Spirit? Meaning having the ONE SAME Nature? Well.......

See, uni-plural is just a fancy name for the same error called trinity. Because it cannot be used for God nature, because that would be three Spirit/Gods. So it comes right back to "PERSONS" which the term “TRINITY” that say the same thing, but here with uni-plural, a new bow on the same package.

2 Corinthians 2:11 "Lest Satan should get an advantage of us: for we are not ignorant of his devices”.

PICJAG.
So you're saying the Bible is lying.
 

CoreIssue

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facts speak for themselves. do you want to explain the one person in John 1:1-3 with the same One person of Isaiah 44:24? don't try to talk around that fact.

will be looking for your answer, or explanation of the scriptures stated

PS, please don't give that old excuse, "I already explain that". give it again for all to see.

PICJAG.
The second person of the Trinity appears in both the Old Testament and New Testament.

Jesus never appears in the Old Testament because the flesh not exist until the incarnation.

Let us try this to speed this up.

What does Elohim mean?