Total Inability: Genesis 1-4

[atpollard]

THE TOPIC:
We are (T)otally Incapable of choosing God on our own because sin causes us to always flee from God.

Since this is very well trodden soil, I would prefer to pass on repeating the same old “proof texts”, arguments and counter arguments and approach this from a less travelled direction. Total Inability, the “T” in TULIP, has its roots in the “Adamic curse” and “original sin” and our “sin nature” … and the disagreement is about what these terms mean in our real lives. For this PARTICULAR BAPTIST, they mean that God must save men because men will not choose God.





INTRODUCTION:


I grew up with the expression “the apple doesn’t fall far from the tree”, which means that children are like their parents. I propose that all human beings are just like our father and mother, Adam and Eve. This is the “original sin” and the “natural man” and the “fallen nature” that scripture and theologians speak of. So let’s take a closer look at the first people and see who we are at our most basic level.





GENESIS 1:


[Genesis 1:26-31 NASB]

26 Then God said, "Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness; and let them rule over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the sky and over the cattle and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth." 27 God created man in His own image, in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them. 28 God blessed them; and God said to them, "Be fruitful and multiply, and fill the earth, and subdue it; and rule over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the sky and over every living thing that moves on the earth." 29 Then God said, "Behold, I have given you every plant yielding seed that is on the surface of all the earth, and every tree which has fruit yielding seed; it shall be food for you; 30 and to every beast of the earth and to every bird of the sky and to every thing that moves on the earth which has life, [I have given] every green plant for food"; and it was so. 31 God saw all that He had made, and behold, it was very good. And there was evening and there was morning, the sixth day.


Three observations from Genesis 1, taken at face value:

• Man (male and female) was made in the image of God.
• Man was created to have “dominion” over the earth.
• Man was created “blessed” and “very good”.

The “image of God” means we possess personality (knowledge, feelings and a will), morality (the capacity to make moral judgements; a conscience), and spirituality (we are made for communion and to communicate with God)


God decreed that man would have “dominion” over the earth as part of His plan even before the creation of man, so our preeminence in creation and ability to affect the environment is God’s plan for man on earth. Therefore, it is a sin for mankind to not use this dominion responsibly through proper stewardship of the earth.


God’s first act for man after creating him, was to “bless” him, and God’s final appraisal of his entire creation was that it was “very good” … which precludes any evil at all in it.


From this I offer the following personal observations:

• Adam and Eve are what God created them to be.
• As beings with “personality, morality and spirituality” they were able to think and possess knowledge (make rational decisions), they had a conscience, and they were in communion with and communication with God.
• Adam and Eve had no external negative “baggage” from previous generations or a bad childhood to blame on any decisions they made.

Therefore, Adam and Eve represent the best that human beings are naturally capable of (morally speaking).

 

[atpollard]

GENESIS 2:


[Genesis 2:8-9 NASB] 8 The LORD God planted a garden toward the east, in Eden; and there He placed the man whom He had formed. 9 Out of the ground the LORD God caused to grow every tree that is pleasing to the sight and good for food; the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.


Observation: It was no accident that the “tree of the knowledge of good and evil” was in the garden with the man (Adam); God did it on purpose. Morality is not a choice if there is no opportunity to choose otherwise.

Speculation: God’s plan knew all along about the inability of man to resist temptation and had made provision for “special creations” to one day become “beloved children” through Jesus Christ … God’s ultimate goal from the start.


[Genesis 2:16-17 NASB] 16 The LORD God commanded the man, saying, "From any tree of the garden you may eat freely; 17 but from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat from it you will surely die."


Observation: Adam is able to reason, has a conscience and is in communion with God (personality, morality, spirituality). God gave Adam a direct and completely unambiguous COMMAND. Adam must have understood the command.


[Genesis 2:25 NASB] 25 And the man and his wife were both naked and were not ashamed.


Observation: “Nakedness” is about far more than simple nudity, it carries a sense of being totally open and exposed before God and other people. So Adam and Eve being “naked and … not ashamed” indicates they had no sin, nothing to be ashamed of and nothing that needed hiding.

Speculation: Who among us today would be comfortable if everyone knew the real you all of the time without our “social masks”?

 

[atpollard]

GENESIS 3:


[Genesis 3:1 NASB] 1 Now the serpent was more crafty than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said to the woman, "Indeed, has God said, 'You shall not eat from any tree of the garden'?"


Observation: Wherever you go, temptation will find you … even in paradise.

Speculation: Since temptation is unavoidable, the key must be how we deal with it.


[Genesis 3:2-3 NASB] 2 The woman said to the serpent, "From the fruit of the trees of the garden we may eat; 3 but from the fruit of the tree which is in the middle of the garden, God has said, 'You shall not eat from it or touch it, or you will die.'"


Observation: “or touch it” … Even people that were created “very good” and “blessed” and had never ‘sinned’ still felt it worthwhile to add to the word of God with a “thou shall not” that God did not say.

Speculation: It is innate in all people to “miss the mark” when it comes to understanding the commands of God and we all want to add what makes sense to what scripture actually says. Thus the benefit of an honest challenge to our assumptions and a hard “second” look at scripture.


[Genesis 3:4-5 NASB] 4 The serpent said to the woman, "You surely will not die! 5 "For God knows that in the day you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil."


Observation: Temptation calls into question the truthfulness of what God said and promises people what they most desire … to be like God.

Speculation: All men want what the serpent tempted Eve with. We all question the truth of the word of God and we all want to be god of our own lives (or to choose a god of our liking). That is what pre-fall Eve wanted and that is what all post-fall mankind wants in its natural (pre-salvation) state.


[Genesis 3:6 NASB] 6 When the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was a delight to the eyes, and that the tree was desirable to make [one] wise, she took from its fruit and ate; and she gave also to her husband with her, and he ate.


Observation: Here we have the very first recorded exercise of moral free will. Eve knows what God wants, so her conscience is intact, and she is able to reason. Using her 100% untainted free will, Eve chooses to believe God lied to her, directly disobey the command of God, and to rebel against the authority of God by trying to become like God. Adam, who is just as much morally untainted, uses his 100% untainted free will to believe that God personally lied to him (face to face), to disobey the command that God gave him personally, and to join in the rebellion to become gods. We have a 100% record of free will, unfallen human beings choosing to embrace rebellion and reject God.

Speculation: “The apple doesn’t fall far from the tree”. What Adam and Eve were, we are (only more so). It is innate in human nature to want to be a god and to reject the authority of God Almighty.


[Genesis 3:7 NASB] 7 Then the eyes of both of them were opened, and they knew that they were naked; and they sewed fig leaves together and made themselves loin coverings.


Observation: Adam and Eve gained experiential knowledge of sin … they knew what it was to be in rebellion against God. As a result, they lost the freedom to be naked and unashamed (Gen 2:25) and felt the shame that they wanted to hide. They made covering of leaves to attempt to hide their nakedness (guilt and sin), but their covering was inadequate.

Speculation: We are born with an innate urge to sin (to be a god and rebel against God), but something still changes when we sin for ourselves. We are “spiritually dead” in our sins and we have lost that original communion and communication with God that Adam and Eve were born with and is our forfeited birthright as beings created in the image of God. Even in our ignorance, we instinctively attempt to clothe our spiritual nakedness in some sort of man made “religion” that is inadequate to the task. This is part of our natural spiritual “Total Inability”.


[Genesis 3:8 NASB] 8 They heard the sound of the LORD God walking in the garden in the cool of the day, and the man and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the LORD God among the trees of the garden.


Observation: The often repeated “free will” mantra is that people choose to come to God for forgiveness. Here are two people that have no experiential reason to fear God (God has never harmed them) and the very first opportunity they have to exercise their free will and run to God, they exercise their free will and run and hide instead.

Speculation: How much more reason do we, living today, have to run and hide from the presence of God to hide our far greater sins? This is “Total Inability” of people to choose to come to God for forgiveness because of our human nature.


[Genesis 3:9 NASB] 9 Then the LORD God called to the man, and said to him, "Where are you?"


Observation: God initiated contact with the people that were trying to hide from Him. God called to a specific person, not a general call to whomever might be listening.

Speculation: God always initiates contact because God must initiate contact; fallen people only want to hide from God. God always calls specific individuals because nobody would respond if they had a choice in the matter.


[Genesis 3:10-12 NASB] 10 He said, "I heard the sound of You in the garden, and I was afraid because I was naked; so I hid myself." 11 And He said, "Who told you that you were naked? Have you eaten from the tree of which I commanded you not to eat?" 12 The man said, "The woman whom You gave [to be] with me, she gave me from the tree, and I ate."


Observation: Adam was confronted by God and showed no intention of revealing what he had done, but just made empty excuses rather than confess and repent. God knows what happened (omniscience) and invites Adam to confess his sin. Adam responds in typical fallen human fashion by first blaming others (Eve) and then blaming God (“whom you gave me”) for the sin, but never accepting responsibility for his actions. This is human nature without any “special curse”.

Speculation: What Adam was, we still are. We have no intention of coming out of hiding to face God if we have a choice. God must draw us out individually and confront us with the reality of our sin. We will and do respond just like Adam, by first blaming everyone else and then blaming God for our sins. Adam was “Totally Unable” to do what was right and face God, confess his sin and repent of that sin all under the power of his free will … and we have the exact same “Total Inability” as children of Adam.


[Genesis 3:13 NASB] 13 Then the LORD God said to the woman, "What is this you have done?" And the woman said, "The serpent deceived me, and I ate."


Observation: Eve only confronts her sin when forced to confront it by God, and she uses her free will to choose to blame someone else rather than acknowledge, confess, repent and ask forgiveness.

Speculation: Eve is no less “Totally Unable” to do what is right than Adam was. This is the “Total Inability” of the human free will to do what God requires without some external compulsion by God.


[Genesis 3:21 NASB] 21 The LORD God made garments of skin for Adam and his wife, and clothed them.


Observation: God clothed Adam and Eve to cover their nakedness. Human attempts to cover nakedness are always inadequate. Something had to die to cover their nakedness … sin has a blood cost.

Speculation: Only God can cover the shame of our sin and guilt. All human efforts to cover our sin and guilt are “Totally Ineffective”. Only the shedding of blood, from the sacrifice chosen by God, by the hand of God, will cover our sin and guilt … anything and everything we do to “help” God is “Totally Ineffective”.

 

[atpollard]

GENESIS 4:


[Genesis 4:6-7 NASB] 6 Then the LORD said to Cain, "Why are you angry? And why has your countenance fallen? 7 "If you do well, will not [your countenance] be lifted up? And if you do not do well, sin is crouching at the door; and its desire is for you, but you must master it."


Observation: God offers a warning to Cain that sin and death are waiting for him if he continues on his present path. Cain has every opportunity to use his free will to obey the warning directly from God and avoid the sin.

Speculation: It is often suggested that the fact that God gives a command must mean that men can obey it. That does not seem true. How can an omniscient God not know how Cain and Abel will end? If the desire of God was to save Abel, then God should have warned Abel to defend himself. Instead God gives a warning to Cain that God must know Cain will not obey. Part of “Total Inability” is that warnings are given to all men not because they can obey, but to leave them without excuse in their guilt for the evil they have already set their heart on.


[Genesis 4:8-10 NASB] 8 Cain told Abel his brother. And it came about when they were in the field, that Cain rose up against Abel his brother and killed him. 9 Then the LORD said to Cain, "Where is Abel your brother?" And he said, "I do not know. Am I my brother's keeper?" 10 He said, "What have you done? The voice of your brother's blood is crying to Me from the ground.


Observation: Cain ignored God’s warning. The sins of the children were greater than those of the parents. Cain used his free will to murder Abel and lie to God. Once again, God must confront men with their sin since men choose to hide their sins.

Speculation: Like the first generation, all mankind is “Totally Incapable” of choosing to do right, even when warned by God, and will not go to God of their own free will to confess and repent of their sin. God, and only God, confronts men with sin and only God has the ability to draw men to God’s grace.


So there is TOTAL INABILITY presented from the beginning of the story … Genesis

 

[Enoch111]

So there is TOTAL INABILITY presented from the beginning of the story … Genesis

TOTALLY FALSE -- TOTAL INABILITY IS NOT IN THE BIBLE.

 

[OzSpen]

So there is TOTAL INABILITY presented from the beginning of the story … Genesis

This is unbiblical teaching. Joshua 24:14-22 (ESV) confirms it:

14 “Now therefore fear the Lord and serve him in sincerity and in faithfulness. Put away the gods that your fathers served beyond the River and in Egypt, and serve the Lord. 15 And if it is evil in your eyes to serve the Lord, choose this day whom you will serve, whether the gods your fathers served in the region beyond the River, or the gods of the Amorites in whose land you dwell. But as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord.”

16 Then the people answered, “Far be it from us that we should forsake the Lord to serve other gods, 17 for it is the Lord our God who brought us and our fathers up from the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery, and who did those great signs in our sight and preserved us in all the way that we went, and among all the peoples through whom we passed. 18 And the Lord drove out before us all the peoples, the Amorites who lived in the land. Therefore we also will serve the Lord, for he is our God.”

19 But Joshua said to the people, “You are not able to serve the Lord, for he is a holy God. He is a jealous God; he will not forgive your transgressions or your sins. 20 If you forsake the Lord and serve foreign gods, then he will turn and do you harm and consume you, after having done you good.” 21 And the people said to Joshua, “No, but we will serve the Lord.” 22 Then Joshua said to the people, “You are witnesses against yourselves that you have chosen the Lord, to serve him.” And they said, “We are witnesses.”​

You promote false theology with your statement. It cannot be confirmed by the totality of Scripture.

Who are the people Jesus draws to salvation? John 12:32 (ESV) is crystal clear: 'And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all people to myself"'.

Oz

 

[atpollard]

TOTALLY FALSE -- TOTAL INABILITY IS NOT IN THE BIBLE.

Neither is “Trinity”.
So what was your point?

 

[Jane_Doe22]

Before we go into specifics, let's talk big picture. @atpollard are you aware that your very presence here trying to convince men to accept your views runs contradictory to your argument that men don't have free will at all?

 

[atpollard]

You promote false theology with your statement. It cannot be confirmed by the totality of Scripture.

These are serious charges you throw so casually at me. I suggest you might want to ponder the motto of the Moravian Church when attempting to converse with other Christians:

In essentials unity. In non-essentials liberty. In all things charity.

With respect to your actual statement that Total Inability cannot be confirmed by the totality of scripture:

1. You have made no attempt to refute the “Total Inability” of sinless Adam and Eve to follow one simple command, or seek God, or to repent when confronted with their sin as evidence that mankind is incapable of seeking God and repenting of his own free will.

2. With respect to your counter-verse offered to prove that people can choose to serve God of their own free will; how did that work out for them? I seem to remember that this is the same “nation” that God said ... “THIS PEOPLE HONORS ME WITH THEIR LIPS, BUT THEIR HEART IS FAR AWAY FROM ME.” [Matthew 15:8]

3. Since we are attempting to look at the WHOLE of scripture, I offer:

• [John 6:44 NASB] 44 "No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up on the last day.”
• [John 10:26 NASB] 26 "But you do not believe because you are not of My sheep.
  
• [Romans 3:10-12 NASB] 10 as it is written, "THERE IS NONE RIGHTEOUS, NOT EVEN ONE; 11 THERE IS NONE WHO UNDERSTANDS, THERE IS NONE WHO SEEKS FOR GOD; 12 ALL HAVE TURNED ASIDE, TOGETHER THEY HAVE BECOME USELESS; THERE IS NONE WHO DOES GOOD, THERE IS NOT EVEN ONE."
  
• [Romans 9:14-26 NASB] 14 What shall we say then? There is no injustice with God, is there? May it never be! 15 For He says to Moses, "I WILL HAVE MERCY ON WHOM I HAVE MERCY, AND I WILL HAVE COMPASSION ON WHOM I HAVE COMPASSION." 16 So then it [does] not [depend] on the man who wills or the man who runs, but on God who has mercy. 17 For the Scripture says to Pharaoh, "FOR THIS VERY PURPOSE I RAISED YOU UP, TO DEMONSTRATE MY POWER IN YOU, AND THAT MY NAME MIGHT BE PROCLAIMED THROUGHOUT THE WHOLE EARTH." 18 So then He has mercy on whom He desires, and He hardens whom He desires. 19 You will say to me then, "Why does He still find fault? For who resists His will?" 20 On the contrary, who are you, O man, who answers back to God? The thing molded will not say to the molder, "Why did you make me like this," will it? 21 Or does not the potter have a right over the clay, to make from the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for common use? 22 What if God, although willing to demonstrate His wrath and to make His power known, endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction? 23 And [He did so] to make known the riches of His glory upon vessels of mercy, which He prepared beforehand for glory, 24 [even] us, whom He also called, not from among Jews only, but also from among Gentiles. 25 As He says also in Hosea, "I WILL CALL THOSE WHO WERE NOT MY PEOPLE, 'MY PEOPLE,' AND HER WHO WAS NOT BELOVED, 'BELOVED.'" 26 "AND IT SHALL BE THAT IN THE PLACE WHERE IT WAS SAID TO THEM, 'YOU ARE NOT MY PEOPLE,' THERE THEY SHALL BE CALLED SONS OF THE LIVING GOD."

However, as I stated at the beginning I have no real desire to retread the same old proof texts, arguments and counter arguments. That was why I sought to discuss Genesis 1-4 and the origin of the fall and “original sin”.

 

[atpollard]

Before we go into specifics, let's talk big picture. @atpollard are you aware that your very presence here trying to convince men to accept your views runs contradictory to your argument that men don't have free will at all?

Your comment indicates that you did not read my opening post.

First, of course people have free will and are not some sort of automatons. They exercise their free will all the time. However, people do not choose to do things contrary to their nature ... people of sound mind do not choose to set themselves on fire or chop off their legs with a chainsaw, but that does not mean that people are physically incapable of setting themselves on fire or chopping off limbs with a chainsaw. People also do not choose to run to God, confess their sins and repent of their own free will, either.

Second, I have not come here to convince anyone of anything. That is the beauty of being a Reformed Baptist ... changing your heart and mind is the job of God and His Holy Spirit. I am just required to answer what I understand to be true when asked. A friend asked about the origin of Total Depravity ... where did we loose free will ... so I posted an answer here for her to read. (And anyone else that wants to).

I was an atheist, who heard the Gospel from Catholic Charismatics and learned to study the Bible from the Church of God of Anderson Indiana (Wesleyan Arminianism) where I came to 4 of the 5 points of TULIP from just reading scripture before I ever learned the terms Calvinism and Arminianism. So I believe what I believe and unless you deny something really fundamental like the Deity of Christ or his resurrection, then as far as I am concerned you are a Christian and free to believe whatever you wish. I will just say “told you so” when we get to heaven and all see that God was always SOVEREIGN and in control.

 

[atpollard]

Who are the people Jesus draws to salvation? John 12:32 (ESV) is crystal clear: 'And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all people to myself"'.

John 6:44 states that all those DRAWN will also be raised, so if you advocate “all people without exception are drawn” then how do you not embrace the unbiblical “universal salvation of all people without exception”?

To answer your question ...
[Revelation 5:9 NASB] 9 And they sang a new song, saying, "Worthy are You to take the book and to break its seals; for You were slain, and purchased for God with Your blood [men] from every tribe and tongue and people and nation.

[Romans 9:23-24 NIV] 23 What if he did this to make the riches of his glory known to the objects of his mercy, whom he prepared in advance for glory-- 24 even us, whom he also called, not only from the Jews but also from the Gentiles?


All people = Jews AND Gentiles ... men and women ... from from every tribe and tongue and people and nation.

More specifically:
Those the FATHER teaches and draws to the Son and gave to the Son , and only them:

• [John 6:43-45 NIV] 43 "Stop grumbling among yourselves," Jesus answered. 44 "No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws them, and I will raise them up at the last day. 45 It is written in the Prophets: 'They will all be taught by God.' Everyone who has heard the Father and learned from him comes to me.
• [Jhn 10:25-30 NIV] 25 Jesus answered, "I did tell you, but you do not believe. The works I do in my Father's name testify about me, 26 but you do not believe because you are not my sheep. 27 My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me. 28 I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand. 29 My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all; no one can snatch them out of my Father's hand. 30 I and the Father are one."

 

[Enoch111]

That was why I sought to discuss Genesis 1-4 and the origin of the fall and “original sin”.

Well Genesis 1-4 certainly DOES NOT teach Calvinistic nonsense. Both Adam and Eve were held fully accountable for their actions and their disobedience because they did have free will (having been created in the image of God).

And even after the Fall, mankind did not lose the capacity to make free moral choices. The very fact that God now commands all men everywhere to repent confirms that if all men would choose to do so, then all could be saved. And that is why the Gospel must be preached in all the world and to every creature.

 

[atpollard]

Well Genesis 1-4 certainly DOES NOT teach Calvinistic nonsense. Both Adam and Eve were held fully accountable for their actions and their disobedience because they did have free will (having been created in the image of God).

And even after the Fall, mankind did not lose the capacity to make free moral choices. The very fact that God now commands all men everywhere to repent confirms that if all men would choose to do so, then all could be saved. And that is why the Gospel must be preached in all the world and to every creature.

Man always exercises his free will to choose to reject God. See Romans 1 for a discussion on this topic.

God causes all things to work together for those called according to HIS purpose. God foreknows and God predestines and God calls and God justifies and God glorifies. [Rom 8:28-30] God teaches and God draws (irresistibly compels) those that will be raised on the last day. [Jhn 6:44-45] God makes alive those that are dead in their sins. [Eph 2:1-9] God works in us both to will (desire) and to do (accomplish). [Phl 2:13]. God gathers a people and God cleanses them and God removes their dead heart (stone) and God gives them a living heart (flesh) and God places His Spirit within them and God CAUSES them to walk in His statutes. [Eze 36:24-27] God has mercy on whomever He wills and God hardens whomever He wills. [Rom 9:18] God is the potter that makes some vessels for wrath and some vessels for honor, because that is His right. [Rom 9:21-24]

So where are the teachings about the power of man to choose salvation?

 

[atpollard]

Well Genesis 1-4 certainly DOES NOT teach Calvinistic nonsense.

Of course it does. Reread the opening posts.

More technically correct would be to say that Genesis 1-4 and “Calvinism” both affirm the same Biblical truth about the sinfulness of man and the sovereignty of God.

 

[Enoch111]

Man always exercises his free will to choose to reject God.

And that is why the Gospel has been given to man. Do you see the connection between the Gospel and sinners choosing God and Christ? If not why don't you study Romans 10 (which comes long after Romans 1).

Calvinists have DISMISSED the power of the Gospel and the attendant power of the Holy Spirit in bringing sinners to the Savior. And that is because they have been blinded to the truth by Five Point Calvinism.

 

[Mjh29]

Before we go into specifics, let's talk big picture. @atpollard are you aware that your very presence here trying to convince men to accept your views runs contradictory to your argument that men don't have free will at all?

This is assuming that God will not choose to open the eyes of some sinners who read this, and use this as His tool to lead them to the acknowledging of the truth.

 

[Mjh29]

And that is why the Gospel has been given to man. Do you see the connection between the Gospel and sinners choosing God and Christ? If not why don't you study Romans 10 (which comes long after Romans 1).

Calvinists have DISMISSED the power of the Gospel and the attendant power of the Holy Spirit in bringing sinners to the Savior. And that is because they have been blinded to the truth by Five Point Calvinism.

Not at all. Indeed, Reformed theology confirms the need of the Scriptures as the tool by which God brings men to repentance. You dismiss the very power of God in salvation, claiming that it is by man. Just because it is not man that makes the decision does not make the Gospel any more or less powerful; it merely makes MAN less powerful. In fact, the power of the Gospel is INCREASED, because it is able to reach the hearts of the unwilling by the power of God.

 

[Enoch111]

More technically correct would be to say that Genesis 1-4 and “Calvinism” both affirm the same Biblical truth about the sinfulness of man and the sovereignty of God.

Actually Calvinism DISTORTS both the sinfulness of man and the sovereignty of God. We could go into a lot of detail, but until and unless you are prepared to accept the fact that Calvinism is NOT Bible truth, nothing will make any difference.

 

[Mjh29]

Actually Calvinism DISTORTS both the sinfulness of man and the sovereignty of God. We could go into a lot of detail, but until and unless you are prepared to accept the fact that Calvinism is NOT Bible truth, nothing will make any difference.

How so? I would love to hear your point of view.

 

[OzSpen]

With respect to your actual statement that Total Inability cannot be confirmed by the totality of scripture:

Where did I state that?