Just curious here, is there something sinful about my post to which you replied:
"Forgive her, Lord Jesus! (1 John 5:16)." ?
How to debate the Bible: for beginners
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Just curious here, is there something sinful about my post to which you replied:
"Forgive her, Lord Jesus! (1 John 5:16)." ?
I still lose my temper sometimes in traffic. And yeah, it's less than it used to be, but if I were walking in the Spirit/abiding in Him in who there is no sin, I believe it wouldn't be lessened but would instead be gone.
I'm happy that I have improved. I clearly see He has had some influence over me and its mostly through what a friend of mine would call these small little paradigm shifts but what I call a renewing of my mind. One day I suddenly see something from a different perspective and it largely removes a certain anger or pettiness I had been coddling.
But, I still have to know, I am completely capable of reverting back to how I was before I saw some improvement. In fact, it's frightening, the sheer speed at which I can find myself there again, capable of all those same pettinesses and angers and evils.
I don't know if I agree that this constant buffeting by my flesh is always going to be a struggle until I die. I think it must not be true or abiding in Him so we don't sin and walking in the Spirit so we don't do what our flesh lusts to do would not even be said to us. It appears to be something more, despite the arguments of many men that there is nothing more than struggling with your flesh until you die.
I think...it could probably happen in an instant, walking in the Spirit/abiding. Except that our flesh is always, always in argument with the Spirit. But by those paradigm shifts/renewed thinking, we quit arguing because we see it as God does (or more nearly as He does). And it all seems like training or preparation for something more. And this suddenly came to me - can two walk together except they be agreed?
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I think that verse shows that...it is impossible to walk in the Spirit unless you are in agreement with Him. And since our flesh is always not in agreement but rather is always in enmity with the Spirit, through the changing of our mind, we come more and more to agreement...so yes, it is being prepared for something...
It is interesting learning from interactions on forums. I noticed some antagonistic people, who desire to confront and provoke rather than put a case forward and leave people to decide their response, try and discover an emotional provocative statement.
It may well be insulting, lying, condescending, aggressive etc. but their intent is to show up the other party in behaviour, rather than discussing the subject. It is always tempting to start to try and find a weakness etc in the other party, thinking this matters, a war of domination, while Jesus seems always to just state realities of God and our walk.
It was strange to discover some had fallen for the fireworks when actually people were brothers and sisters in faith, but just expressed concepts slightly differently. I have now learnt to ignore the distraction and focus on the issues, because people will take away what they will out of free will and not because they have lost a discussion. It is ironic that often you find certain positions are taken as absolutes, and nothing will oppose them, because truth no longer matters, just their world view. And the world views are often based on good foundations, so empathy is certainly deserved, but if they manage to stir up antagonism, it can make it appear they are victims of evil opponents. And if primarily this is ones goal to stir up anger, avoiding walking into their trap, truly frustrates them, but allows for truth to be simply spoken.
And we do fight against principalities in the heavenly realms. But the fruit of the spirit is
Gal 5:22-23
is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law.
It does make me wonder when some get angry at this spiritual reality, but then maybe that just declares what spirit they might have working in them to begin with.
Okay I really do have to start working here! But I am very hopeful for us that this thread could turn into practical help and building up each other in our trust!
I believe we are progressively freed from the power of sin (Romans 6:15–23). We have been freed from the penalty of sin but are not immune to it. Sin lives in our flesh...sometimes it seems as though we can take 3 steps forward and 2 steps back...we fall but it is the getting back up that makes all the difference. Yes, I believe we will sin less and less as we grow in His knowledge and faith, as we are being sanctified. There are times I think I have overcome a thing only to find it rearing its head again. It's all in striving to become the new creatures He tells us we are. It just seems to me that our flesh and our spirit are always at war against one another. We do not make a practice of sinning yet, it can still happen since we are not immune to it. Repentance is huge and often with myself. It is my thought life that mostly brings me down, thoughts of judgement against another person, I find I am hypocritical of things I myself have been guilty of! As much as I desire to forgive those who have hurt me deeply (and these are Christians who can hurt deeply) I can "say" it daily, several times yet, I still have arguments in my head with them and, this is my toughest sin to overcome...my thought life. We will be judged in the same manner we judge others and this scares me because when the thoughts come, after the tirade in my mind, I realize I will be judged the same way. It is a battle for me. Outward sins have pretty much vanished, THANK GOD!!! Funny, it is the outward sins I thought I could never, ever overcome yet, they were the first to go! The more the Holy Spirit convicts us of sin and righteousness, the more I see myself as a hypocrite BUT... that just means that the Holy Spirit is working in me and opening my eyes...telling me to take the plank out of my own eye... :)
What impressed me was the idea God provided the temple, with continuous sacrifices. It was not assumed Israel walked without sin or sinning, but when sin occurred they had a way of reconciliation.
Paul never claimed to be perfect, but rather pressed on towards the goal.
For me the two issues are the walk is long and the end can be achieved in Christ.
Life will always have struggles and compromises, and issues we have to face. Facing them with Jesus makes things very different.
I begin to see being right is less important that being with Jesus. Situations may never be resolved, but in Him, all things are set right.
Paul and Barnabus were liable to be killed, they were in prison, praising the Lord. It was knowing the moment is in His hands and we are mere servants to the King and need to honour Him in the here and now. God bless you.
Ach...I don't go for that thought that He is making me progressively holier or that I'm slowly becoming holy. I don't see that I'm holier than I was 14 years ago. I don't look at someone else and think, oh, I'm holier than they are or, oh, they are holier than I am. One sin makes you not holy. I don't think there are levels of holiness.
For sure! We all (at least, most of us Christians) agree with God yet, will choose our own ways over His at times. My ONLY desire is to do His will at all times...yet, I miss the mark many times.
"Therefore, to him who knows to do good and does not do it, to him it is sin." James 4:17
"Paul never claimed to be perfect, but rather pressed on towards the goal.
For me the two issues are the walk is long and the end can be achieved in Christ."
Agreed! We are in a constant battle with the flesh, sin, and Satan. STRIVING for that high calling means to me that it is an ongoing thing and the more we abide in Him, the less we will fulfill the desires of the flesh.
Maybe one should separate our status in being cleansed in Christ, Holy, and our current understanding of how well we are walking.
Many seem to condemn or feel bad about everything they literally do, while God is not being that hard and is actually loving the expression and openness being shown.
I read a testimony from one brother who suffered from OCD, and he could not stop condemning himself, which he resolved by becoming a free grace believer, where there was no issues. This highlights the problem of subjective conscience and behaviour over objective sin and real issues. Most I have met are so far apart on these issues, they need both grace and correction to start to see things more clearly.
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"Holiness [N] [T]
in the highest sense belongs to God ( Isaiah 6:3 ; Revelation 15:4 ), and to Christians as consecrated to God's service, and in so far as they are conformed in all things to the will of God ( Romans 6:19 Romans 6:22 ; Ephesians 1:4 ; Titus 1:8 ; 1 Peter 1:15 ). Personal holiness is a work of gradual development. It is carried on under many hindrances, hence the frequent admonitions to watchfulness, prayer, and perseverance ( 1 Corinthians 1:30 ; 2 co 7:1 ; Ephesians 4:23 Ephesians 4:24 ). (See SANCTIFICATION .)"
Holiness Definition and Meaning - Bible Dictionary
If you look at how the priests were made Holy, it was by purification and cleansing.
In Christ we are made holy through confession, faith and repentance of sins.
Lots of verses talk about us being purified and holy, in the present, with all our failures and possible future failures.
It is the relationship that purifies and makes us whole, that pulls us through the deceitfulness of sin and the hardening of our hearts.
Why do we listen to Jesus? Because we love Him and He loves us.
Peter discovered he believed he would make a heroic stand with Jesus, as Jesus came to reign, but failed at the test, but knew Jesus would forgive him and accept him again, once he had worked through his repentance and emotions.
Okay, yeah, I miss the mark many times too. And yes, I agree, Its sin. But this is training in righteousness. There is no training in holiness, there's only examples of zap, you're dead! In the bible if you touch the ark or lie to the Holy Spirit.
And that should produce fear of God and a desire to not mess with holiness. It makes me think, nah, I'm good right here where I am, being trained and exercised in righteousness, you won't hear any talk from me about how I'm way holier than I used to be. And oddly, that very seriousness is, I suspect, training for maybe entering into holiness one day, so you WONT get zapped dead.
Awesome verse Nancy!
Holy...Holy...Holy
Just a thought....the term or word saint means different things to different people now a days.
In the biblical era Paul is calling Christians...saints. The Greek word means: Most Holy Thing. The Christian usage of that Greek word is defined as: sacred...physically pure...morally blameless ...consecrated....holy one....saint.
The word is associated with the word sanctity or state of holiness.
Take that for what it is worth. A good point of discussion? Certainly there will be different perspectives on this....
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