My Lord And Savior Is Not A "SISSIFIED NEEDY JESUS", But HE is a GOD of WRATH!!

[Willie T]

I've read my Bible through numerous times, and believed this prior to being Reformed. The objector is like you, complaining against God, calling him unfair. That's very plain to see. Nothing in the text or context has a thing to do with him complaining that God is saving Gentiles. Frankly, that's just plain ignorant and eisegetical. You and many others have a problem with God being Sovereign, doing as he wills.

Oh, and I've yet to see you attempt to explain the text and prove your point. The thing is, you heard what Willie said, and thought it sounded good, so now you're trying to impose it on the text.

Guess what, it isn't in the text.

I'll say it again, since you must have missed it.... God is not unfair. He gave His own son so that every single person now born on this Earth since Christ died, could have eternal life with Him.

It is the followers of that mad tyrant, John Calvin, who try to convince people God made most of humanity as pre-damned to burn in Hell, no matter what. They are already doomed, (according to that insane killer's followers) and have no way to get out of guaranteed damnation.

 

[amadeus]

I'll say it again, since you must have missed it.... God is not unfair. He gave His own son so that every single person now born on this Earth since Christ died, could have eternal life with Him.

It is the followers of that mad tyrant, John Calvin, who try to convince people God made most of humanity as pre-damned to burn in Hell, no matter what. They are already doomed, (according to that insane killer's followers) and have no way to get out of guaranteed damnation.

LOL That is a very clear statement. I don't know much of Calvin himself not having read his writings. From what I have read on forums like this one it seems he missed some important things. I also don't believe God created men with no alternative available to unending torment. If that were the God we were serving we all would be in trouble... especially if we, you and I, LOL were not included among those elected to salvation before we were born to woman. So much for love!

osely condemn them eternal torment.

 

[Preacher4Truth]

Should we obtain truth from commentators and scholars? What about this?

"But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you." John 14:26

Ephesians 4:11-13.

 

[amadeus]

Ephesians 4:11-13.

That speaks of ministers God has given us. Some of them may indeed be scholars or commentators, but too much study without the Holy Spirit is indeed a weariness of the flesh: Ecc 12:12.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

I also don't believe God created men with no alternative available to unending torment.

sounds completely irrelevant and maybe it is, but consider unending torment and the Lake of Fire. The topic, unless I’ve misunderstood is whether God chooses certain ones always destined for unending torment. Asked the question how there could be “night and day” there which my husband pointed out first. yet to receive an answer. Revelation 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Revelation 21:23 And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.

 

[Preacher4Truth]

That speaks of ministers God has given us. Some of them may indeed be scholars or commentators, but too much study without the Holy Spirit is indeed a weariness of the flesh: Ecc 12:12.

Yes, and those ministers have written and we study them and learn from them.

Let me put things in perspective for you: God did not tell you he would lead you into all truth.

He said that to the apostles, which he did.

Do you possess all truth? Why not? You didn't let God lead you to all of it? Every Scripture you know, you have total truth on them? No? Yes? If no, why not? If yes then tell us all.

Lastly, no one is in danger of too much study these days, but of too little. Any true Christian who studies, reads from godly men will have the Spirit there with them in it. The problem is really free lance folks who say ignorantly while accusing others "I don't follow man" as if reading men is to follow them, not Christ. Such accusations are prideful arrogance.

 

[Preacher4Truth]

LOL That is a very clear statement. I don't know much of Calvin himself not having read his writings. From what I have read on forums like this one it seems he missed some important things. I also don't believe God created men with no alternative available to unending torment. If that were the God we were serving we all would be in trouble... especially if we, you and I, LOL were not included among those elected to salvation before we were born to woman. So much for love!.

The only alternative to not experiencing eternal damnation is God's electing grace before the foundation of the world. Note Ephesians 1.

You speak as if God owes man a chance at salvation and if he doesn't "so much for love." Well, he doesn't owe this to man and isn't unloving for not electing some to eternal life.

 

[Waiting on him]

Yes, and those ministers have written and we study them and learn from them.

Let me put things in perspective for you: God did not tell you he would lead you into all truth.

Neither did He commission you to go into all the world.

 

[Waiting on him]

The only alternative to not experiencing eternal damnation is God's electing grace before the foundation of the world. Note Ephesians 1.

You speak as if God owes man a chance at salvation and if he doesn't "so much for love." Well, he doesn't owe this to man and isn't unloving for not electing some to eternal life.

The eternal damnation only exists in your mouth.

 

[reformed1689]

Should we obtain truth from commentators and scholars? What about this?

"But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you." John 14:26

There is such a thing as too much emphasis on the Holy Spirit. And I'm waiting for the liberal charismatic meltdown that is going to occur because of this comment.

CC: @Preacher4Truth @SovereignGrace @Anthony D'Arienzo

 

[reformed1689]

The eternal damnation only exists in your mouth.

So you do not believe in Hell? You are a universalist (which is blatant heresy)?

 

[amadeus]

sounds completely irrelevant and maybe it is, but consider unending torment and the Lake of Fire. The topic, unless I’ve misunderstood is whether God chooses certain ones always destined for unending torment. Asked the question how there could be “night and day” there which my husband pointed out first. yet to receive an answer. Revelation 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Revelation 21:23 And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.

Could our punishment if we miss the Way be unending nothingness? Understanding that much may help you see where I am, but remember I am very cautious about stating ATs [Absolute Truths]. I have unanswered questions myself on my own position, but no man, and certainly not God, has given me a better explanation. Does your cited verse include you and me? What are the devil and the beast and the false prophet? Again I don't have clear answers myself? Do we need them? Perhaps!

If you really want to discuss this further I would suggest starting a new thread on it rather than going off on another tangent here. It is likely to be controversial. I hope not, but who knows where it might go?

 

[Waiting on him]

So you do not believe in Hell? You are a universalist (which is blatant heresy)?

I fully believe in Hell Father David

 

[Preacher4Truth]

So you do not believe in Hell? You are a universalist (which is blatant heresy)?

Ever notice that Willie only "likes" any and all heretical and heterodox teachings, and opposes all orthodox teachings? That coupled with his always errant takes from Scripture paints a picture of certainty about him.

 

[reformed1689]

I fully believe in Hell Father David

Then please explain this comment:

The eternal damnation only exists in your mouth.

And do not call me Father.

 

[reformed1689]

Ever notice that Willie only "likes" any and all heretical and heterodox teachings, and opposes all orthodox teachings? That coupled with his always errant takes from Scripture paints a picture of certainty about him.

He's not the only one. Nancy is another.

 

[Waiting on him]

Then please explain this comment:



And do not call me Father.

It’s spewing from your mouth.

He’ll is the absence of God.

 

[Preacher4Truth]

He's not the only one. Nancy is another.

Yep. They both think God is playing. A pushover.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Could our punishment if we miss the Way be unending nothingness? Understanding that much may help you see where I am, but remember I am very cautious about stating ATs [Absolute Truths]. I have unanswered questions myself on my own position, but no man, and certainly not God, has given me a better explanation. Does your cited verse include you and me? What are the devil and the beast and the false prophet? Again I don't have clear answers myself? Do we need them? Perhaps!

If you really want to discuss this further I would suggest starting a new thread on it rather than going off on another tangent here. It is likely to be controversial. I hope not, but who knows where it might go?

thank you. No need to start another thread. Like you, I have many questions concerning it, but will take your advice to not discuss it now. Was only bringing it up for those so sure who is going there(hell), when are any of us so sure what and when and where hell is.

 

[amadeus]

The only alternative to not experiencing eternal damnation is God's electing grace before the foundation of the world. Note Ephesians 1.

Well that is what you have decided is truth. I really believe that God gave us the opportunity to choose. That is our free will, to choose God or mammon.

Because God knows beforehand who will choose rightly, does not mean the choice is not ours. What is predestinated is that some will make it. Who will be in that elect group is only known ahead of
time [if time is even an issue with God] by God.

You speak as if God owes man a chance at salvation and if he doesn't "so much for love." Well, he doesn't owe this to man and isn't unloving for not electing some to eternal life.

You misunderstand. I don't believe God owes anyone anything, but in spite of this, He does love us and in His overall plan He has provided the means for those who really choose Him to receive Life. The means is measured by Him according to our Love for Him and our neighbors. No man without the revelation of the Holy Spirit can really even begin to understand that whole plan, but a vision of it, albeit through as glass darkly, I believe is necessary.