The Old Man and The New Man

[marks]

Ephesians 4
20 But ye have not so learned Christ;
21 If so be that ye have heard him, and have been taught by him, as the truth is in Jesus:
22 That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;
23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;
24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

What is the Old Man? What is the New Man? And why are believers told to "put of the old man" and to "put on the new man"?

I believe when you are able to answer these questions in keeping with the teaching of the Bible, you will have taken a huge step towards being able to keep this Word.

Much love!

 

[justbyfaith]

I believe that the new man is our new spirit as it becomes one spirit with Jesus Christ (1 Corinthians 6:17, Ephesians 3:19-20)....and our flesh as it becomes one flesh with Jesus Christ (1 Thessalonians 5:23-24, Ephesians 5:30-32)...in that it becomes crucified and the element of sin within it rendered dead (Romans 6:6, Galatians 5:24, Romans 7:8); and our souls as they are purified through obedience (1 Peter 1:22).

 

[marks]

I believe that the new man is our new spirit as it becomes one spirit with Jesus Christ

Are you saying we are becoming the new man as we become one with Christ?

Much love!

 

[Philip James]

Are you saying we are becoming the new man as we become one with Christ?

Much love!

All of us, gazing with unveiled face on the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, as from the Lord who is the Spirit.

2cor 3:18
Peace!

 

[marks]

All of us, gazing with unveiled face on the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, as from the Lord who is the Spirit.

2cor 3:18
Peace!

It's hard to be sure what a person is saying sometimes . . . are you saying this, that we are in a process of becoming the new man?

Much love!

 

[Waiting on him]

It's hard to be sure what a person is saying sometimes . . . are you saying this, that we are in a process of becoming the new man?

Much love!

I don't believe God gives partial birth. I simply believe that most upon receiving Christ as Lord and Savior go to religion first to know who they are in Christ, and in doing so typically get the wolf pack version. If they are truly converted, born of God, He alone in time will convince that individual of His truth.

 

[Waiting on him]

Paul himself said that at his departure the wolves would come in not sparing the flock, we have to ask ourselves where are these wolves today, or did this not come to pass?

And also what is the product of the wolves coming in?

 

[Philip James]

. are you saying this, that we are in a process of becoming the new man?

I would say we are being transformed into His perfect image, from Grace to Grace and Glory to Glory, growing in '
love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, generosity, faithfulness,gentleness, self-control

Peter speaks of it this way:

For this very reason, make every effort to supplement your faith with virtue, virtue with knowledge,
knowledge with self-control, self-control with endurance, endurance with devotion,

devotion with mutual affection, mutual affection with love.

Peace!

 

[Waiting on him]

I would say we are being transformed into His perfect image, from Grace to Grace and Glory to Glory, growing in '
love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, generosity, faithfulness,gentleness, self-control

Peter speaks of it this way:

For this very reason, make every effort to supplement your faith with virtue, virtue with knowledge,
knowledge with self-control, self-control with endurance, endurance with devotion,

devotion with mutual affection, mutual affection with love.

Peace!

Are not all these attributes the fruit of the Holy Spirit?

 

[justbyfaith]

Are you saying we are becoming the new man as we become one with Christ?

Much love!

The old man is our old thought patterns that still exist in our thinking from before we were born again. Putting off the old man and putting on the new means being transformed by the renewing of your mind; so that you don't live according to the old thought patterns any more.

The old man can also be likened to the flesh (though not exactly to the flesh).

 

[Jay Ross]

Ephesians 4
20 But ye have not so learned Christ;
21 If so be that ye have heard him, and have been taught by him, as the truth is in Jesus:
22 That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;
23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;
24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

What is the Old Man? What is the New Man? And why are believers told to "put of the old man" and to "put on the new man"?

I believe when you are able to answer these questions in keeping with the teaching of the Bible, you will have taken a huge step towards being able to keep this Word.

Much love!

Perhaps a little more study is required: -



and looking at G:2537 we read: -



With the following verses with the same Greek word derived from the Greek Root Word G:2537: -



Where the context of Matthew 26:29 is best understood in this manner: -

Matthew 26:29: - 29 But I say to you, I will not drink of this fruit of the vine from now on until that day when I drink it new/renewed with you in My Father's kingdom."​

It is whether the Greek word, "καινὸν," has been translated into English correctly. It is my belief that this verse should be read as: - "until that day when I drink it renewed with you in My Father's kingdom."

The same is true for Ephesians 4:24. It should also read as : "And that ye put on the renewed man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness."

There is no point in renewing the mind if we do not put on the renewed personhood/man at the same time.

Shalom

 

[marks]

I don't believe God gives partial birth

I don't either.

@Philip James

Myself, I answer this way. The old man is the man born from Adam, sinful, corrupt. The new man is the man born from God, holy, righteous.

To put off the old man is to make the choice to stop allowing the influence of the old adamic creation man over our thoughts and deeds, and to live according to the who we are in Christ.

The more we do this, we see it as sanctification, spending more and more of our lives living the new creation. Not becoming the new creation, because we are already reborn. But learning to stop living like we are the old man, and to live the new man.

Much love!

 

[Philip James]

. Not becoming the new creation, because we are already reborn.

Hello marks,

Reborn yes, but just as our bodies had to grow, mature, develop, until they were fully formed, so do we as newborn children of God grow, mature, develop, allowing God to mold us into His perfect image.

Peace be with you!

 

[amadeus]

@marks

All of us, gazing with unveiled face on the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, as from the Lord who is the Spirit.

2cor 3:18
Peace!

The unveiled face? When Moses sought to see God he was allowed to see only the hinder parts because as it is written...

"And he said, Thou canst not see my face: for there shall no man see me, and live." Ex 33:20

Later David was told to seek the face of God and so he did.

"When thou saidst, Seek ye my face; my heart said unto thee, Thy face, LORD, will I seek." Psalm 27:8

Now we may be able to see but for most part is it not still as through darkened glass? A greater vision is available! That maturing new man! The transformation is, or should be, occurring even now as we walk along this way. The old man dying and/or being killed while the new is growing stronger and closer to God. His eyesight is to be improving:

"He must increase, but I must decrease." John 3:30

"And the multitude rebuked them, because they should hold their peace: but they cried the more, saying, Have mercy on us, O Lord, thou son of David.
And Jesus stood still, and called them, and said, What will ye that I shall do unto you?
They say unto him, Lord, that our eyes may be opened." Matt 20:31-33

 

[amadeus]

I don't believe God gives partial birth. I simply believe that most upon receiving Christ as Lord and Savior go to religion first to know who they are in Christ, and in doing so typically get the wolf pack version. If they are truly converted, born of God, He alone in time will convince that individual of His truth.

When an natural infant comes out into the natural light, he cannot do much or see much at the first. He is a "new" little man, but a very immature "new" little man. Apostle Paul is speaking of the new man born from above or born again as per Jesus in John 3:3.

Our problem is that the old man of each of us has to die. He has to be killed and the only one in us who up to the job is the Holy Spirit in us:

"For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God." Rom 8:13-14

To "mortify" means to kill:

"Wisdom... She hath killed her beasts;..." Prov 9:1-2

The "beasts" are the old man of us.

 

[Waiting on him]

When an natural infant comes out into the natural light, he cannot do much or see much at the first. He is a "new" little man, but a very immature "new" little man. Apostle Paul is speaking of the new man born from above or born again as per Jesus in John 3:3.

Our problem is that the old man of each of us has to die. He has to be killed and the only one in us who up to the job is the Holy Spirit in us:

"For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God." Rom 8:13-14

To "mortify" means to kill:

"Wisdom... She hath killed her beasts;..." Prov 9:1-2

The "beasts" are the old man of us.

Ok, sounds good, but what if the new man is seated in heaven with Christ while the old man just continues to shoulder his way through this world ( as Christ walks in him)?

We see this in the ministry of Christ as He calls on the Lord though He is Lord?

 

[amadeus]

Ok, sounds good, but what if the new man is seated in heaven with Christ while the old man just continues to shoulder his way through this world ( as Christ walks in him)?

We see this in the ministry of Christ as He calls on the Lord though He is Lord?

Killing the old man is getting rid of the double mindedness of everyone of us who has not yet overcome the worldly old flesh with which he was born. The Holy Spirit is the means, but when people regularly and habitually quench the Holy Spirit, the old man does not diminish and may well increase...

"A double minded man is unstable in all his ways." James 1:8

"Draw nigh to God, and he will draw nigh to you. Cleanse your hands, ye sinners; and purify your hearts, ye double minded." James 4:8

Jesus was sent to bring Life to dead men, but when a Spirit filled man continues to practice the ways of death and suppressed the power of God in him, what is already uninhabitable by Jesus in him will remain and eventually the same thing will happen to the living part of him that happened to Adam and Eve when they disobeyed God.

Jesus needs a place to rest his Head, but could we ever be the neck of the Body of Christ if we were more dead than alive?

 

[Waiting on him]

I don't either.

@Philip James

Myself, I answer this way. The old man is the man born from Adam, sinful, corrupt. The new man is the man born from God, holy, righteous.

To put off the old man is to make the choice to stop allowing the influence of the old adamic creation man over our thoughts and deeds, and to live according to the who we are in Christ.

The more we do this, we see it as sanctification, spending more and more of our lives living the new creation. Not becoming the new creation, because we are already reborn. But learning to stop living like we are the old man, and to live the new man.

Much love!

Maybe stop having this whole idea of being naked. Christ is our clothing, we stand before a Holy father unashamed.

Fully clothed in Christ. My opinion, there should be a clear conscience if not maybe because the individuals conscience which is the faculty by which we view our self is contrived of their own works?

 

[marks]

2 Corinthians 5
17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;

The one who is "in Christ" is a new creation. Everything about us is new. I am a new creature. Everything about the old me is passed away, and I am completely new. Everything about the new me is from God. God has restored me to friendship with Himself through Jesus.

Colossians 3
9 Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds;
10 And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:

The new man was created by God, Who is also renewing him according to God's Own image.

Ephesians 4
22 That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;
23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;
24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

The old man is corrupted, the new man is holy. The old man's deeds are evil, the new man is righteous. It is no longer I that sin, Paul wrote, but sin that lives in me. For I know that in me, that is, in my flesh lives No Good Thing.

Colossians 3
12 Put on therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering;
13 Forbearing one another, and forgiving one another, if any man have a quarrel against any: even as Christ forgave you, so also do ye.

Much love!

 

[marks]

Maybe stop having this whole idea of being naked. Christ is our clothing, we stand before a Holy father unashamed.

Fully clothed in Christ. My opinion, there should be a clear conscience if not maybe because the individuals conscience which is the faculty by which we view our self is contrived of their own works?

Romans 2 . . . those who don't have the law, a law unto themselves, their thoughts either accusing or defending. That's what we can do, accuse ourselves, defend ourselves, but that's not our job.

1 Corinthians 4 . . . I don't even judge myself, but Jesus will judge when He comes, knowing the thoughts and intents of the heart. I'm not a qualified judge of myself.

Someone may ask, do you sin? When was your most recent sin? I have to honestly answer I don't always know what my most recent sin was. Maybe a moment ago, and if I has the wisdom and understanding that Jesus has, I'd know. I don't know myself well enough to be able to tell you with any certainty whether I'm sinning today or not.

Ephesians 2 . . . God has raised us up together with Christ, and seated us together with Him in the heavenlies. 2 Corinthians 5 . . . we HAVE a building, not made with hands, eternal in the heavens. Colossians 3 . . . your life is hid with Christ in God. This is not your body of flesh. This is your new creation. Alive in the heavenlies, a building not made by hands, eternal. Hid with Christ. Seated with Him. The new man.

Much love!