Jesus isn't Catholic

[Taken]

Ummmm......that is why we have thousands of different "churches" throughout the world with all of them saying that what they are preaching is the true word of God sooooo your theory is currently in practice and has been spreading like wildfire since The Reformation and it isn't working.

Sooo which one of those thousands of churches have "men moved by the Holy Spirit"???

You are the one who has numbered thousands of churches ... why ask me to tell you what your research of some unnamed thousands of churches reveals?

 

[Marymog]

Bottom line is; The Membership of any mad-MADE Church is either with Belief in "Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the Living God...or is not."

Bottom line is Scripture says A LOT more than that...

 

[Marymog]

You are the one who has numbered thousands of churches ... why ask me to tell you what your research of some unnamed thousands of churches reveals?

You make ZERO sense. It is very well known that there are thousands of different churches that teach competing doctrines with all of them saying they have the truth. You are a dishonest conversationalist.

I agree with you that men are fallible. I have met your criteria of listening and searching Scripture to see if what you say is true and you sir are fallible.

 

[justbyfaith]

Hi JBF,

That is a very interesting interpretation of Scripture. I have heard it before from others and asked for clarification by using follow up questions. Those people have never followed up with logical answers or didn’t follow up at all. Maybe you can help me better understand that interpretation?

Jesus said to his disciples you must eat/drink my body/blood and several walked away when he said this because they were offended. Why would they be offended about “partaking of the word of God”?

Jesus also referenced their ancestors eating the manna from heaven in Moses time (Exodus 16:4) and that he is the true new bread that they will eat. Jesus equated the act of eating bread (manna) to eating him. How does that equate to eating His word?

Mary

They may have walked away because they misunderstood what Jesus was saying as being literal.

As for eating manna, it seems to me that we eat of the hidden manna every day when we read the word of God...we ingest the spiritual truth that is given to us and it nourishes us spiritually.

Hi JBF,

That would kind of make sense except at the Last Supper He said this IS my body given up for you and then within 24 hours He gave up his body for us on the cross. Before that in the bread of life discourse he equated manna (real bread) from heaven that their anscestors ate to him being the bread of life we need to eat if we want to have life in us. How can life be IN us if we "metaphorically" eat bread? Also, when he told his disiciples they must eat him and they walked away the word "eat" that he used meant to chew or gnaw. That is why they walked away because they were thinking cannibalism; literally eating Him. How do you chew/gnaw a metaphor?

That should tell you that His body was not in the bread that they ate; but that the bread that they ate symbolized His body that would be crucified. His life can be in us when we metaphorically eat bread in that we metaphorically eat the bread by partaking of His word and His word literally imparts spiritual life (see 1 Peter 1:23).

 

[Taken]

Bottom line is Scripture says A LOT more than that...

Bottom line- the Church, Jesus, the Son of Man, Established is Built on the Foundation:
"Jesus IS the Christ, the Son of the Living God."

 

[Taken]

You make ZERO sense. It is very well known that there are thousands of different churches that teach competing doctrines with all of them saying they have the truth. You are a dishonest conversationalist.

Ya, Ya...heard 40,000 from your fellow Catholic...

Funny, it's so Well known, I could MAYBE name a handful!

IOW- people pick numbers out of thin-air and repeat it as Facts... but then they can not identify even A 100, or what is so different about their beliefs...

So who is being Dishonest?
Raise your hand!

I agree with you that men are fallible. I have met your criteria of listening and searching Scripture to see if what you say is true and you sir are fallible.

Do you have anything...like Evidence...or do you merely judge according to your opinions?

 

[Truthcampaign.org]

-
Jesus isn't a Catholic.
Neither is Paul.

Also, think of every denomination you can think of, then add in 2500 more you dont know about.
Jesus and Paul are none of those........also.
Jesus and Paul do not belong to a man made denomination.
But you do, or have.
Do you belong to the Cult of Mary and call a leader "holy father" when the NT tells you to "call no man on earth Father"?

Its interesting that we are told to "not forsake the assembling of ourselves together"< but we are not told to join a denomination.
The Heretic thinks that their "church" is THE Church, when in fact ALL the born again believers are "the Body of Christ" or "The" Church.

There is the concept of a Local Church, revealed in the NT, but its never given a BRAND NAME.
Its never titled the Catholic or the Baptist Believer's Convention, or the Lutherans, or the "Pentecostals".
All that came later, as men moved in, took over, and created DENOMINATIONS such as the Cult of Mary.

Also...
IF you are born again, you've already joined the "one true Church", which is the literal, spiritual, body of Christ...that is not made with hands., but is made with The Blood of God as Jesus dying on The Cross.

So, is "organized religion", (denominations), the local church, good for you? ???
Well, It can be great for you and your family, but, the sticking point, is, that NT doctrine as "sound doctrine" is always sound, of itself..... but the way it is taught in "church", is often man made reinvention.
= Carnal bible twisting mania.

The only thing the Devil loves more then 25000 denominations that dont agree with each other's theology, (he had a full hand in this).....are 300 "New versions" of the BIBLE, that have changed verses, removed "sound" doctrine, and often try to leave God out, whenever possible.
Satan loves this.
LOVES it.

So, how do you know if your church is false, and is not walking in the Light, as Jesus is the Light?

It all comes down to how they teach Salvation and how they teach GRACE and how they teach JUSTIFICATION by FAITH.
It all comes down to each denomination's personal explanation of God's Gospel of GRACE.... Or as Paul said...>"My Gospel".
Understand Saint, that if they get this wrong, then everything else is wrong, also.
And if you belong to a church that has substituted works for Grace, or includes works (self effort) as a part of God's redemption, then you are wrong also., and they did it to you.
They, your church, has caused you to walk in the dark if you are trying to keep yourself saved, or if you believe that you can lose your salvation.

So, how do you check all this, to find out if you are in a poisonous religious cult, or if you are in a place where God reigns and the Holy Spirit is active? ???

First, you have to understand that Jesus is Grace.
JESUS is Eternal Life.
Jesus is Salvation....
Jesus is the author and finishers of YOUR FAITH. Hebrews 12:2.
And because Jesus is "Christ in you, the hope of Glory", and you are "IN Christ"", you have become the very "righteousness of Christ", if you are born again.
So, If you know all this, and believe all this, and TRUST all this and not in yourself to keep yourself saved.. then You will also have to come to the truth of the revelation that God began your salvation and HE will finish it.
Philippians 1:6

So....You have to come to a place in your theological mastery where you understand GRACE is a free gift, that Salvation is a free gift, and you no longer worry about losing your salvation, or still believe you have to keep yourself saved. = (Legalism) (Galatians 1:8)
Saint, you have to come to the revelation, that, if i ask you, "what are you trusting in, to get you to heaven""".... your only and final answer, is "JESUS."
And until you are there, completely certain..... until you have the revelation of "Grace without works".. Then you will always answer...."well, I trust in Jesus, BUT"....but....but......but..... = Spiritual and Theological Fail.
So, until you come to understand and truly believe that Jesus and Jesus alone saved you and will get you into heaven, then you are lost in the deceitful maze of "who is right"...>"who is lying"...."how do i know", and worst deceit of all = "you can lose your salvation".

-
Jesus isn't a Catholic.
Neither is Paul.

Also, think of every denomination you can think of, then add in 2500 more you dont know about.
Jesus and Paul are none of those........also.
Jesus and Paul do not belong to a man made denomination.
But you do, or have.
Do you belong to the Cult of Mary and call a leader "holy father" when the NT tells you to "call no man on earth Father"?

Its interesting that we are told to "not forsake the assembling of ourselves together"< but we are not told to join a denomination.
The Heretic thinks that their "church" is THE Church, when in fact ALL the born again believers are "the Body of Christ" or "The" Church.

There is the concept of a Local Church, revealed in the NT, but its never given a BRAND NAME.
Its never titled the Catholic or the Baptist Believer's Convention, or the Lutherans, or the "Pentecostals".
All that came later, as men moved in, took over, and created DENOMINATIONS such as the Cult of Mary.

Also...
IF you are born again, you've already joined the "one true Church", which is the literal, spiritual, body of Christ...that is not made with hands., but is made with The Blood of God as Jesus dying on The Cross.

So, is "organized religion", (denominations), the local church, good for you? ???
Well, It can be great for you and your family, but, the sticking point, is, that NT doctrine as "sound doctrine" is always sound, of itself..... but the way it is taught in "church", is often man made reinvention.
= Carnal bible twisting mania.

The only thing the Devil loves more then 25000 denominations that dont agree with each other's theology, (he had a full hand in this).....are 300 "New versions" of the BIBLE, that have changed verses, removed "sound" doctrine, and often try to leave God out, whenever possible.
Satan loves this.
LOVES it.

So, how do you know if your church is false, and is not walking in the Light, as Jesus is the Light?

It all comes down to how they teach Salvation and how they teach GRACE and how they teach JUSTIFICATION by FAITH.
It all comes down to each denomination's personal explanation of God's Gospel of GRACE.... Or as Paul said...>"My Gospel".
Understand Saint, that if they get this wrong, then everything else is wrong, also.
And if you belong to a church that has substituted works for Grace, or includes works (self effort) as a part of God's redemption, then you are wrong also., and they did it to you.
They, your church, has caused you to walk in the dark if you are trying to keep yourself saved, or if you believe that you can lose your salvation.

So, how do you check all this, to find out if you are in a poisonous religious cult, or if you are in a place where God reigns and the Holy Spirit is active? ???

First, you have to understand that Jesus is Grace.
JESUS is Eternal Life.
Jesus is Salvation....
Jesus is the author and finishers of YOUR FAITH. Hebrews 12:2.
And because Jesus is "Christ in you, the hope of Glory", and you are "IN Christ"", you have become the very "righteousness of Christ", if you are born again.
So, If you know all this, and believe all this, and TRUST all this and not in yourself to keep yourself saved.. then You will also have to come to the truth of the revelation that God began your salvation and HE will finish it.
Philippians 1:6

So....You have to come to a place in your theological mastery where you understand GRACE is a free gift, that Salvation is a free gift, and you no longer worry about losing your salvation, or still believe you have to keep yourself saved. = (Legalism) (Galatians 1:8)
Saint, you have to come to the revelation, that, if i ask you, "what are you trusting in, to get you to heaven""".... your only and final answer, is "JESUS."
And until you are there, completely certain..... until you have the revelation of "Grace without works".. Then you will always answer...."well, I trust in Jesus, BUT"....but....but......but..... = Spiritual and Theological Fail.
So, until you come to understand and truly believe that Jesus and Jesus alone saved you and will get you into heaven, then you are lost in the deceitful maze of "who is right"...>"who is lying"...."how do i know", and worst deceit of all = "you can lose your salvation".

Many seek to be right, and as a result, they fail to seek the truth!

Truth Campaign | Gospel of John Chapter 6 | Always Seek The Truth!

 

[HisLife]

Good Morning JBF,

Can you help clear this up for me: You answered that the Spirit of Truth decides what sound doctrine is. You clearly disagree with Calvin and Luther so I am assuming that you would think they did not have the Spirit with them when they came to their truth’s?

Sooooo WHO in the last 1,900 years (since the last Apostle died) has had the Spirit of Truth in them that helps us decide what sound doctrine is? WHO are your go to guys when looking for sound doctrine?

Mary

Let God be true, but every man a liar. Gods word is truth, Jesus is the Truth, When you follow men instead you have a cult, like Catholics following the Pope as an example

 

[Marymog]

They may have walked away because they misunderstood what Jesus was saying as being literal.

As for eating manna, it seems to me that we eat of the hidden manna every day when we read the word of God...we ingest the spiritual truth that is given to us and it nourishes us spiritually.



That should tell you that His body was not in the bread that they ate; but that the bread that they ate symbolized His body that would be crucified. His life can be in us when we metaphorically eat bread in that we metaphorically eat the bread by partaking of His word and His word literally imparts spiritual life (see 1 Peter 1:23).

Hi JBF,

No one listening to Jesus in the bread of life discourse understood him to be speaking metaphorically. When Jesus said he was a “door” or a “vine" nowhere do we find anyone asking, “How can this man be a door made out of wood or to be a plant?” When Jesus spoke in metaphor, his audience was fully aware of it. They didn't misunderstand him to be speaking literal. They KNEW he was speaking literally and that IS why they walked away. At no point, never, not once ever did he clear it up and say He was speaking metaphorically. Several years later Paul made it clear it wasn't a metaphor. The writers of the Didache did not take it as a metaphor. Several years after that (in the early 2nd century) Christians were accused by the Romans of being cannibals. That covers the first 70+ years of Christianity that they DID NOT take it as a metaphor. It wasn't until the Reformation that the metaphor theory took off!!

Furthermore when we take into context the surrounding context of John 6:53 His words could hardly have been clearer. In verse 51, he claims to be “the living bread” that his followers must eat. And he says in no uncertain terms that “the bread which I shall give . . . is my flesh.” Then the Jews started disputing among themselves, saying, ‘How can this man give us his flesh to eat?’ in verse 52, he reiterates even more emphatically, “Truly, truly, I say unto you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of man and drink his blood, you have no life in you.”

In John 6:50-53 there are various forms of the Greek verb phago, “eating.” After the Jews begin to express incredulity at the idea of eating Christ’s flesh, the language begins to intensify. In verse 54, John begins to use trogo instead of phago. Trogo is a decidedly more graphic term, meaning “to chew on” or to “gnaw on”—as when an animal is ripping apart its prey.

In verse 61 it is no longer the Jewish multitudes but the disciples themselves who are having difficulty with these radical statements of Jesus. If he were speaking symbolically he would clear up the difficulty now among his disciples. Instead He reiterates the fact that he meant just what he said: “Do you take offense at this? Why would he ask them if they were offended if he meant it as a metaphor? He didn't say to them “Hey guys, I was misleading the Jewish multitudes and everyone else, but now I am going to tell you alone the simple truth: I was speaking symbolically.” Rather, he says to them, “Will you also go away?” (v. 67).

Jesus said Your ancestors ate (chewed) the manna in the wilderness, yet they died. But here is the bread that comes down from heaven, which anyone may eat (chew) and not die. Whoever eats this bread will live forever. This bread is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world."
Your interpretation (or whatever man taught you that interpretation) of that passage suggest that Jesus is switching from literally eating bread (manna) to metaphorically eating bread (Him). That makes no sense and would make Jesus a poor teacher. At that time they obviously didn't know HOW they were going to eat (chew/gnaw) His flesh. He cleared it up at The Last Supper by SHOWING them how to do it.

Jesus was a very good teacher. He told us WHAT we had to do and then he showed us HOW to do it. After the Reformation Christians started rejecting WHAT he told us to do and rejecting HOW to do it. It makes me sad!!


Mary

 

[Marymog]

So who is being Dishonest?
Raise your hand!

Well, it's been a few days now. Is your arm getting tired??

 

[Marymog]

Let God be true, but every man a liar. Gods word is truth, Jesus is the Truth, When you follow men instead you have a cult, like Catholics following the Pope as an example

Hi,

Who's interpretation of Scripture do you rely on to reveal this "truth" that you speak of?

 

[HisLife]

Hi,

Who's interpretation of Scripture do you rely on to reveal this "truth" that you speak of?

What Part here are some Scriptures for ya
Romans 3:4 God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.

John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

John 17:17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.

And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us.... I could go on but A question for you What do you consider the definition of a Cult

 

[justbyfaith]

Hi @Marymog,

Here is where I am coming from.

If the Catholic Church transubstantiates the bread and wine into the body and blood of Jesus; and the partaking of it means eternal life; then I become dependent on the Catholic Church to have eternal life.

However, the Catholic Church teaches certain false doctrines that I will not abide by (such as Mary being co-redeemer); which also, if anyone abides by them, their salvation is in question from my pov.

So then, if what you say is true, it would appear that we must become accepting of certain false doctrines that diminish eternal life in order to obtain eternal life.

Because if I do not abide by those doctrines, the Catholic Church has the power to exclude me from communion and thus eternal life; but if I do abide by them, I do not have eternal life either.

Therefore, if what you say is true, who can be saved?

 

[Marymog]

What Part here are some Scriptures for ya
Romans 3:4 God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.

John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

John 17:17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.

And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us.... I could go on but A question for you What do you consider the definition of a Cult

Sooooo lets try this again: Who's interpretation of Scripture do you rely on to reveal this "truth" that you speak of?

Your own interpretation? Martin Luthers? Calvins? Your pastors?

Curious Mary

 

[Marymog]

Hi @Marymog,

Here is where I am coming from.

If the Catholic Church transubstantiates the bread and wine into the body and blood of Jesus; and the partaking of it means eternal life; then I become dependent on the Catholic Church to have eternal life.

Thank you for sharing your concerns.

What I think you are saying is that as Catholics we need to go to a priest to have eternal life since they are the ones who transubstantiation the bread? Is that the gist of what you are saying?

Mary

 

[HisLife]

Sooooo lets try this again: Who's interpretation of Scripture do you rely on to reveal this "truth" that you speak of?

Your own interpretation? Martin Luthers? Calvins? Your pastors?

Curious Mary

The Holy Spirit Leads unto all truth, the only one that can

But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

You Cant even answer simple questions

 

[Marymog]

The Holy Spirit Leads unto all truth, the only one that can

But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

You Cant even answer simple questions

Soooo the Holy Spirit leads who into all truth? I am only asking questions based on your statements.

 

[BreadOfLife]

The Holy Spirit Leads unto all truth, the only one that can

But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

You Cant even answer simple questions

Jesus's promise that the Holy Spirit would guide His Church to ALL truth (John 16:12-15) was NOT granted to every individual.
It was granted to those who were at the Last supper - His inner circle. They were the Leaders of His Church - the first Bishops (Acts 1:20).

If this promise HAD been given to EVERY individual - we wouldn't have what we have today:
Tens of thousands of perpetually-splintering Protestant sects that ALL teach different doctrines yet ALL claim to have been "led" by the Holy Spirit to this confusion.

WHICH one of them is the "pillar and foundation of Truth" (1 Tim. 3:15)?

 

[HisLife]

Soooo the Holy Spirit leads who into all truth? I am only asking questions based on your statements.

You ask setup questions and dodge the ones asked of you, it's fine but quite boring.... When someone is born again they receive the Holy Spirit And the Spirit reveals truth to them, They can Read Scripture and understand it, That's why to Carnal men the Bible doesn't make sense and they cant interpret it


Let's turn it around what part of scripture I used do you not agree with

 

[HisLife]

Jesus's promise that the Holy Spirit would guide His Church to ALL truth (John 16:12-15) was NOT granted to every individual.
It was granted to those who were at the Last supper - His inner circle. They were the Leaders of His Church - the first Bishops (Acts 1:20).

If this promise HAD been given to EVERY individual - we wouldn't have what we have today:
Tens of thousands of perpetually-splintering Protestant sects that ALL teach different doctrines yet ALL claim to have been "led" by the Holy Spirit to this confusion.

WHICH one of them is the "pillar and foundation of Truth" (1 Tim. 3:15)?

You try and redefine the meaning of Church, It's not Romes Version, It is a promise to the Church you are right there but the Church is Gods Children that have been born again the Ecclesia, the rest of your first statement contradicted what you said after

Once again The church is the Followers of Jesus that have been born again not any Denomination

The Pillar is the confession Peter made of Faith In Jesus "you are the Christ the Son of the Living God" no one can be saved without Faith in Jesus

There is a Big Thing you are ignoring, The New testament The new Covenant in his Blood, The Church Period Taught By Paul, Roman Catholicis are not Jews and they aren't under Peter, There are no more alters no more Priests and no more sacrifices, You guys are living in the past trying to apply the old Covenant to the wrong people, There is a new thing It's All About Gods Grace! You can have forgiveness of sins be Born again and get the Gift of Eternal Life Because the Blood of Jesus Its Through Faith in the Finished Work Of Jesus, Its the Best Thing You could ever comprehend