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BreadOfLife

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Your religious insanity is showing again.
Listen, there are no catholics in heaven.
There are no denominations in heaven.
There are no "saved by water " in heaven.
So, .... you have a big problem that you can't solve with a cookie or the city water system.
Figure this out before you take your last breath.
You're right about ONE thing: There are no saved "BY" water ANYWHERE - let alone, Heaven.
Unfortunately, you don't seem to have tht capacity to understand when I've told you this the last 8 or 9 times.

Everything else is your usual ignorant hot wind . . .
 

ChristisGod

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You're right about ONE thing: There are no saved "BY" water ANYWHERE - let alone, Heaven.
Unfortunately, you don't seem to have tht capacity to understand when I've told you this the last 8 or 9 times.

Everything else is your usual ignorant hot wind . . .
the ad hominem attacks continue in defeat.
 

BreadOfLife

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I realized that my question kinda came out of nowhere.....there were some other posts in this thread that I could have tied my question to and it would have made better sense.....I was too lazy to look around for a more relevant post......apologies if I caused any aggravation.....I Believe most Protestants and ALL that adhere to catholic doctrine , live their entire lives “fallen from Grace” and are completely unaware of it.A serious charge.But if you read Galatians , I don’t see any getting around it....Almost every church adds to Paul’s Of Grace Plus Nothing....The Catholics are just a little more transparent about it.....your thoughts,please...
In Gal. 5, where Paul make the statement about being fallen from grace - he is talking about works of the LAW.. People are always conflating works of the Law with the works that God has prepared for ALL of us who follow Christ in advance (Eph. 2:10). These works are an essential part of faith because we cannot take credit for them. They were prepared by GOD Himself.
This is why, in Gal 5:6, Paul says that the ONLY thing that matters is faith WORKING through love.

This is precisely what Jesus is talking about in the Lesson of the Sheep and Goats (Matt. 25:31-46) - and what James is talking about when he describes what REAL faith is - not just "Belief" (James 2"14-26).

In short - Catholics don't ADD works TO faith.
We believe those works prepared for us are PART OF faith.
 

ChristisGod

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In Gal. 5, where Paul make the statement about being fallen from grace - he is talking about works of the LAW.. People are always conflating works of the Law with the works that God has prepared for ALL of us who follow Christ in advance (Eph. 2:10). These works are an essential part of faith because we cannot take credit for them. They were prepared by GOD Himself.
This is why, in Gal 5:6, Paul says that the ONLY thing that matters is faith WORKING through love.

This is precisely what Jesus is talking about in the Lesson of the Sheep and Goats (Matt. 25:31-46) - and what James is talking about when he describes what REAL faith is - not just "Belief" (James 2"14-26).

In short - Catholics don't ADD works TO faith.
We believe those works prepared for us are PART OF faith.
Can you share with us what are these " works" that are part of faith ?
 

BreadOfLife

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Everyone is saved exactly the same way.
They hear the Gospel, and they Believe on Christ, as they are convicted by the Holy Spirit into this Truth.
But, there is a distinction between this understanding and this application.
This is the part that you can't understand. so, hang around as long as you like, as maybe this will help you.
The Bible says that we're saved at Baptism (Acts 2:38, 1 Pet. 3:21, Mark 16:16).
What YOU believe matters very little me . . .
 

ChristisGod

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The Bible says that we're saved at Baptism (Acts 2:38, 1 Pet. 3:21, Mark 16:16).
What YOU believe matters very little me . . .
The bible says we are saved by faith what you believe about water doesn't matter.

Acts 16:31
They said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household.”

1 Corinthians 1:21
For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not come to know God, God was well-pleased through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe.

Hebrews 10:39
But we are not of those who shrink back to destruction, but of those who have faith to the preserving of the soul.

Ephesians 2:8
For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;

Luke 7:50
And He said to the woman, “Your faith has saved you; go in peace.”

Romans 10:9
that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved;

1 John 5:4
For whatever is born of God overcomes the world; and this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith.

Romans 11:20
Quite right, they were broken off for their unbelief, but you stand by your faith. Do not be conceited, but fear;

Romans 11:23
And they also, if they do not continue in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.

John 3:15
so that whoever believes will in Him have eternal life.

John 3:16
“For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.

John 3:36
He who believes in the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.”

John 5:24
“Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life.

John 6:40
For this is the will of My Father, that everyone who beholds the Son and believes in Him will have eternal life, and I Myself will raise him up on the last day.”

John 1:12
But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, even to those who believe in His name,

John 20:31
but these have been written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing you may have life in His name.

Acts 10:43
Of Him all the prophets bear witness that through His name everyone who believes in Him receives forgiveness of sins.”

Hebrews 4:3
For we who have believed enter that rest, just as He has said,
“As I swore in My wrath,
They shall not enter My rest,”
although His works were finished from the foundation of the world.

Matthew 9:2
And they brought to Him a paralytic lying on a bed. Seeing their faith, Jesus said to the paralytic, “Take courage, son; your sins are forgiven.”

Mark 2:5
And Jesus seeing their faith *said to the paralytic, “Son, your sins are forgiven.”

Luke 5:20
Seeing their faith, He said, “Friend, your sins are forgiven you.”

John 3:18
He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

Acts 13:39
and through Him everyone who believes is freed from all things, from which you could not be freed through the Law of Moses.

2 Thessalonians 2:13
But we should always give thanks to God for you, brethren beloved by the Lord, because God has chosen you from the beginning for salvation through sanctification by the Spirit and faith in the truth.

1 Timothy 4:10
For it is for this we labor and strive, because we have fixed our hope on the living God, who is the Savior of all men, especially of believers.

1 Peter 1:9
obtaining as the outcome of your faith the salvation of your souls.

John 8:24
Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for unless you believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.”

Luke 8:12
Those beside the road are those who have heard; then the devil comes and takes away the word from their heart, so that they will not believe and be saved.

Romans 9:32
Why? Because they did not pursue it by faith, but as though it were by works. They stumbled over the stumbling stone,

Romans 4:14
For if those who are of the Law are heirs, faith is made void and the promise is nullified;

It appears you are outmatched and outnumbered. Faith Alone through Grace saves.

BTW there are plenty more passages about salvation by faith apart from water and works.

hope this helps !!!
 

justbyfaith

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Romans 4:5-6, Ephesians 2:8-9, Titus 3:4-7, and Romans 11:5-6,

all show that salvation is by grace through faith and not of works.

If I am saved by faith and not works;

But then say that works are a part of faith; and that I am saved by faith;

Am I not then saved by works? Because I would be saved by faith of which works would be a part.

But, the Bible teaches, salvation is not of works.

Therefore works are not a part of faith.

To @BreadOfLife.
 
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justbyfaith

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John 3:16
“For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.
I believe that certain translations, in their zeal to provide a false assurance, do corrupt certain verses in the word.

In the kjv, John 3:16 is written thus:

Jhn 3:16, For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

This preserves the teaching that it is possible to believe and then later fall away (Luke 8:13). Otherwise there is a contradiction between John 3:16 and Luke 8:13.
 

Marymog

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Uh...no

2 Pat 1:
[20] Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.

Taken
Hi Taken,

My response, in context to the conversation, still holds true but it would help if I expounded.

The passage you quoted continues to vs 21 and bolsters my faith in The Church. VS21: because no prophecy ever came by the impulse of man, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God.

Soooooo once again Scripture supports what I believe and what I have been telling you all along and what you keep rejecting: The Church, which is made up of men moved by the Holy Spirt, is the pillar and foundation of truth. The Church decides who is to be treated as a pagan/tax collector. The Church properly interprets Scripture.

Bible Study Mary
 

Marymog

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Jesus is the Word (John 1:1, John 1:14)...so we partake of His flesh by partaking of the word of God (like pure spiritual milk, 1 Peter 2:1-3). And we also partake of His blood by appropriating His blood to our lives; by receiving the forgiveness of sins that is given through His shed blood.

John 6:53-58 also speaks symbolically.
Hi JBF,

That is a very interesting interpretation of Scripture. I have heard it before from others and asked for clarification by using follow up questions. Those people have never followed up with logical answers or didn’t follow up at all. Maybe you can help me better understand that interpretation?

Jesus said to his disciples you must eat/drink my body/blood and several walked away when he said this because they were offended. Why would they be offended about “partaking of the word of God”?

Jesus also referenced their ancestors eating the manna from heaven in Moses time (Exodus 16:4) and that he is the true new bread that they will eat. Jesus equated the act of eating bread (manna) to eating him. How does that equate to eating His word?

Mary
 

Marymog

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No, He was using the literary tactic of metaphor. In that literary tactic, a person may say, "this is this"....when in all reality what he means is "this represents this."
Hi JBF,

That would kind of make sense except at the Last Supper He said this IS my body given up for you and then within 24 hours He gave up his body for us on the cross. Before that in the bread of life discourse he equated manna (real bread) from heaven that their anscestors ate to him being the bread of life we need to eat if we want to have life in us. How can life be IN us if we "metaphorically" eat bread? Also, when he told his disiciples they must eat him and they walked away the word "eat" that he used meant to chew or gnaw. That is why they walked away because they were thinking cannibalism; literally eating Him. How do you chew/gnaw a metaphor?
 

Taken

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Hi Taken,

My response, in context to the conversation, still holds true but it would help if I expounded.

The passage you quoted continues to vs 21 and bolsters my faith in The Church. VS21: because no prophecy ever came by the impulse of man, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God.

Soooooo once again Scripture supports what I believe and what I have been telling you all along and what you keep rejecting: The Church, which is made up of men moved by the Holy Spirt, is the pillar and foundation of truth. The Church decides who is to be treated as a pagan/tax collector. The Church properly interprets Scripture.

Bible Study Mary

* The Church, is Exclusively Christ's Church.
* Earthly men were Selected By Jesus, to Teach and Preach, the Word of God, TO all men.
* Earthly men, Appoint And Elect by votes...
Other Earthly men, TO sit in a position of Authority, over Particular Man-Made "gathering" buildings, men call churches.
* The Appointed or Elected person, is the person Authorized (by the people who gather together in that building), TO Deliver the Word of God...TO the gathered People.
* The People listening, SHOULD BE, Verifying, what they are "hearing"....With Scripture.

^ That requires the person "hearing" to SEARCH the Scriptures, to Find, what the Speaker has Said IS True....or Not.

This SHOULD notify you...the Speaker FOR the man-made building...is Fallible.
The Earthly man speaker ... May Speak, claim it is the Word of God...and the Listener may Search the Scriptures TO find and Verify IF what the Speaker says IS Truly the Word of God...or Not.

It is the Listeners OPTION...
* to Search the Scriptures.
* to ask the Speaker, where it is in Scripture.
* to be satisfied with the Speaker, and Never Verify.
* To Never find what the Speaker says is IN Scripture.
* To keep listening, without Verifying.
* To leave that man-made building, and stop listening to that Speaker.
* To go listen to another Speaker in another man- made building "gathering" place.
* listen to Speakers via Radio.
* SEE and LISTEN to Speakers, via TV, Internet, CDs, or other electronic devices.
* Read and Study Scripture FOR himself.

Glory to God,
Taken
 

Marymog

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*
^ That requires the person "hearing" to SEARCH the Scriptures, to Find, what the Speaker has Said IS True....or Not.

This SHOULD notify you...the Speaker FOR the man-made building...is Fallible.
The Earthly man speaker ... May Speak, claim it is the Word of God...and the Listener may Search the Scriptures TO find and Verify IF what the Speaker says IS Truly the Word of God...or Not.

It is the Listeners OPTION...
* to Search the Scriptures.
* to ask the Speaker, where it is in Scripture.
* to be satisfied with the Speaker, and Never Verify.
* To Never find what the Speaker says is IN Scripture.
* To keep listening, without Verifying.
* To leave that man-made building, and stop listening to that Speaker.
* To go listen to another Speaker in another man- made building "gathering" place.
* listen to Speakers via Radio.
* SEE and LISTEN to Speakers, via TV, Internet, CDs, or other electronic devices.
* Read and Study Scripture FOR himself.

Glory to God,
Taken
Upon reading what you have written I have SEARCHED the Scriptures to Find out if what YOU, the Speaker, has Said IS True or Not.

I have verified thru Scripture that what you have said is not true.

Soooo are you ready to listen?

Mary
 

Marymog

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* The Church, is Exclusively Christ's Church.
* Earthly men were Selected By Jesus, to Teach and Preach, the Word of God, TO all men.
* Earthly men, Appoint And Elect by votes...
Other Earthly men, TO sit in a position of Authority, over Particular Man-Made "gathering" buildings, men call churches.
* The Appointed or Elected person, is the person Authorized (by the people who gather together in that building), TO Deliver the Word of God...TO the gathered People.
* The People listening, SHOULD BE, Verifying, what they are "hearing"....With Scripture.

^ That requires the person "hearing" to SEARCH the Scriptures, to Find, what the Speaker has Said IS True....or Not.


Glory to God,
Taken
Ummmm......that is why we have thousands of different "churches" throughout the world with all of them saying that what they are preaching is the true word of God sooooo your theory is currently in practice and has been spreading like wildfire since The Reformation and it isn't working. ;)

Sooo which one of those thousands of churches have "men moved by the Holy Spirit"???
 

Taken

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Upon reading what you have written I have SEARCHED the Scriptures to Find out if what YOU, the Speaker, has Said IS True or Not.

I have verified thru Scripture that what you have said is not true.

Soooo are you ready to listen?

Mary

What do you Reject?
 

Taken

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Ummmm......that is why we have thousands of different "churches" throughout the world with all of them saying that what they are preaching is the true word of God sooooo your theory is currently in practice and has been spreading like wildfire since The Reformation and it isn't working. ;)

Bottom line is; The Membership of any mad-MADE Church is either with Belief in "Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the Living God...or is not."

Where are these Places calling themselves Churches ... whose members are fleeing from, Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the Living God?
 

Taken

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Your theory.....

Stop playing games.
I didn't ask for your opinion.
If you disagree with something I've Said ...
Be specific...Quote me...and I'll address it one thing at a time!