The Two Witnesses

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Davy

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Certainly Israel will experience this as well but its plain to me that Rev. 6:16 is speaking to mostly the gentile nations.

It's going to cover all nations, I'm not denying that. Some think the tribulation and "day of the Lord" events is only going to be for those in Jerusalem, but that's not really what God's Word shows. God's consuming fire will cover the whole earth, not just upon the armies out of the northern quarters that come upon Israel on the last day. As a blueprint for this, it was hinted at with the hot fiery furnace of Daniel 3, heated seven times hotter than necessary. Neb looked over into the furnace and a saw a 4th Man likened to The Son of God. When they came out of it, their clothes didn't even smell of smoke. That is how our Lord Jesus is able to protect us through God's consuming fire event on the earth. This is why the 'change' at the 'twinkling of an eye' is to happen.
 

101G

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Revelation 11:9 "And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their dead bodies three days and an half, and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves".

The key words here, which open up this verse is, “And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations“, OF THE PEOPLE AND NATIONS, meaning by eye witness account of the mouth to those who might not have been present at the event. Lets get with it.

many people from around the known world was in Jerusalem during this time, of the crucifixion, they was there, or arrived for Pentecost, which means they arrive ahead of Pentecost, (because there were NO air planes, trains or cars in that day and time to come in short notice). this is bared out on the road to Emmaus, which explain this to us. Luke 24:13 "And, behold, two of them went that same day to a village called Emmaus, which was from Jerusalem about threescore furlongs. Verse 14 "And they talked together of all these things which had happened. Verse 15 "And it came to pass, that, while they communed together and reasoned, Jesus himself drew near, and went with them. Verse 16 "But their eyes were holden that they should not know him. Verse 17 "And he said unto them, What manner of communications are these that ye have one to another, as ye walk, and are sad? Verse 18 "And the one of them, whose name was Cleopas, answering said unto him, Art thou only a stranger in Jerusalem, and hast not known the things which are come to pass there in these days? (BINGO, to see is to know, we today say it all the time, "do you see what I mean?).Verse 19 "And he said unto them, What things? And they said unto him, Concerning Jesus of Nazareth, which was a prophet mighty in deed and word before God and all the people: verse 20 "And how the chief priests and our rulers delivered him to be condemned to death, and have crucified him. Verse 21 "But we trusted that it had been he which should have redeemed Israel: and beside all this, to day is the third day since these things were done”.

here, from this conversation, we see that there was a lot of people in Jerusalem From around the known world there. Other words how he could not know about the Crucifixion of Jesus of Nazareth. So yes, the whole known world was there during the time of the Crucifixion. Just read your commentaries on this verse.

Just a few scriptures to help us understand, Acts 2:5 "And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven. Verse 6 "Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language. Verse 7 "And they were all amazed and marvelled, saying one to another, Behold, are not all these which speak Galilaeans? Verse 8 "And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born? Verse 9 "Parthians, and Medes, and Elamites, and the dwellers in Mesopotamia, and in Judaea, and Cappadocia, in Pontus, and verse 10 "Phrygia, and Pamphylia, in Egypt, and in the parts of Libya about Cyrene, and strangers of Rome, Jews and proselytes”.

some there for Pentecost was from, Cyrene, scripture, Mark 15:21 "And they compel one Simon a Cyrenian, who passed by, coming out of the country, the father of Alexander and Rufus, to bear his cross”. so was he there for Pentecost and was caught up in the crowd? I don't know for sure, but people from around the known world was in Jeruslam during this time. it was not a Israel only thing of the crucifixion. for Jerusalem was a international trading center, so people from around the known world was there. so sorry, NO, no CNN news cameras was there, nor Fox , or MSNBC, was there to telecast it around the world... nope, for this has already happen.


next, "Proper burial", shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves . Neither John nor the Lord Jesus was not given proper burials. they both was rushed jobs. hence the reason why they came to the tomb early that morning to give a proper burial. but he had arisen. and John's body had no head, it was cut off.


so again all the scriptures points to the Lord Jesus and John the Baptist as the two witness.

PICJAG
101G The "Spiritual Saboteur"
 

Josho

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Raising this topic back up. As I want to reply to a post in the appropiate thread.

... because satan hates GOD's Anointed, and is throwing EVERYTHING at his disposal against these TWO WITNESSES, -- Trump & Pence.

But they will win if for no other reason than they both end up murdered to lie in the streets for 3 1/2 days before coming back to life and ascending.


Or so I anticipate ... :)
Bobby Jo

@Bobby Jo how are Trump and Pence the two witnesses, where does it say in the Bible that the two witnesses come from USA? Are there any verses that suggest this?

Why not Australia? Or New Zealand? Or Russia? Or even Kazahkstan?
 
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Jay Ross

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Raising this topic back up. As I want to reply to a post in the appropiate thread.



@Bobby Jo how are Trump and Pence the two witnesses, where does it say in the Bible that the two witnesses come from USA? Are there any verses that suggest this?

Why not Australia? Or New Zealand? Or Russia? Or even Kazahkstan?

Josho, it cannot be people from this present time period unless they are able to circumvent God's time limitation of 120 years which was set before the time of the Flood. The time period for the two witnesses in Revelation 11 is still over 1,000 years into our future. But people will tell us that miracles like that can happen.

Trying to identify who the two witness are from this present time period is just nonsense on their part, but there have been many people over the years who have tried and been proved wrong anyway.

Shalom
 
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friend of

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The two witnesses breath fire. So there's that little giveaway
 

101G

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The two witnesses breath fire. So there's that little giveaway
sorry, the fire out of their mouth is the word of God, Jeremiah 5:14.

the two witness themselves are come and gone, but their wittness is still in the earth today.

PICJAG
101G The "Spiritual Saboteur"
 

friend of

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sorry, the fire out of their mouth is the word of God, Jeremiah 5:14.

the two witness themselves are come and gone, but their wittness is still in the earth today.

PICJAG
101G The "Spiritual Saboteur"

Okay. Who were they? And why isnt it said that those who preach the gospel have fire from their mouths?
 

Bobby Jo

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The two witnesses breath fire. So there's that little giveaway

Figurative versus Literal is often confusing. For example, Trump has ALREADY launched some 59 Cruise Missiles into Syria; and who know how many other military strikes against targets in Iraq and Afghanistan, and possibly other "unadvertised activity".

As for me, my "fire" is limited to leaving my shopping cart in a parking space because I didn't like the store's services. ;)
Bobby Jo
 

101G

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Okay. Who were they? And why isnt it said that those who preach the gospel have fire from their mouths?
the two witness are A. John the Baptist, and B. Jesus the Christ.


and as for preachers who preach the "Gospel", did God put his word in their mouth as fire? go ask God.....

Revelation 11 said, Revelation 11:5 "And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed."

and Jeremiah 5:14 "Wherefore thus saith the LORD God of hosts, Because ye speak this word, behold, I will make my words in thy mouth fire, and this people wood, and it shall devour them."


Revelation 11:5 b "and devoureth their enemies"

Jeremiah 5:14c. "and it shall devour them."

so if anyone is a enemy of the gospel, (which is one of the witness) in the earth today, it will "devour" them. and "Baptism" is the other witness in the earth today.

so the two witness is the Lord Jesus, (who instituted the Gospel). and John the Baptist, (who instituted baptism), all from God.

PICJAG
101G The "Spiritual Saboteur"
 

Bobby Jo

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... how are Trump and Pence the two witnesses, where does it say in the Bible that the two witnesses come from USA? Are there any verses that suggest this?
Why not Australia? Or New Zealand? Or Russia? Or even Kazahkstan?

Except for Russia, who are those other three countries and are they even MENTIONED in Scripture? And Russia is HARDLY as Bastion of Christian/Jewish VALUES.

So maybe the question should be: What nation is the MOST Christian BASED nation on earth? And if the U.S., then the "HERITAGE" of that nation SHOULD offer the FOREMOST candidates for the TWO WITNESSES as depicted in Rev. 11.

And although I've previously provided a scenario where these TWO would be murdered, lie in the street for 3 1/2 days, and then ascend; it remains to be seen. And please recall that Rabin wasn't the ONLY targeted assassination, but that Shimon Peres WAS ALSO TARGETED and avoided that potential encounter by his slightly earlier departure from that "Peace Rally".


I expect we'll most likely see within the next weeks to few months whether what Bible Prophecy appears to depict transpires as anticipated. And if it does, then we will know that:

Rev. 11:7 ... the beast that ascends from the bottomless pit will make war ...

... not only on the TWO WITNESSES, but also the church. And if the church, then who will be prepared for the Mark of the Beast, and being unable to buy -- Toilet Paper --? That is, unless the church has already gotten out of the cities; stocked their pantries; provisioned their necessities, including medications; have acquired generators and fuel; and swords as necessary to defend themselves and their households for the estimated 3 to 6 months (maybe up to a year) of deprivation.

Or alternately, whether the church continues to defy Luke 22:36, -- whereupon I understand the "State" will offer FREE SHOWERS! :)
Bobby Jo
 

Bobby Jo

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The two witnesses breath fire. So there's that little giveaway

I believe that a President has the ability to "breath fire" whether in Syria, or Iraq, or Afghanistan, or against any other Nation, Caliphate, Terrorist, or Land Target.

But if you're waiting for a LITERAL FULFILLMENT, then a FIGURATIVE FULFILLMENT will disappoint you! :)
Bobby Jo
 

Bobby Jo

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... no love is greater than that of someone who gives up his life for his brothers and sisters." (The End Times by Maria Valtorta)

Sacrifice is one thing, but VICTIM is altogether different. And if someone poses a threat to my family, the WORSE thing in the world is having to take a life, -- and I'll feel TERRIBLE for that person's mother, father, and family. :)

Two is ONE, and One is NONE (because "swords" often malfunction),-- and THREE is BEST,
Bobby Jo
 

Ziggy

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Isa 8:16
Bind up the testimony, seal the law among my disciples.
Rev 14:12
Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Rev 11:6
These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will.

What does it mean to shut heaven?
What is the rain?
What are the waters, which are turned to blood?
and what are the plagues of the earth? earthy...

Shutting heavens doors:
2Ch 6:26 When the heaven is shut up, and there is no rain, because they have sinned against thee; yet if they pray toward this place, and confess thy name, and turn from their sin, when thou dost afflict them;
2Ch 6:27 Then hear thou from heaven, and forgive the sin of thy servants, and of thy people Israel, when thou hast taught them the good way, wherein they should walk; and send rain upon thy land, which thou hast given unto thy people for an inheritance.

Law:
Mat 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

Testimony:
Rom 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

Shut heaven:
1Jo 3:17
But whoso hath this world's good, and seeth his brother have need, and shutteth up his bowels of compassion from him, how dwelleth the love of God in him?
Psa 145:8
The LORD is gracious, and full of compassion; slow to anger, and of great mercy.
Mat 9:36
But when he saw the multitudes, he was moved with compassion on them, because they fainted, and were scattered abroad, as sheep having no shepherd.

Rain:
Gen 8:2 The fountains also of the deep and the windows of heaven were stopped, and the rain from heaven was restrained;
Psa 68:9 Thou, O God, didst send a plentiful rain, whereby thou didst confirm thine inheritance, when it was weary.
Isa 55:10 For as the rain cometh down, and the snow from heaven, and returneth not thither, but watereth the earth, and maketh it bring forth and bud, that it may give seed to the sower, and bread to the eater:
Isa 55:11 So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.

Turn water into blood:
Waters:
Rev 17:15
And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues.
Mat 27:24 When Pilate saw that he could prevail nothing, but that rather a tumult was made, he took water, and washed his hands before the multitude, saying, I am innocent of the blood of this just person: see ye to it.
1Jo 5:6
This is he that came by water and blood, even Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth.
Rev 7:14
And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

Plagues:
Exo 9:14 For I will at this time send all my plagues upon thine heart, and upon thy servants, and upon thy people; that thou mayest know that there is none like me in all the earth.
Lev 26:21
And if ye walk contrary unto me, and will not hearken unto me; I will bring seven times more plagues upon you according to your sins.
Mar 3:10
For he had healed many; insomuch that they pressed upon him for to touch him, as many as had plagues.
Rev 15:1
And I saw another sign in heaven, great and marvellous, seven angels having the seven last plagues; for in them is filled up the wrath of God.

Psa 73:11
And they say, How doth God know? and is there knowledge in the most High?
Psa 73:12
Behold, these are the ungodly, who prosper in the world; they increase in riches.
Psa 73:13
Verily I have cleansed my heart in vain, and washed my hands in innocency.
Psa 73:14
For all the day long have I been plagued, and chastened every morning.

plagued: stricken
Isa 1:5
Why should ye be stricken any more? ye will revolt more and more: the whole head is sick, and the whole heart faint.

Rev 11:6
These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will.

Isa 8:20
To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

Just passing through and thought I'd give it a try
:)

You guys are doing awesome!
So much to see, so much to learn!
Thank You
HUGS
 

Bobby Jo

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...
Rev 11:6
These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will.

What does it mean to shut heaven?
What is the rain?
What are the waters, which are turned to blood?
and what are the plagues of the earth? earthy...
...

Hi Ziggy,

It seems to me that we're looking at a LITERAL versus a FIGURATIVE interpretation. For example, Obama DID shut "heaven" when he directed the government to CLOSE EVERY GOVERNMENT SERVICE he could, including OPEN AIR MONUMENTS like the Iwo Jima Statue. And Trump is similarly threatening to shut "heaven"/"rain" funding for Sanctuary Cities.

And waters to blood, and plagues, can have equal FIGURATIVE aspects which I can't "assign", but may be in "John's" eyes as he wrote those words.


So until we see if Trump & Pence are murdered in the streets to lie dead for 3 1/2 days, -- all we can do is watch and wait! :)
Bobby Jo
 
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Ziggy

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Hi Ziggy,

It seems to me that we're looking at a LITERAL versus a FIGURATIVE interpretation. For example, Obama DID shut "heaven" when he directed the government to CLOSE EVERY GOVERNMENT SERVICE he could, including OPEN AIR MONUMENTS like the Iwo Jima Statue. And Trump is similarly threatening to shut "heaven"/"rain" funding for Sanctuary Cities.

And waters to blood, and plagues, can have equal FIGURATIVE aspects which I can't "assign", but may be in "John's" eyes as he wrote those words.


So until we see if Trump & Pence are murdered in the streets to lie dead for 3 1/2 days, -- all we can do is watch and wait! :)
Bobby Jo
Trump and Pence

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Thanks Bobby Jo!

I don't see the book of Revelation in material form. I see it as God who is Sprirt talking to our spirit.
And yet.. God said, and it was.. and we see it, walk in it, feel it, taste it. The physical world.
Sometimes I don't want to smell it, that's why I left that out. :rolleyes:
They already been in office 3 1/2 years. They are trying since day one to remove them.
Some have said that he wouldn't be here this long.. Like Soros and John Kerry.. telling Iran to hold up making any deals and all.

so maybe those 3 1/2 (days) are years.. God has his own way of telling time.
Wonder what the next 1/2 will look like.. oh my.
We could be in for some nasty weather.
Get your raincoat..there's a storm coming.

HUGS
 

Ziggy

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Except they are killed in Jerusalem, so how can it be Trump and Pence?
Maybe Jerusalem is a state of mind.
Scripture says we are to come out of this world. and yet we have to live in it.
It's that render unto Ceasar what is Ceasar's and unto God what is God's.
If all our thoughts are on earthy things, than how can we ever rise above and
think of spiritual things.
If you think about it,
The world we live in is that Babylon world. It's that fallen state.. like the adulterous woman.
In shame, and contempt.
But if you can lift your thoughts and see the world God is preparing for us,
then you can walk in that world or city called New Jerusalem.
Jesus said where your heart is that's where your treasure will be also.
And I been going through the treasures and I never seen such beautiful things..
I say YES! Let's make America Great Again!
And bring the whole world along too. :)

Just thinking :)
Thank You lforrest
HUGS
I'm walking on sunshine, wow.. I'm walking on sunshine, wow, and don't it feel good?
:D
 

lforrest

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Maybe Jerusalem is a state of mind.
Scripture says we are to come out of this world. and yet we have to live in it.
It's that render unto Ceasar what is Ceasar's and unto God what is God's.
If all our thoughts are on earthy things, than how can we ever rise above and
think of spiritual things.
If you think about it,
The world we live in is that Babylon world. It's that fallen state.. like the adulterous woman.
In shame, and contempt.
But if you can lift your thoughts and see the world God is preparing for us,
then you can walk in that world or city called New Jerusalem.
Jesus said where your heart is that's where your treasure will be also.
And I been going through the treasures and I never seen such beautiful things..
I say YES! Let's make America Great Again!
And bring the whole world along too. :)

Just thinking :)
Thank You lforrest
HUGS
I'm walking on sunshine, wow.. I'm walking on sunshine, wow, and don't it feel good?
:D

Its a rainy day here. I'm thinking Jereusalem is literal because their dead bodies are witnessed by some from every people, tribe, language and nation. And the inhabitants of the earth will gloat over them. If it were a spiritual city they who are in the world would not see their dead bodies.
 
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Bobby Jo

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... maybe those 3 1/2 (days) are years. ...

They walk the earth for 42 months (3 1/2 years), but lie dead in the streets while the masses party for 3 1/2 days. :)

Re: waters to blood
Are you familiar with the phrase: there's blood in the water?

Bobby Jo
 
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101G

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Maybe Jerusalem is a state of mind.
GINOLJC, to all.
I don't believe so, because Rev 11:8 states, "And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified".

our Lord crucifixion, I don't believe is a state of mind.

PICJAG
101G The "Spiritual Saboteur"
 
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