The Two Witnesses

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Bobby Jo

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Revelation 11:3 "And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth."

... Revelation 11:6 "These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will."
...

Sometimes words are depictive, rather than literal. Consider the word "temple" in Dan. 11:31 which cites the "temple", where MODERN history cites this event as applying to the Neve Shalom in Istanbul, Turkey, -- not an Ancient even, or a Future event, but rather which occurred in 1986.


So now, your Bible is getting HARDER to understand everyday! :)
Bobby Jo
 

101G

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So now, your Bible is getting HARDER to understand everyday! :)
your first mistake of the day, ERROR, not "my" bible... (smile).... :eek: the Lord word which is truth.

Matthew 11:25 "At that time Jesus answered and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes."

NOPE, it's getting eaiser to understand, it just those who are follish and ignorant in heart that's its harder to understand. scripture, 1 Corinthians 1:17 "For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect."
1 Corinthians 1:18 "For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God."
1 Corinthians 1:19 "For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent."
1 Corinthians 1:20 "Where is the wise? where is the scribe? where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?"
1 Corinthians 1:21 "For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe." BINGO.

you got to come to GOD as babies, and then grow up..... :D

PICJAG.
 

Bobby Jo

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... you got to come to GOD as babies, and then grow up.....

... and so it's true with RESEARCH where we start with a postulation/hypothesis, then test it against TRUTHS, and refine/adjust/correct as necessary to ACCURATELY reflect the TRUTH, -- which ANY thinking person, including Kenneth Doig, DOES.

But when a person is born PERFECT, (YOU), they are the ONLY ONES who can cast stones. But the rest of use are still working toward PERFECTION.

Whew,
Bobby Jo
 

101G

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... and so it's true with RESEARCH where we start with a postulation/hypothesis, then test it against TRUTHS, and refine/adjust/correct as necessary to ACCURATELY reflect the TRUTH, -- which ANY thinking person, including Kenneth Doig, DOES.

But when a person is born PERFECT, (YOU), they are the ONLY ONES who can cast stones. But the rest of use are still working toward PERFECTION.

Whew,
Bobby Jo
flattering, but untrue, scripture, Hebrews 5:12 "For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat."
Hebrews 5:13 "For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe."
Hebrews 5:14 "But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil."

PICJAG.
 

Bobby Jo

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flattering, but untrue ...

ABSOLUTELY TRUE. Otherwise you'd APPRECIATE that K. Doig would be so responsible to make any refinements necessary to present the MOST ACCURATE information in his book.


I only wish EVERYONE was PERFECT like YOU, -- who criticizes everyone else's imperfections as though it were representative of the Merit of the Research, instead of providing ANY REBUTTAL to the facts presented.

No hypocrites or slanderers HERE!
Bobby Jo
 
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101G

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ABSOLUTELY TRUE. Otherwise you'd APPRECIATE that K. Doig would be so responsible to make any refinements necessary to present the MOST ACCURATE information in his book.


I only wish EVERYONE was PERFECT like YOU, -- who criticizes everyone else's imperfections as though it were representative of the Merit of the Research, instead of providing ANY REBUTTAL to the facts presented.

No hypocrites or slanderers HERE!
Bobby Jo
first thanks for the reply, second, do I hear some resentment in the voice your post?.... never mind, which I really don't care. but is it because God have given me some insight on some scriptures that you and your perfect buddy don't have? is that the cause of your resentment? well perk up, good news, you can be "perfect" too just like the man you adore so much. Matthew 5:47 "And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so?"
Matthew 5:48 "Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect." .... (smile), now where is your christian manners at? did I not thank you for the reply? why not the same. but if you don't that's ok, I'll leave you with Revelation 22:11.

and if you just want to talk or run your mouth, that's what facebook and tweeter are for, ok. see ya.

PICJAG.
101G, The "Spiritual Saboteur" ... :eek:
 

101G

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You're welcome. Maybe it'll do some good if you are ever interested in OBJECTIVITY. :)

Bobby Jo
again thanks for the reply, the light of day is breaking. I have no objection to OBJECTIVITY. so what was wrong to what I had posted before?

see, I did go to your link, but did you go to mine? speaking of OBJECTIVITY

PICJAG
101G The "Spiritual Saboteur"
 

Bobby Jo

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... see, I did go to your link, but did you go to mine? ...

You provided a LINK which refutes the carefully presented Chronology which both Scripture and History document? Or did you simply post some affiliated Scriptures and then close your mind?

Bobby Jo
 

101G

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You provided a LINK which refutes the carefully presented Chronology which both Scripture and History document? Or did you simply post some affiliated Scriptures and then close your mind?

Bobby Jo
well any OBJECTIVITY just went out the door.

see ya.

PICJAG.
101G The "Spiritual Saboteur"
 

Bobby Jo

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... see ya. ...
... hopefully not unless you've gained some integrity/honesty/maturity ...




New Testament Chronology,
(Lewiston, NY: Edwin Mellen Press, 1990)
Kenneth Frank Doig
New Testament Chronology - The Division of Abijah

Chapter 6
THE SIXTH MONTH

II. The Syro-Macedonian Calendar
What calendar system would be used by Luke? Luke was a Greek from Antioch, and he wrote his gospel to Theophilus, another Greek in Antioch. The calendar system in use there was the Syro-Macedonian calendar, introduced by Alexander the Great over three centuries earlier. This calendar was the basis of the Seleucid Era, the standard for dating throughout the Middle East for many centuries. This calendar was likely that used by the Herods and other Eastern rulers for one method of dating their reigns. This Syro-Macedonian calendar is the expected reference by Luke.

Chapter 7
THE DIVISION OF ABIJAH ...


V. Conclusion
Based on the division of Jehoiarib having been on duty during the destruction of the Second Temple in 70 CE, it is possible to establish the weeks in which the division of Abijah served during the time of Zacharias. When Zacharias burned incense the "whole multitude" were outside in prayer. It is expected that such a multitude would only be present at one of the three required feasts. In 6 BCE the Feast of Tabernacles overlapped the regular serving of the division of Abijah. It would be at this time that the angel Gabriel appeared to Zacharias. If Elizabeth became pregnant with John the Baptist shortly after Zacharias returned home, then John was conceived about October 10, 6 BCE. The Annunciation of the conception of Jesus followed about five and a half months later, or about March 25, 5 BCE. Jesus was then born nine month later, about December 25, 5 BCE.

... versus the lazy and unreliable assertions most make:

What Year Was Jesus Born?

Dikkon Eberhart | Author
When was Jesus Born? What Year Was His Birth?


...
In my case, it’s October 30. If I were so vastly important that the world’s dating was to hinge on October 30, then the 365 days BEFORE my birth would be termed 1 B.D. (the final year before Dikkon) and the 365 days AFTER my birth would be termed 1 A.D. (the first year after Dikkon). ...



National Catholic REGISTER:
What year was Jesus born? The answer may surprise you

What year was Jesus born? The answer may surprise you

...
The Alogoi -- 4 B.C. or A.D. 9
Cassiodorus Senator -- 3 B.C.
St. Irenaeus of Lyon -- 3 B.C. or 2 B.C.
St. Clement of Alexandria -- 3 B.C. or 2 B.C.
Tertullian of Carthage -- 3 B.C. or 2 B.C.
Julius Africanus -- 3 B.C. or 2 B.C.
St. Hippolytus of Rome -- 3 B.C. or 2 B.C.
“Hippolytus of Thebes” -- 3 B.C. or 2 B.C.
Origen of Alexandria -- 3 B.C. or 2 B.C.
Eusebius of Caesarea -- 3 B.C. or 2 B.C.
Epiphanius of Salamis -- 3 B.C. or 2 B.C.
Orosius --2 B.C.
Dionysius Exiguus -- 1 B.C.
The Chronographer of the Year 354 -- A.D. 1

...
We thus have strong indication--from a careful reading of Matthew, from Luke, and from the Church Fathers--that Jesus was born in 3 or 2 B.C.



Yeah, it's all carved in stone, until you realize it's most carved in peoples expectations. And then the REAL WORK begins, -- or ends depending on whether people are too lazy to find out, or have an alternate agenda which supersedes the Scriptural Evidence.

No Shortage of BLISSFUL (read: IGNORANT) people here!
Bobby Jo
 
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Earburner

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When they had crossed over, Elijah said to Elisha, "Ask for whatever I may do for you, before I am taken from you." Elisha answered, "May I receive a double portion of your spirit."

What does it mean to have the spirit of Elijah?

Peace!
That is an interesting viewpoint:
"A double portion of your spirit".
That is exactly what John the Baptist and Jesus were together.
Being both physically born BY/OF THE Holy Spirit, John was an anointed person by God, to bare witness of who Jesus was. Then Jesus Himself, reveals that He is the faithful witness of who God is. Together, they were the annointed double portion of the spirit of Elijah.

On page four of this thread, "101G" provided an awesome account, showing that the two witnesses are none other than John and Jesus.
I have agreed with him, because I also did come to the same truth in my own study time awhile back.
Therefore, because we both know of it, and there are more I am sure, this knowledge is of no private interpretation.
 

Trekson

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In Roman 11, Apostle Paul revealed that the majority of un-believing Jews have been spiritually blinded by God's Own hand, until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in (which won't happen until Lord Jesus returns). So they cannot be put in that category of the "synagogue of Satan", because per prophecy like the end of Zechariah 12 when Jesus returns, they will understand their error, and the majority of them will repent to Jesus. These are who will want for the rocks and mountains to fall on them when Jesus is revealed coming in the clouds. Their wanting that is a marker of their shame for that time. But the crept in unawares among them, that hide, they will not repent then. Yet even the tares will indeed bow to Christ whether they like it or not, and that is what Jesus is pointing to with the idea of their being made to come worship Christ at the feet of His elect during the future Millennium (Revelation 3:9).

It won't just be the jews wanting to hide from christ, but the whole world.
 

Stumpmaster

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Just in case anyone has bought into the error presented on this forum that Jesus is one of the two witnesses mentioned here...

Rev 11:8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.

...please be advised of the following:

Rom 6:8-10
Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him: (9) Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dies no more; death has no more dominion over him. (10) For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he lives, he lives unto God.
 
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Bobby Jo

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Just in case anyone has bought into the error presented on this forum that Jesus is one of the two witnesses mentioned here...

Well stated, -- but the "church" is uninformed and lazy, starting from the commentators, to the Hirelings, to the membership. And who can confront all the misinformation/disinformation?!?

There's a REASON for the Great Falling Away.
Bobby Jo
 
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Davy

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It won't just be the jews wanting to hide from christ, but the whole world.

I refer specifically to what Lord Jesus said to those in Jerusalem when He was on His way to be crucified, see Luke 23:27-30. That specifically is pointing to the Jews in Jerusalem.
 

101G

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Just in case anyone has bought into the error presented on this forum that Jesus is one of the two witnesses mentioned here...

Rev 11:8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.

...please be advised of the following:

Rom 6:8-10
Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him: (9) Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dies no more; death has no more dominion over him. (10) For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he lives, he lives unto God.
GINOLJC, to all.
First thanks for the reply, second, there are two DEATHS. the first death is from the natural flesh which our Lord died from, supportive scripture, Revelation 1:17 "And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:"
Revelation 1:18 "I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death."

NOW, knowing that he died a natural death in flesh, back to Revelation 11:8 "And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified."
dead bodies shall lie in the street is a representative symbol of a violent death, or a shameful death. for he was crucified with the guilty, yet himself innocent. in our slang today, "street violence", as we say someone died a horrible death. John beheaded, the Lord Jesus crucified, violent deaths. that's about the worst it could be in that time and day.

now, the Great city called Sodom and Egypt spiritually is none other than Jerusalem itself, (who kills the prophets), and "WHERE OUR LORD WAS CRUCIFIED", that's Jerusalem. spiritually, Isaiah 1:8 "And the daughter of Zion is left as a cottage in a vineyard, as a lodge in a garden of cucumbers, as a besieged city."Isaiah 1:9 "Except the LORD of hosts had left unto us a very small remnant, we should have been as Sodom, and we should have been like unto Gomorrah."
and Spiritually Egypt? Isaiah 51:9 "Awake, awake, put on strength, O arm of the LORD; awake, as in the ancient days, in the generations of old. Art thou not it that hath cut Rahab, and wounded the dragon?" for the TERM "Rahab" was addressed to Jerusalem, listen, Isaiah 51:17 "Awake, awake, stand up, O Jerusalem, which hast drunk at the hand of the LORD the cup of his fury; thou hast drunken the dregs of the cup of trembling, and wrung them out." and this,
and the TERM "Rahab is a spiritual name for "Egypt". in hebrew at Isaiah 51:9 it is,
H7294 רַהַב Rahab (rah'-haɓ) n-m.
Rahab (i.e. boaster), an epithet of Egypt.
[the same as H7293]
KJV: Rahab.
Root(s): H7293

BINGO, an epithet of Egypt.

in Revelation 18:10 "Standing afar off for the fear of her torment, saying, Alas, alas, that great city Babylon, that mighty city! for in one hour is thy judgment come”. here, the code name for Jerusalem is that "GREAT CITY". in Revelation 17:18 "And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth”. and that cup in the woman hand Isaiah describe clearly, again, Isaiah 51:17 "Awake, awake, stand up, O Jerusalem, which hast drunk at the hand of the LORD the cup of his fury; thou hast drunken the dregs of the cup of trembling, and wrung them out."

The “GREAT CITY” is Jerusalem. which is spiritually called Rahab/Egypt, and Sodom. BINGO.

so all you who say that the Roman Catholic Church is that "Great City" the scarlet woman with the cup in here hand, well get off the Roman Catholic Church backs with that nonesense. face the facts, it's the old dragon seat "Jerusalem".

so Rev 11:8 "And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified". well it proved out that the city is Jerusalem.

PICJAG.
101G The "Spiritual Saboteur"

Another successful sabotage operation.... :p
 

101G

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Well stated, -- but the "church" is uninformed and lazy, starting from the commentators, to the Hirelings, to the membership. And who can confront all the misinformation/disinformation?!?

There's a REASON for the Great Falling Away.
Bobby Jo
yes there is a reason for the GREAT falling away.... 2 Thessalonians 2:9 "Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,"
2 Thessalonians 2:10 "And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved." (one might want to read that again).
2 Thessalonians 2:11 "And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:" BINGO.
2 Thessalonians 2:12 "That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness." BINGO.

those who believe NOT, NOT, NOT the truth. you been duped by the great deceptor, that old dragon, the devil.
again I say it, "YE HAVE NOT BECAUSE YE ASK NOT".

Isaiah 66:4 "I also will choose their delusions, and will bring their fears upon them; because when I called, none did answer; when I spake, they did not hear: but they did evil before mine eyes, and chose that in which I delighted not." BINGO.

God as in 2 Thessalonians 2:11 has chose your delusion ...... :eek: ...yikes!, as MC Hammer said, "I can't touch that". ..... :)

so unbelief and having pleasure in unrighteousness will get you in the "DEAD" zone, not end Zone, but it'll be a END.... (smile). just re-read post #117.

PICJAG.
101G The "Spiritual Saboteur"
 

Trekson

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I refer specifically to what Lord Jesus said to those in Jerusalem when He was on His way to be crucified, see Luke 23:27-30. That specifically is pointing to the Jews in Jerusalem.

Certainly Israel will experience this as well but its plain to me that Rev. 6:16 is speaking to mostly the gentile nations.