I've explained that already.
This and the other Mary threads are just going round and round and have become Catholic bashing threds pages ago.
I'm opting out of all of them
Biblical Mary
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I've explained that already.
This and the other Mary threads are just going round and round and have become Catholic bashing threds pages ago.
I'm opting out of all of them
it’s the immaculate conception of Mary!
and the miraculous conception of Jesus by the power of the Holy Spirit!
Eternally Grateful
Well-Known Member
Christ never founded a church that teaches salvation by “faith alone”!
salvation is by grace
matt 24:13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
Matthew 10:22
And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.
Mark 13:13
And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
Rev 2:26 And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:
Heb 3:14 For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end;
Heb 6:11 And we desire that every one of you do shew the same diligence to the full assurance of hope unto the end:
1. Romans 11:22 – God’s kindness, if you continue in His kindness
2. Colossians 1:21-23 – holy and blameless, if you continue in the faith"
3. The race of faith: the example of Paul
4. Hebrews 12:22-25: "we shall not escape if we turn away from Him"
5. Hebrews 4:1-3, 9-12: "strive to enter the rest of God"
6.Hebrews 6:4-9 – those who became partakers of the holy spirit and fell away
7. Hebrews 10:23-29, 35-39: "if we sin willfully", "if anyone draws back".
8. Matthew 24:13: He that endures to the end, the same shall be saved
9. Hebrews 3:4-6: Holding fast our confidence firm until the end
10. Matthew 24:13: "But the one who endures to the end will be saved"
11. 1 John 2:24-25 – "if what you heard from the beginning abides in you"
12. 2 John 8-9 : to "everyone who goes on ahead and does not abide in the teaching of Christ
13. 2 Peter 1:5-11 : "Make every effort to supplement your faith"
14. Philippians 2:12-16: "work out your salvation with fear and trembling"
15. 1 Timothy 6:10-16: the love of money
16. Galatians 5:2-4 "Severed from Christ"
17. 2 Timothy 2:11-13: "if we deny him, he will also deny us"
18. James 5:19-20: the wandered brother
19. Some will abandon the faith
20. 1 Timothy 5:8: "he has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever"
22. The real family of Jesus: "Those who hear the Word of God and do it"
23. 1 Corinthians 5:5: "so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord"
24. Peter 2: "It would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness"
25. Jude: "Turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness" - a much relevant warning
26. 1 Cor. 9:27 ....Lest I myself might become a castaway
Romans 13:11
And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.
So salvation by “faith alone” is completely false and impossible!
[QUOTE
how are you going to obey the commands Christ gave to the apostles?
matt 28:19-20
19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.
they are commanded to you but to the apostles, but you are still required to obey them, how?
how are you going to obey the commands Christ gave to the apostles?
matt 28:19-20
19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.
they are commanded to you but to the apostles, but you are still required to obey them, how?
And it refers to redemption not justification or salvation@Tong2020 Ephesians 2 is a great chapter!
salvation cannot be by faith alone!
Romans 13:11
And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.
see below
Redemption, Justification, Sanctification, and Salvation!
Redemption: 100 percent the work of God, thru the life, death, resurrection, and ascension of Jesus Christ! All mankind are redeemed in Christ! Eph 2
Galatians 2:16 3:13
Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law...
Christ alone accomplished the redemption of mankind apart from any works on our part!
(Redemption is not Salvation)
Rom 5:10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.
Justification: our acceptance of redemption thru faith and baptism! Become a disciple and member of Christ and His Church! Jn 3:5 acts 2:38 Mk 16:16 He who believes and is baptized shall be saved. 1 Corinthians 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
Sanctification: the life of grace in the holy sacrifice of the mass and sacraments, prayer, virture, and good works, the just living by faith, and faith working thru love! Phil 1:29 called to suffer with Christ.
All done in Christ thru His grace! Jn 15:5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
Salvation: a christian in the state if grace at the moment of death we enter into the salvation of the Lord! Mt 24:44-47 faithful servant! Jn 15:1-5 abide in me. Mt 24:13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
Heb 3:14 For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end;
Heb 6:11 And we desire that every one of you do shew the same diligence to the full assurance of hope unto the end:
Heb 4:14 For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end;
Rom 13:11 ...for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.
Suffering required for glorification with Christ!
Romans 8:17
And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.
2 Timothy 2:12
If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us:
Justification and salvation are not the same rom 5:9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.
1 Pet 3:20
Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.
21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!
(Ark of Noah a type of the church, member of Christ and his church and salvation by baptism!)
(Outside the ark all died and outside the church there is no salvation!)
The holy church is the ark of grace and salvation!
Redemption: 100 percent the work of God, thru the life, death, resurrection, and ascension of Jesus Christ! All mankind are redeemed in Christ! Eph 2
Galatians 2:16 3:13
Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law...
Christ alone accomplished the redemption of mankind apart from any works on our part!
(Redemption is not Salvation)
Rom 5:10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.
Justification: our acceptance of redemption thru faith and baptism! Become a disciple and member of Christ and His Church! Jn 3:5 acts 2:38 Mk 16:16 He who believes and is baptized shall be saved. 1 Corinthians 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
Sanctification: the life of grace in the holy sacrifice of the mass and sacraments, prayer, virture, and good works, the just living by faith, and faith working thru love! Phil 1:29 called to suffer with Christ.
All done in Christ thru His grace! Jn 15:5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
Salvation: a christian in the state if grace at the moment of death we enter into the salvation of the Lord! Mt 24:44-47 faithful servant! Jn 15:1-5 abide in me. Mt 24:13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
Heb 3:14 For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end;
Heb 6:11 And we desire that every one of you do shew the same diligence to the full assurance of hope unto the end:
Heb 4:14 For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end;
Rom 13:11 ...for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.
Suffering required for glorification with Christ!
Romans 8:17
And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.
2 Timothy 2:12
If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us:
Justification and salvation are not the same rom 5:9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.
1 Pet 3:20
Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.
21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!
(Ark of Noah a type of the church, member of Christ and his church and salvation by baptism!)
(Outside the ark all died and outside the church there is no salvation!)
The holy church is the ark of grace and salvation!
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I believe the basic church congregations as seven...
The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the seven churches. Unto the angel of the church of Ephesus write; These things saith he that holdeth the seven stars in his right hand, who walketh in the midst of the seven golden candlesticks; - Revelation 1:20 - Revelation 2:1
Ephesus - Messianic - Beginning with the Apostle to the Circumcision, Peter
Smyrna - Martyr - Beginning with the Apostle to the Un-Circumcision, Paul
Pergamos - Orthodoxy formed in this time... Pergos is a tower... Needed in the dark ages
Thyatira - Catholicism formed in this time - The spirit of Jezebel is to control and to dominate.
Sardis - Protestantism formed in this time- A sardius is a gem - elegant yet hard and rigid
Philadelphia - Wesleyism formed in this time - To be sanctioned is to acquire it with love.
Laodicea - Charismatic movement formed in this time.
Candlesticks - Seven church congregations
Stars - Individuals within the congregations, all held in the right hand of Christ
Seals - The seven seals sealed each congregation within the lambs book of life
And I wept much, because no man was found worthy to open and to read the book, neither to look thereon. - Revelation 5:4
I am glad, though, that I did not live in Thyatirean times. I believe the Catholic Church is indeed a Church Christian, but I also believe she will have plenty of company in that last day.
The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the seven churches. Unto the angel of the church of Ephesus write; These things saith he that holdeth the seven stars in his right hand, who walketh in the midst of the seven golden candlesticks; - Revelation 1:20 - Revelation 2:1
Ephesus - Messianic - Beginning with the Apostle to the Circumcision, Peter
Smyrna - Martyr - Beginning with the Apostle to the Un-Circumcision, Paul
Pergamos - Orthodoxy formed in this time... Pergos is a tower... Needed in the dark ages
Thyatira - Catholicism formed in this time - The spirit of Jezebel is to control and to dominate.
Sardis - Protestantism formed in this time- A sardius is a gem - elegant yet hard and rigid
Philadelphia - Wesleyism formed in this time - To be sanctioned is to acquire it with love.
Laodicea - Charismatic movement formed in this time.
Candlesticks - Seven church congregations
Stars - Individuals within the congregations, all held in the right hand of Christ
Seals - The seven seals sealed each congregation within the lambs book of life
And I wept much, because no man was found worthy to open and to read the book, neither to look thereon. - Revelation 5:4
I am glad, though, that I did not live in Thyatirean times. I believe the Catholic Church is indeed a Church Christian, but I also believe she will have plenty of company in that last day.
Pythagorean12
Active Member
She is the mother of God in that Emmanuel was The Word made flesh who dwelt among us. Emmanuel = God with us. It doesn't get more clear than that. God with us.
Therein Mary, chosen by God to bear him to life as a human son, that word he made flesh, is indeed the mother of Emmanuel, Jesus. And being who Jesus was, she is rightly called the mother of God.
But she's not to be worshiped. Nor asked to act as emissary between ourselves and God. We are indwelt by God's holy spirit. We have a person to God connection. No need for a party line.
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Agreed…
10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.
11 This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.
12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved. - Acts 4
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I must say that in both the Catholic and Orthodox Church Mary seems to play a prominent role.I believe the basic church congregations as seven...
The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the seven churches. Unto the angel of the church of Ephesus write; These things saith he that holdeth the seven stars in his right hand, who walketh in the midst of the seven golden candlesticks; - Revelation 1:20 - Revelation 2:1
Ephesus - Messianic - Beginning with the Apostle to the Circumcision, Peter
Smyrna - Martyr - Beginning with the Apostle to the Un-Circumcision, Paul
Pergamos - Orthodoxy formed in this time... Pergos is a tower... Needed in the dark ages
Thyatira - Catholicism formed in this time - The spirit of Jezebel is to control and to dominate.
Sardis - Protestantism formed in this time- A sardius is a gem - elegant yet hard and rigid
Philadelphia - Wesleyism formed in this time - To be sanctioned is to acquire it with love.
Laodicea - Charismatic movement formed in this time.
Candlesticks - Seven church congregations
Stars - Individuals within the congregations, all held in the right hand of Christ
Seals - The seven seals sealed each congregation within the lambs book of life
And I wept much, because no man was found worthy to open and to read the book, neither to look thereon. - Revelation 5:4
I am glad, though, that I did not live in Thyatirean times. I believe the Catholic Church is indeed a Church Christian, but I also believe she will have plenty of company in that last day.
Is not this the carpenter, the son of Mary, the brother of James, and Joses, and of Juda, and Simon? and are not his sisters here with us? And they were offended at him. - Mark 6:3
The Gospel of Mark (6:3) and the Gospel of Matthew (13:55–56) mention James, Joseph/Joses, Judas/Jude and Simon as brothers of Jesus, the son of Mary. The same verses also mention unnamed sisters of Jesus. ... That the brothers were children of both Mary and Joseph was held by some in the early centuries and us in the later centuries as well.
Pythagorean12
Active Member
Imagine being the sister or brother of God, the word made flesh, as he delivers his ministry.
Sibling rivalry? I think not.
Sibling rivalry? I think not.
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But other of the apostles saw I none, save James the Lord's brother. - Galatians 1:19
I bet that was entertaining and would have made a great book of the Bible had Paul written of the conversations!
Pythagorean12
Active Member
There are the accounts of Thomas.
The Lost Books of the Bible: Thomas's Gospel of the Infancy of Jesus Christ
Salvation is of God
Salvation is by God
Salvation is by grace
Salvation is through faith
Salvation is in God, in Christ Jesus, in the gospel.
Read about Abraham, Isaac, Jacob,……they were chosen by grace and were saved by God
Read about Peter and the other apostles, Paul…. They were chosen and saved by God.
Read about the remnants of Israel and the Gentiles in Acts 13:48….They were chosen and saved by God.
Tong
R4717
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But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name. - John 20:31
I believe the basic church congregations as seven...
The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the seven churches. Unto the angel of the church of Ephesus write; These things saith he that holdeth the seven stars in his right hand, who walketh in the midst of the seven golden candlesticks; - Revelation 1:20 - Revelation 2:1
Ephesus - Messianic - Beginning with the Apostle to the Circumcision, Peter
Smyrna - Martyr - Beginning with the Apostle to the Un-Circumcision, Paul
Pergamos - Orthodoxy formed in this time... Pergos is a tower... Needed in the dark ages
Thyatira - Catholicism formed in this time - The spirit of Jezebel is to control and to dominate.
Sardis - Protestantism formed in this time- A sardius is a gem - elegant yet hard and rigid
Philadelphia - Wesleyism formed in this time - To be sanctioned is to acquire it with love.
Laodicea - Charismatic movement formed in this time.
Candlesticks - Seven church congregations
Stars - Individuals within the congregations, all held in the right hand of Christ
Seals - The seven seals sealed each congregation within the lambs book of life
And I wept much, because no man was found worthy to open and to read the book, neither to look thereon. - Revelation 5:4
I am glad, though, that I did not live in Thyatirean times. I believe the Catholic Church is indeed a Church Christian, but I also believe she will have plenty of company in that last day.
no there is only one church one flock Jn 16:13 located in different places
I agree with all but the last part read Jn 2 they have no wine vs 11 the disciples believed cos of Mary’s intercession
Blessing from God thru Mary!
All graces come to us they Mary, from God by the merits (blood) of Christ!
Jn 1:16
Of His fullness we have all received, grace for grace!
Salvation Lk 1:30
Consented to our salvation Lk 1:38
Mother of Christ Matt 1:16
Mother of the word Jn 1:1
Mother of our savior Matt 1:21
Mother of our salvation Lk 2:30
Our mother Jn 19:26-27
Elizabeth filled with the Holy Spirit!
Lk 1:41 And it came to pass, that, when Elisabeth heard the salutation of Mary, the babe leaped in her womb; and Elisabeth was filled with the Holy Ghost:
John sanctified in the womb!
Lk 1:15 For he shall be great in the sight of the Lord, and shall drink neither wine nor strong drink; and he shall be filled with the Holy Ghost, even from his mother's womb.
Lk 1:44 For, lo, as soon as the voice of thy salutation sounded in mine ears, the babe leaped in my womb for joy.
Zacharias is filled with the Holy Spirit and prophecy!
Lk 1:67 And his father Zacharias was filled with the Holy Ghost, and prophesied, saying,
The wedding couple have wine and not shame!
Jn 2: 10 And saith unto him, Every man at the beginning doth set forth good wine; and when men have well drunk, then that which is worse: but thou hast kept the good wine until now.
The disciples are supplied with faith, hope, and charity!
11 This beginning of miracles did Jesus in Cana of Galilee, and manifested forth his glory; and his disciples believed on him.
All these blessings from God because of Mary most holy!
Mother of Divine Grace!
Hebrews 4:16
Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.
The throne of Grace is the throne of Mary the ever Virgin mother of God!
We come boldly to this throne cause Mary is our mother and advocate!
Mary is the storehouse of divine graces!
Lk 1:28
And the angel entered to her, and said, Hail Mary, full of grace; the Lord is with thee; blessed be thou among women.
All graces come from the merits of Christ, from His passion and death and come thru Mary to the glory of Her only begotten Son!
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