Did Jesus claim to be God?

Truthnightmare said:

Jewish law is oral, The law Christ spoke of was written. Jesus did not teach from Jewish scripture… Why do you think they wanted to and killed Him…

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The Jews wanted to kill Jesus because he exposed them as the liars and hypocrites that they were….after Jesus had resurrected Lazarus, the Pharisees were fearful, not of Jesus, but of the Romans…what were they afraid of losing? God’s favor….or the nice little niche they had created for themselves under Roman rule?
”…the chief priests and the Pharisees gathered the Sanʹhe·drin together and said: “What are we to do, for this man performs many signs? 48 If we let him go on this way, they will all put faith in him, and the Romans will come and take away both our place and our nation.” (John 11:47-48)

Jesus and his apostles quoted from the Hebrew Scriptures and even today we can read the scriptures from which they quoted. The oral law is what was corrupted. Very open to misinterpretation, which is why God had his word recorded by trusted “secretaries…..and preserved down to this day.

When Jesus corrected the teachings of the Pharisees, he stated “You heard it was said…..but I say to you…” Jesus was talking about the oral law, then he used God’s word to refine the teaching and even outlined the steps leading to a sinful action so as to avoid them. (e.g. Matt 5:27-30)
You seem ill equipped to debate anything if you don’t even know the fundamentals…

And if you want to pit one scholar over another….there are many to choose from….who speaks the truth?…all of them or none of them? God knows.

Wayne222 said:

You seem emotional about the subject. My opinion is you deny Jesus being God that is a grave error. It is Antichrist in my opinion.

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Opinions will count for nothing when the judgment comes….there is only truth and delusion according to Paul….God will grant both…he will “draw” right hearted ones to HIS truth (John 6:44)….but allow the deluded ones to cling to their delusions without correction….he tells us why….
2 Thess 2:9-12…
”But the lawless one’s presence is by the operation of Satan with every powerful work and lying signs and wonders 10 and every unrighteous deception for those who are perishing, as a retribution because they did not accept the love of the truth in order that they might be saved. 11 That is why God lets a strong delusion mislead them so that they may come to believe the lie, 12 in order that they all may be judged because they did not believe the truth but took pleasure in unrighteousness.”

These ones have no love for the truth….the lies suit what they want to believe…..
Fortunately for us, we are not the judge of who is right and who is wrong….Jesus has been given that job…and he cannot be fooled as easily as we can.

Some of us, “few” will be still standing but “many” of us to our horror, will not pass muster….(Matt 7:13-14; 21-23)
Its really not a case of WHAT you believe, so much as WHO you believe….

Cassandra said:

There are disagreements among Christians here.

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My issue is when people basically deny this--when they baselessly assert that trinitarians cannot have eternal life.

GracePeace said:

My issue is when people basically deny this--when they baselessly assert that trinitarians cannot have eternal life.

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Well, a JW here clearly stated that "JW's are the only religion Jesus is with".

Aunty Jane said:

The Jews wanted to kill Jesus because he exposed them as the liars and hypocrites that they were….after Jesus had resurrected Lazarus, the Pharisees were fearful, not of Jesus, but of the Romans…what were they afraid of losing? God’s favor….or the nice little niche they had created for themselves under Roman rule?
”…the chief priests and the Pharisees gathered the Sanʹhe·drin together and said: “What are we to do, for this man performs many signs? 48 If we let him go on this way, they will all put faith in him, and the Romans will come and take away both our place and our nation.” (John 11:47-48)

Jesus and his apostles quoted from the Hebrew Scriptures and even today we can read the scriptures from which they quoted. The oral law is what was corrupted. Very open to misinterpretation, which is why God had his word recorded by trusted “secretaries…..and preserved down to this day.

When Jesus corrected the teachings of the Pharisees, he stated “You heard it was said…..but I say to you…” Jesus was talking about the oral law, then he used God’s word to refine the teaching and even outlined the steps leading to a sinful action so as to avoid them. (e.g. Matt 5:27-30)
You seem ill equipped to debate anything if you don’t even know the fundamentals…

And if you want to pit one scholar over another….there are many to choose from….who speaks the truth?…all of them or none of them? God knows.

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I agree, nevertheless, the fundamentals of scripture differs from each person.

Jack said:

Well, a JW here clearly stated that "JW's are the only religion Jesus is with".

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Yeah, that's what I'm saying--I look at this discussion as one that is occurring between Christian siblings, among saints, but they do not. I'm starting to think maybe God really isn't with JWs, because this weird rabidness is a pattern I'm seeing with them. They just desperately want to win an argument, they don't care that they are full of hatred in the meantime--beside being absolutely nutty, interpreting a symbolic number in a symbolic book (144,000 in Revelation) literally. LOL

GracePeace said:

Yeah, that's what I'm saying--I look at this discussion as one that is occurring between Christian siblings, among saints, but they do not. I'm starting to think maybe God really isn't with JWs, because this weird rabidness is a pattern I'm seeing with them. They just desperately want to win an argument, they don't care that they are full of hatred in the meantime--beside being absolutely nutty, interpreting a symbolic number in a symbolic book (144,000 in Revelation) literally. LOL

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It’s rather complicated

Jack said:

Well, a JW here clearly stated that "JW's are the only religion Jesus is with".

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The JWs didn’t start until around 1870, was God against everyone before then…

Truthnightmare said:

The JWs didn’t start until around 1870, was God against everyone before then…

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Very good point!

Jack said:

Very good point!

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The JWs have a doctrine that teaches only 144,000 go to heaven…
What many don’t know is when you go to Passover, and they pass around the wine and bread, no one partakes because it’s only for the 144,000. (They’re special)
When they passed the wine I drank and ate the bread… my wife did also…..

We were the only ones out of 250 people who participated… and the looks we received for doing so were awkward to say the least.

But we are simple… Jesus said do this in the remembrance of of me… No doctrine of men will prevent me from obeying this.

Nothing against JWs but traditions of men make void the word of God.

Johann said:

And I can give you a ton of other rabbinical and scholars writings.

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How do you pick your scholars Johann? What makes one scholar superior to another in their interpretation of scripture…..whoever it is that we look to for teaching God’s truth, they actually have to be teaching it as it is written, and not just their version of it…..scholarly as it might seem….lies can sound like truth to the untrained ear.

Look how widely the “theory” of evolution has been accepted in the scientific community, just on the word and opinion of so-called experts. Despite the fact that there is not a single shred of actual evidence for their “theory”, doesn’t seem to matter in the big scheme of things…..like celebrity endorsements for products doesn’t mean the product is good….they just pay the celebrity enough to make people believe that it is. It actually takes more faith to believe in evolution and it’s proponents than it does to believe in an intelligent Creator…..could the devil use the same MO in religion? Why not?

The devil has practiced his art of deception for as long as humans have existed….he knows human nature better than we do….and he knows what works in his tool box of human traps and temptations, because his MO is so successful, he has never needed to change it. It’s the reason why history repeats…human generations come and go, and they forget the lessons of the past….the devil never does.

Aunty Jane said:

How do you pick your scholars Johann? What makes one scholar superior to another in their interpretation of scripture…..whoever it is that we look to for teaching God’s truth, they actually have to be teaching it as it is written, and not just their version of it…..scholarly as it might seem….lies can sound like truth to the untrained ear.

Look how widely the “theory” of evolution has been accepted in the scientific community, just on the word and opinion of so-called experts. Despite the fact that there is not a single shred of actual evidence for their “theory”, doesn’t seem to matter in the big scheme of things…..like celebrity endorsements for products doesn’t mean the product is good….they just pay the celebrity enough to make people believe that it is. It actually takes more faith to believe in evolution and it’s proponents than it does to believe in an intelligent Creator…..could they devil use the same MO in religion? Why not?

The devil has practiced his art of deception for as long as humans have existed….he knows human nature better than we do….and he knows what works in his tool box of human traps and temptations, because his MO is so successful, he has never needed to change it. It’s the reason why history repeats…human generations come and go, and they forget the lessons of the past….the devil never does.

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The same can be asked of anyone..

What Bible do you use? When you choose you have decided on translators and scholars over others.

Truthnightmare said:

I agree, nevertheless, the fundamentals of scripture differs from each person.

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They never differ for God though, do they? The truth is there, in amongst all that confusion created by God’s adversary….just as the “wheat” are there among the “weeds” planted by the devil….God and his appointed judge know the difference.…and soon the separation will be complete.

Truthnightmare said:

The same can be asked of anyone..

What Bible do you use? When you choose you have decided on translators and scholars over others.

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Indeed…in a world of endless choices the devil makes sure that you have so many choices that it is difficult to make sense of anything…..he is the god of confusion and he has the ability to “blind the minds” of those who want to believe what is not true. (2 Cor 4:3-4) These are not blinded eyes but he tampers with the control centre of all our senses….our minds….so ears will not hear and eyes will not see because they don’t want to...and God will not correct them because they have no love for the truth when they hear it….

Aunty Jane said:

How do you pick your scholars Johann?

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Such irony! lol

A good start would be to avoid Kingdom Hall like the plague it is.

Are you the JW who said, "JW's are the only religion Jesus is with!"?

Aunty Jane said:

Indeed…in a world of endless choices the devil makes sure that you have so many choices that it is difficult to make sense of anything…..he is the god of confusion and he has the ability to “blind the minds” of those who want to believe what is not true. (2 Cor 4:3-4) These are not blinded eyes but he tampers with the control centre of all our senses….our minds….so ears will not hear and eyes will not see because they don’t want to...and God will not correct them because they have no love for the truth when they hear it….

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Absolutely, it is up to everyone of us to correctly determine truth … as it is written..

Isaiah 30
And though the Lord give you the bread of adversity, and the water of affliction, yet shall not thy teachers be removed into a corner any more, but thine eyes shall see thy teachers:

And thine ears shall hear a word behind thee, saying, This is the way, walk ye in it, when ye turn to the right hand, and when ye turn to the left.

Jack said:

Sounds like the JW twist. The Bible insists that Jesus is God!

John 20 Thomas said to Jesus, "My Lord and MY GOD"!

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How so, it was the Spirit of God in Jesus were in He manifested Himself? If we are of that same Spirit should we not manifest the same that Christ did?

Aunty Jane said:

Please find us “God the Son” mentioned anywhere in scripture. That term was invented by the Catholic church, along with “God the Holy Spirit“…..neither of which are spoken about in the Bible at all.
”God the Father” IS mentioned several times. There is no mention of a “godhead”…a word also invented by the apostate church. Are you Catholic by any chance RN? What truth ever came out of Roman Catholicism? The same kind of twisted truth that came out of Judaism….mirror images of one another. Replacing God’s word with man made traditions. (Matt 15:7-9)

Do people forget that Jesus was Jewish? He was raised Jewish and and taught from Jewish scripture….
The God of Israel was “one Yahweh” (Deut 6:4)….he was never three.

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God head is in the bible.

Acts 17:29
Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device.

Romans 1:20
For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

Colossians 2:9
For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

So you have been misinformed.

Deut. 6:4 uses the compound one of Hebrew as well as Elohim which is the plural of elowah!

John 5:18
Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God.

John 1:1

King James Version

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1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

2 Corinthians 3:17
Now the Lord(Yahweh) is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.

Jesus and the Holy Spirit are equally divine as God the Father. so the terms god God the Son and God the Holy Spirit are used to differentiate the epersons within the Godhead!

Waiting on him said:

How so, it was the Spirit of God in Jesus were in He manifested Himself? If we are of that same Spirit should we not manifest the same that Christ did?

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We are not God. Jesus is.

Peter said to Jesus, "Lord you know ALL THINGS". ONLY God knows all things. Thomas and Peter knew Jesus personally. They knew He is God!

Jack said:

We are not God. Jesus is.

Peter said to Jesus, "Lord you know ALL THINGS". ONLY God knows all things. Thomas and Peter knew Jesus personally. They knew He is God!

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So much for what Peter understood at this time.
But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father.
— Mark 13:32

Waiting on him said:

So much for what Peter understood at this time.
But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father.
— Mark 13:32

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Peter was taught directly by Jesus. Who taught you?