I found this in an unsuccesful thread and it's absolutley true, full of wisdom, and personally feels like it could come out of Gods own mouth. "I am new here and have been reading over some threads and already see contention and division in this board. Its not surprising really... there are divisions and fightings among the churches we fellowship in every Sunday, so how much more will there be sharp words and unloving behavior among internet fellowships with ppl we don't know personally or ever come face-to-face with? This type of thing is a perversion that has been with the Church since the days of Paul, and personally I feel it is Satan's greatest "tee hee hee" in the Body of Christ. I find it amazing that in just about every epistle the writer takes a moment to command the churches to "be of one mind, one spirit, forsake not the assembly, love one another, walk in one accord", and yet we as the church seem to take extra precautions to make sure that those verses never become a reality. Jesus Christ taught us the power of unity ("when two or three are gathered in My name...") and even made it a point to ask the Father that we would all be one as He and Him were one. It is any wonder why we face such spiritual oppoistion when it comes to unity? I honestly believe that the biggest problem among the Body at this point is not simply false doctrine. Our Lord promised that the wheats and the tares would be seperated in due time. The Family of God's problem is that, thousands of years down the line, we still have not come to terms with the fact that we need each other." - Apple of his eye Just thought it was to Good for everybody to miss.
The problem with christianity today!!!
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Jon-Marc
New Member
I have been saying that for a long time. There is very little unity among believers. We fight and bicker over which day to worship on when we should be worshiping God and fellowshipping with believers EVERY day.Churches split because of an argument over the color of the new carpet. I heard of a church where that happened. Another church split because some windows were filled in on the back of the church building for security reasons without everyone being consulted first. Many got in a big huff and left. Then they wrote letters to people in the church accusing the pastor and deacons of misusing church funds.There are churches in the same denomination that won't associate with others of their denomination because of minor differences of scripture interpretation. The problem with scripture interpretation is that too many people rely on their own limited wisdom and understanding instead of relying on the Holy Spirit for the interpretation. That is where all the division and lack of unity begins. Satan sits back and delights in his efforts to separate believers. He doesn't attack from outside; he does it from within. Infiltrate, divide, and conquer.
I see that too and that was the reason I pulled away from Christianity . It was only until I saw that my eyes must be on God not man and by allowing man to make my decisions and running to people with my problems that I was disappointed and angry and so many other emotions.. I see know that I have to put my trust in God, not man. Too much discord, people tend to think and see what they want and to perceive things according to their thoughts and our thought are not always God's thoughts.Humans, get caught up in the dogmatic rules of What the Church is. Too much judgement and narrow minded thinking. Wrong thinking , wrong mind sets and fear that is controlling the church. Great post!
Thanks for bringing back this thread. We did need to see it. The real problem is called "Christian immaturity". We are not acting like Christ because we are not letting His Spirit control us. We are feeding on the milk- not even desiring the meat of the Word of God. He gives us all of Himself (John 3:34), yet we don't give Him all of us. We hold back "rooms" within us and keep them dark. We don't want the Holy Spirit to "turn the light on" in those rooms because they are our areas of weakness and we just might have to repent and rely on Him to improve in these areas. It may take diligence and self-sacrifice. I am definitely talking to myself. I hear the HS telling me quite clearly of the areas I need to get right. I want Him to knock on the doors that are already lit up! I want some areas to stay dormant. It's easier. That shouldn't be. We need to make a challenge to ourselves and those we love to hold each other accountable like the Word says. We need to love more deeply and not lie to each other. We need to be spending time reading the Bible so as to know by heart the Words of the Lord. Who knows? We may have these precious thoughts taken away from us one day! What will we have stored to remember Christ by and to strengthen ourselves with for a future hope? Thanks again for challenging me to be a better witness for Christ.
What a great post His by Grace you are so rightChristians today suffer from Amos 8:11 The churches today do not teach meat there is no contradictions in Gods Word it is with men and there playing one ups menshipwe are right no we are ect. ect. I see this everday my church says this or that in reality who should care if its not what God says that what should matter Not understanding all Gods meat is the problem when one is taught only milk they will swear thats the whole of it they refuse to see that meat is the subtance the milk only hints at the meat. In days of oldEvangelism was to bring one to the milk of the Word it was your minister/preacher teacher that was to then teach you the meat Today everyone is an Evangelist a Noble cause this should be only the start not the End result.but the minister/preachers/teachers no longer teach the meat they are evangelists alsoSo all we have is a bunch of milk teaching Evanglist with No teachers of Meatthus we have a true famine of the true word of God
I have seen this all over this board to. Masturbation-Some say NO,some say YES. Homosexuality- Some say yes,Some say No. Those are just two examples. What we are not doing is going straight to the bible and getting the information that says it is WRONG,yet we use the principles of society which now 90% percent or more of the time society has become wrong,what they have accepted now as normal,will never be right! We would most likely not argue if we taught BIBLE TEACHINGS,and not what one man thinks about sex before marriage or lying but what the BIBLE SAYS! I believe this is causing that contention and division! Leave the man assumed doctrines,beliefs out. Let the word of God in!
(Dukester;40727)
I have seen this all over this board to. Masturbation-Some say NO,some say YES. Homosexuality- Some say yes,Some say No. Those are just two examples. What we are not doing is going straight to the bible and getting the information that says it is WRONG,yet we use the principles of society which now 90% percent or more of the time society has become wrong,what they have accepted now as normal,will never be right! We would most likely not argue if we taught BIBLE TEACHINGS,and not what one man thinks about sex before marriage or lying but what the BIBLE SAYS!I believe this is causing that contention and division! Leave the man assumed doctrines,beliefs out. Let the word of God in!
I do not believe the problem is false doctrines. We all have different opinons on some issues and most of the time can back it up with evidence. There is only one doctrine, but will we ever fully know this doctrine until we meet God. No The problem is that while debating these doctrines we become catholics, and lutherans, and baptists, and evangelicals, and pentecostals, and nondenominations, and every other denomination in the planet. and forget who we are. We are christians, We are one in christ, We are one family. We are not 33,000 different groups, we are one group, in one spirit. Don't forget that. We all disagree on issues, but Christ is the center for all of us. From today on, may this forum be an example to the world, how christians can live outside there differences and live in Christ. Doctrine is not the problem, We are the problem. as we forget who we are.
I have seen this all over this board to. Masturbation-Some say NO,some say YES. Homosexuality- Some say yes,Some say No. Those are just two examples. What we are not doing is going straight to the bible and getting the information that says it is WRONG,yet we use the principles of society which now 90% percent or more of the time society has become wrong,what they have accepted now as normal,will never be right! We would most likely not argue if we taught BIBLE TEACHINGS,and not what one man thinks about sex before marriage or lying but what the BIBLE SAYS!I believe this is causing that contention and division! Leave the man assumed doctrines,beliefs out. Let the word of God in!
I do not believe the problem is false doctrines. We all have different opinons on some issues and most of the time can back it up with evidence. There is only one doctrine, but will we ever fully know this doctrine until we meet God. No The problem is that while debating these doctrines we become catholics, and lutherans, and baptists, and evangelicals, and pentecostals, and nondenominations, and every other denomination in the planet. and forget who we are. We are christians, We are one in christ, We are one family. We are not 33,000 different groups, we are one group, in one spirit. Don't forget that. We all disagree on issues, but Christ is the center for all of us. From today on, may this forum be an example to the world, how christians can live outside there differences and live in Christ. Doctrine is not the problem, We are the problem. as we forget who we are.
forgivenWretch
New Member
There is no a problem with Christianity now nor has it ever been. The problem lies solely in man and how we deal with it. Instead of taking God at His word, too many insist that it be changed only to benefit their situations.Quit disagreeing with God and move on. Stop making issues, then there will be none.
The truth is that the mind of man in one way or another is always wrong, if there is debate or argument regarding an issue, one can be assured that it isn't just one side in error but both. IMO
Dukester, tell me if I'm wrong, but I think what you meant by doctrine wasn't a religion, but that we seek to do what is right in our own eyes, just like the Israelites did in Moses' day. Moses constantly had to remind them of that. It is truly a human heart condition versus a God's heart condition. If each of us isn't careful, we can easily slip into sin by doing what we "feel" is right rather than measuring our actions against scripture and the character of our Christ. As a Christian, we shouldn't have to ask if homosexuality is wrong. Only an unbeliever should have those kinds of questions because they don't have the Spirit of truth to guide them. They are just acting like the world 'cause that's all they know. I don't think Dukester was making it out to be a denomination think, LGF, but if so, I'm sorry for overstepping. If we say we belong to Him, then shame on us for not studying to show ourselves approved so we can know His heart. We should know the obvious things unless we're a new baby in Christ. Then, by all means, ask, seek, knock.
(Letsgofishing;40619)
I found this in an unsuccesful thread and it's absolutley true, full of wisdom, and personally feels like it could come out of Gods own mouth. "I am new here and have been reading over some threads and already see contention and division in this board. Its not surprising really... there are divisions and fightings among the churches we fellowship in every Sunday, so how much more will there be sharp words and unloving behavior among internet fellowships with ppl we don't know personally or ever come face-to-face with? This type of thing is a perversion that has been with the Church since the days of Paul, and personally I feel it is Satan's greatest "tee hee hee" in the Body of Christ. I find it amazing that in just about every epistle the writer takes a moment to command the churches to "be of one mind, one spirit, forsake not the assembly, love one another, walk in one accord", and yet we as the church seem to take extra precautions to make sure that those verses never become a reality. Jesus Christ taught us the power of unity ("when two or three are gathered in My name...") and even made it a point to ask the Father that we would all be one as He and Him were one. It is any wonder why we face such spiritual oppoistion when it comes to unity? I honestly believe that the biggest problem among the Body at this point is not simply false doctrine. Our Lord promised that the wheats and the tares would be seperated in due time. The Family of God's problem is that, thousands of years down the line, we still have not come to terms with the fact that we need each other." - Apple of his eye Just thought it was to Good for everybody to miss.
I would agree with this.....to an extent.1. All Christians on this planet, or the vast majority, have one common theme: Jesus Christ. This is the foundation of our faith, and it's a wonderful place to start. He is our foundation. But you know what? You still have to build something after you lay the foundation.2. I think so many Christians want to paint Christ as some 1970's hippie flower child who just wants everyone to say, "Hey guys, let's just all hold hands and sing Kumbayah. Make love, not war!" But if you read the Bible, there are several passages that paint Christ in a very different light. The one that always pops into my mind is where he chases the people out of the temple with a chord. I also don't think Christ had this mindset when he accused others of being "hypocrites" or "brooding of vipers". We are to speak the truth and spread the Good News. It's not gonna always feel good!!3. This doesn't mean that we should go out LOOKING for arguments. The reason I came to this forum was to speak the truth about the Catholic Church and to dispel the thousands of myths about my Church. After reading a lot of posts by different people on here, it's pretty apparent that there are some anti-Catholics on this forum. Fine.....so be it. But I'll be damned if I just sit back and let others talk badly about my Church. That's not me....So again, I think all of us have a good foundation to start with. But you still have to build something......just my 2 cents
I found this in an unsuccesful thread and it's absolutley true, full of wisdom, and personally feels like it could come out of Gods own mouth. "I am new here and have been reading over some threads and already see contention and division in this board. Its not surprising really... there are divisions and fightings among the churches we fellowship in every Sunday, so how much more will there be sharp words and unloving behavior among internet fellowships with ppl we don't know personally or ever come face-to-face with? This type of thing is a perversion that has been with the Church since the days of Paul, and personally I feel it is Satan's greatest "tee hee hee" in the Body of Christ. I find it amazing that in just about every epistle the writer takes a moment to command the churches to "be of one mind, one spirit, forsake not the assembly, love one another, walk in one accord", and yet we as the church seem to take extra precautions to make sure that those verses never become a reality. Jesus Christ taught us the power of unity ("when two or three are gathered in My name...") and even made it a point to ask the Father that we would all be one as He and Him were one. It is any wonder why we face such spiritual oppoistion when it comes to unity? I honestly believe that the biggest problem among the Body at this point is not simply false doctrine. Our Lord promised that the wheats and the tares would be seperated in due time. The Family of God's problem is that, thousands of years down the line, we still have not come to terms with the fact that we need each other." - Apple of his eye Just thought it was to Good for everybody to miss.
I would agree with this.....to an extent.1. All Christians on this planet, or the vast majority, have one common theme: Jesus Christ. This is the foundation of our faith, and it's a wonderful place to start. He is our foundation. But you know what? You still have to build something after you lay the foundation.2. I think so many Christians want to paint Christ as some 1970's hippie flower child who just wants everyone to say, "Hey guys, let's just all hold hands and sing Kumbayah. Make love, not war!" But if you read the Bible, there are several passages that paint Christ in a very different light. The one that always pops into my mind is where he chases the people out of the temple with a chord. I also don't think Christ had this mindset when he accused others of being "hypocrites" or "brooding of vipers". We are to speak the truth and spread the Good News. It's not gonna always feel good!!3. This doesn't mean that we should go out LOOKING for arguments. The reason I came to this forum was to speak the truth about the Catholic Church and to dispel the thousands of myths about my Church. After reading a lot of posts by different people on here, it's pretty apparent that there are some anti-Catholics on this forum. Fine.....so be it. But I'll be damned if I just sit back and let others talk badly about my Church. That's not me....So again, I think all of us have a good foundation to start with. But you still have to build something......just my 2 cents
yes we should be of one mind in Christ.We should all believe the same things.now there is no doubt to be a christian one has to believe in the Trinity, the virgin birth of Jesus, what he came to do and also accomplished on the cross. and his rising again.these truths are most often confessed by Christians in the nicene creed the apostles creed and the athanasian creed.but just the above does not make us all "one mind in Christ" for there are many other teachings of Jesus we must also agree on to be of that one mind. and since we are not one mind in Christ in these other teachings then there must be "division" as Christ also commanded.Romans 16:17When i think of Romans 16:17
Jesus himself wants us to watch out for those who in sheep clothing are eager to devour us by their false doctrines.Their are people who call them selves christian and appear to be . But when you check out their beliefs they are any thing but Christian .Even here there are some who reject the Christian Triune God . These people are not one mind in Christ with Christians at all.they are only one in mind with the spirit of the antichrists of this world.
Hi Jon-Marc,You're right about differences within a specific church that should not be there. People, in their self-centeredness, get lost in needing to express that instead of discussing different understandings of the Bible -- which is the important thing, after all.I especially like the truth you expressed at the end of your message that Satan does get right within the church and wants to cause divisions no matter what kind. We, Christians, ought to be wise enough to see that division in progress and to turn away from that. The small book of Jude is a constant warning about false teachings and divisions within the churches.In 1 Corinthians 1:12-13, Paul chastises the churches for having divisions about some following Paul, others Apollos, or Cephas, etc. And he sharply reminds them, "Was Paul crucified for you?..."Good Reply, here!waynemlj
(forgivenWretch;40748)
There is no a problem with Christianity now nor has it ever been. The problem lies solely in man and how we deal with it. Instead of taking God at His word, too many insist that it be changed only to benefit their situations.Quit disagreeing with God and move on. Stop making issues, then there will be none.
I disagree. It does have a problem. Being that if it lies solely with man and man supposedly is Christian, well not all men, then why do we as Christians go for each others throat when theres a difference of opinion. Thats Christianitys problem now every one is right and no one is wrong. Everyones word is the final word. Look at it. Go back through this forum and find the number of insults and personal attacks its unreal....a Rabbi ask Pastor Hagee one time "if Christians believe in the Messiah then why do they fight all the time?" Interesting observation by the Rabbi don't you think?
There is no a problem with Christianity now nor has it ever been. The problem lies solely in man and how we deal with it. Instead of taking God at His word, too many insist that it be changed only to benefit their situations.Quit disagreeing with God and move on. Stop making issues, then there will be none.
I disagree. It does have a problem. Being that if it lies solely with man and man supposedly is Christian, well not all men, then why do we as Christians go for each others throat when theres a difference of opinion. Thats Christianitys problem now every one is right and no one is wrong. Everyones word is the final word. Look at it. Go back through this forum and find the number of insults and personal attacks its unreal....a Rabbi ask Pastor Hagee one time "if Christians believe in the Messiah then why do they fight all the time?" Interesting observation by the Rabbi don't you think?
(Two;41032)
I disagree. It does have a problem. Being that if it lies solely with man and man supposedly is Christian, well not all men, then why do we as Christians go for each others throat when theres a difference of opinion. Thats Christianitys problem now every one is right and no one is wrong. Everyones word is the final word. Look at it. Go back through this forum and find the number of insults and personal attacks its unreal....a Rabbi ask Pastor Hagee one time "if Christians believe in the Messiah then why do they fight all the time?" Interesting observation by the Rabbi don't you think?
completley agree
I disagree. It does have a problem. Being that if it lies solely with man and man supposedly is Christian, well not all men, then why do we as Christians go for each others throat when theres a difference of opinion. Thats Christianitys problem now every one is right and no one is wrong. Everyones word is the final word. Look at it. Go back through this forum and find the number of insults and personal attacks its unreal....a Rabbi ask Pastor Hagee one time "if Christians believe in the Messiah then why do they fight all the time?" Interesting observation by the Rabbi don't you think?
completley agree
marksman
My eldest granddaughter showing the result of her
I have just done a 12 month study of the New Testament church and it doesn't take too much to work out that the division in the church today is created mainly by its leadership who want to protect their powerbase. I am not on my own on this one as I have committed it all to paper and included the thoughts of 40 other authors. You can see it all at my website which I am not allowed to post the URL of yet. I called all the ministers of the churches in the town I live together and presented them with a paper that would enable them to work towards unity. They were skeptical about things and thought I was telling them they didn't know what they were doing, which I wasn't so I asked them how many people have been converted in the last 12 months. Amongst 8 churches the total was three.I suggested that something needs to happen with that sort of result, but their end response was "don't tell us what to do we know what we are doing." Two years later they are still turning over the machinery with nothing happening.
marksman
My eldest granddaughter showing the result of her
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