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I think you should be asking "Taken" this question, not me--I literally said Adam was born alive, as an unearned gift, but died through his sin. The gifts he was born into was lost through sin--so just because something is a "gift" doesn't make it "unlosable".

You don't have to denigrate me to disagree with me. I didn't call you names, please don't call me names.

Everything Adam had was given to him, wasn't earned, yet, by his deeds, he suffered great loss: the result of his sin was he was "cursed" with "death". He wasn't born "dead", he was born "alive", but he "died" through sinning. I accept that I won't change your mind, but I share this for the...

No, "the Law" is just one form of "the knowledge of good and evil" which all those in Adam are born into--for non-Jews, what Paul describes here would be the equivalent of a child coming to the age when he knows good and evil (Isaiah 7:15).

"The unrighteous will not inherit the Kingdom of God" has to be a meaningful warning, though. I have an inkling that the hell isn't eternal (for everyone--some have committed unpardonable sins, though), since Christ says "you will not get out of there until you have paid the uttermost...

No, because my issue is with whether something being a "gift" makes it "unlosable". That is what people cite as the dynamic that makes salvation "unlosable"--"it's a gift". Salvation isn't the only thing that is a "gift". Many things are "gifts"--and many things have been "lost" despite being...

Because of what Paul says in Romans 7, I can't be sure about that. Romans 7 9I was once alive apart from the Law; but when the commandment came, sin became alive and I died; 10and this commandment, which was to result in life, proved to result in death for me; 11for sin, taking an opportunity...

We'll have to differ, since everything Adam was born into, which was a "gift", since he did nothing to earn it, was life and a blessing, but, what he ended up with, through his sin, was death and a curse. Why would someone have an issue with acknowledging this obvious truth?

Being born in Adam means you're born into slavery to sin due to the body of sin--the result of the slavery is spiritual death when you come of age, come to know good and evil, and knowingly do evil, and your "eyes" are "opened". This would be without exception be the case for those "in Adam".

@Taken I believe the Bible teaches Christians can fall under wrath for sinning. I tried linking you to the post, but I am not sure if you will follow a link, so I'll share it here. 1 Corinthians 9:26-1 Corinthians 10 show that salvation can be jeopardized by sin--that just as the Jews fell...

Adam's very existence, all he was born in to, was an unearned gift--he ended up "dead" and "cursed" for sinning. He lost what had been gifted to him.

Irrespective whether he took eternal life or not, the issue is he was "gifted" with many blessings, and ended up dead (not the state he started in) and cursed (not blessed as he began) as a result of his sin--it wasn't "unlosable" just because it was a gift!

Well, yes, God certainly is at work--and, so, we are told "obey... Work out your salvation with fear and trembling". It's not one or the other, it's both. I go back to passages like 1 Co 9:26-1 Co 10, which show salvation can be lost. I posted about it here recently.

I don't know if I refused a gift, but I don't understand the idea that "because it's a gift, it can't be lost" lol How are gifts in a category of "unlosable"? If you have a child, and you give him a gift, can he not lose it? I don't understand that logic. Adam received everything as a gift, but...

Actually, now that I've taken a second look at the context, I don't think it is possible to believe that everyone will die. 1 Thessalonians 4 16For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a cry of command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the sound of the trumpet of God. And the...

I mean to say, if I were considering the belief for myself, I'd probably have to find a way to reconcile it with that verse, so, have you considered it? Could it dissuade your belief in it?

1. Paul says "those of us who are alive and remain will be transformed", so, what would you do with that verse? 2. LOL The thread is about people who were saved but who then still fell under God's wrath and did not inherit eternal life.

If the following is the answer for how they will be outside the city (not committing the dirty deeds, but suffering on account of them), I wouldn't want to be there with them. Isaiah 66 24“Then they will go forth and look On the corpses of the men Who have transgressed against Me. For their...

Just a technicality, I guess, but what about the generation that sees Christ's return? They won't die, they will be transformed. An aside, anyway, I guess. Not directly related to verses in the Bible proving salvation can be lost.

Death occurred, for Adam, because of his sin. Those born in Adam have the "body of sin", and we spiritually die because of being forced into sin by that body. Christ resurrects us from the spiritual death which the body of sin caused. Absence of faith in Christ doesn't cause death, presence of...