haz said:
Again you are assuming how few there are who share the same understanding as I. I just told you of the ones that I'm aware of.
I'll find the links for the 2 I found so far in the USA and post them later as I'm at work now and have limited time.
But I'm sure you must realize that the truth is not determined by a popularity contest, hence I don't know why you would suggest it might be. It's God who teaches the truth.
As for your issue about obedience and my issue with the law, the fact is that most who focus on obedience inevitably reveal they refer to the law and that disobedience results in one being unrighteous and condemned. I'm not sure what your position is yet as you have not made it that clear.
Christians have been purified once we obeyed God's will (John 6:40) which is to believe on Jesus, 1John 3:3. Purification is not a gradual process.
The thief on the cross was purified. He obeyed Christ to believe on him, John 3:16.
Haz,
I know truth is not determined by popularity contest, but then again after 2,000 years there should be many "witnesses" even though they don't number in the millions. God has a remnant in every generation and it would be helpful if you could point me to some writings that have been put online regarding previous generations of a remnant that adhered to this understanding. Do the writings or thoughts on this only exist in your generation or are there older "witnesses" from previous centuries?
1 Peter 1:22 (KJV) Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth
through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren,
see that ye love one another with a
pure heart fervently:
The key here is "through the Spirit", which modern versions leave out. They have implicitly attacked the work of the Spirit in the life of a true believer. By removing "the Spirit", it makes it look like we can obey God on our own without the regenerating work of the Holy Spirit. The fact is that if a person does not have the Holy Spirit indwelling them, they are unsaved.
(Rom 8:9 KJV) But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
The Romans verse confirms that if a person does not have the Holy Spirit living in them, they do not belong to Christ. The only way a person can ever be obedient to the truth is when the Holy Spirit is dwelling in them. In other words, we see a very important tenet of salvation being omitted here. No person, who is in the flesh, can ever please God.
(Rom 8:8 KJV) So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
Therefore, when the Gnostics removed this portion of the verse, they were keeping in line with their disbelief of a spirit world, especially the Holy Spirit. Their idea of salvation is to be pumped up with more and more knowledge.
The Bible says that "he that is joined to the Lord is one spirit". 1Cor 6:17 But he that is joined unto the Lord is one spirit.
In 1 Peter 1:22 it is talking about our souls, not our spirit and they are not the same as we learn in Thessalonians.
1Th_5:23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole
spirit and
soul and
body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.
The purification of our souls is an ongoing process as we live and walk with Christ on this earth. It is a work of the Holy Spirit to sanctify our souls and this includes renewing our mind daily with the Word of God (cleansing us through the truth) and delivering us from old thought and sin patterns in our flesh (body). On one hand we are justified and cleansed before the Lord and we become a member of the household of faith. Our spirits have been regenerated, but our mind and body has not been regenerated. One day after you are saved, you still have your same body and your same soul (mind, will and emotions), but your spirit has been regenerated and is joined to the Lord. This will have a positive effect now on the daily sanctification of your soul as the Christian will learn to yield more and more of their mind, will and emotions to Christ.
There is a sanctification process at work
through the Spirit in a believer's life in the area of his/her soul. Now, that one is a Christian, as their mind is renewed by the Word of Truth, they will reclaim more and more of their mind, will and emotions and bring them into subjection to Christ (through the Holy Spirit). Your theology presupposes that a person is saved and then there is no work for the Holy Spirit to do in one's life. Every Christian on this forum can probably testify as they came into more and more truth (reneweing of the mind), that the Lord delivered from this or that habit or weight (that so easily besets them).
Just as Israel was saved and delivered from Egypt and then had a walk to walk in taking back land from the "enemy", the Christian has a walk to walk in taking back land (mind, will emotions, body) for the service of Christ. We have the Spirit of God to be overcomers, but we all have to learn to walk by faith and "possess the land", completely as God commands.
This is the process of sanctification of our souls.
This is not about working for our salvation and cleansing ourselves to be good enough for heaven. That was done at the cross. This is about relationship with Christ and walking with Him and keeping covenant with Him.
After writing to the church about being freed from sin and the power of sin so that we now have a choice and don't have to sin, Paul tells the Church to not let sin reign in your mortal body. He is referring to the sanctification of our body and soul so that we yield our members as instruments of righteousness utno God now and no longer as members of unrighteousness. The members of the soul are our mind, will and emotions.
If one understands that their soul was not regenerated and joined to the Lord, but their spirit was, then Romans 6 makes a lot more sense to them. They realize that they have a walk to walk now and land to conquer and possess through the Spirit of Christ.
Num_33:53 And ye shall dispossess the inhabitants of the land, and dwell therein: for I have given you the land to possess it.
What are the inhabitants of the land? Everything that seeks to destroy us and the work of God in our lives. Wrong thinking, fragile and weak emotions, easily hurt, and a passive will. And a body of flesh that has "muscle memory" of many years of habitual sin. All of these must be sanctified and brought into subjection to Christ.
1Co_9:27
But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.
Rom_12:2 And be not conformed to this world: but
be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
2Ti_1:7 For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind.
Just because God gave Israel the land, does not mean that they experientially possessed it. It is the same thing in the Believer's life. We must walk by faith and possess the land. From glory to glory He is changing us (sanctifying our soul) and it is a process.
2Co_3:18 But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord,
are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.
Axehead
No matter when anyone of us have been saved or how many years we were in the world, we have all been bruised and battered by the world, by sin, by Satan and we all need the sanctifying work of the Holy Spirit upon our souls. It is not a one time thing.
Matt_12:20
A bruised reed shall he not break, and smoking flax shall he not quench, till he send forth judgment unto victory.
Luke_4:18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind,
to set at liberty them that are bruised,
Even the Lord did not drive all the "enemies" out in one day or even one year.
Exo_23:29
I will not drive them out from before thee in one year; lest the land become desolate, and the beast of the field multiply against thee.
Their land surely would have become desolate because they would not have grown in faith and matured and known how to maintain their deliverance. They would not have grown in their "faith" relationship with God and learned His ways which are definitely not our ways.
It is no different with the Christian. God teaches us through relationship, day by day and that includes many failures. And if we give up, and shrink back and don't continue on there is no good that will come out of it in this life.
Num_33:55
But if ye will not drive out the inhabitants of the land from before you; then it shall come to pass, that those which ye let remain of them shall be pricks in your eyes, and thorns in your sides, and shall vex you in the land wherein ye dwell.