Always Spirit-Filled Or Unsaved?

[Enow]

I see this as always striving to be complete in him, and none of us has reached those heights as far as I can see.

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  Philippians 3:12-14
  "Not that I have already attained, or am already perfected; but I press on, that I may lay hold of that for which Christ Jesus has also laid hold of me. Brethren, I do not count myself to have apprehended; but one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind and reaching forward to those things which are ahead, I press toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus. "

Running that race is by looking to the author & finisher of our faith to help us lay aside every weight & sin; not by seeking to be Spirit-filled, but by sowing to the fruits of the Spirit in us as opposed to sowing to the works of the flesh in us to be received as that vessel unto honor in His House.

Hebrews 12:1Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us, 2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

When you had received Jesus Christ at your salvation at the calling of the gospel when you believed in Him, you became complete in Him as Spirit-filled.

2 Thessalonians 2:13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth: 14 Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. 15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.

Colossians 2:6 As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in him: 7 Rooted and built up in him, and stablished in the faith, as ye have been taught, abounding therein with thanksgiving. 8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. 9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. 10 And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:

 

[marks]

Always Spirit-filled after having come to and believed in Jesus Christ for salvation is why we shall never hunger nor thirst to be filled any more because we are saved.

Hi Enow,

This sure seems to get parsed a lot!

It always amazes me that people think the Holy Spririt comes and goes from us. All that comes and goes is our willingness to believe God, I think.

And instead of living abundant life in the fullness of God's love, some will teach that He comes and goes, demonstrating a true lack of understanding of what God's justification of us is, and means, and does.

I've come more and more to think that this lack of understanding of justification cripples so many from actually standing in grace as a way of life.

I know some here teach that we can't even, as born again Christians, walk in the Spirit unless God does something rare and unusual to us. Denying the reality that God has already given us all we need for life and godliness. But the truth being, we only need trust that He has already done it. The work is finished, we can come to Jesus for rest.

Much love!

 

[marks]

Running that race is by looking to the author & finisher of our faith to help us lay aside every weight & sin; not by seeking to be Spirit-filled, but by sowing to the fruits of the Spirit in us as opposed to sowing to the works of the flesh in us to be received as that vessel unto honor in His House.

This is why this discussion is important to me.

If God is doing things this way, and we think it's that way, then we're going the wrong way.

We run our race in knowing that we can, not in hoping we can, or not knowing whether or not we can. As you say, laying aside our weights, looking to Jesus, as it's Jesus Who both originated and matures our faith.

We can spend our lives waiting, hoping to get something more from God so we can actually do what He wants, or we can walk in the Spirit, knowing that we already have all we need.

Much love!

 

[Nancy]

Running that race is by looking to the author & finisher of our faith to help us lay aside every weight & sin; not by seeking to be Spirit-filled, but by sowing to the fruits of the Spirit in us as opposed to sowing to the works of the flesh in us to be received as that vessel unto honor in His House.

Hebrews 12:1Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us, 2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

When you had received Jesus Christ at your salvation at the calling of the gospel when you believed in Him, you became complete in Him as Spirit-filled.

2 Thessalonians 2:13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth: 14 Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. 15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.

Colossians 2:6 As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in him: 7 Rooted and built up in him, and stablished in the faith, as ye have been taught, abounding therein with thanksgiving. 8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. 9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. 10 And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:

"...and let us run with patience the race that is set before us"
This tells me that the race is ongoing and we grow as we learn and submit to Him. I am not at all saying that we are to seek a second or third or even fourth "helping" of His Spirit. Do you EVER grieve His Spirit? I'm sure Peter did when Paul had to correct Peters error in Antioch.
Galatians 2:11-14
11 " When Peter came to Antioch, I told him face to face that he was wrong. 12 He used to eat with Gentile followers of the Lord, until James sent some Jewish followers. Peter was afraid of the Jews and soon stopped eating with Gentiles. 13 He and the other Jews hid their true feelings so well that even Barnabas was fooled. 14 But when I saw that they were not really obeying the truth that is in the good news, I corrected Peter in front of everyone and said:
Peter, you are a Jew, but you live like a Gentile. So how can you force Gentiles to live like Jews?"

So, if you have made it to perfectness, more power to you. I just cannot agree.


Does that mean Peter did not have the Spirit living in him? I would say no, not at all...Peter was also still growing to completion.

 

[Enow]

Depends what you mean by in us. The Spirit is always there, but we don't always allow him to come to the forefront. Think about the most spiritual people you've ever met. Do you believe every word that ever comes out of their mouth is from the Spirit? If this were the case there would be no war between the Spirit and the flesh, and we would be perfect. You know any perfect people?

Our testimony should align with God's testimony in what He has done to us & in us that He has made us new creature with us always Spirit-filled, and therefore reconciled with God to serve Him as ambassadors.

How we live that reconciled relationship with God thru Jesus Christ is not by focusing on seeking a continual supernatural infilling of the Holy Spirit. The absence in scripture as something taught to the churches in the epistles is no where to be found. It is found wanting as much as the RCC is.

 

[Enow]

This is why this discussion is important to me.

If God is doing things this way, and we think it's that way, then we're going the wrong way.

We run our race in knowing that we can, not in hoping we can, or not knowing whether or not we can. As you say, laying aside our weights, looking to Jesus, as it's Jesus Who both originated and matures our faith.

We can spend our lives waiting, hoping to get something more from God so we can actually do what He wants, or we can walk in the Spirit, knowing that we already have all we need.

Much love!

Amen, brother!

 

[Enow]

"...and let us run with patience the race that is set before us"
This tells me that the race is ongoing and we grow as we learn and submit to Him. I am not at all saying that we are to seek a second or third or even fourth "helping" of His Spirit. Do you EVER grieve His Spirit? I'm sure Peter did when Paul had to correct Peters error in Antioch.
Galatians 2:11-14
11 " When Peter came to Antioch, I told him face to face that he was wrong. 12 He used to eat with Gentile followers of the Lord, until James sent some Jewish followers. Peter was afraid of the Jews and soon stopped eating with Gentiles. 13 He and the other Jews hid their true feelings so well that even Barnabas was fooled. 14 But when I saw that they were not really obeying the truth that is in the good news, I corrected Peter in front of everyone and said:
Peter, you are a Jew, but you live like a Gentile. So how can you force Gentiles to live like Jews?"

So, if you have made it to perfectness, more power to you. I just cannot agree.


Does that mean Peter did not have the Spirit living in him? I would say no, not at all...Peter was also still growing to completion.

But Paul never said after correcting him or for correcting him, that he needed a filling of the Spirit, now did he? Peter only needed to repent by looking to Jesus Christ to help him to do it by not shunning the Gentiles brothers when the Jewish brothers were there. No filling of the Spirit required for that. It is because he was Spirit-filled, he has power to repent by looking to Jesus Christ for the love he needs to repent.

 

[marks]

This is ridiculous and a parody of God's grace. I don't see anything in your posts that would suggest anything other than a religious bent based on theories.

Theoretically you mean. I am not on the forums to listen to religious people that have no experience but are quick with armchair theories. ,

When you talk as if you know something...you sink...fast. But when you question things...then it is possible for you to look at things you have not yet considered. So I'm not writing you off...just trying to filter through your misshapen theories.

How is this proper?

Someone posts something you don't like, and you turn on them. I've watched this repeat over and over.

Tell . . . do you talk as is you know something? Or do you talk as if you know nothing? See how that plays?

In my experience people write this way because they don't have a good response, so they, well, it's like whack-a-mole.

Seriously man, maybe addressing the material instead of just getting down on the person?

 

[marks]

Depends what you mean by in us. The Spirit is always there, but we don't always allow him to come to the forefront. Think about the most spiritual people you've ever met. Do you believe every word that ever comes out of their mouth is from the Spirit? If this were the case there would be no war between the Spirit and the flesh, and we would be perfect. You know any perfect people?

Hi Renniks,

Good post! We should make sure we're all talking about the same things in the same ways.

I believe that when we are born again, we are indwelt by the Holy Spirit, Who unites us to Him, giving us a new kind of life. The Holy Spirit will never ever leave us for all eternity.

I believe that we can be filled afresh for particular works, such as in Acts, when the believers were filled with the Holy Spirit, and testified with boldness.

Then there is walking in the Spirit, which is to look to God in reliance that these things are true, and that we have peace with God, and stand in His grace, and as we do that, the Holy Spirit guides our lives to cause us to become like Jesus.

And not that there is never sin in our lives, because in those times we stop looking to God, and take it on ourselves, sin is the result, as all that is not of faith is sin.

Jesus, the Author and Finisher of our faith, who began His good work in us, He will complete it - until - the day of Christ Jesus. Not one day will go by that Jesus is not continuing to complete His work in us.

We are filled with the Holy Spirit, united to Him forever, so now let us walk in that Spirit, not another, let us live who we are. Live in truth.

Much love!

 

[Nancy]

But Paul never said after correcting him or for correcting him, that he needed a filling of the Spirit, now did he? Peter only needed to repent by looking to Jesus Christ to help him to do it by not shunning the Gentiles brothers when the Jewish brothers were there. No filling of the Spirit required for that. It is because he was Spirit-filled, he has power to repent by looking to Jesus Christ for the love he needs to repent.

Forgive my wording. I know Peter had the Spirit that is sealed in us at our being born anew through Christ. My point is more about following the leading of the Spirit, walking in, and being led by the Spirit, growing through the Spirit by keeping our eyes on Christ and living Christ life. This is the striving that I refer to. I do not believe at all that we need "more" of His Spirit as, we already have His Spirit residing in us. It is still a bit fuzzy to me when speaking of being led and walking in His Spirit as, it is hard to know what the difference is to me. Each day I ask to be sensitive to His leading and guidance...so to "be being filled" was probably not the best way to put it...

 

[Enoch111]

So are we always Spirit-filled or unsaved?

Evidently you are confused about this. It is not an *either/or* proposition.

 

[Episkopos]

It always amazes me that people think the Holy Spririt comes and goes from us.

Nobody is saying the Holy Spirit comes and goes. But we are the ones who come and go. We enter into the Spirit...but only as God permits. We need to be in line with His Spirit.

 

[Episkopos]

So by departing from that testimony above in verse 13 is why you are seen as preaching another calling, another Jesus to receive, another spirit to receive and yet not receive because you are still seeking to receive. and yet preaching many gospels while you are at it too.

This makes sense to you perhaps? But rather than trying to say something FROM your understanding...just lay out what causes you to write such an incoherent statement. THEN we can be constructive.

I find your reasoning so far off...that the radar no longer tracks...

 

[Episkopos]

The forum allows for people...who have not thought through what they are trying to get across...but rather repeat an idea that has not been fully apprehended...and then try to teach that to others. This would not be permitted in any real life meeting.

But it's a free country.

 

[Episkopos]

So what does the OP mean by Spirit-filled...and what does saved mean to the OP?

I think the problem begins right there.

 

[marks]

We enter into the Spirit...but only as God permits.

Very true, we enter into the Spirit, and that only as God permits. So we need to see what God says about entering into His Holy Spirit.

One place is in Romans 8:
6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

This part here:

ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you.

There is a simple statement being made here, that you are in the Spirit if the Spirit of God dwell in you.

And then he goes on to write, that if you Don't have the Spirit of Christ, you're not His. Again, a very simple statement.

So then being in the Spirit, and the Spirit being in you, these happen together. And if you don't have the one, you don't have the other.

But these things being true, that if we have His Spirit in us, we are in truth In Christ, in the Spirit, this being true, let us now Walk in the Spirit, and not According to the flesh, not according to what we once were, but in what we are now, the spirit children of God.

We walk in faith, and in love, and in these all is fulfilled by Christ in us.

 

[marks]

The forum allows for people...who have not thought through what they are trying to get across...but rather repeat an idea that has not been fully apprehended...and then try to teach that to others. This would not be permitted in any real life meeting.

But it's a free country.

As you say . . . Just Anyone can write stuff on the internet. But this is a problem peculiar to Christian forums. Because anyone has the platform to conduct themself as a teacher, whether or not they actually are intended by God to be a teacher to the church.

 

[Episkopos]

Very true, we enter into the Spirit, and that only as God permits. So we need to see what God says about entering into His Holy Spirit.

One place is in Romans 8:
6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

This part here:

ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you.

There is a simple statement being made here, that you are in the Spirit if the Spirit of God dwell in you.

And then he goes on to write, that if you Don't have the Spirit of Christ, you're not His. Again, a very simple statement.

So then being in the Spirit, and the Spirit being in you, these happen together. And if you don't have the one, you don't have the other.

But these things being true, that if we have His Spirit in us, we are in truth In Christ, in the Spirit, this being true, let us now Walk in the Spirit, and not According to the flesh, not according to what we once were, but in what we are now, the spirit children of God.

We walk in faith, and in love, and in these all is fulfilled by Christ in us.

That's the problem of trying to make a universal truth out of one verse...when so many other verses go against that. All this means is that the people Paul is speaking to either have walked in the Spirit or are walking in the Spirit. But this doesn't mean that someone who reads about that in his epistle to the Romans has the Spirit or is walking in the Spirit.Paul exhorts other churches towards a more spiritual walk.
The tiring thing here is the selectivity and wishful thinking that one can derive by ignoring the whole counsel of God in favour of an easy to accept verse...since it's easy. people who do that...are known...not for honest exegesis...but a wishful thinking.

So then look for other verses that speak of being IN the Spirit or walking in the Spirit....and compare. Then you wouldn't be championing one interpretation over another. And people like me wouldn't have to continually correct such a basic blunder ALL the time.

 

[Episkopos]

So what does the OP mean by Spirit-filled...and what does saved mean to the OP?

I think the problem begins right there.

OK I'll do it. Jesus likened the spiritual life to rivers of living water flowing out of the belly. So there is a flow of eternal life in the one who is filled with the Spirit. It is a miraculous provision with outstanding effects on the people all around. When the life of God is flowing out of a person there is NO sin at all...because of the presence of God ON that person as well as in. The anointing is experienced by people around that one. Signs and wonders are a daily occurrence.

So then most definitely the OP meant something of a more dogmatic religious nature that doesn't actually require God's miraculous grace to be present.

And "saved" means to preserve. So a person whose knee is healed can be said to be have been saved...according to the bible. Sodzo...can mean a temporal healing or a deliverance from a temporal evil. In fact...it MAINLY means a temporal solution.

Whoever calls on the name of the Lord will be saved...is about a temporal deliverance in times of trouble.

 

[Episkopos]

Is this thread saved?

(Hey, I just pressed "save" and then it appears on my screen)