Am I wrong

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bbyrd009

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My husband and 4 kids moved to a small town in Tennessee a few years ago. We had always attended Calvary Chapel but none here. We have tried a bunch of churches but they always reject me because I was not baptized properly.

I was born to parents that actively hated the church God, Jesus w extreme passion. I can say that I was born to love Christ. Even as a tiny girl, I can remember secretly reading my bible. I contribute this to a praying MIL but another story...my dad was very violent, like a trip to the ICU at age 3 violent. I was baptized at 15 at a football game by sprinkle and I really was putting myself in a lot of danger doing that.
Fast forward 30 years..everytime we try to join a church, they say I need to be baptized. I feel baptized..and my baptism came at personal cost that few will ever know and meant more to me accordingly. Getting baptized again makes me want to vomit, my skin crawls when idiots tell me that this extremely important spiritual moment where God spoke to me w prophetic news that came true was all a lie and God is a liar.
I quit trying to even go to church bc my husband would get so mad when they rejected me and then none went to church. Am I wrong not to go to church? Should I just take a bath in sanctuary to make idiots happy?
Maybe you are being called to start a congregation? Church is wherever you are after all, yeh?
 

jshiii

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My husband and 4 kids moved to a small town in Tennessee a few years ago. We had always attended Calvary Chapel but none here. We have tried a bunch of churches but they always reject me because I was not baptized properly.

I was born to parents that actively hated the church God, Jesus w extreme passion. I can say that I was born to love Christ. Even as a tiny girl, I can remember secretly reading my bible. I contribute this to a praying MIL but another story...my dad was very violent, like a trip to the ICU at age 3 violent. I was baptized at 15 at a football game by sprinkle and I really was putting myself in a lot of danger doing that.
Fast forward 30 years..everytime we try to join a church, they say I need to be baptized. I feel baptized..and my baptism came at personal cost that few will ever know and meant more to me accordingly. Getting baptized again makes me want to vomit, my skin crawls when idiots tell me that this extremely important spiritual moment where God spoke to me w prophetic news that came true was all a lie and God is a liar.
I quit trying to even go to church bc my husband would get so mad when they rejected me and then none went to church. Am I wrong not to go to church? Should I just take a bath in sanctuary to make idiots happy?


I can empathize with what you are feeling LWK. Before you do anything else, make any decisions, read any more of the responses to your question, please prepare your heart 1st. Find you a quiet spot in your home, away from your family, away from distractions, and ask Jesus to fill your spirit with love. Do this every day however long it takes...maybe minutes, maybe hours. You have to get to a point where you give up and turn it all over to Jesus. Then and only then, you will be able to see through the darkest times in your life. Trust Jesus, start with prayer and sincerely ask for his unconditional love, then let him show you the truth about many things. Prayers for you and your family!
 
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Yehren

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Don't give up on going to Church, but stick to your beliefs, because you are right, and they are the ones in error.

There is nothing wrong with water baptism. It was done in the Bible. But the literal practice isn't required.

Ephesians 5:25-26 KJV
Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it; [26] That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,

The only water you must be baptized in is the Word: the same water that Jesus told the widow at the well about.

Right. The Good Thief was saved simply by expressing remorse for his sins, and trust in Jesus.

Luke 23:40 But the other answering, rebuked him, saying: Neither dost thou fear God, seeing thou art condemned under the same condemnation? [41] And we indeed justly, for we receive the due reward of our deeds; but this man hath done no evil. [42] And he said to Jesus: Lord, remember me when thou shalt come into thy kingdom. [43] And Jesus said to him: Amen I say to thee, this day thou shalt be with me in paradise.

The Baptism of desire is, absent the opportunity for a proper baptism, good enough for God.

And if it's good enough for Him, who are we to object?
 

Grams

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You could watch church on the compute !!!!!!!!

We have ours on the computer !!!!!! and its just a bible church !!!!! We all love it !!
 
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Marymog

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There is nothing wrong with water baptism. It was done in the Bible. But the literal practice isn't required.
Hi FHII,

Soooo let me see if I got your theory right.

Jesus was baptized (Matthew 3) but we don't have to be baptized and follow his example?

Jesus told the Apostles to baptize (Matthew 28) but that practice ended when the Apostles died because they were "in the Bible" and we are not?

The Apostles baptized and told converts they had to be baptized and the necessity of baptism (MULTIPLE passages that you should know already) but anyone that was converted to Christianity AFTER that didn't have to be baptized since they did not live during biblical times?

The 1st/2nd century historical writings that we have from our Christian brothers/sisters show that they practiced, preached, affirmed and required baptism. They were taking Scripture literally but 2,000 years later your theory is that we are not to take baptism literally?

And you actually got some fellow members @Nancy @Giuliano @amadeus @Willie T to "like" your post.....:(

Mary
 

Pearl

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You could watch church on the compute !!!!!!!!

We have ours on the computer !!!!!! and its just a bible church !!!!! We all love it !!
What's the link to that Marlene?
 

Grams

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All I can find now is !!!!

Grace Bible Church its in Warren.

all of a sudden I was hitting the wrong stuff and the computer I shut down some how.
Ill try again ? and see if I can find it. But am sure if you just put in the church it will come out
just in case I have more trouble ! :)

Grace Bible Church - Warren, MI

Grace Bible Church - Warren, MI

I did go and try again and got this !
 
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FHII

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Hi FHII,

Soooo let me see if I got your theory right.
Sadly, but predictably, you don't. It's like you received a memo on my post but didn't actually read my post.
Jesus was baptized (Matthew 3) but we don't have to be baptized and follow his example?
Well he also literally died on the cross. We died with him on that cross, but must we die on a literal cross as well?

Besides, I am not against baptism. Not even water baptism, but I do proclaim we must be baptized. It is necessary. We must be baptized (immersed) in him. Being baptized in water isn't necessary. It's ok, it's good, it's edifying... But not necessary. Being baptized in him IS necessary.

Jesus told the Apostles to baptize (Matthew 28)
That's right, and he told them how to baptise:

Matthew 28:19-20 KJV
Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: [20] Teaching them to observe all things...

Did you see the colon after the word "Ghost"? A colon dictates that a list or method (in this case) is going to explain how it is going to be done and defined what it is.

The baptism is done by teaching. That is the real baptism. It's kind of like communion... The eating of bread and drinking of wine... I LOVE bread and wine! So I am not against that. I am also not against toasting Jesus when it's appropriate. But there is a greater meaning to the ritual. The ritual is a shadow... Not the real thing. I say it's ok to do the shadow, but it's necessary to do the real thing.

we don't have to be baptized and follow his example?
I never said that. I never even said not to... By the way, John bapised with water... John said Jesus would baptized with the Holy Ghost and with fire.

I've never been baptized with literal water, but I will make a deal with you... I will be baptized with John's baptism (literally) if you take on Jesus's literal baptism with fire.

You ok with that?

but that practice ended when the Apostles died because they were "in the Bible" and we are not?
Well that's more stuff you are making up... I never said that. In fact, I do believe and know they baptized. They went beyond baptizing. Besides baptizing the way Jesus said, they also did water baptism.

The Apostles baptized and told converts they had to be baptized and the necessity of baptism (MULTIPLE passages that you should know already) but anyone that was converted to Christianity AFTER that didn't have to be baptized since they did not live during biblical times?
Again, I did not say that...again, they did baptize... They taught. They did what Jesus told them to do. Even today some are baptising by teaching.

So when your Church baptised, what are they doing?

The thief on the cross was baptized. Yet he didn't see literal water...

Marymog... Hold to your tradition! I will not stop you, and I encourage you to continue!
 
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Pearl

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Sadly, but predictably, you don't. It's like you received a memo on my post but didn't actually read my post.

Well he also literally died on the cross. We died with him on that cross, but must we die on a literal cross as well?

Besides, I am not against baptism. Not even water baptism, but I do proclaim we must be baptized. It is necessary. We must be baptized (immersed) in him. Being baptized in water isn't necessary. It's ok, it's good, it's edifying... But not necessary. Being baptized in him IS necessary.


That's right, and he told them how to baptise:

Matthew 28:19-20 KJV
Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: [20] Teaching them to observe all things...

Did you see the colon after the word "Ghost"? A colon dictates that a list or method (in this case) is going to explain how it is going to be done and defined what it is.

The baptism is done by teaching. That is the real baptism. It's kind of like communion... The eating of bread and drinking of wine... I LOVE bread and wine! So I am not against that. I am also not against toasting Jesus when it's appropriate. But there is a greater meaning to the ritual. The ritual is a shadow... Not the real thing. I say it's ok to do the shadow, but it's necessary to do the real thing.


I never said that. I never even said not to... By the way, John bapised with water... John said Jesus would baptized with the Holy Ghost and with fire.

I've never been baptized with literal water, but I will make a deal with you... I will be baptized with John's baptism (literally) if you take on Jesus's literal baptism with fire.

You ok with that?


Well that's more stuff you are making up... I never said that. In fact, I do believe and know they baptized. They went beyond baptizing. Besides baptizing the way Jesus said, they also did water baptism.


Again, I did not say that...again, they did baptize... They taught. They did what Jesus told them to do. Even today some are baptising by teaching.

So when your Church baptised, what are they doing?

The thief on the cross was baptized. Yet he didn't see literal water...

Marymog... Hold to your tradition! I will not stop you, and I encourage you to continue!
Matthew 28:19-20 NIV 'Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptising them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.’

No colon!
 

FHII

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Matthew 28:19-20 NIV 'Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptising them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.’

No colon!
So Pearl, what do you suppose is the problem here? You are going by one version of the Bible and I am going by another. If we were to line up all the Bible versions, some will have a colon, others won't. I am surprised (though not really) that anyone would respond in this manner: that is, to claim the colon doesn't exist.

We have look at what the verse(s) are saying. What is of greater concern to me is that the NIV inserts the word "and" at the beginning of verse 20. Doing so significantly changes the meaning. Let's look at the differences:

NIV:
...baptising them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you...

KJV:
... baptising them in name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you:...

If you look carefully you will notice the difference. In the NIV the word "and" joins two tasks: baptise AND teach. The KJV doesn't do this. It gives one task which is to baptise and it defines it as "teaching".

Now, when you look at the original text, the word "and" does not appear. The NIV translators added it because they believed it was needed for clarification. The bottom line is that with this verse, the KJV is more in line with the original text.

All translations do this... They all add certain words to make the idea more clear. So I'm not purposely endorsing or condemning any particular version. I am simply pointing out an undeniable fact. If you believe the NIV has it right, so be it. I happen to believe it doesn't. No hard feelings.

Once again, I will point out that I am not against water baptism. I acknowledge it was done. My stance is that the real, meaningful baptism (which IS necessary) is to be baptized (immersed) into Christ. That requires learning of him and allowing the Word to dictate your life.

But doing the symbolic action is ok, too. It's just not going to save you whereas the real baptism will.
 

Pearl

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I am surprised (though not really) that anyone would respond in this manner: that is, to claim the colon doesn't exist.
It doesn't exist in a lot of translations so I don't think it means what you suggested it does. Did they even use colons in the original language?
 
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bbyrd009

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Hi FHII,

Soooo let me see if I got your theory right.

Jesus was baptized (Matthew 3) but we don't have to be baptized and follow his example?

Jesus told the Apostles to baptize (Matthew 28) but that practice ended when the Apostles died because they were "in the Bible" and we are not?

The Apostles baptized and told converts they had to be baptized and the necessity of baptism (MULTIPLE passages that you should know already) but anyone that was converted to Christianity AFTER that didn't have to be baptized since they did not live during biblical times?

The 1st/2nd century historical writings that we have from our Christian brothers/sisters show that they practiced, preached, affirmed and required baptism. They were taking Scripture literally but 2,000 years later your theory is that we are not to take baptism literally?

And you actually got some fellow members @Nancy @Giuliano @amadeus @Willie T to "like" your post.....:(

Mary
Hey, I liked it too!
“How is it you did not know I was not talking about bread?”
Not that I have any objection to ritual baptisms, Don’t get me wrong
 
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FHII

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It doesn't exist in a lot of translations so I don't think it means what you suggested it does. Did they even use colons in the original language?
On the other hand it does exist in many translations. I do not know if the Greek language has a colon or an equivalent, but one thing I am sure of is that the word "and" was inserted into the beginning of verse 20 and wasn't in the original text. If it was, we could conclude that teaching and baptizing were separate Acts. However, I stand by my assertion that the context of the verses say that the teaching is the baptising spoken of in these verses.
 

Giuliano

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On the other hand it does exist in many translations. I do not know if the Greek language has a colon or an equivalent, but one thing I am sure of is that the word "and" was inserted into the beginning of verse 20 and wasn't in the original text. If it was, we could conclude that teaching and baptizing were separate Acts. However, I stand by my assertion that the context of the verses say that the teaching is the baptising spoken of in these verses.
No, there was no punctuation of any kind in the Greek of the time.
 
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FHII

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No, there was no punctuation of any kind in the Greek of the time.
Ok, thanks... As I said, I didn't know either way. I don't mean to offend you, but how is it you know this?
 

Giuliano

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Ok, thanks... As I said, I didn't know either way. I don't mean to offend you, but how is it you know this?
Oh, I wasn't offended. No problem. I share your reservations about the NIV's adding "and" to the passage.

I have a hard copy interlinear Bible from the days before the internet; and now I use Blue Bible, and you can also see there's no punctuation. Bible Search and Study Tools - Blue Letter Bible
 
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Truth

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My husband and 4 kids moved to a small town in Tennessee a few years ago. We had always attended Calvary Chapel but none here. We have tried a bunch of churches but they always reject me because I was not baptized properly.

I was born to parents that actively hated the church God, Jesus w extreme passion. I can say that I was born to love Christ. Even as a tiny girl, I can remember secretly reading my bible. I contribute this to a praying MIL but another story...my dad was very violent, like a trip to the ICU at age 3 violent. I was baptized at 15 at a football game by sprinkle and I really was putting myself in a lot of danger doing that.
Fast forward 30 years..everytime we try to join a church, they say I need to be baptized. I feel baptized..and my baptism came at personal cost that few will ever know and meant more to me accordingly. Getting baptized again makes me want to vomit, my skin crawls when idiots tell me that this extremely important spiritual moment where God spoke to me w prophetic news that came true was all a lie and God is a liar.
I quit trying to even go to church bc my husband would get so mad when they rejected me and then none went to church. Am I wrong not to go to church? Should I just take a bath in sanctuary to make idiots happy?

Well if this makes it any better, Scripturally there are more than one Baptism. 1- baptism for repentance, 2- Baptism of Identification [in His name, 3- Baptism of the Holy Spirit, 4- Baptism of suffering [ persecution] so being Baptized again would do no harm, as Our Savior said to John, let it be so as to fulfill all RIGHTIOUSNESS!
Be Blessed in His Holy Name, Yashua [Jesus]
 
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Yehren

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Well if this makes it any better, Scripturally there are more than one Baptism. 1- baptism for repentance, 2- Baptism of Identification [in His name, 3- Baptism of the Holy Spirit, 4- Baptism of suffering [ persecution] so being Baptized again would do no harm, as Our Savior said to John, let it be so as to fulfill all RIGHTIOUSNESS!

We believe in one God, the Father Almighty, Maker of heaven and earth, and of all things visible and invisible.
And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son of God, begotten of the Father before all worlds (æons), Light of Light, very God of very God, begotten, not made, being of one substance with the Father;
by whom all things were made;
who for us men, and for our salvation, came down from heaven, and was incarnate by the Holy Ghost and of the Virgin Mary, and was made man;
he was crucified for us under Pontius Pilate, and suffered, and was buried, and the third day he rose again, according to the Scriptures, and ascended into heaven, and sitteth on the right hand of the Father;
from thence he shall come again, with glory, to judge the quick and the dead. ;
whose kingdom shall have no end.
And in the Holy Ghost, the Lord and Giver of life, who proceedeth from the Father, who with the Father and the Son together is worshiped and glorified, who spake by the prophets.
In one holy catholic and apostolic Church; we acknowledge one baptism for the remission of sins; we look for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the world to come. Amen.

Nicene Creed, 381
 
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