Answering The Error: Did Paul Teach Christ Sent Him Not To Baptize?

[Fred J]

+++i have no conversation with heretics who think that Paul is the Apostle of the Gentiles and Gentile church.
In that case you aint gonna like Gal 2:7-9 :)

Well you ain't gonna like this either.

Acts 9:
15. But the Lord said to him, "Go, for he is a chosen instrument of Mine to carry my name before the Gentiles and kings and the children of Israel.
16. For I will show him how much he must suffer for the sake of My name."

First of all, the Master Jesus Christ chose Paul as His 'instrument' to minister the Gospel given him to the uncircumcised Gentiles and cirsumcised children of Israel as well.

The Gospel which Paul received is an 'addition' that corresponds with the Gospel received by the 12 Apsotles prior, as one foundation to bring law, order and unity between Jew and Gentile church.

Nevertheless, Paul faced mostly hostility from the Jews and he's most wanted in Israel to be persecuted, therefore his Gospel ministry to the Jews became very difficult.

And at one time, he even washed his hands of them and stop ministering to them the Gospel, even the one give to him for furthermore understanding.

Acts 18:
5. When Silas and Timothy arrived from Macedonia, Paul was occupied with the word, testifying to the Jews that Christ was Jesus.
6. And when they opposed and reviled him, he shook out his garments and said to them, "Your blood be on your own heads heads! I am innocent. From now on I will go to the Gentiles."

Henceforth Paul turned his attentiion and Gospel ministry to the Gentiles which was more welcoming and peaceful, besides time to time scattered Jews in Gentile nation gave him trouble.

As a result in the letter to the Galatians later, Paul verifies that the false brothers/spy/seemed influential Jews added to the church, were themselves aware that Paul's Gospel ministry was to the uncircumcised Gentile church. (Gal. 2:7)

This deviation of Gospel which Christ entrusted to Peter later, is to minister unto the saved Jew church, once under the Law as their schoolmaster, circumcised and have not come off it.

And the Gospel which Christ entrusted to Paul later as well, is to minister unto the saved Gentile church who were once Heathens, uncircumcised, immoral, idol worshippers and easily deceived.

But the Gospel unto salvation ministered to the unsaved Jews and Gentiles about sin, repentance, baptism and discipleship, remain the same given to the 12 Apostles and to Paul furthermore in understanding.

Apparently your 'out of context' scripture quotes and shortsighted understanding just falls apart against the context which is the sound doctrine truth in the Holy Bible.

Where scripturally written, only the unlearned and unstable 'wrest' the scripture and doctrine to their own destruction, preaching and imparting another gospel and spirit.

End of discussion.

 

[sondring7]

Well you ain't gonna like this either.

Acts 9:
15. But the Lord said to him, "Go, for he is a chosen instrument of Mine to carry my name before the Gentiles and kings and the children of Israel.
16. For I will show him how much he must suffer for the sake of My name."

First of all, the Master Jesus Christ chose Paul as His 'instrument' to minister the Gospel given him to the uncircumcised Gentiles and cirsumcised children of Israel as well.

The Gospel which Paul received is an 'addition' that corresponds with the Gospel received by the 12 Apsotles prior, as one foundation to bring law, order and unity between Jew and Gentile church.

Nevertheless, Paul faced mostly hostility from the Jews and he's most wanted in Israel to be persecuted, therefore his Gospel ministry to the Jews became very difficult.

And at one time, he even washed his hands of them and stop ministering to them the Gospel, even the one give to him for furthermore understanding.

Acts 18:
5. When Silas and Timothy arrived from Macedonia, Paul was occupied with the word, testifying to the Jews that Christ was Jesus.
6. And when they opposed and reviled him, he shook out his garments and said to them, "Your blood be on your own heads heads! I am innocent. From now on I will go to the Gentiles."

Henceforth Paul turned his attentiion and Gospel ministry to the Gentiles which was more welcoming and peaceful, besides time to time scattered Jews in Gentile nation gave him trouble.

As a result in the letter to the Galatians later, Paul verifies that the false brothers/spy/seemed influential Jews added to the church, were themselves aware that Paul's Gospel ministry was to the uncircumcised Gentile church. (Gal. 2:7)

This deviation of Gospel which Christ entrusted to Peter later, is to minister unto the saved Jew church, once under the Law as their schoolmaster, circumcised and have not come off it.

And the Gospel which Christ entrusted to Paul later as well, is to minister unto the saved Gentile church who were once Heathens, uncircumcised, immoral, idol worshippers and easily deceived.

But the Gospel unto salvation ministered to the unsaved Jews and Gentiles about sin, repentance, baptism and discipleship, remain the same given to the 12 Apostles and to Paul furthermore in understanding.

Apparently your 'out of context' scripture quotes and shortsighted understanding just falls apart against the context which is the sound doctrine truth in the Holy Bible.

Where scripturally written, only the unlearned and unstable 'wrest' the scripture and doctrine to their own destruction, preaching and imparting another gospel and spirit.

End of discussion.

Gal 2:7-9
Tell me FJ oh wise one :)
Who did ALL the Apostles agree would teach FJ the Gospel ? :)

 

[David Lamb]

Gal 2:7-9
Tell me FJ oh wise one :)
Who did ALL the Apostles agree would teach FJ the Gospel ? :)

If by FJ you mean Fred J, no Apostles agreed who would teach FJ the gospel. FJ is not mentioned in the Bible by name, nor is anybody alive now, and we don't read of any apostle being told that he would retain his apostleship after his death.

 

[Fred J]

True born again readers,

Lets go by this reasoning, for example, am a Gentile got saved by the 12 Apostles and their Gospel just after the day of Pentecost.

Based on their disicipled and given Gospel ministry and commissioned by Jesus to make disciples of all nations consisting scattered Jews and Gentiles, in order for us to 'see' the Kingdom of GOD.

And likewise baptize us Jews and Gentiles alike, of water and of the Holy Ghost in order to 'enter' the Kingdom of GOD.

Henceforth i became a member of a uncircumcised Gentile church where am confortable with compared to a circumcised Jew church, where it's the beginning and were division between both.

Therefore the 12 Apostles comtinued the same mimistry in all nations and by the time there were already established uncircumcised Gentile churches and circumcised Jew churches while division remain.

Then towards the 'middle' of everything where i have been growing built in the Gospel foundation of the 12, with them fellowshipping and serving in the body of Christ.

Here comes Paul with another Gospel specifically for the uncircumcised Gentiles who are not saved and those already saved by the 12 and initially built in their foundation.

To me the irony is, GOD is apparently an author of confusion and not of peace, where did HE go wrong that HE had to send Paul to fix HIS mistake?

Why did i have to go through all that trouble to be saved, built upon, established in the body of Christ, fellowshiped and served by the Gospel ministry of the 12 Apostles in the first place?

Then suddenly later have to renounce everything am founded with whilst served all along and now transfer to the Gospel ministry of Paul in order to start all over again?

Did Paul write to any of the uncircumcised Gentile church he ministered and established by his gospel, that they're specifically built in his foundation alone sent by Christ?

NO!!!

This is the truth in context of the Gospel given to the 12 Apostles first and the Gospel given to Paul later, resonates with me as the one foundation unto salvation for both.

Jesus Christ is the author through the 12 Apsotles first and finisher through Paul later of our faith, both for the circumcised Jews and uncircumcised Gentiles, one foundation unto salvation.

Apparently Paul was given by Christ the finishing doctrine and knowledge of the Gospel in completion, combined with 12 Apostles' prior and ongoing.

As the one foundation for both Jews and Gentiles., since Paul even acknowledged addressing to the Ephesian Gentile church as follow;

Ephesians 2:
19. Therefore you(Gentiles) are no longer outsiders (exhiles, migrants, and aliens, excluded from the rightd of citizens), but you now share citizenship with the saints (GOD's own people, consecrated and set apart for HIMSELF); and you belong to GOD's {own} household.
20. You(Gentiles) are built upon the foundation of the Apostles and Prophets with Christ Jesus Himself the Chief Cornerstone.

Shalom in the name of Lord Jesus Christ.

 

[rmb60]

If by FJ you mean Fred J, no Apostles agreed who would teach FJ the gospel. FJ is not mentioned in the Bible by name, nor is anybody alive now, and we don't read of any apostle being told that he would retain his apostleship after his death.

I've observed the Gal 2:7-9 debate elsewhere with interest
These are 3 easy questions

1st - are you heathen or the circumcision
2nd - based on your answer who is the Apostle that teaches you the gospel
3rd - What are the actual gospel verses that that apostle quotes that teaches how you are saved

Often well meaning believers will in vain rely on their opinions rather than actual verses.

Gal 2:7-9
7But contrariwise, when they saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as the gospel of the circumcision was unto Peter;

8(For he that wrought effectually in Peter to the apostleship of the circumcision, the same was mighty in me toward the Gentiles:)

9And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision.

 

[Fred J]

7But contrariwise, when they saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as the gospel of the circumcision was unto Peter;

The one who saw, were these reliable witnesses?

8(For he that wrought effectually in Peter to the apostleship of the circumcision, the same was mighty in me toward the Gentiles:)

Where in the Gospel is written that Jesus made Peter an Apostle to the Jews and Paul an Apostle to the Gentiles?

9And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision.

This was an intermediate period of the Gospel, where there was 'shift' in acceptance and preference between the Jews and Gentiles, whether Peter or Paul would best serve them.

Since Peter's ministry and establishment was from Jerusalem and more towards the Jews, while Paul's was outside of Jerusalem and more towards the Gentile nations.

But the Gospel is ministered the same, even Paul water baptized when Jesus didn't send him to baptize, since baptism started way earlier and ongoing, and Paul need not minister about that.

Moreover, this did not include the 10 other Apostles of Christ in other nations, since it was from Jerusalem where Peter, John and James were and the immediate surrounding Gentile nations where Paul was.

The remaining 10 Apostles absent to these things, apparently in other further Gentile nations ministering the same Gospel discipled and commissioned by Jesus Christ, whilst establish churches.

 

[David Lamb]

I've observed the Gal 2:7-9 debate elsewhere with interest
These are 3 easy questions

1st - are you heathen or the circumcision

Surely the contrast in Scripture is between circumcision and uncircumcision, i.e. Jew and Gentile, rather than heathen and circumcision. For what it's worth, I am a Gentile. However, we are told that in Christ that makes no difference:

NKJV Gal 3:26 For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus.
Gal 3:27 For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
Gal 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
Gal 3:29 And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

2nd - based on your answer who is the Apostle that teaches you the gospel

Any of the apostles who were human "penmen" of the Bible, and any of the apostles whose words are quoted in the Bible.

3rd - What are the actual gospel verses that that apostle quotes that teaches how you are saved

There are so many, by various apostles, including John 3:16 and Paul in Acts 16:31.

Often well meaning believers will in vain rely on their opinions rather than actual verses.

Gal 2:7-9
7But contrariwise, when they saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as the gospel of the circumcision was unto Peter;

8(For he that wrought effectually in Peter to the apostleship of the circumcision, the same was mighty in me toward the Gentiles:)

9And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision.

But those verses make no mention of Paul, Peter (Cephas), James or John continuing their apostleship after the end of their life on earth.

 

[Fred J]

Surely the contrast in Scripture is between circumcision and uncircumcision, i.e. Jew and Gentile, rather than heathen and circumcision. For what it's worth, I am a Gentile. However, we are told that in Christ that makes no difference:

NKJV Gal 3:26 For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus.
Gal 3:27 For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
Gal 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
Gal 3:29 And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.


Any of the apostles who were human "penmen" of the Bible, and any of the apostles whose words are quoted in the Bible.

There are so many, by various apostles, including John 3:16 and Paul in Acts 16:31.

But those verses make no mention of Paul, Peter (Cephas), James or John continuing their apostleship after the end of their life on earth.

Going by the epistles of Paul, the issue was more directed to the established churches, division, confusion and deception between the Jew and Gentile believers or church.

Furthermore to the initial Gospel given and commissioned for the salvation of the world, a Gospel as folow was required to bring law and order between the divided, confused and decieved Jew and Gentile believers.

Since to top it off to make matters worse, there were also Jews as false brethren, secretly smuggled in and are spy, who's not found of Paul nor Paul is found of them. (Galatians 2:4)

And that's the Gospel as follow ministry, where Peter is more suited to work with the circumcised believers and Paul is more suited to work with the uncircumcised believers.

Whereas the 10 other Apostles who are absent, apparently continued with their initial disicpled, given and commissioned Gospel by Christ to other Gentile nations for salvation.

Until the scripture to the Gospel as follow from Peter and Paul, shall arrive to the 10 Apostles and are read to the Jew and Gentile believers there, then they'll be well aware.

i believe these reasoning make more sense to the Gospel dispensation that took place in the New Testament, thank you.

 

[rmb60]

Surely the contrast in Scripture is between circumcision and uncircumcision, i.e. Jew and Gentile, rather than heathen and circumcision. For what it's worth, I am a Gentile. However, we are told that in Christ that makes no difference:

NKJV Gal 3:26 For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus.
Gal 3:27 For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
Gal 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
Gal 3:29 And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.


Any of the apostles who were human "penmen" of the Bible, and any of the apostles whose words are quoted in the Bible.

There are so many, by various apostles, including John 3:16 and Paul in Acts 16:31.

But those verses make no mention of Paul, Peter (Cephas), James or John continuing their apostleship after the end of their life on earth.

List the gospel verses that teach how you are saved.
Giving an opinion will confirm that you dont know those verses, so either ask or don't bother responding :)