anti-christ sitting in the rebuilt Jewish 3rd. temple saying he is god.

[Trekson]

If there are no Jews then who are the Jews who will return to God by accepting Christ... and why not let Hitler and all the others who tried over the last 2000 years wipe the Jews out if they were not Jews

I agree Ivor, there is no sense in symbolizing the 144,000+ literal Jews who will enter the earthly millennial kingdom.

 

[Dave L]

If there are no Jews then who are the Jews who will return to God by accepting Christ... and why not let Hitler and all the others who tried over the last 2000 years wipe the Jews out if they were not Jews

Those who accept Christ will be reunited to Israel. As it stands now, the unbelievers are neither biblical Jews nor biblical Israel. But gentiles who practice Judaism.

 

[Hidden In Him]

I see we agree that it will be a ten-nation confederacy of Eastern Rome, not Western Rome as is the popular opinion.

Yes, well it's an interesting question how much the Beast will encompass Rome and Europe. Europe is slowly turning Muslim and they know it. It's why their leaders tolerate Muslims as they do. Europeans are like Americans in that they're not having enough kids to sustain their population growth, and without immigration the future of most of Europe would be in trouble. Muslims average something like four children per family, so it makes up for those who are hardly having one per couple.

Anyway, while I do think the European nations will increasingly bow to Muslim influence (either internally and/or through NATO), I think most of the ten nations will likely come from nations currently already under Muslim control: Saudi Arabia, Turkey, Syria, Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan, Yemen, Oman, Jordan, etc. All these countries are currently 95% Muslim or higher, with most nearing 100%. This is the same region that was at the heart of territory encompassed by the four beasts of Daniel as well, so I think the idea that Rome was ever truly the fourth beast of Daniel was a misconception.

 

[CoreIssue]

If you consider Dan. 9:26..."the people of the prince" The Roman army used mostly conscripted soldiers from neighboring nations
in their attack against Jerusalem. When you consider the rest of the prophecy regarding the a/c, Dan. 11:21 to the end, it really makes much more sense than a western roman empire. Imo, it ceased to be a contender for this prophecy once the EU was formed.

It makes no sense at all.

The EU is the 10 toes. They are all former parts of the Eastern Roman Empire. The waist and hips of the statue of Daniel broke down into two legs, which the Roman Empire did. Then they broke down into the 10 toes, which is history.

The description of the AC is the same as the historical facts concerning Alexander the great. Plus the fact that had little horn comes out of the Greece beast.

Alexander the great consolidate all the Greek independent city states into his empire. He will consolidate the EU countries into his new empire.

The harlot in revelations is the city of Rome and the Roman Catholic Church. Which I believe will produce the false prophet.

 

[CoreIssue]

Those who accept Christ will be reunited to Israel. As it stands now, the unbelievers are neither biblical Jews nor biblical Israel. But gentiles who practice Judaism.

And here you go with replacement theology again.

Israel as a nation has already returned. It will return as covenant nation at the second coming.

Genetically speaking, Jews remain Jews.

They will be gathered from the nations at the second coming. They will be restored to their proper tribe. The temple will be cleansed and properly rebuilt after the second coming. The new covenant to the houses of Judah and Israel will be instituted. Israel and Judah will reunite into one nation.

It's all in the Bible.

 

[Hidden In Him]

So I wonder if those who promote these views, ever read that part of scripture that warns of deception. Those warnings against false prophets and false calls of Christ being here, or there...and even more important, the point Revelation makes that Satan "deceives them that dwell upon the earth"; if the above end-time paradigm is true, and the whole world is aware of it, where is the deception?

Buddy, the whole world is not aware that the Antichrist will be Muslim. Not even most of the church is aware of it yet. Many are still stuck in the old thinking that the Beast's empire will be the result of some formation of the European Union.

 

[CoreIssue]

Buddy, the whole world is not aware that the Antichrist will be Muslim. Not even most of the church is aware of it yet. Many are still stuck in the old thinking that the Beast's empire will be the result of some formation of the European Union.

Will direct the extermination of non-Muslims in the name of Allah.
The AC will not be Muslim. In Islam ʿĪsā ibn Maryam Will direct extermination of non-Muslims.

There is no way you can make that theology fit AC prophecy.

 

[Hidden In Him]

The AC will not be Muslim. In Islam ʿĪsā ibn Maryam Will direct extermination of non-Muslims.

There is no way you can make that theology fit AC prophecy.

Who do you think will be directing the "Jesus" of Islam? The Mahdi will. "Isa" is not their awaited redeemer, the Madhi is. And thus the Antichrist will not be subservient to the false prophet, but the other way around.

 

[Hidden In Him]

Will direct the extermination of non-Muslims in the name of Allah.
The AC will not be Muslim. In Islam ʿĪsā ibn Maryam Will direct extermination of non-Muslims.

There is no way you can make that theology fit AC prophecy.

CoreIssue, in case you don't understand this, the New Testament writers did not expect the Antichrist would be a religious leader, they expected him first and foremost to be a political one; an emperor; a world ruler. They expected false Christs and false prophets would submit to him, not the other way around. So too will it be when the Caliphate becomes a reality. The real power will rest in the hands of the Madhi; a political and military leader first and foremost. This is what the Jews were looking for as well; one who would act similar to Antiochus Epiphanes, who (as a ruler and conqueror) forbid the keeping of Jewish law.

 

[CoreIssue]

CoreIssue, in case you don't understand this, the New Testament writers did not expect the Antichrist would be a religious leader, they expected him first and foremost to be a political one; an emperor; a world ruler. They expected false Christs and false prophets would submit to him, not the other way around. So too will it be when the Caliphate becomes a reality. The real power will rest in the hands of the Madhi; a political and military leader first and foremost. This is what the Jews were looking for as well; one who would act similar to Antiochus Epiphanes, who (as a ruler and conqueror) forbid the keeping of Jewish law.

They most assuredly expect him to declare himself Christ the Messiah.

Maybe you forgotten the Roman emperors were declared gods. Alexander was a God King. As was every other king in Daniel's statue and beasts.

I know what the Jews were expecting, but we are talking Bible here, not Jewish zealots.

They also looked forward to a restored temple. Just look at the Wailing Wall.

 

[Hidden In Him]

They most assuredly expect him to declare himself Christ the Messiah.

Maybe you forgotten the Roman emperors were declared gods. Alexander was a God King. As was every other king in Daniel's statue and beasts.

Your first statement is based on pure supposition. Your second - the suggestion that he will claim deity - is based in 2 Thessalonians 2:4 I'm presuming, but there the text merely states that he will exalt himself above everything that is called god or is worshipped. It goes on to say he will display or "show" himself in the temple that he is god. It means he will do so not in words so much as by the implications of his actions.

 

[Enoch111]

It means he will do so not in words so much as by the implications of his actions.

Not really. "exalteth himself above all that is called God...shewing himself that he is God" will include declaring himself to be both God and Christ.

In Daniel and Revelation he is shown as the great blasphemer, and in Revelation he is shown as the man who will demand worship from all humanity upon pain of death.

And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him? And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months. And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven... (Rev 13:3-6).

 

[brakelite]

It means he will do so not in words so much as by the implications of his actions.

Sorta like this?????

 

[Hidden In Him]

In Daniel and Revelation he is shown as the great blasphemer, and in Revelation he is shown as the man who will demand worship from all humanity upon pain of death.

And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him? And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months. And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven... (Rev 13:3-6).

As I was stating elsewhere, "Who is able to make war with him?" is likely a reference to the empire the Antichrist shall rule over, not the Antichrist himself. Their adoration of an empire no one can challenge will amount to worship and fear towards the power of the flesh rather than towards God.

As for the words "And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven," these confirm what I was telling you: He will exalt himself above everything that is named god specifically BY opening his mouth to blaspheme God. He will exalt himself by brazenly blaspheming the gods men worship.

 

[CoreIssue]

Sorta like this?????
View attachment 4923

Not the AC, probably the False Prophet.

 

[Hidden In Him]

Sorta like this?????
View attachment 4923

I don't take the Vatican to be the temple of God, LoL.

 

[brakelite]

Buddy, the whole world is not aware that the Antichrist will be Muslim. Not even most of the church is aware of it yet. Many are still stuck in the old thinking that the Beast's empire will be the result of some formation of the European Union.

But the whole world is expecting some antichrist figure to appear in a Jerusalem temple and make himself out to be god. You know, and I know, that such an action will deceive absolutely no-one...but...if the true Antichrist has already been here and was identified by Protestantism but now rejected because they are now deceived into believing those former protestants had it wrong, all due to the Antichrist's own machinations through deceiving the modern church into accepting futuristic hermeneutics regarding prophecy, then my friend, that meets the criteria of last day deception to a tee.
There are at least ten specific criteria that must be met in order to identify the true Antichrist. Some come from Daniel, some from 2Thess., some from 1 John, others from Revelation. Some of those criteria are repeated in those places, but there are at the very least ten, but more if one was to be more precise. I could reveal ten off the top of my head, and several of them could not possibly be met by a Muslim individual arising in the future. Impossible.

 

[CoreIssue]

As I was stating elsewhere, "Who is able to make war with him?" is likely a reference to the empire the Antichrist shall rule over, not the Antichrist himself. Their adoration of an empire no one can challenge will amount to worship and fear towards the power of the flesh rather than towards God.

As for the words "And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven," these confirm what I was telling you: He will exalt himself above everything that is named god specifically BY opening his mouth to blaspheme God. He will exalt himself by brazenly blaspheming the gods men worship.

No, it means the AC himself with his armies.

He will not worship the gods of men, he will declare himself the only God to be worshiped. Just like the Emperors of old.

 

[Hidden In Him]

But the whole world is expecting some antichrist figure to appear in a Jerusalem temple and make himself out to be god.

Where you are getting this from I'm not sure. Most of the world are not even believers, Brakelite.

You know, and I know, that such an action will deceive absolutely no-one...but...if the true Antichrist has already been here and was identified by Protestantism but now rejected because they are now deceived into believing those former protestants had it wrong, all due to the Antichrist's own machinations through deceiving the modern church into accepting futuristic hermeneutics regarding prophecy, then my friend, that meets the criteria of last day deception to a tee.

Since you are stressing deception as the primary (if not sole) means by which the Antichrist rises to power, what scriptures are you basing this on?

I could reveal ten off the top of my head, and several of them could not possibly be met by a Muslim individual arising in the future. Impossible.

Well name them then, at your earliest convenience. It's not as if I'm going somewhere soon and won't be back for a month or something. Reveal away!

 

[Hidden In Him]

No, it means the AC himself with his armies.

He will not worship the gods of men, he will declare himself the only God to be worshiped. Just like the Emperors of old.

Actually the emperors of old didn't proclaim themselves as gods during life. They were deified after death. Only Caligula appears to have had the plums to try and pull it off while still alive, and he didn't live for very long after doing so. They proved how mortal he was pretty quick.