Are Your Beliefs Absolute Truths?

[bbyrd009]

Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:

we might note that the twelve foundations are all rocks, yeh?

Some will see the failings of men, some will see the working of the Holy Spirit, guiding, guarding and correcting us.

All depends on your pov i suppose..

Peace!

pls pm it was a clown show, and the Holy Spirit was nowhere in evidence, except possibly among those who gave The Finger and told Rome to shove it. It was a bunch of overbearing smug powerhungry Roman tards doing the same thing the Caesars did to destroy Rome, and Roman Catholics only get a pass bc the Bible is so spiritually removed from them. Tbh most Muslims are closer to Christians than most Catholics, doctrinally speaking, although there are surely fine souls in any of them, or for that matter any group of Samaritans?

will it depend upon your pov when Christ has dismantled your rulers, powers and authority? Sure wont to me bro. But dont get me wrong, at the same time they have not been dismantled yet--well, not entirely anyway--and they obv serve a purpose, to protect us from ourselves prolly?

 

[bbyrd009]

Pearl, I cannot say

but if you put yourself particularly in the frame of mind of someone then, and i asked you why some mollusks, every now and then, very rarely (apparently, he said 20 minutes later lol) (few there are who find it) produce a pearl...ha well voilá imo.

the part i love the most is how even today the metaphor works, we commonly consider "sand" to be the irritant right, and sand has obv metaphoric refs for us, so, to descend into the literal, a pearl is only produced when a being is irritated, and seeks to insulate itself from the irritation, something like that prolly right. Which seems to me would lead to plowing ones own ground as a necessity, havent quite figured out the conundrum there...might be looking at that wrong tho, dunno

ergo The Gates--which are of course "always open," = "i cant say?"
which i used "i dont know" until...ha right now, but i like "i cant say" even better
did you do that on purpose?

 

[amadeus]

ha well we now know what pearl is made from, right...but if you were to find out what they knew about pearl 2k years ago, that would prolly clarify too maybe. We only quite recently discovered that pearls were an irritant covered by pearl spit i guess?

While the historical importance of pearls as well as the manner in which they are formed are both almost certainly involved in the answers to your questions, I still have to leave that open rather than to speculate. They are the Way into the City. Is not Jesus the Way? Why 12 gates? Why 12 of anything in scripture? All 12 gates are pearl. If we were to look at the 12 gates of old Jerusalem would we find a connection with the New Jerusalem? One list I found on the Internet is below, many studies about those gates apparently have been made. Will they help?

1. Sheep Gate
2. Fish Gate
3. Old Gate
4. Valley Gate
5. Dung Gate
6. Fountain Gate
7. Water Gate
8. Horse Gate
9. East Gate
10. Miphkad (Appointed) Gate
11. Gate of Ephraim
12. Guard (Prison) Gate

well, so you say, but after all what is the New Jerusalem, if not the Bride of Christ?

Is the foundation for the sum total of the New Jerusalem the same as the foundation each of its component parts?

Each of us before becoming the perfectly fitting part of the Body of Christ must be properly and precisely formed. For this we need our own foundation, which is Jesus Christ as per I Cor 3:10-11 that I cited in a previous post.

What is the foundation of the whole city? Is it also Jesus? I recall no place in scripture that says that specifically. Maybe someone else has? In Revelation it speaks of the foundation of the walls of the city, but is that different than the foundation or foundations of the city itself?

There are references in scripture also regarding the foundations of temples. How do they relate to the foundation of the city?

Lot of questions, but I do not have the answers.

 

[bbyrd009]

Will they help?

maybe, but dont think so; i would continue the thread "Whats the New Jerusalem made of" myself
What is the new Jerusalem constructed out of
but you might prefer to start elsewhere too

 

[amadeus]

we might note that the twelve foundations are all rocks, yeh?

Yes, which should mean that they also are the Rock, Jesus, with the names of the 12 apparently inscribed on them?

 

[bbyrd009]

Yes, which should mean that they also are the Rock, Jesus, with the names of the 12 apparently inscribed on them?

yeh, extra credit for matching the names to the foundations i guess
then once you do that you see stuff wherever their name is mentioned, like within a phrase or so, that reveals more stuff. Like a puzzle

 

[amadeus]

but if you put yourself particularly in the frame of mind of someone then, and i asked you why some mollusks, every now and then, very rarely (apparently, he said 20 minutes later lol) (few there are who find it) produce a pearl...ha well voilá imo.

the part i love the most is how even today the metaphor works, we commonly consider "sand" to be the irritant right, and sand has obv metaphoric refs for us, so, to descend into the literal, a pearl is only produced when a being is irritated, and seeks to insulate itself from the irritation, something like that prolly right. Which seems to me would lead to plowing ones own ground as a necessity, havent quite figured out the conundrum there...might be looking at that wrong tho, dunno

ergo The Gates--which are of course "always open," = "i cant say?"
which i used "i dont know" until...ha right now, but i like "i cant say" even better
did you do that on purpose?

Well, I can't say...

Sorry, but I couldn't resist doing that, but really no, it was not on purpose as you meant it.

One problem with sandy soil may be that it really consists of little tiny rocks rather than the rich comparatively fine soil which makes up really fertile ground. Plants do grow in sandy soil, but I would guess it is because the nutrients that plants use are able to inhabit or dwell on or in-between the tiny little particles of rock or perhaps in the water that may be retained even in sand. I've never been a student of botany or horticulture so that is at in part [maybe all] a guess.

 

[Philip James]

will it depend upon your pov when Christ has dismantled your rulers, powers and authority?

Are you absolutely sure about that?

Just teasing beloved...

But seriously, why would Jesus remove His own authority?

Peace!

 

[amadeus]

maybe, but dont think so; i would continue the thread "Whats the New Jerusalem made of" myself
What is the new Jerusalem constructed out of
but you might prefer to start elsewhere too

Yes, I sometimes read studies of other people, but more often than not, at best, they give me clues about where to look further. The answers are in the scriptures, all of the answers we ultimately need, but other people's words sometimes contain things that God has given them to share knowingly; or they even speak unknowingly as the high priest who prophesied of the need for one to die while he, himself, was one of the leading conspirators in the accomplishment of that death.

 

[amadeus]

yeh, extra credit for matching the names to the foundations i guess
then once you do that you see stuff wherever their name is mentioned, like within a phrase or so, that reveals more stuff. Like a puzzle

Go back to the OT where the making of the priest's vestments is described. Wasn't it the ephod that had the 12 stones with the names of the 12 tribes of Israel engraved on them?

 

[Philip James]

Go back to the OT where the making of the priest's vestments is described. Wasn't it the ephod that had the 12 stones with the names of the 12 tribes of Israel engraved on them?

2 stones actually, a type of the western and eastern Church?

Peace!

 

[amadeus]

2 stones actually, a type of the western and eastern Church?

Peace!

Actually while you are correct about the two onyx stones placed the shoulders of the ephod, there are 12 different stones placed on the breastplate. Six tribal names each on the two shoulder stones and one tribal name on each of the 12 stones the stones on the breastplate. I just checked it in Exodus 28:9-21.

 

[Giuliano]

I have had a few experiences with "12" gates. People can think me nuts if they want, but I'll tell what I saw about the heart and the Holy City.

I was meditating and praying one day and I was facing east for some reason. All of a sudden it was as if my heart blossomed and opened; and there were 12 paths of light coming from its center. That was similar to when I was caught up in the spirit one day and saw the Holy City from far off. I'll admit I wanted to go inside but was told I wasn't allowed. What I saw was the "cube" again with 12 pathways of Light, and angels of Light were flying in and out.

I was not up close enough to look at the gates, but my guess is they too are of Light -- thus always open, but still visible.

I also figured out a reason I believe I was given the vision of the Holy City with its 12 pathways. There are other Holy Cities in the spiritual heavens; and eventually each City is supposed to be connected with the others with these pathways. I perceived one day there was a problem with the one over Alexandria in Egypt where St. Mark started a church. It caused me come concern. After a period of praying, I was very pleased one day to see the obstacle had been removed when I was in the spirit and saw angels going up and down -- connecting the Coptic Orthodox Cathedral and the whole city of Alexandria below with the Holy City above it.

The "highway" Isaiah wrote about between Jerusalem and Egypt appears to be there today in fine shape; and eventually it will circle the whole earth. The highway from Jerusalem going east connecting it with Babylon in Assyria may not be, I could not say. (For the record, let me say east and west in this context is more magnetic east and west rather than geographical. Does that help explain the odd orientation of the Temple Mount? It seems obvious that the Temple faced magnetic west more than geographical.)

I can tell about another time when I found out what the "glass" is that the people are standing on. I was in the spirit one day with angelic being, and we were talking about something. When I returned to my body, I couldn't remember any of what he said. My guess is it had been planted in my mind to grow. I do remember what I saw. We were walking on what appeared to be a hard clear surface. It didn't strike me as the least bit unusual at the time although I wondered about it later. Below us, under the "glass" was a huge vine that I could not see the end of; and there were beautiful globes of light of different colors attached to it. The globes moved around, and somehow the branches of the vine never got tangled. I knew what those were when I returned to my body. I had seen the souls of men attached to the Vine. When the "grapes" were mature, they would be harvested -- and united with the Spirit with the soul being made immortal.

I had been standing on the firmament, of course, that separates "lower waters" and "upper waters." I did not realize it was "spiritual gold," however, until I discussed this with someone else who said it sounded as if I had seen spiritual gold. That almost has to be right since we're also told the "streets" are made of gold -- and the gold in the Holy City is transparent. It probably depends on how you look at it. It can look like a sea of glass, completely transparent; but it could also appear azure blue the way oceans and the sky look blue.

Why is earthly gold yellow then? Ah, that's because men crave it and have put so much spiritual energy into it. I've never liked wearing gold. Even in my younger days, it made me feel uncomfortable. My guess is I was picking up on the negative spiritual energy in it.

 

[bbyrd009]

Well, I can't say...

Sorry, but I couldn't resist doing that, but really no, it was not on purpose as you meant it.

made me spew coffee lol

 

[bbyrd009]

Well, I can't say...

Sorry, but I couldn't resist doing that, but really no, it was not on purpose as you meant it.

One problem with sandy soil may be that it really consists of little tiny rocks rather than the rich comparatively fine soil which makes up really fertile ground. Plants do grow in sandy soil, but I would guess it is because the nutrients that plants use are able to inhabit or dwell on or in-between the tiny little particles of rock or perhaps in the water that may be retained even in sand. I've never been a student of botany or horticulture so that is at in part [maybe all] a guess.

nice imo. couple irrelevant side notes, as i have just come from planting in FL, where the sand is (fairly) white until you wet it, and it turns black! Also you can water for ten minutes, and then take your pinky and dig down 1/4 inch and its dry! Also sand in a barrel makes a fab water filter, which might actually come in handy i guess

and yeh i took one look at the soil (sand) there 7 years ago and was like "aint nothing gonna grow in that" narf wrong. Sure wont hold water though. hmm.

 

[bbyrd009]

Are you absolutely sure about that?

But seriously, why would Jesus remove His own authority?

um, surely i Quoted this somewhere back there?
1 Corinthians 15:24 Lexicon: then comes the end, when He hands over the kingdom to the God and Father, when He has abolished all rule and all authority and power.

so wadr youre asking the wrong guy i guess, but i doubt its about Jesus removing His own authority? But as you recognize someone between you and Christ i am reluctant to continue this convo any further in this forum, where your replies would be considered blasphemy and heresy and whatnot; i would then be complicit in your downfall or whatever imo. But if you would invite me to a Roman forum i would be happy to continue this there wadr

 

[amadeus]

made me spew coffee lol

Sorry about the coffee!

 

[bbyrd009]

Go back to the OT where the making of the priest's vestments is described. Wasn't it the ephod that had the 12 stones with the names of the 12 tribes of Israel engraved on them?

also quite interesting, and likely quite connected too i guess

 

[bbyrd009]

2 stones actually, a type of the western and eastern Church?

Peace!

likely more like Christian and Muslim i bet, with those two ignored or subtracted, no offense. "destroyed" is i guess the right term,
1 Corinthians 15:24 Lexicon: then comes the end, when He hands over the kingdom to the God and Father, when He has abolished all rule and all authority and power.
ok abolished now, whatever
v of the day i guess


just left an Eastern "church" (arg) very pretty um "service" tho!
dint see anybody getting served tho tbh
sang all the Scriptures, quite pretty. Lotta acapella singing.
i even cried, but not for why they thought i guess
very nice ppl though, Antiochian Ortho, guess theyre jumping in where Rome has failed in US
from their perspective, understand

 

[amadeus]

nice imo. couple irrelevant side notes, as i have just come from planting in FL, where the sand is (fairly) white until you wet it, and it turns black! Also you can water for ten minutes, and then take your pinky and dig down 1/4 inch and its dry! Also sand in a barrel makes a fab water filter, which might actually come in handy i guess

and yeh i took one look at the soil (sand) there 7 years ago and was like "aint nothing gonna grow in that" narf wrong. Sure wont hold water though. hmm.

Yes, while no farmer, I always planted my own little garden every year until a couple years ago when this old body was just unable to handle it any more. I had always enjoyed it as a time to meditate as I worked, a welcome change from my office job, but when the discomfort of an aging body began to outweigh the pleasure it was time to end it. Many of my gardens were in California with very rich dark soil. In Oklahoma some of my gardens were in a sandier soil but did very well. Only in Wyoming was successful gardening an impossibility.