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Did Cornelius receive the Holy spirit prior to his Water Baptism - or was he BAPTIZED in the Holy Spirit?
Are you sure about that?As far as I see it, he received the Holy Spirit baptism before he was baptized in water.
Are you sure about that?
Did the Apostles receive the Holy Spirit on the night after Jesus rose from the dead (John 20:21-23) - or were they BAPTIZED in the Holy Spirit that night??
Hi,There are many who claim that when the Lord said "born of water and of the Spirit" He was speaking about Christian baptism.
But when we study the New Testament, we discover that water is also a metaphor for the Word of God, and in this case the Gospel (which is the power of God unto salvation). So this "water" is the Gospel, since sinners are regenerated BEFORE they are baptized.
23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.
24 For all flesh is as grass, and all the glory of man as the flower of grass. The grass withereth, and the flower thereof falleth away:
25 But the word of the Lord endureth for ever. And this is the word which by the gospel is preached unto you. (1 Peter 1)
Sooooo, what Jesus told Nicodemus in John 3:5 was only a TEMPORARY prescription??That was before JESUS went to the CROSS..... now we have it , with out the water !
Really??We no longer need to be Baptized ........ We have it all upon belief...
We are now all Gentiles !
Hi,
I may be misunderstanding you. It seems you are saying that "water" = Gospel (the written word)?
What I see is that in John 1 Jesus is baptized with water.
Jesus then goes on to talk about water baptism in John 3:5 being necessary to enter the kingdom of God. Jesus and his disciples then put into action what He has been preaching and what he did himself when they go out and baptize others with water. The NT is rife with water baptism. When one looks at the totality of John, and the rest of the NT, we can easily see that He was referring to water baptism.
All historical Christian writings from the time show that they practiced water baptism even building baptismal fonts.
I can not see the connection with 1Peter 1 23:25 having anything to do with water baptism. Could you elaborate?
Mary
Absolutely - as the Early Church did.Do they still baptize baby's ?
I understand how you are twisting this passage - so let me ask YOU:***
Mary, show me where it says baptism in water. In this whole dialogue there is no mention of baptism.
The following is a quote from my study on water baptism. You would do well to at least think about what is says before you write your reply against it.
""" Many people use John 3:1-6 to support water baptism. -- But what do these scriptures really say?
**** Scripture
John 3:1-6 .. (NIV)
1 Now there was a man of the Pharisees named Nicodemus, a member of the Jewish ruling council.
2 He came to Jesus at night and said, "Rabbi, we know you are a teacher who has come from God. For no one could perform the miraculous signs you are doing if God were not with him."
3 In reply Jesus declared, "I tell you the truth, no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again."
4 "How can a man be born when he is old?" Nicodemus asked. "Surely he cannot enter a second time into his mother's womb to be born!"
5 Jesus answered, "I tell you the truth, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless he is born of water and the Spirit.
6 Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit gives birth to spirit.
**** end scripture
It seems to me that in verses 3 and 4 there are only two births being discussed, a man's first birth in the flesh and a necessary second birth of the Spirit. -- Notice that in verse 5 he used the words "born of water" and then "the spirit" and in verse 6, "WHICH AMPLIFIES VERSE 5," He uses the words "birth to flesh" and then "birth to spirit." Nicodemus has brought up the subject of being born in the flesh for a second time. What has been said is that physical birth is not enough. Some will disagree but I believe he is talking about our physical birth "birth to flesh" in verse 5 and that there is another birth, "birth to spirit" which is accomplished by the Holy Spirit (NOT MAN)
Since the word baptism was not included in the text, to add it is to change the meaning of the word of God to fit into the theologies of men.
It has been said by another: I think it would be trivial to tell Nicodemus that he had to be born of the water if this meant physical birth. After all, he had already gone through this birth. Why bother to tell him then? -- Why, because it was Nicodemus that brought up the idea of going back into the womb and being born again.
Amen.Maybe this will help you to understand BreadOfLife ! I sure hope and pray it will ............
Eph. 3:
1 For this cause I Paul, the prisoner of Jesus Christ for you Gentiles,
2 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:
3 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,
4 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)
5 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;
Eph4;
22
That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;
23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;
24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.
6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:
7 Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power.
8 Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints, is this grace given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ;
9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:
EPH 4:
30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
Amen. That's good - for cherry-picking.EPH 4:
30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
Acts 9:18 – Paul, even though he was directly chosen by Christ and immediately converted to Christianity, still had to be baptized to be forgiven his sin. This is a powerful text which demonstrates the salvific efficacy of water baptism, even for those who decide to give their lives to Christ.We no longer need to be Baptized ........ We have it all upon belief...
It doesn't say "saved through faith alone."[/quote]We are now all Gentiles !
Eph.2;
8
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Ephesians 2:9, "works" is works of the law. James 2:24 appears to be inconsistent with Ephesians 2:9 until one realizes that the Word of God cannot contradict itself. This means that the “works” in James 2:24 are different from the “works of the law in Ephesians 2:9, Gal. 2:16 and Rom. 3:20,28. James is referring to “good works” (e.g.,clothing the naked; giving food to the poor) and Paul is referring to the “Mosaic law” (which included both the legal, moral and ceremonial law) or any works which oblige God to give us payment.Not of works, lest any man should boast.
I understand how you are twisting this passage - so let me ask YOU:
As to being born of WATER and SPIRIT - what does this "Water" pertain to?
If you tell me that it pertains to amniotic fluid - not ONE Early Church Father agrees with you. Not ONE Protestant Father agrees with you, either. Sooooo, where did this teaching come from??
I will answer YOUR question when you answer mine.***
It comes from John 3:1-6. Now answer my question, where do you see the word baptism in John 3:1-6??
I have shown you what John 3:1-6 actually says but you reject it.
When you add words to scriptures to make them say what you want them to say, you are twisting the scriptures and are a false teacher.
You never will admit that the word baptism is not in John 3:1-6 because you must add it to make it support your ideas.