Be Warned: Revelation 20 Is Not... A Current Reality

[Big Boy Johnson]

Hard for me to accept their testimony. Lot sensationalism in their story. Getting them to repeat their testimony several times like how police investigations are done, would reveal whether or not they were making up their story.

Exactly... and when the drugs wear off their testimony would be changing

 

[ScottA]

Do you believe Jesus of Nazareth is "Emmanuel" (God with us), meaning GOD come in the flesh??

I have NEVER heard you answer my question, because this is the FIRST time I have asked that!

Nice try with your attempt to scoot my question, which any Christian should be able to answer.

One last time then: Yes, but not because I "believe" it, but because I know it.

But back to your answer: You did answer, only not in a way that fits the Original Post topic (and why I asked). The fitting answer is that God never changes (Malachi 3:6)...which does not fit or reconcile with your reference to the acts of God being "future."

 

[Jay Ross]

I agree it's definitely very close to coming, but I don't put a time frame for when. I'm watching the signs of the end leading up to Christ's future coming that He gave us.

The end of this present age will occur when the two ages of the visitation of the fathers' iniquities upon their children and the children's children as God foretold in Exodus 20:4-6. God in Daniel 9:24a gave the Israelites 490 years to repent of their idolatrous worship during the first and second ages of their existence. My understanding that the end of the first two ages of the existence of the Israelites ended when Christ was born, and the fourth age of the visitation of the fathers' iniquities will end at the end of this present age when the 2,300 years of the Gentile kings and their armies, under the influence of the Little Horn, ends when God judges the heavenly hosts in heaven and the kings of the earth on the earth and together they will be imprisoned for many days to await the time of their punishment. (Isaiah 24:21-22)

Christ foretold this in Matthew 24:32 with the lesson to be learnt from the Fig Tree. The fig tree began budding leaves again in 1948 and the time frame given from 1948 to the end of the age is the length of the Spring Season, which is approximately 91 days, dependant on whether or not in 1948 the arrival of the Spring Season was early or late relative to when the Summer Season of harvest would start, either early of late.

The gathering of the kings of the earth at Armageddon, as foretold in the Sixth Bowl judgement follows the signs and wonders performed by the three frog like spirits that came out of the mouth of the Dragon, the Beast and the False Prophet, i.e., the Little Horn, to draw the Kings of the Earth to the Day of the Lord to judge them for their part in the trampling of God's sanctuary and His earthly hosts under the influence of the Little Horn. When the fullness with respect to the 2,300 years of the gentiles trampling God's Sanctuary and His earthly hosts is completed, after that "all" of Israel will be saved. This is when God will begin gathering all of Israel to Himself and He will place this in His fertile soil and will begin teaching them about the foundation of their refurbished covenantal purpose to be a kingdom of Priests, a Holy Nation and God's possession amongst the Gentile nations where they are scattered throughout all of the earth. God also promises to remove the heavenly beasts of the field from the face of the earth for a time so that Israel will have peace upon the earth. (Ezekiel 34.)

In Daniel 2's Statue Prophecy we are told that during the time of the Kings who are the feet of the Statue prophecy have dominion over the land of Babylon that a rock untouched by human hands will come down from heaven and strike the feet of the statue and cause it to topple over and will turn the statue into fine chaff which will be blown away by the winds of the spirit. The foundation stone that will come down from heaven will expand to become the greatest mountain, i.e., religion, on all of the earth.

Yes, there are signs that we can see if we have eyes to see and ears to hear with.

It is my view that Revelation 20 will become a reality in around 20 years from now.

Shalom

 

[Davy]

One last time then: Yes, but not because I "believe" it, but because I know it.

But back to your answer: You did answer, only not in a way that fits the Original Post topic (and why I asked). The fitting answer is that God never changes (Malachi 3:6)...which does not fit or reconcile with your reference to the acts of God being "future."

The way I used the word 'future' was in reference to prophecy, NOT GOD'S NATURE! You are being SILLY!

 

[Truth7t7]

That above brethren of course is THE GNOSTICS FALSE DOCTRINE of Amillennialism introduced in the 2nd century A.D. which the deceived in the Church latched onto and have taught it, and it having continued among 'some' Christian denominations today. It is not Biblical. With some, they try to claim the 1,000 of Rev.20 is only meant spiritually, and began with Christ's death and resurrection. Well, anyone that knows a little history well understands Christ's death and resurrection happened around 2,000 years ago. The mention of 1,000 years in Rev.20 is meant LITERALLY.

The 1,000 years period written of in Revelation 20 is easy to grasp as being literal, and to know that it will begin ONLY on the day of Christ's FUTURE return, for it is linked to the time of the FUTURE 'resurrection' of saints that will be persecuted at the very END of this world in the coming "great tribulation".

We know this how? Because at the very END of this world is when that "mark of the beast" is to manifest with the coming Antichrist. That happens BEFORE Christ's future 2nd coming.

Rev 20:2-4
2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,

3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
KJV


Thus it is so.......... silly to listen to those pushing the false Gnostic Amillennialism doctrines that DENY that FUTURE, literal, 1,000 years reign by Christ Jesus and His elect that will begin ONLY at Christ's FUTURE return on the "day of the Lord".

It's presented truth that shows no future physical kingdom on this earth is seen in Revelation 20:1-6, it's showing 100% spiritual, Angel, Devil, Satan, The Souls, The Dead, God, Christ

It's pre-millennialism that is creating something not seen

 

[ScottA]

The way I used the word 'future' was in reference to prophecy, NOT GOD'S NATURE! You are being SILLY!

No, silly is thinking the same way about God for 2,000 years without the renewing of your mind. Surely you know that even way back then they had begun saying, "How shall we therefore live?" with the idea that changes had already commenced.

So, forgive me for entering every thread with that needful change and renewing of the mind perspective.

It is no coincidence that Jesus' last words before being betrayed, were, "Rise, let us be going." He wasn't talking about getting up from their sleeping, but from their slumber.

 

[Jay Ross]

So, forgive me for entering every thread with that needful change and renewing of the mind perspective.

But after reading your posts in many threads that you tend to gatecrash; I do not perceive that you have renewed your mind during this time period.

For me, I know that God is renewing my mind continually and is teaching me new concepts and understandings of His word. It seems that your are still lost in your past concepts of what God requires of us.

 

[ScottA]

But after reading your posts in many threads that you tend to gatecrash; I do not perceive that you have renewed your mind during this time period.

For me, I know that God is renewing my mind continually and is teaching me new concepts and understandings of His word. Iit seems that your are still lost in your past concepts of what God requires of us.

Yeah, that's kind of like Nicodemus not perceiving the concept of being born again. Things not understood are usually first rejected. But he didn't throw stones like some do.

 

[Freedm]

Oh most definitely, just as with other false doctrines being pushed upon new babes, like the false Pre-trib Rapture theory, Full Preterism that teaches Christ's 2nd coming already happened back in the days of His Apostles, Historicism, Futurism, Jehovah Witness that doesn't believe Jesus is GOD come in the flesh while claiming to be a Christian denomination, Gnosticism, etc.

The History channel is taking part in pushing programming of the Occult and 2nd century Gnostic doctrines, so it's not just some Christian seminaries that are at fault. Especially see their history special on the Knights Templars history who brought middle eastern pagan doctrines back to Europe from the crusades.

Wow. So you're literally accusing me of knowingly lying, because, according to you, I want people to be deceived? Why on earth would I want people to be deceived? Do you think I'm the devil?

 

[Davy]

Wow. So you're literally accusing me of knowingly lying, because, according to you, I want people to be deceived? Why on earth would I want people to be deceived? Do you think I'm the devil?

You asked me if I thought Preterists were lying, and I said YES. I didn't say anything about you personally, because you didn't claim what you following in that post, so get off your high horse!

I was raised in a Preterist Church system. They did not teach Christ's Revelation, nor His Olivet discourse about the Signs Jesus gave for His faithful Church to be watching leading up to His future return. Nor did they cover prophecy written in the Old Testament that still has yet to come to pass today. The reason that Preterist Church system did that was because of the FALSE DOCTRINES OF MEN they were pushing OUTSIDE God's Word. They wrongly believed the only part of Revelation that was not fulfilled, was the event of Christ's future return. And that's pretty much how they treated the rest of The Bible too. They stressed good works and The Gospel more than anything, and the rest of The Bible be damned, in their view.

 

[Freedm]

You asked me if I thought Preterists were lying, and I said YES. I didn't say anything about you personally, because you didn't claim what you following in that post, so get off your high horse!

Whether you knew I was a preterist or not, you're accusing your fellow brethren of being liars and deceivers. That's not o.k. We, as a group, disagree with each other on this forum all the time. That's normal, and to be expected, but accusing others of being purposely deceitful is a very big accusation and I think you need to take that back and apologize. Nobody here is purposely lying and deceiving. We're all just trying to figure it out, but apparently you're so certain about the truth that you have the audacity to accuse others of being outright deceitful, so if anybody's sitting on a high horse, it is definitely you.

 

[Freedm]

I was raised in a Preterist Church system. They did not teach Christ's Revelation, nor His Olivet discourse about the Signs Jesus gave for His faithful Church to be watching leading up to His future return. Nor did they cover prophecy written in the Old Testament that still has yet to come to pass today. The reason that Preterist Church system did that was because of the FALSE DOCTRINES OF MEN they were pushing OUTSIDE God's Word. They wrongly believed the only part of Revelation that was not fulfilled, was the event of Christ's future return. And that's pretty much how they treated the rest of The Bible too. They stressed good works and The Gospel more than anything, and the rest of The Bible be damned, in their view.

So what? If that's what they believe to be the truth, then they believe they are preaching the truth! They certainly are not purposely lying and deceiving, because to do that they would have to know what the truth is, and purposely preach the opposite. Do you think your old church was purposely preaching that which was opposite of what they knew to be true?

 

[Davy]

Whether you knew I was a preterist or not, you're accusing your fellow brethren of being liars and deceivers. That's not o.k.

Your 'opinion' is noted, but that's all. I instead resort to God's written Word...

1 Tim 5:20
20 Them that sin rebuke before all, that others also may fear.
KJV

2 Tim 4:2
2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
KJV

Titus 1:13-14
13 This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith;
14 Not giving heed to Jewish fables, and commandments of men, that turn from the truth.
KJV

You obviously must be in a type of church that just allows whatever one wants to believe, and does not rebuke the sinner, which Christian rebuke is actually a show of love with trying to correct those who err.

 

[Davy]

So what? If that's what they believe to be the truth, then they believe they are preaching the truth! They certainly are not purposely lying and deceiving, because to do that they would have to know what the truth is, and purposely preach the opposite. Do you think your old church was purposely preaching that which was opposite of what they knew to be true?

You should really step back and listen to yourself...

"If that's what they believe to be the truth..." = whatever one wants to believe is the truth. NOPE!

"They certainly are not purposely lying and deceiving..." = the preacher is responsible for WHAT they preach, and from WHERE they get it from. If it is not from The Bible according to how GOD said to study and rightly divide His Word, then they are NOT staying with what The Bible says, and that means pushing false doctrine, and guilty as charged.

"Do you think your old church was purposely preaching that which was opposite..." = loaded question, because the preacher was preaching a SYSTEM CREATED BY MEN IN THE SEMINARY of that denomination. It's error was the SYSTEM of PURPOSEFULLY OMITTING BIBLE SCRIPTURE, especially Scripture relevant to our times all the way up to Christ's future return, which He gave His 'faithful' servants.

Either one remains "a chaste virgin" waiting on Jesus Christ to come, or they fall away to the systems and ideas of this world. Each person's choice, and that applies to ALL Churches as well. Jesus even gave FIVE examples of Churches falling away in His Revelation. Only TWO Churches kept His Word.

 

[Freedm]

Your 'opinion' is noted, but that's all. I instead resort to God's written Word...

1 Tim 5:20
20 Them that sin rebuke before all, that others also may fear.
KJV

2 Tim 4:2
2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
KJV

Titus 1:13-14
13 This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith;
14 Not giving heed to Jewish fables, and commandments of men, that turn from the truth.
KJV

You obviously must be in a type of church that just allows whatever one wants to believe, and does not rebuke the sinner, which Christian rebuke is actually a show of love with trying to correct those who err.

It's not an opinion, it's a fact that nobody on here is lying. Do you understand the difference between being wrong and telling a lie? You're more than welcome to claim that I'm wrong about something, or that anybody else is wrong, but to say that they are outright lying is something else entirely, and you don't seem to understand the difference. That's where the problem lies.

And speaking of rebuking sinners, you are falsely accusing your brethren and that makes you a devil, so I rebuke you.

 

[Freedm]

You should really step back and listen to yourself...

"If that's what they believe to be the truth..." = whatever one wants to believe is the truth. NOPE!

"They certainly are not purposely lying and deceiving..." = the preacher is responsible for WHAT they preach, and from WHERE they get it from. If it is not from The Bible according to how GOD said to study and rightly divide His Word, then they are NOT staying with what The Bible says, and that means pushing false doctrine, and guilty as charged.

You really need to pick up a dictionary and learn the difference between being wrong and lying. Believing something that is not true, is not the same as lying. Any one of us could be guilty of believing something that is not true, but that doesn't make us liars. You still owe me, and all preterists, an apology.

Furthermore, you have some nerve pretending that you know the truth and anybody who disagrees with you is preaching false doctrine. You don't have the authority to decide what's true and what's false. Obviously everybody on here believes they understand the difference, but since we all disagree on at least one point, that means every single one of us is wrong on at least one point, so get off your high horse and stop falsely accusing me of purposely deceiving my brethren. Nobody on here, least of all myself, is on here purposely trying to deceive. I may state something that turns out to be false, though I believe it to be true, but every single one of us, including yourself will fall into that trap, and that's part of the learning process. That's why we're here, to learn from each other, not to accuse.

So once again, if you want to accuse me of being wrong, I have absolutely no problem with that. Test me and I will try to answer, and in fact, I want you to test me so that I can test myself and get closer to the truth because I don't want to be wrong, so if I'm wrong about something, convince me, but don't you dare accuse me of purposely lying and deceiving because I would NEVER do that!

 

[Freedm]

You should really step back and listen to yourself...

"If that's what they believe to be the truth..." = whatever one wants to believe is the truth. NOPE!

I should step back and listen? How about you go back and read it again, because you're falsely representing what I said. I never said that whatever you want to believe to be truth, IS TRUTH! I never said that, so stop falsely accusing me. I said that they are preaching what they BELIEVE to be the truth... which is EXACTLY what you are doing also. You are also preaching what you BELIEVE to be the truth. In fact, we all do that, because if we didn't, then we would be liars. You may be right, or you may be wrong, but I could never accuse you of lying because for you to lie you would have to KNOW that what you are saying is false, and obviously if you knew it was false, you wouldn't say it. Do you understand the difference yet? Or do I need to go over this again?

 

[Freedm]

If it is not from The Bible according to how GOD said to study and rightly divide His Word, then they are NOT staying with what The Bible says, and that means pushing false doctrine, and guilty as charged.

If you believe the book of Revelation speaks of our future, then YOU are not rightly dividing his word and you are not staying with what the Bible says, that means you're pushing false doctrine, and that makes you guilty according to your own measure. Guilty as charged!

You see how stupid this is? I can so easily point out where you're going wrong and accuse you of "spreading false doctrine", but that's not the way this is supposed to work. We're supposed to come together here with open minds and humble hearts and test ourselves and learn and grow. All this nonsense about accusing others of "lying and deceiving" is not only ridiculous, but insulting and counter productive. That's not the way Christians are supposed to interact with each other. Look at what you've accomplished with your stupid accusations. Nothing good! All you've done is made me angry, and distrust you, and disrespect you. You've got a long hill to climb now if you want to earn my respect back, and for me to consider your words, and you've done nothing to bring me closer to your point of view. So what was it for? What did you think you were going to accomplish? You thought Jesus would give you a pat on the back for that nonsense? You think Jesus is saying "well done"? No, all you've done is reveal your ignorance and your ego. Well done, indeed.

 

[Davy]

It's not an opinion, it's a fact that nobody on here is lying. Do you understand the difference between being wrong and telling a lie?

I well understand the difference between preaching as a "hireling" (John 10), treating it like a business, compared to those who refuse to be tethered down by men's doctrines, like the leaven which Jesus warned His disciples that the Pharisees were doing.

I don't care if the preacher looks like an ogre at the pulpit with worn out clothes, if that person is staying in The Word of God, then that is a true disciple of Jesus Christ, and will have rewards coming in the world to come. So it ain't about looks, or money, nor Ph.D,.s, etc., which are things of this world.

 

[Big Boy Johnson]

Yeah, that's kind of like Nicodemus not perceiving the concept of being born again. Things not understood are usually first rejected. But he didn't throw stones like some do.

He received the Lord's correction and believed.