Well your right about the little people it is just my opinion and thoughts not backed up by any scripture I know of yet:)but still looking.But I am positive who Antichrist is and it will be Satan de facto getting kicked out of heaven. His physical person has been held there sense the death on the cross he plays the role of accuser night and day.Only his spirit roams the earth now.(as opposed to the time before the cross when he could roam to and fro) He is held by Michael. He will be kicked out of heaven (rev.9:5 an 9:10)an there will be silence in heaven for 1/2 hr. At that same time we are told Woe to those on earth for the devil/that old serpent has come down unto them. Futher more we are told by Luke when this happens there will be Lighting and thunders. And if thats not enough we are also told in 2 thes says that the second coming will not occur untill after the Son of Perdition the Man of lawlessness (both of which are names for Satan) comes first. http://www.christianityboard.com/god-s-hig...ngel-t3794.htmlRev 12:7 ¶ And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels, Rev 12:8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven. Rev 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him. Rev 12:10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night theres several threads on the site about this if your interested.
Beasts Of Revelation And Daniel
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Yes, Satan will be kicked out of heaven, but I believe the bible teaches that he will indwell in the man of the antichrist. 2 Thes 2, tells us that he is the “Man” of sin and Rev 13 tells us that his number is a number of a “Man”. In the OT of Isaiah 14: 15, also tells us that he is a “Man”. The Strong’s Concordance in both the OT and NT, tells us that this word Man to describe the Antichrist is the same word Man used in other places to describe a human being. Just as Jesus was God in the flesh, the antichrist will be Satan in the flesh. I think the bible teaches that he will be a man. (aka Satan in the flesh = Man = human being according to the Strong’s Concordance)
New Testament man - means a human being (same meaning)2 Thess 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; (man= Strong’s Concordance #444)Rev 13:18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six. (man= Strong’s Concordance #444)Mt 12:35 A good man out of the good treasure of the heart bringeth forth good things: and an evil man out of the evil treasure bringeth forth evil things. (man= Strong’s Concordance #444)Strong’s Concordance - Man – 2 Thes 2:5, Rev 13:18, Math 12:35 = anthrōpos (#444) Meaning;1) a human being, whether male or femalea) generically, to include all human individuals
to distinguish man from beings of a different order1) of animals and plants2) of from God and Christ3) of the angelsc) with the added notion of weakness, by which man is led into a mistake or prompted to sind) with the adjunct notion of contempt or disdainful pitye) with reference to two fold nature of man, body and soulf) with reference to the two fold nature of man, the corrupt and the truly Christian man, conformed to the nature of Godg) with reference to sex, a male2) indefinitely, someone, a man, one3) in the plural, people4) joined with other words, merchantmanOld Testament man - means a human being (same meaning)Is 14:15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit. 16 They that see Thee shall narrowly look upon Thee, and consider Thee, saying, Is thIs The man that made The earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms; (man Strong’s Concordance #0376) Gen 2:23 And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of man. (man Strong’s Concordance #0376)Strong’s Concordance - Man – Is 14:15, Gen 2:23 = 'iysh (#0376) Meaning;1) mana) man, male (in contrast to woman, female)
husbandc) human being, person (in contrast to God)d) servante) mankindf) championg) great man2) whosoever3) each (adjective)
New Testament man - means a human being (same meaning)2 Thess 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; (man= Strong’s Concordance #444)Rev 13:18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six. (man= Strong’s Concordance #444)Mt 12:35 A good man out of the good treasure of the heart bringeth forth good things: and an evil man out of the evil treasure bringeth forth evil things. (man= Strong’s Concordance #444)Strong’s Concordance - Man – 2 Thes 2:5, Rev 13:18, Math 12:35 = anthrōpos (#444) Meaning;1) a human being, whether male or femalea) generically, to include all human individuals
Of course I can see why you have that opinion. but Satan can appear as a man he did it in the garden he and his fallen angels (sons of God) mated with the daughters of men. Resulting in offspring. Human form would have been required. (Gen.19)( look at the description they washed thier feet they ate ext.)also Gen 32:24 And Jacob was left alone; and there wrestled a man with him until the breaking of the day. Just as angels appeared as men to many in the bible, So will Satan "the terms "Man of Sin" or "Son of perdition" is accepted by all bible scholars as being names for Satan himself.also:Revelation 9:1 "And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit [pit of the abyss]."The "star" that falls to the earth is the star of Isaiah 14. The star is "Lucifer", who will be the Antichrist once he arrives on earth. Satan is given the key, or authority to the bottomless pit, for this is where Satan's fallen angels are held.Besides this I find no biblical support for this Human taking over theory nowhere are we led to believe he will enter into a of human body. Although spirit may be capable of invading a human body I don't recall any precedence of an an Angel itself being capable of this.And you have to take into account his reason for his being here.It is to claim he is Christ/God Anti =meaning instead of christ. What point to enter into a human. We are told this delusion (of him being christ returned) will be so strong that the whole world will follow after him. A delusion so great that even the very elect would be fooled had not God shortened the time. So when you take the whole picture into account:Satan gets kicked out of heavenThere will be lighting Luk 10:18 And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven. He will claiming to be christ returnedThe whole world follows after him He makes world peaceHe creates a one world religious systemHe will be performing miraclesHe will have his army of fallen angels with himHe will stand in the holy place and declare himself godThis can not be a man(human)There is no human that can cause Jews and Muslims to join the same religious systemAs You say Jew's are expecting the Messiah for the first time It is also an Islamic believe that Jesus will return (though they believe it will be with their 12th Imam to proclaim Islam the right religion) My point is the return of a fake Jesus is the one thing that bring Jews Islam and Christianity together under a one world religion. (and the smaller ones will follow)He does all by pretending to be Christ and we are told when the true Christ comes every eye will see him.This is where Luke's verse comes in every eye will also see a conterfit coming when Satan comes down to earth this is the beginning of the great deception.There is no purpose for him to appear as a human His role will be as Antichrist (instead of christ) the false prophet.To commit the abomination of Desolatin. To convince all who are not sealed with the mark of God to believe he is christreturned. This is Satan the Arch Angel, not a human.
Agreed Kriss, although we are made of the image of God. According to the story of Sodom on Genesis 19...by reading it... Angels already looks like a man...but not human as we are.
Lovest ye in Christ Yahshua our Lord and Saviour.
(Gods Child;18070)
You may be right, time will tell. One reason I think that it could be possible that he would come up among the Jews is that they are waiting for their Messiah. The scripture does say that "he shall come up" and we know the antichrist will be a man. He will have to be born of woman and come "up" from somewhere. He "shall come up" from men. Satan is cast down, but he will inhabit the man of the antichrist, in which the man will have to come up to power among small people.If he came up from the Jews, they would be more apt to believe him to be their Messiah, but that is just my thought on it. Many Jewish people believe that the Messiah must be of Jewish decent, but I have heard of some Jews who say that who ever brings peace and makes it so they can rebuild their temple, that person will be the Messiah. At this point I do not think that anyone of us can say for sure who the "small people" are, but it is good to get different perspectives on it. Cover all the basis if you will.
I think one problem lies in identifying that the "messiah" of the Jews as the Antichrist. It may be, but I think most likely not. I have not been convinced by scriptures that people say identify him as Jewish.Let me throw in a different scenario. Say some Jew rise up and was able to lead the Jews into great victory. This person would be like a Jewish Messiah. However, after a while (3.5 years perhaps), this person gets killed by the Antichrist and the False Prophet (First and Second Beast). Now in despair, some of them follow the First Beast. Possible?Now think about the Two Witnesses who were killed by the First Beast.Now cross-reference Muslims expectations. They expect that there will be a Dajjal (Jewish leader) who will war against the Muslims. He will be killed by Mahdi and Isa.see the following articles for the comparisons:http://al-mahdi.atspace.com/al-mahdi.htmlhttp://al-mahdi.atspace.com/isa.htmlhttp://al-mahdi.atspace.com/dajjal.html
You may be right, time will tell. One reason I think that it could be possible that he would come up among the Jews is that they are waiting for their Messiah. The scripture does say that "he shall come up" and we know the antichrist will be a man. He will have to be born of woman and come "up" from somewhere. He "shall come up" from men. Satan is cast down, but he will inhabit the man of the antichrist, in which the man will have to come up to power among small people.If he came up from the Jews, they would be more apt to believe him to be their Messiah, but that is just my thought on it. Many Jewish people believe that the Messiah must be of Jewish decent, but I have heard of some Jews who say that who ever brings peace and makes it so they can rebuild their temple, that person will be the Messiah. At this point I do not think that anyone of us can say for sure who the "small people" are, but it is good to get different perspectives on it. Cover all the basis if you will.
I think one problem lies in identifying that the "messiah" of the Jews as the Antichrist. It may be, but I think most likely not. I have not been convinced by scriptures that people say identify him as Jewish.Let me throw in a different scenario. Say some Jew rise up and was able to lead the Jews into great victory. This person would be like a Jewish Messiah. However, after a while (3.5 years perhaps), this person gets killed by the Antichrist and the False Prophet (First and Second Beast). Now in despair, some of them follow the First Beast. Possible?Now think about the Two Witnesses who were killed by the First Beast.Now cross-reference Muslims expectations. They expect that there will be a Dajjal (Jewish leader) who will war against the Muslims. He will be killed by Mahdi and Isa.see the following articles for the comparisons:http://al-mahdi.atspace.com/al-mahdi.htmlhttp://al-mahdi.atspace.com/isa.htmlhttp://al-mahdi.atspace.com/dajjal.html
tim_from_pa
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Yes Yaqub:Thank you for those links. I found them very enlightening and eye-opening. I especially like the charts at the end of the articles to make a quick comparison instead of trying to sort out all the text.In addition, it's good to see these articles where Christian eschatology is well understood. An example of what I mean is when the Antichrist is compared to the Al-Mahdi, the Christian perspective sees Antichrist as coming from the Seleucid Portion of the Grecian empire. I agree. When we study Daniel and compare to Revelation, we see why that is. I get so tied and weary of hearing on forums, books, preaching and what-not about Antichrist being a wayward US president, a "Common Market" businessman or whatever else they can dream up that only shows they do not know half of the scriptures and are clueless (albeit with science-fiction imagination).I always believed He would be Assyrian (again from the Seleucid portion of the Grecian Empire) . However, when I read the apocrypha, there are mentions of Arabia (ie. "dragons of Arabia" read II Esdras 15) in end times and I could not figure out the connection. I see it now with these articles. I was only looking at Antichrist from a national and geographical perspective. Islam on the other hand, is newer than those prophecies and the Antichrist and his people from that region would naturally embrace it later on.Yes, I think these articles you supplied are onto something here. Thanks again for them.Thanks Kriss for pointing this thread out to me, too!
(kriss;18126)
Of course I can see why you have that opinion. but Satan can appear as a man he did it in the garden he and his fallen angels (sons of God) mated with the daughters of men. Resulting in offspring. Human form would have been required. (Gen.19)( look at the description they washed thier feet they ate ext.)also Gen 32:24 And Jacob was left alone; and there wrestled a man with him until the breaking of the day. Just as angels appeared as men to many in the bible, So will Satan "the terms "Man of Sin" or "Son of perdition" is accepted by all bible scholars as being names for Satan himself.also:Revelation 9:1 "And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit [pit of the abyss]."The "star" that falls to the earth is the star of Isaiah 14. The star is "Lucifer", who will be the Antichrist once he arrives on earth. Satan is given the key, or authority to the bottomless pit, for this is where Satan's fallen angels are held.Besides this I find no biblical support for this Human taking over theory nowhere are we led to believe he will enter into a of human body. Although spirit may be capable of invading a human body I don't recall any precedence of an an Angel itself being capable of this.And you have to take into account his reason for his being here.It is to claim he is Christ/God Anti =meaning instead of christ. What point to enter into a human. We are told this delusion (of him being christ returned) will be so strong that the whole world will follow after him. A delusion so great that even the very elect would be fooled had not God shortened the time. So when you take the whole picture into account:Satan gets kicked out of heavenThere will be lighting Luk 10:18 And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven. He will claiming to be christ returnedThe whole world follows after him He makes world peaceHe creates a one world religious systemHe will be performing miraclesHe will have his army of fallen angels with himHe will stand in the holy place and declare himself godThis can not be a man(human)There is no human that can cause Jews and Muslims to join the same religious systemAs You say Jew's are expecting the Messiah for the first time It is also an Islamic believe that Jesus will return (though they believe it will be with their 12th Imam to proclaim Islam the right religion) My point is the return of a fake Jesus is the one thing that bring Jews Islam and Christianity together under a one world religion. (and the smaller ones will follow)He does all by pretending to be Christ and we are told when the true Christ comes every eye will see him.This is where Luke's verse comes in every eye will also see a conterfit coming when Satan comes down to earth this is the beginning of the great deception.There is no purpose for him to appear as a human His role will be as Antichrist (instead of christ) the false prophet.To commit the abomination of Desolatin. To convince all who are not sealed with the mark of God to believe he is christreturned. This is Satan the Arch Angel, not a human.
I have been following this thread from the beginning with fascination. It certainly is a subject that needs a lot of dissection and lateral thinking to try and decode the prophecy/s.One thing that keeps coming up (Highlighted in Red) that no one has sufficiently answered - What is "sealed with the mark of God" I am at a loss as to the possible meaning of this. Anyone have any suggestions?
Of course I can see why you have that opinion. but Satan can appear as a man he did it in the garden he and his fallen angels (sons of God) mated with the daughters of men. Resulting in offspring. Human form would have been required. (Gen.19)( look at the description they washed thier feet they ate ext.)also Gen 32:24 And Jacob was left alone; and there wrestled a man with him until the breaking of the day. Just as angels appeared as men to many in the bible, So will Satan "the terms "Man of Sin" or "Son of perdition" is accepted by all bible scholars as being names for Satan himself.also:Revelation 9:1 "And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit [pit of the abyss]."The "star" that falls to the earth is the star of Isaiah 14. The star is "Lucifer", who will be the Antichrist once he arrives on earth. Satan is given the key, or authority to the bottomless pit, for this is where Satan's fallen angels are held.Besides this I find no biblical support for this Human taking over theory nowhere are we led to believe he will enter into a of human body. Although spirit may be capable of invading a human body I don't recall any precedence of an an Angel itself being capable of this.And you have to take into account his reason for his being here.It is to claim he is Christ/God Anti =meaning instead of christ. What point to enter into a human. We are told this delusion (of him being christ returned) will be so strong that the whole world will follow after him. A delusion so great that even the very elect would be fooled had not God shortened the time. So when you take the whole picture into account:Satan gets kicked out of heavenThere will be lighting Luk 10:18 And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven. He will claiming to be christ returnedThe whole world follows after him He makes world peaceHe creates a one world religious systemHe will be performing miraclesHe will have his army of fallen angels with himHe will stand in the holy place and declare himself godThis can not be a man(human)There is no human that can cause Jews and Muslims to join the same religious systemAs You say Jew's are expecting the Messiah for the first time It is also an Islamic believe that Jesus will return (though they believe it will be with their 12th Imam to proclaim Islam the right religion) My point is the return of a fake Jesus is the one thing that bring Jews Islam and Christianity together under a one world religion. (and the smaller ones will follow)He does all by pretending to be Christ and we are told when the true Christ comes every eye will see him.This is where Luke's verse comes in every eye will also see a conterfit coming when Satan comes down to earth this is the beginning of the great deception.There is no purpose for him to appear as a human His role will be as Antichrist (instead of christ) the false prophet.To commit the abomination of Desolatin. To convince all who are not sealed with the mark of God to believe he is christreturned. This is Satan the Arch Angel, not a human.
I have been following this thread from the beginning with fascination. It certainly is a subject that needs a lot of dissection and lateral thinking to try and decode the prophecy/s.One thing that keeps coming up (Highlighted in Red) that no one has sufficiently answered - What is "sealed with the mark of God" I am at a loss as to the possible meaning of this. Anyone have any suggestions?
I can answer that the seal of God is the exact oppiste of the Mark of the beastthe seal of God is Eph 1:13 In whom ye also [trusted], after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise, If you know Gods word trust and the truth of your salvation you are sealed by God as one of his. There are two seals of the end times, one you know antichrist comes first and are not fooled by his delusion and lies. And stand firm waiting for true Christ. These are the sealed of God. Then their are those who believe the delusion and lies of Antichrist it is these who will take the seal/mark of the beast.This is what the true mark of the beast is not a chip or tatoo or any other physical markit is believing Antichrist is christ. Now even if you are required to receive a chip or tatooas always,Let your common sense work here, God is concerned with your state of your heart/spirt not mark on you body. Ezek 9:4 "And the LORD said unto him, Go through the midst of the city, through the midst of Jerusalem, and set a mark upon the foreheads of the men that sigh and that cry for all the abominations that be done in the midst thereof".Ezek 6 Slay utterly old and young, both maids, and little children, and women: but come not near any man upon whom is the mark; and begin at my sanctuary. Then they began at the ancient men which were before the house. Let me ask what is in your forehead? Your mind who is your mind set on Christ or Antichrist? Right Hand means to work who are you working for Christ or antichrist?
Well Kriss, my head is full of mush - My heart is with God - and he knows the truth of that.I have 40 years of stubborn independence behind me which I keep at bay for long enough to read the Bible looking for the truth. Sometimes the truth jumps out at me. And sometimes I think it is a load of rubbish. But I am honest about that.I may be a little rough round the edges, jaded, world weary and especially sick of the stupidity of mankind.But should the anti-christ come along claiming to be the new messiah I for one will not fall for the horned clown.
2Cr 11:14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. Here is a verse that most people read right over without really understanding what is being saidlook at this word TransformedStrongs #3345 metaschematizo met-askh-ay-mat-id'-zo from 3326 and a derivative of 4976; ===> to transfigure or "disguise" ;
Dear Kriss,Over the years as a non Christian and as a Christian revelations has always been a stumbling block. I have tried myself and also asked of the Christian community what the meaning of revelations is. Most have not had an understanding themselves and some have seemed almost embarassed to try and explain it.Even during my non Christian years revelations has always been in the back of my mind - ticking away looking at world and religious leaders trying to see any correlation with the prophecy even when I thought it pure nonsense.Your explanation, Kriss, is the clearest, most concise, non crazy yet.The world, right now, is sleepwalking into trouble. The wierd thing (I am not crazy) is I feel it and see it happening but the majority of people are totally oblivious - as if they have been drugged (TV Hey?
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