Biblical Mary
- Thread starter theefaith
- Start date
-
Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.
You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
No. The church became corrupt before it became the RCC. The RCC depending on which Christian historian states the church was born either at the end of the fourth or the end of the sixth century. I hold to the end of the sixth as it was after this time that the ten major false doctrines of Rome were promulgated and made official.
The church from Constantine till 600Ad was the seed for Romanism to be born. For Constantine through his edicts and influence tied the church to the empire. It was here that teh dark ages began as well when the roman church became supreme and the Pope was called pontificus maximus and vicarius Christos.
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
n the Catholic Church, the veneration of Mary, mother of Jesus, encompasses various Marian devotions which include prayer, pious acts, visual arts, poetry, and music devoted to the Blessed Virgin Mary. Popes have encouraged it, while also taking steps to reform some manifestations of it. Wikipedia
If you like we can list the feast days dedicated to Mary, the prayers exalting mary, hymns exalting mary, devotions dedicated to Mary, adoration dedicated to Mary etc.etc.
Like I said, if it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, walks like a duck, acts like a duck--its a duck!
peter is the vicar of Christ
Christ continues His mission in the world thru his church thru Peter and his successors
It’s not possible to honor or venerate Her enough as Her exalted dignity demands but it is always less than adoration or worship
Of course you would find it offensive....truth is always offensive to its gainsayers!
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
Now just show that the church was commanded to exalt and venerate her from SCripture and I will believe it.
Show from Scripture she was Immaculately conceived and I will believe it.
Show form Scripture that she never had sex with Joseph and I will believe it.
Stop giving me mens opinion. The bible is Gods Opinion. Anything a man would say no matter what title others may confer on Him has to coincide exactly with Scripture or be resisted at all costs.
why scripture?
why not believe what God has revealed?
Peter
Christ founded the church on Peter!
Matt 16:18
18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.
You CANNOT give the keys (authority) to a confession but to a person! Peter
Vs 19 unto thee (Peter) thou shalt bind (Peter) thou shalt loose (Peter)
Only the one true church founded by Christ on Peter and the apostles and their successors and those members of Christ by faith and baptism United with them, the communion of the saints
Jn 16:10 matt 16:18 18:18 Jn 20:21-23
Jn 10:16
Ephesians 5:32
This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church
1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
The office of apostle that has the three fold office, to teach: to govern the church: and to sanctify by the sacraments or sacred oaths (promises) of the father! Acts 2:38-39 with ez 36:25-27 Heb 8:6
Keys of authority! And power to bind and loose! Matt 16:18 and Matt 18:18
Moral authority:
(Teaching)
Necessity of being taught by Christ:
Two edge sword: defining truth and condemning errors, and Interpreting scripture.
Jurisdictional authority:
(Governing / administering)
Necessity of Peter and the apostles and their successors to govern the holy church.
Spiritual authority:
(Life of Grace)
Sanctifying thru the mass and Sacraments
Jn 8:12
Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.
Jn 9:5
As long as I am in the world, I am the light of the world.
Matt 5:14
Ye (the apostles/ the church) are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid.
(There is only one church founded by Christ on Peter and the apostles and their successors!) Jn 10:16
Only Peter and the apostles and their successors have the teaching authority of Christ with the guarantee of the Holy Spirit! Matt 16:18 matt 18:18 matt 28:19 Jn 8:32 Jn 16:13
Fathers have care of their children, spiritual fathers care for our souls!
Pope, papa, father, yes spiritual father!
Isa 22 father
Christ is the head of the church!
Peter is appointed by Christ as the head of the church on earth!
Supreme pastor and teacher of the faithful!
Matt 10:2
First apostle Peter:
Matt 17:27
Jesus and Peter are one:
Jesus even works a miracle to make this point. 27 Notwithstanding, lest we should offend them, go thou to the sea, and cast an hook, and take up the fish that first cometh up; and when thou hast opened his mouth, thou shalt find a piece of money: that take, and give unto them for me and thee.
Mt 16:18 Peter received the keys of the kingdom: (jurisdictional authority of the universal church) and the power to bind and loose:
Lk 22:32
Peter commanded to confirm his breathren:
Lk 22:32
Jesus prays for Peter:
Jn 21:17
Peter commanded to Feed my sheep:
Matt 10:2
Peter is the prince of the apostles, head of the universal church on earth!
Jn 20:21-23
Peter and the apostles receive the Holy Spirit and the power to forgive sins:
Acts 1:15 1:17 1:26
Peter declares Judas office of apostle valid and vacant and chooses a successor:
Acts 2:14
Peter preaches the first sermon on Pentecost:
Acts 2:38
Peter requires baptism as the outward sign and initiation into the new covenant!
Acts 4:8 Then Peter, filled with the Holy Ghost, said unto them, Ye rulers of the people, and elders of Israel,
(Peter guided by the Holy Spirit guides the church)
Acts 5 authority of the apostles verified by them being stricken dead by God verifying Matt 16:18 matt 18:18 whatsoever you bind on earth is bound in heaven and the apostles have the light of the Holy Spirit!
1 Tim 1 Paul is Timothy’s spiritual father.
1 Jn 2:1 little children are adult Christians, John is their spiritual father.
Apostles have Care for our souls
(Acts 20:28 Jn 21:17 Heb 13:17)
———
The successors of Moses having kingdom authority of the keys and the power to bind and loose Mt 23 was taken from them Mt 21:43 and given to Peter, the apostles, and their successors: Mt 16:18 Mt 18:18 and Jesus says this power and authority is to be obeyed!
Rom 13:2
Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation.
(If it applies to civil authority, how much more to religious authority)
Mt 28:18-20
all authority is given to Peter, the apostles, and their successors requiring obedience, rom 1:5 obedience to the faith!
And Jesus say to Peter, the apostles, and their successors: behold I am with you even until the end of the world!!!
So the apostles have to remain until the end!
Lk 10:16 He who hears you hears me...
(The apostles and their successors)
John 13:20
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that receiveth whomsoever I send receiveth me; and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me.
Without a central authority there can be no unity of the spirit, no obedience to the faith!
God - Christ - Peter - the apostles - the apostles successors - the people
Hierarchy is the nature of authority!
God always establishes order in obedience to hierarchical authority!
The angelic order!
The church order!
The family order!
The civil order!
All require obedience to hierarchical authority!
The church is not a democracy but a kingdom!
They are not God, not the king, not the founder!
But equal with Christ yes!
As far as roles go, Jesus is the head of the church, Peter is the head of the church on earth Mt 16:18 and leader of the apostles Mt 10:2 administers of the kingdom in the absence of the king. Acts 1:9 Jn 21:17 and Peter, the apostles and their successors are sent in the same way as Jesus!
Jn 20:21 Then said Jesus to them again, Peace be unto you: as my Father hath sent me, even so send I you.
22 And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost:
They are God breathed!
Jesus Christ continues HIS ministry in His new covenant church thru Peter, the apostles, and their successors with the same mission, power, and authority!
Mt 16:18 Mt 28:19 Acts 1:17 acts 8:31 & 35 Lk 10:16 Jn 8:32 Jn 13:20 Jn 16:13
Jn 20:21-22 eph 2:20
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
Your ignorance of what jesus said is glaring. Jesus founded the church not on Peter, but on Peters statement of "Thou art the christ, the Son of the Living God!"
Go back to the greek. Peter is Petros a pebble or little stone. Rock is petra, a ledge or huge stone! And when you properly follow th erules of Grammar and read it as Jesus said it, you would know the Rock He was referring to was not Peter but upon HIs statement .
And that was given to all church elders (Matt. 18).
Keys open doors. Not symbols of power! If you read Gods Word (this is what God reveals) ytou will see that the Gospel did not go out ot the Jews, until Peter first preached to the Jews after Pentecost. It did not go out to the Gentiles until Peter preached to Cornelius. It was Peter who had to open the doors for the gospel to go out to all peoples.
That is the Pastors and teachers not the Apostles now! The Office of the Apostle ended when John died! We now are all apostolos or sent ones.
If you want to keep Apsotolic succession going you should follow the rules the original 11 had after Judas died:
Acts 1:
15 And in those days Peter stood up in the midst of the disciples, and said, (the number of names together were about an hundred and twenty,)
16 Men and brethren, this scripture must needs have been fulfilled, which the Holy Ghost by the mouth of David spake before concerning Judas, which was guide to them that took Jesus.
17 For he was numbered with us, and had obtained part of this ministry.
18 Now this man purchased a field with the reward of iniquity; and falling headlong, he burst asunder in the midst, and all his bowels gushed out.
19 And it was known unto all the dwellers at Jerusalem; insomuch as that field is called in their proper tongue, Aceldama, that is to say, The field of blood.
20 For it is written in the book of Psalms, Let his habitation be desolate, and let no man dwell therein: and his bishoprick let another take.
21 Wherefore of these men which have companied with us all the time that the Lord Jesus went in and out among us,
22 Beginning from the baptism of John, unto that same day that he was taken up from us, must one be ordained to be a witness with us of his resurrection.
23 And they appointed two, Joseph called Barsabas, who was surnamed Justus, and Matthias.
24 And they prayed, and said, Thou, Lord, which knowest the hearts of all men, shew whether of these two thou hast chosen,
25 That he may take part of this ministry and apostleship, from which Judas by transgression fell, that he might go to his own place.
26 And they gave forth their lots; and the lot fell upon Matthias; and he was numbered with the eleven apostles.
Now you are adding ot teh Scriptures things which are not true of what Jesus said.
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
MIsapplying a verse again. That damnation is not eternal damnation. If it were, every time you break the speed limit, you are condemened to hell for you are resisitng the higher powers.
This is for civil authority only. And spiritual authority is derived from God and the Word. If a Pope or preacher makes a "doctrine" that runs contrary to Scripture- they are to be resisted under the Authority of God and His Word.
And that Central Authority is the Holy spirit Himself! Not men. There can only be unity among men and their leaders when all are in accord with Scripture! SCripture is higher than the pontifications of Popery.
We are above angels.
God instituted Family first and our first priority is to family according ot God, then church, then human government.
1. We can only obey hierarchy when it is in accord with the highest authoriuty God gave to man- His Inspired Word! If they run contrary to it- they must be resisted and fought against.
2. Yes it is a kingdom and we have only one king-Jesus.
3. No man is equal with Christ- no one! If they think that- they must be resisted for the arrogant pride they hold!
4. After the original apostles- there was no more doctrine to be given to the church. That is why when the councils of Hippo and Carthage canonized teh Scripture, they did not include th ewritings of anyone other than the Apostles or their compatriots who wrote for them like Luke!
There are no successors to the Apostles, only the presbytry which are also called Pastors, teachers, and bishops. It was only to the original Apostles that the doctrines which became the foundation of the church was given to be passed on without addition!
Ephesians 2:19-21
King James Version
19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;
20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;
21 In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord:
Sorry but every legitimate church leader after the apostles are built upon the Apostles and prophets and Jesus. There are no more foundation builders. Just like with a regular house, you cannot build the building until teh foundation is fully laid and solidified! If we still have apostles, then we are still pouring the foundation of the church and the church cannot be built!
how many times must I do so?
lk 1:45 And blessed is she that believed: for there shall be a performance of those things which were told her from the Lord.
46 And Mary said, My soul doth magnify the Lord,
47 And my spirit hath rejoiced in God my Saviour.
48 For he hath regarded the low estate of his handmaiden: for, behold, from henceforth all generations shall call me blessed.
Eph 6:2
So Jesus has to honor Her and grant Her petitions
she’s your mother too!
John 19:26-27
When Jesus therefore saw his mother, and the disciple standing by, whom he loved, he saith unto his mother, Woman, behold thyson! Then saith he to the disciple, Beholdthy mother! And from that hour that disciple took her unto his own home.
Romans 13:7
Render therefore to all their dues: tribute to whom tribute is due; custom to whom custom; fear to whom fear; honour to whom honour.
Holy Saturday: traditionally a day of Hope!
the blessed Mary ever Virgin, mother of God hoped steadfastly in the resurrection of Her divine son when no one else did!
All Saturday’s are dedicated to the blest Virgin, our immaculate mother!
the blessed Mary ever Virgin, mother of God hoped steadfastly in the resurrection of Her divine son when no one else did!
All Saturday’s are dedicated to the blest Virgin, our immaculate mother!
dogma de fide thee faith
87. The God-Man Jesus Christ is to be venerated with one single mode of Worship, the absolute Worship of Latria which is due to God alone.
Similar threads
