Bibliolatry: Worship/knowledge of the book MORE than the author

[St. SteVen]

And just to add, if we get confused with one passage we can and need to look at others....

Yes, of course.
But that saw cuts both ways.

Isn't it a contradiction to believe that Jesus taught us that godly behavior is to love your enemies
but then claim that he will incinerate his own enemies? Incinerating your enemies is not love. - LOL

Or perhaps I should be more godly and incinerate my enemies?
What's wrong with this picture? - LOL

/

 

[Lizbeth]

Yes, of course.
But that saw cuts both ways.

Isn't it a contradiction to believe that Jesus taught us that godly behavior is to love your enemies
but then claim that he will incinerate his own enemies? Incinerating your enemies is not love. - LOL

Or perhaps I should be more godly and incinerate my enemies?
What's wrong with this picture? - LOL

/

The difference is that you are not God. We are mere human beings who fell short of the glory. So we have no right to sit in judgment on our fellow creatures.

These are the days/years of God's longsuffering (age of grace) spoken about in 2 Peter 3.......so we are to longsuffer our enemies with Him and share the mercy/grace of Christ, to show His mercy and forgiveness in this long season that is accounted as salvation, as the time of opportunity to be saved......while it is still called day, as in Today is the day of salvation. But once the master has arisen and shut to the door.......well, that day will be over and there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth without. It is appointed unto man but once to die and then the judgment.

 

[Lizbeth]

Yes, of course.
But that saw cuts both ways.

Isn't it a contradiction to believe that Jesus taught us that godly behavior is to love your enemies
but then claim that he will incinerate his own enemies? Incinerating your enemies is not love. - LOL

Or perhaps I should be more godly and incinerate my enemies?
What's wrong with this picture? - LOL

/

The bible explicitly says of some that they will perish like the beasts of the earth. We were all given the gift of a temporal life just like the animals, and without Christ all will die like the animals. God doesn't owe anyone eternal life. But some will get hold of it through faith in Christ. You're looking at the cup half empty when it is half full. That He is saving any at all is great news.....because He doesn't have to. It isn't anything anyone is "entitled" to at all, it is a gift..........that cost Jesus a great deal.

 

[St. SteVen]

The difference is that you are not God.

Sorry... But that is an absolutely insane double standard in my view.
Is there not a standard for righteousness? A standard for right and wrong?
A standard for goodness and a standard for sin?

How can God exist at a standard BELOW the moral and ethical standard he set for us?

/

 

[St. SteVen]

The bible explicitly says...

Do you have any idea where the Bible came from?
Please explain. Thanks.

/

 

[Hillsage]

Yes, of course.
But that saw cuts both ways.

Isn't it a contradiction to believe that Jesus taught us that godly behavior is to love your enemies
but then claim that he will incinerate his own enemies? Incinerating your enemies is not love. - LOL

Or perhaps I should be more godly and incinerate my enemies?
What's wrong with this picture? - LOL

/

The problem here Steven, is "INCINERATE" doesn't even fit the dictionary definition of 'the majority churches' POV. Incinerate means to "burn up" "consume" "carbonize" "reduce to ashes". That isn't 'ETERNAL PURPOSELESS TORTURE' with no DAMNED end. Other than the fact that their God is mad as ETERNAL HELL at what HE CREATED....as an omniscient God. HELLLLLO!

Love your "Saw cuts both ways" picture.

 

[St. SteVen]

Love your "Saw cuts both ways" picture.

 

[Lizbeth]

Sorry... But that is an absolutely insane double standard in my view.
Is there not a standard for righteousness? A standard for right and wrong?
A standard for goodness and a standard for sin?

How can God exist at a standard BELOW the moral and ethical standard he set for us?

/

He is the Lord God Almighty. And we were created by Him.....for His purposes. Some were created to be vessels of His wrath, in a foreknowledge, sovereign kind of way, including the devil created for His purposes. His wrath is not unjust, it is perfectly just. So it is not sin. Read the bible....justice is a virtue. Was He sinning when He sent the flood? Was He sinning when He slew Ananias and Sapphira? Was He sinning when He sent Paul a thorn in the flesh? Or was He sinning when He told the Israelites to exterminate the Canaanites because their transgression had come to the full?......no, the Lord was judging them and made Israel "His battle axe and weapon of war.". That is the idea behind the harvest in the end of this age......sin growing to its full, as well as fullness of the Gentiles who believe.

Not going to be very nice around here in the end.....it's already gotten bad and the evening news is depressing to watch. The bible says the whole world lies under His wrath even now and I sure believe it when I look around at this world......but through faith in Christ and only through Him, are some saved from wrath. If we would judge ourselves we will not be judged with the world. Mercy triumphs over judgment through Christ and in no other way. In wrath God remembers mercy........which is the gospel and whatever relief we can provide to the lost where it is being preached. Jesus is the cleft of the Rock that we hide in and in this way we are not consumed by the consuming fire of God, even though we feel the heat of it at times for our spiritual good....otherwise no man can see God and live.

 

[Lizbeth]

Do you have any idea where the Bible came from?
Please explain. Thanks.

/

Oh here we go. When some people see things in the bible that doesn't agree with their pet doctrines, they want to bring out the questionable content card. That's always convenient isn't it. But why don't they question the legitimacy of scriptures that they believe support their doctrines?

We have the Holy Spirit to lead us into all truth and we are to seek the whole counsel of God...comparing scripture with scripture and seeing how God's truth is harmonious throughout the whole bible. So if there are any errors they must be overall minor ones.

The Lord gives and the Lord takes away, blessed be His name. As Job said, "Shall we accept only good things from God's hand and not evil?" It's with good reason Jesus told the parable of a great King (the Lord) coming with his mighty army that is much bigger than a lesser ruler's army....so it would be wise for that lesser ruler (ie, us) to seek terms of peace (ie, surrender) while He is still far away.

 

[Lizbeth]

The problem here Steven, is "INCINERATE" doesn't even fit the dictionary definition of 'the majority churches' POV. Incinerate means to "burn up" "consume" "carbonize" "reduce to ashes". That isn't 'ETERNAL PURPOSELESS TORTURE' with no DAMNED end. Other than the fact that their God is mad as ETERNAL HELL at what HE CREATED....as an omniscient God. HELLLLLO!

Love your "Saw cuts both ways" picture.

A humble and contrite heart He will not despise. He won't turn anyone away who humbly bends the knee and seeks Him and comes to Him in contrition.

But His wrath is a real thing. Though His ways are higher than man's....it's not as if He is consumed with emotions that make Him lose His temper, like man may be. This has all been in His plans and forethought before the foundation of the world. He just isn't going to longsuffer evil and wickedness in His kingdom forever. A time will come when it will all be purged forever. And that will be a good thing, not bad. He offered His only Son to rescue from that fate whosoever will receive Him....what more could He have done? Man, that is mercy....would we do the same with our only son, a young man who was innocent of any sin and spent His life eschewing career, a home, wife and family...doing nothing but selflessly going around doing good to others? Offer him up to suffer and die like that for the same wretched race of mankind who made him suffer and die? He is WORTHY, so worthy.

 

[St. SteVen]

He is the Lord God Almighty. And we were created by Him.....for His purposes. Some were created to be vessels of His wrath, in a foreknowledge, sovereign kind of way, including the devil created for His purposes. His wrath is not unjust, it is perfectly just.

What an absolute horrible mischaracterization of our loving heavenly Father. Sickening!

To claim that the worst despots in human history pale in comparison to the brutal acts and plans of God for humankind created in his image.

How is this different from a dog-breeder that creates ferocious monster dogs to be used in dog fights?
Making sport of these innocent beasts. Were they not created by the breeder for his purposes?

--- PARODY ---

God: Welcome to the afterlife.
Person: Who are you?
God: I created you for my own purposes.
Person: Like what.
God: For destruction.
Person: What does that mean?
God: It means eternal conscious torment.
Person: Why?
God: It was my choice for you.
Person: What did I do to deserve this.
God: You were born a sinner.
Person: Not by my choice.
God: Right. By my choice.
Person: Was that fair?
God: It doesn't matter. You can't stop me.
Person: Who did you say you were again?
You sound more like the Devil than God.

/ @Hillsage

 

[St. SteVen]

St. SteVen said:
Do you have any idea where the Bible came from?
Please explain. Thanks.

Oh here we go. When some people see things in the bible that doesn't agree with their pet doctrines, they want to bring out the questionable content card. That's always convenient isn't it. But why don't they question the legitimacy of scriptures that they believe support their doctrines?

So... the answer to my question is, No you do NOT know where the Bible came from.
Which translation method do you prefer? Three to choose from.

Majority Text vs. Critical Text vs. Textus Receptus – Textual Criticism 101​

https://www.bereanpatriot.com/majority-text-vs-critical-text-vs-textus-receptus-textual-criticism-101/#Corruption-of-the-Alexandrian-text-type

/

 

[Lambano]

"In the end, there is no right or wrong. There is only power."

 

[St. SteVen]

"In the end, there is no right or wrong. There is only power."

That's a curious quote.
Could you unpack that a bit?

/

 

[Cassandra]

"In the end, there is no right or wrong. There is only power."

I know the rest of this phrase and (you know) who said it

 

[Lizbeth]

What an absolute horrible mischaracterization of our loving heavenly Father. Sickening!

To claim that the worst despots in human history pale in comparison to the brutal acts and plans of God for humankind created in his image.

How is this different from a dog-breeder that creates ferocious monster dogs to be used in dog fights?
Making sport of these innocent beasts. Were they not created by the breeder for his purposes?

--- PARODY ---

God: Welcome to the afterlife.
Person: Who are you?
God: I created you for my own purposes.
Person: Like what.
God: For destruction.
Person: What does that mean?
God: It means eternal conscious torment.
Person: Why?
God: It was my choice for you.
Person: What did I do to deserve this.
God: You were born a sinner.
Person: Not by my choice.
God: Right. By my choice.
Person: Was that fair?
God: It doesn't matter. You can't stop me.
Person: Who did you say you were again?
You sound more like the Devil than God.

/ @Hillsage

Not sure it means "eternal conscious torment".........as I have already said, I believe the wages of sin is death......the Lake of Fire means second death. Broad way leads to destruction. I stand to be corrected or tweeked if that is wrong, no problem.....and we only know in part....but that is currently how I see it. Don't know the details of how it will be, maybe there will be suffering to the extent of the sins committed by each soul before the lights go out permanently. That seems reasonable and just to me.

Remember the rich man and Lazarus, how the rich man was in torment after his death.......and a gulf was fixed between him and where Abraham was with no way to cross over from hades to paradise. I mean, shouldn't we be learning from these things?

And we vastly underestimate how sinful mankind is in the flesh. We dont know the half of it....I'm sure we saw even an inkling of what God sees and how He sees it, I'm sure we would not be so sympathetic. And to think He has provide a way out for us wretches....it's more than we deserve and yet He was so gracious and merciful to do it.

 

[Lizbeth]

St. SteVen said:
Do you have any idea where the Bible came from?
Please explain. Thanks.

So... the answer to my question is, No you do NOT know where the Bible came from.
Which translation method do you prefer? Three to choose from.

Majority Text vs. Critical Text vs. Textus Receptus – Textual Criticism 101​

Majority Text vs. Critical Text vs. Textus Receptus - Textual Criticism 101 - Berean Patriot

/

If you have a point to make, then please feel free to make it. I am not very good at playing "twenty questions".

 

[St. SteVen]

Not sure it means "eternal conscious torment".........as I have already said, I believe the wages of sin is death......the Lake of Fire means second death. Broad way leads to destruction. I stand to be corrected or tweeked if that is wrong, no problem.....and we only know in part....but that is currently how I see it. Don't know the details of how it will be, maybe there will be suffering to the extent of the sins committed by each soul before the lights go out permanently. That seems reasonable and just to me.

That's a minor technicality against what I am saying.
If we change "eternal conscious torment" to destruction, then how would you respond?

/

 

[St. SteVen]

St. SteVen said:
Do you have any idea where the Bible came from?
Please explain. Thanks.

So... the answer to my question is, No you do NOT know where the Bible came from.
Which translation method do you prefer? Three to choose from.

Majority Text vs. Critical Text vs. Textus Receptus – Textual Criticism 101​

Majority Text vs. Critical Text vs. Textus Receptus - Textual Criticism 101 - Berean Patriot

If you have a point to make, then please feel free to make it. I am not very good at playing "twenty questions".

That was only one question. You have three choices. Is that too much?

That point is that you really don't know where the Bible came from, and you don't care.

/

 

[Lambano]

I know the rest of this phrase and (you know) who said it

When I searched for it online, the Great Google came up with J.K. Rowling's Voldemort character. I haven't read ol' Harry. But I actually had in mind a quote by one of the characters in Frank Peretti's Piercing the Darkness about a girl who got seriously messed up by the amoral, culture-relative philosophy being peddled on college campuses at the time. She really needed some stakes she could put in the ground and say, yes, this is right; no, this is wrong. She found what she needed in the Bible. But what I keep seeing here is the same principle used by the powers of this age: God can do whatever he wants, because He has the biggest hammer.

20 On the contrary, who are you, O man, who answers back to God? The thing molded will not say to the molder, “Why did you make me like this,” will it? (Romans 9:20) See what happens when you make sentient beings out of clay?