Book of Daniel - Relevant time periods

[CTK]

During my study on the Book of Daniel, I have found there are 3 specific time periods these 12 chapters apply to. Whether the verses in Daniel are speaking of Greece in Chapters 2, 7, or 8, the interpretations will always stay within the same time period - one of the three. So, we have 4 kingdoms within 3 specific time periods where all the verses (actors and events) can be accurately placed.

To start with, I have found there are 4 and only 4 kingdoms that God has selected within His plan of salvation as offered throughout the Book of Daniel. These are the 4 kingdoms that came out of the sea (7:3):

1) Babylon
2) Medes-Persia,
3) Greece,
4) Rome -
a) pagan Rome,
b) papal Rome (the divided kingdom).


These four kingdoms are not at all difficult to identify in Daniel, but that cannot be said for identifying those verses that must be placed within these 4 kingdoms and exactly when they placed.

There is sufficient information within Daniel to identify where and when these 4 kingdoms will fall... so, would anyone care to discuss this critical method of unpacking Daniel? What are the 3 time periods in Daniel? Once that is discussed, if interested, we might attempt to place the "major" verses in certain chapters within each of the 4 kingdoms and within their respective time period.

 

[TribulationSigns]

Well, I am openly against or vigorously opposed to "some" Church Tradition, it is when that tradition is of men and cannot be justified by the Bible. Unlike many, I don't place Church tradition upon a pedestal, because I have God's word already up there, and it doesn't share rule (Matthew 15:3). You see, since God is not speaking to us today verbally from the smoke on the mountain, or out of the burning Bush, or out of the mouth of an donkey, the scriptures alone (Sola Scriptura) are our direct authoritative word for interpretation from God. In other words, God's very own word is the only voice than can be the supreme interpreter of God's own word. Not Hal Lindsay, Gary Hunt, or even Jospehus. Because who better to get the interpretation from, than "the Author!" Sadly, that is a principle which most of the Church of our day seems oblivious to.

Genesis 40:8

• "And they said unto him, We have dreamed a dream, and there is no interpreter of it. And Joseph said unto them, Do not interpretations belong to God? tell me them, I pray you."

Yes, Interpretations belong to God. It's not, "let me get my book of interpretations by hal Lindsey," and it's not, "let me inquire of the stars what something means," and it's not, "let me see how the great Church men of renowned interpret this verse," but Interpretations belong to God. And the immutable law is, "if it didn't come from God's word, then it's not God's interpretation."

What most Christians believe is irrelevant. The words which man's wisdom teaches "the many" concerning eschatology is as foolishness to God. The natural man, as a beast, the carnal man living by the flesh, the wicked man is without sound judgment and doesn't understand the Spiritual.

1st Corinthians 2:13-16

• "Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
• But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
• But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.
• For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ[/i]."

I'm sure you've heard those verses before, but have you "heard" those verses before? The Spiritual man judgeth by that Spirit, but the natural man is like a beast, because he is evil and without the image of God, he is without sound judgment. That most believe something does not make something sound. Interpretation is not by committee, by popular teachings, by big world news, by consensus among the Church teachers, it's by the sound exegesis of God's word compared diligently "with" God's word.

And no, the Church cannot be right in this instance. God is not giving us a "literal" history lesson about Greece and Persia, but a "spiritual" history lesson about a far more sinister spiritual rule. Christ is the prince of peace, what kingdom does He rule? Likewise, Satan is the Prince of this world, thus what kingdom does he rule? Their rules are not from physical countries or empires, but from spiritual principalities. That's what many don't understand. Even though God has stated it in many diverse ways again and again and again. You still eschew the Spiritual nature of what God is speaking about.

Ephesians 6:12

• "For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places."

Whether we like it or not, God is here telling us that our battle is not against the power of empires, of superpowers of today, it's not even physical, it's not political, it's not against physical nations, it's against a "spiritual principality, a spiritual power and spiritual wickedness." Everyone reads these things but few take it to heart.

Colossians 2:14-15

• "Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
• And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it."

These Principalities and powers that Christ spoiled was not Rome, Common Union, it wasn't Greece or Persia on today's map, but it was spiritual "Egypt" and spiritual principalities and rulers of the darkness of this world. The Christian must take his mind off the nations of this world and think about a nation from above and just how it is being attacked. Take our eyes off this world and put them on Christ.

That is all I am saying for now.

 

[CTK]

Well, I am openly against or vigorously opposed to "some" Church Tradition, it is when that tradition is of men and cannot be justified by the Bible. Unlike many, I don't place Church tradition upon a pedestal, because I have God's word already up there, and it doesn't share rule (Matthew 15:3). You see, since God is not speaking to us today verbally from the smoke on the mountain, or out of the burning Bush, or out of the mouth of an donkey, the scriptures alone (Sola Scriptura) are our direct authoritative word for interpretation from God. In other words, God's very own word is the only voice than can be the supreme interpreter of God's own word. Not Hal Lindsay or Gary Hunt. Because who better to get the interpretation from, than "the Author!" Sadly, that is a principle which most of the Church of our day seems oblivious to.

Genesis 40:8

• "And they said unto him, We have dreamed a dream, and there is no interpreter of it. And Joseph said unto them, Do not interpretations belong to God? tell me them, I pray you."

Yes, Interpretations belong to God. It's not, "let me get my book of interpretations by hal Lindsey," and it's not, "let me inquire of the stars what something means," and it's not, "let me see how the great Church men of renowned interpret this verse," but Interpretations belong to God. And the immutable law is, "if it didn't come from God's word, then it's not God's interpretation."

What most Christians believe is irrelevant. The words which man's wisdom teaches "the many" concerning eschatology is as foolishness to God. The natural man, as a beast, the carnal man living by the flesh, the wicked man is without sound judgment and doesn't understand the Spiritual.

1st Corinthians 2:13-16

• "Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
• But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
• But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.
• For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ[/i]."

I'm sure you've heard those verses before, but have you "heard" those verses before? The Spiritual man judgeth by that Spirit, but the natural man is like a beast, because he is evil and without the image of God, he is without sound judgment. That most believe something does not make something sound. Interpretation is not by committee, by popular teachings, by big world news, by consensus among the Church teachers, it's by the sound exegesis of God's word compared diligently "with" God's word.

And no, the Church cannot be right in this instance. God is not giving us a "literal" history lesson about Greece and Persia, but a "spiritual" history lesson about a far more sinister spiritual rule. Christ is the prince of peace, what kingdom does He rule? Likewise, Satan is the Prince of this world, thus what kingdom does he rule? Their rules are not from physical countries or empires, but from spiritual principalities. That's what many don't understand. Even though God has stated it in many diverse ways again and again and again. You still eschew the Spiritual nature of what God is speaking about.

Ephesians 6:12

• "For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places."

Whether we like it or not, God is here telling us that our battle is not against the power of empires, of superpowers of today, it's not even physical, it's not political, it's not against physical nations, it's against a "spiritual principality, a spiritual power and spiritual wickedness." Everyone reads these things but few take it to heart.

Colossians 2:14-15

• "Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
• And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it."

These Principalities and powers that Christ spoiled was not Rome, Common Union, it wasn't Greece or Persia on today's map, but it was spiritual "Egypt" and spiritual principalities and rulers of the darkness of this world. The Christian must take his mind off the nations of this world and think about a nation from above and just how it is being attacked. Take our eyes off this world and put them on Christ.

That is all I am saying for now.

Well, thank you for your response.

 

[TribulationSigns]

Well, thank you for your response.

I'm planning to start some YouTube vlogs. Unfortunately, you won't be able to understand them because I communicate using American Sign Language (ASL) as I am deaf. The good news is that I am working on launching a website and forum later this year.

 

[CTK]

I'm planning to start some YouTube vlogs. Unfortunately, you won't be able to understand them because I communicate using American Sign Language (ASL) as I am deaf. The good news is that I am working on launching a website and forum later this year.

Well, I certainly wish you the best!!!!!! I hope and pray it is a success.....

 

[Keraz]

3 specific time periods where all the verses (actors and events) can be accurately placed.

I disagree, as Daniel Prophesies right thru the ages.

The Prophesies of Daniel"
Daniel 2:20-22 Blessed be the Lord’s Name [Jesus] from age to age, for to Him belong wisdom and power. He changes seasons and times, He deposes and sets up kings. He gives wisdom to the wise and knowledge to those with discernment, revealing deep mysteries: in Him there is light and understanding. Proverbs 8:12-29

Daniel 2:31-33 In your dream, your majesty, you saw a great image. The head of the image was of fine gold, its chest and arms of silver, its belly and thighs of bronze, its legs of iron and its feet of part iron, part clay.

The Assyrian Kingdom – [Sargon]
Daniel 7:4 The first beast was like a lion with eagles wings, then its wings were removed and it stood on two feet like a human. It was given the mind of a human.
[This kingdom had already passed by the time of Nebuchadnezzar’s dream. It conquered and sent into exile the ten Northern tribes of Israel]

The Babylonian Kingdom – [Nebuchadnezzar]
Daniel 2:38 You king Nebuchadnezzar, are that head of gold.

Daniel 7:5 The second beast was like a bear, it raised itself up on one side and it had three ribs in its mouth. The command was given: Get up and gorge yourself on flesh. [The Babylonian conquest of Judah]



The Media/Persian Kingdom [King Cyrus]
Daniel 2:32 & 39a...its chest and arms of silver...After you another kingdom will arise that will be inferior to yours

Daniel 8:3-4 & 20 The ram with two horns, Persia and Media.


The Macedonian [Greek] Kingdom –. [Alexander the Great]
Daniel 2:32 & 39b ...its belly and thighs of bronze....Next a third kingdom of bronze will rule over the whole earth.

Daniel 7:6 The third beast was like a leopard with four wings like a bird, it had four heads and was given authority to rule. [Alexander’s conquest of the known world]

Daniel 8:5-8 & 20-21 The defeat of the Babylonian Empire, by Alexander. Daniel 11:2

Daniel 8:9-14 & 22 After Alexander’s death, four kingdoms are established.

Daniel 11:3-4 One of those kings, Antiochus Epiphanes, succeeded in conquering the holy Land and he desecrated the Temple. 2 Maccabees 5:13-20 Then Judas Maccabaeus defeated him. 2 Maccabees 8:16-24 Then they rededicated the Temple. 2 Maccabees 10:1-8 The 2300 evenings and mornings; actually 1150 days, was the time between the desecration and rededication of the Temple, circa 167BC to 164BC. This is a precursor to what will happen in the last days.
Daniel 11:5-20 This is a description of other historical battles and alliances.

The Roman Empire – [Julius Caesar and his successors]
Daniel 2:32-33 & 40 Finally there will be a fourth kingdom, strong as iron, it will dominate all the others, but as its legs represent, this will be a divided kingdom – its people will be a mixture, it will not remain united. [The Western and Eastern Roman Empires]

Daniel 7:7a & 23 The fourth beast, fearsome and very powerful with great iron teeth, crushed and devoured its victims, then trampled what was left.

Daniel 9:26 After sixty two weeks, [434 years] the anointed Prince, [Jesus] will be removed and the army [of Rome] will destroy the city and the Temple. [As fulfilled in 70AD.]

A Last Days resurgence of Rome – [the Anti Christ]
Daniel 2:33 & 42-43...its feet of part iron and part clay....
Daniel 7:7b-8 ... the fourth beast had ten horns, another horn grew up and uprooted three of the ten. That other horn was very imposing and spoke with great power. As I watched this horn waged war on the holy ones and defeated them. Rev 17:12-13, Rev 13:5-8

Daniel 7:23-24 The explanation is this: This fourth kingdom will take over the whole earth, [The One World Government] The ten horns signify the ten divisions of the world, but another man will arise and defeat three of the first leaders.

Daniel 11:21 Another king will come, a person not worthy of recognition, but he will seize power by intrigue and cunning. [a clever and charismatic man]

Daniel 8:23-25 In the last days, when sin is at its height, a powerful king and a master of strategy will arise. He will succeed in whatever he does and will take control of the nations and the holy people. [all the faithful Christians, gathered in all of the holy Land] By cunning and deceit, he will destroy many when they felt secure and did not expect it. He will challenge the ‘Prince of princes’, [the Lord] yet he will be defeated, but not by human hand.

Daniel 9:27 The prince, [The world leader, descended from Rome] will make a treaty with many, [that is: not all of the Christians] for one week, [that is: seven years] but at the mid point, he will put a stop to the sacrifices and offerings. [in the new Temple] He will place an ‘abomination’ there, then in the end what has been decreed will come on him.

Daniel 7:25 He will defy God and take control of the holy people for 3½ years. [This is the ‘beast’ of Revelation 13:1-8. The One World leader receives a ‘mortal blow’ and his body is taken over by Satan, commencing the ‘forty two months’ Tribulation period]

Daniel 11:22-45 His army will be victorious and a leader of the Covenant people will be killed. The military forces of the South will be defeated and he will invade the Middle East, but ships of the Western nations will oppose him, so he will turn back. In the holy Land, he will vent his fury against the people who hold to the Covenant, but will show favour to those who forsake it by believing his promises. His soldiers will desecrate the Temple, setting up an ‘abomination of desolation’. Those of the Lord’s people [Christians] who remain faithful to the Lord, will be resolute and take action. Wise leaders of the nation will guide their people, though for a time some may be killed or captured. They will receive a little help, as many who join them are insincere. This is a period of testing, of refining and purification, for the end is yet to be; at the appointed time. Daniel 7:9, Daniel 8:22, Rev. 13:8

Daniel 11:36-45 This powerful world ruler will do as he pleases, he will promote himself as god, uttering terrible blasphemies. Things will go well for him until the time of wrath is completed. [The Tribulation] Near the end, the leader of a Southern confederation will attempt to attack him, so he storms out in full force, sweeping all before him, including the holy Land. He will take control of all Arabia and take their treasure. Then, alarmed by rumours from the North and East, he will hurriedly go back to Israel and camp in the valley of Megiddo, where he will meet his end. Daniel 7:11, Revelation 19:17-21

Cont:

 

[Keraz]

The Kingdom of Jesus – 2 Samuel 22:32
Daniel 2:34-35 & 44-45 I saw a supernatural Rock that smashed the statue, it blew it away like chaff. Then that Rock became a huge mountain that filled the whole earth. God will set up a Kingdom that will be supreme over all other kingdoms and it will endure forever.

Daniel 7:13-14 & 26-27 The Return of Jesus for His Millennium reign. Gods judgement is against the Anti Christ and his kingdom is abolished. The governance of the whole world is given to the holy people of God. Revelation 20:6

Daniel 12:1-4 At the end of that time, [the Tribulation] Michael, the Archangel of Israel will appear, he will deliver the Lord’s people – everyone whose name is written in the Book of Life. Many of the dead will rise, some to eternal life, some to eternal abhorrence. The wise leaders, those who guided the people on the true path, will shine like stars forever.
But you, Daniel, keep this book sealed until the time of the end. Many will try, but will not succeed to gain this knowledge.

Daniel 12:5-10 I asked: How long until the end of these things? It will be for 3½ years, [1260 days] when the holy people regain their strength. I asked: What will the outcome of all this be? Go your way, Daniel, for these prophesies are to be kept secret until the time of the end. Many people will be purified and made righteous, but the godless will keep on in their wickedness and none of them will understand. Daniel 8:22

Daniel 12:11-12 From the time the Anti Christ sets up the ‘abomination of desolation’, there will be 1290 days. Blessed are those who see the completion of 1335 days!
Reference: REB, NIV, KJV. some verses condensed.

THE PAST AGES: the first 5 seals were opened, the 4 horsemen released and persecution started, from the murder of Abel until the Return. Zechariah 1:10, Matthew 23:35

THE PRESENT DAY: Wars, rumours of wars, natural disasters, economic problems, food shortages, overpopulation, false teaching, etc, etc. Matthew 24:4-8, 2 Timothy 3:1-4 This is nearly the end of the exile of the Northern ten tribes of Israel. Ezekiel 4:4-5

The great and terrible Day of the Lord’s vengeance and wrath, a CME sunstrike. Isaiah 30:26. It is the Sixth seal. Revelation 6:12-17
Worldwide devastation and the Middle East is completely cleared, Psalm 83, a small Jewish remnant survive in Jerusalem. Isaiah 4:3 Many will die elsewhere, such as America: Isaiah 17:4-10, but most will survive and eventually re establish the infrastructure. Isaiah 2:12-21, 2 Peter 3:7 & 10
The Seventh seal is a 15 year time gap until, the commencement of the Tribulation of 3 1/2 years. .
Next to happen:
The Lord’s people, righteous Israel, gather in the new country of Beulah. Isaiah 62:4 They live in peace and security and 144,000 missionaries are selected from them, to go out to all peoples and preach the coming Kingdom of Jesus. Revelation 7 & 14, Isaiah 66:19

A One World Government is formed, led by ten Presidents. Before long, three will be taken over and the other seven will confer their power onto another strong leader. Daniel 7:24-25, Revelation 13:1-8

A Northern confederation, led by a person referred to as Gog, will be motivated to attack Beulah – an unprotected land, of great wealth. They will be totally wiped out and it takes seven years to bury them and clean the land. Ezekiel 38 & 39, Joel 2:20

The strong leader of the World Government, will make a seven year treaty with Beulah. This marks the commencement of the seventieth ‘week’ [seven years] of Daniel. There is a 3½ year period of calm and peace in the world. Daniel 9:27

The world dictator comes to Jerusalem in force and declares himself to be god in the new Temple. This starts the Great Tribulation, the trumpet and bowl judgements. The ‘Woman’- righteous Israel, are taken to Bozrah [New Zealand] for 1260 days. Zechariah 14:2, Revelation 12:14

The Glorious Return of Jesus. The battle of Armageddon. The regathering of Israel and all those who have kept faithful. The 1000 year Millennium reign.

 

[Douggg]

During my study on the Book of Daniel, I have found there are 3 specific time periods these 12 chapters apply to.

I think the key is find the places in the bible that have the phrase "time of the end". The 5 instances are all in the book of Daniel.

The 'time of the end" is what we are living right now.

https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/search.php?q=time+of+the+end&bsec=&order=0&s=1

 

[Douggg]

The Kingdom of Jesus – 2 Samuel 22:32
Daniel 2:34-35 & 44-45 I saw a supernatural Rock that smashed the statue, it blew it away like chaff. Then that Rock became a huge mountain that filled the whole earth. God will set up a Kingdom that will be supreme over all other kingdoms and it will endure forever.

Daniel 7:13-14 & 26-27 The Return of Jesus for His Millennium reign. Gods judgement is against the Anti Christ and his kingdom is abolished. The governance of the whole world is given to the holy people of God. Revelation 20:6

Daniel 12:1-4 At the end of that time, [the Tribulation] Michael, the Archangel of Israel will appear, he will deliver the Lord’s people – everyone whose name is written in the Book of Life. Many of the dead will rise, some to eternal life, some to eternal abhorrence. The wise leaders, those who guided the people on the true path, will shine like stars forever.
But you, Daniel, keep this book sealed until the time of the end. Many will try, but will not succeed to gain this knowledge.

Daniel 12:5-10 I asked: How long until the end of these things? It will be for 3½ years, [1260 days] when the holy people regain their strength. I asked: What will the outcome of all this be? Go your way, Daniel, for these prophesies are to be kept secret until the time of the end. Many people will be purified and made righteous, but the godless will keep on in their wickedness and none of them will understand. Daniel 8:22

Daniel 12:11-12 From the time the Anti Christ sets up the ‘abomination of desolation’, there will be 1290 days. Blessed are those who see the completion of 1335 days!
Reference: REB, NIV, KJV. some verses condensed.

THE PAST AGES: the first 5 seals were opened, the 4 horsemen released and persecution started, from the murder of Abel until the Return. Zechariah 1:10, Matthew 23:35

THE PRESENT DAY: Wars, rumours of wars, natural disasters, economic problems, food shortages, overpopulation, false teaching, etc, etc. Matthew 24:4-8, 2 Timothy 3:1-4 This is nearly the end of the exile of the Northern ten tribes of Israel. Ezekiel 4:4-5

The great and terrible Day of the Lord’s vengeance and wrath, a CME sunstrike. Isaiah 30:26. It is the Sixth seal. Revelation 6:12-17
Worldwide devastation and the Middle East is completely cleared, Psalm 83, a small Jewish remnant survive in Jerusalem. Isaiah 4:3 Many will die elsewhere, such as America: Isaiah 17:4-10, but most will survive and eventually re establish the infrastructure. Isaiah 2:12-21, 2 Peter 3:7 & 10
The Seventh seal is a 15 year time gap until, the commencement of the Tribulation of 3 1/2 years. .
Next to happen:
The Lord’s people, righteous Israel, gather in the new country of Beulah. Isaiah 62:4 They live in peace and security and 144,000 missionaries are selected from them, to go out to all peoples and preach the coming Kingdom of Jesus. Revelation 7 & 14, Isaiah 66:19

A One World Government is formed, led by ten Presidents. Before long, three will be taken over and the other seven will confer their power onto another strong leader. Daniel 7:24-25, Revelation 13:1-8

A Northern confederation, led by a person referred to as Gog, will be motivated to attack Beulah – an unprotected land, of great wealth. They will be totally wiped out and it takes seven years to bury them and clean the land. Ezekiel 38 & 39, Joel 2:20

The strong leader of the World Government, will make a seven year treaty with Beulah. This marks the commencement of the seventieth ‘week’ [seven years] of Daniel. There is a 3½ year period of calm and peace in the world. Daniel 9:27

The world dictator comes to Jerusalem in force and declares himself to be god in the new Temple. This starts the Great Tribulation, the trumpet and bowl judgements. The ‘Woman’- righteous Israel, are taken to Bozrah [New Zealand] for 1260 days. Zechariah 14:2, Revelation 12:14

The Glorious Return of Jesus. The battle of Armageddon. The regathering of Israel and all those who have kept faithful. The 1000 year Millennium reign.

keras, when you present that much material - you need to present timeline charts of the 7 years, showing events, and inter-7 years time frames.

Something like this, but with information you are presenting in your interpretation(s).

 

[CTK]

I think the key is find the places in the bible that have the phrase "time of the end". The 5 instances are all in the book of Daniel.

The 'time of the end" is what we are living right now.

https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/search.php?q=time+of+the+end&bsec=&order=0&s=1

Thanks Dougg, but there are three specific time periods that can easily be carved out and seen throughout the 12 chapters. Of course, the time we are living in now is the end times... but when did it begin? When did the first and second time periods begin and end? Give it a shot - it is all in Daniel.

 

[CTK]

keras, when you present that much material - you need to present timeline charts of the 7 years, showing events, and inter-7 years time frames.

Something like this, but with information you are presenting in your interpretation(s).


View attachment 49804

No offense Dougg, but you have a bunch of verses that strictly belong in one of the three periods within Daniel and they are not end times. This is the problem, in my opinion, when you try and interpret Daniel through the Book of Revelation.... But that is just my opinion. Try breaking down Daniel into three separate periods as a beginning to unpacking and understanding Daniel... Daniel was written for the Jews and Jerusalem not an audience some 2000 years in the future... It was written so His people would hope to interpret the coming of the Messiah in the last week of the prophecy.

 

[Douggg]

Thanks Dougg, but there are three specific time periods that can easily be carved out and seen throughout the 12 chapters. Of course, the time we are living in now is the end times... but when did it begin?

I would look at Daniel 12:4, which give characteristics of the time of the end.

4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.

So let's look at how people travel around now-a-days in their cars going back and forth to work, driving many thousands of miles a year. I think that fits the "man shall run to and fro".

Next consider the internet, which we communicate with other around the world, discussing things like we do, and there is so much information available. We watch things on You Tube, for example. Or maybe do a word search online in the kjv bible, another example.

So I think that fits the "knowledge shall be increased".

-----------------------------------------------------------------

As far as the end times generation, I think the parable of the fig tree, couple with what it says in Daniel 12:4, puts the beginning of the time of end in 1967 when the Jews regained control of Jerusalem

 

[Douggg]

No offense Dougg, but you have a bunch of verses that strictly belong in one of the three periods within Daniel and they are not end times. This is the problem, in my opinion, when you try and interpret Daniel through the Book of Revelation.... But that is just my opinion. Try breaking down Daniel into three separate periods as a beginning to unpacking and understanding Daniel... Daniel was written for the Jews and Jerusalem not an audience some 2000 years in the future... It was written so His people would hope to interpret the coming of the Messiah in the last week of the prophecy.

No offense taken.

Actually, I compare time of the end parts of Daniel with information found mainly in Matthew 24 (abomination of desolation), 2Thessalonians2 (transgression of desolation), and Revelation.

I think Daniel was written for the benefit of whoever reads it. Have you not benefited from reading Daniel ?

 

[CTK]

I would look at Daniel 12:4, which give characteristics of the time of the end.

4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.

So let's look at how people travel around now-a-days in their cars going back and forth to work, driving many thousands of miles a year. I think that fits the "man shall run to and fro".

Next consider the internet, which we communicate with other around the world, discussing things like we do, and there is so much information available. We watch things on You Tube, for example. Or maybe do a word search online in the kjv bible, another example.

So I think that fits the "knowledge shall be increased".

-----------------------------------------------------------------

As far as the end times generation, I think the parable of the fig tree, couple with what it says in Daniel 12:4, puts the beginning of the time of end in 1967 when the Jews regained control of Jerusalem

I don't think you may understand the question here... There are 3 periods that can be identified within the book of Daniel... Obviously, we have the end times... now. We have the beginning of the first time period which would be found in Chapter 1 -- 606 BC. But what are the beginning and ending periods that the Book of Daniel speaks about?

 

[CTK]

No offense taken.

Actually, I compare time of the end parts of Daniel with information found mainly in Matthew 24 (abomination of desolation), 2Thessalonians2 (transgression of desolation), and Revelation.

I think Daniel was written for the benefit of whoever reads it. Have you not benefited from reading Daniel ?

Yes, you are right. I believe I may have mentioned that somewhere --- that everyone after the cross will benefit from Daniel... that is really a given. But what I found is there are 3 specific audiences that the verses in Daniel speak to.... and this just happens to be the most difficult assignment... the timing of the prophecies in Daniel.

For example, just about everyone places the 2300 evenings and mornings prophecy in the end of times period, but it is not. They also place the 1290 days prophecy in the end times, but it does not belong there. Yes, it is mentioned in Chapter 12, but it refers to a different event in Daniel. The 1335 days is truly an end time event.

So, if the prophetic verses are not placed in their proper period (one of the three), it means their interpretation is misapplied and does not mean what it is meant to convey.

So, one of the very first things maybe to determine how God may have carved up Daniel into those definite periods where He has placed the events and actors found within each verse. Not an easy thing to do which is why there are so many scholars and academics and theologians who have many different interpretations. They can not agree...

 

[Douggg]

Yes, you are right. I believe I may have mentioned that somewhere --- that everyone after the cross will benefit from Daniel... that is really a given. But what I found is there are 3 specific audiences that the verses in Daniel speak to.... and this just happens to be the most difficult assignment... the timing of the prophecies in Daniel.

Where-ever in the text of the book of Daniel it starts talking about the time of the end - the audience is us. Who the events are about - depends on the context of the text.

For example, just about everyone places the 2300 evenings and mornings prophecy in the end of times period, but it is not. They also place the 1290 days prophecy in the end times, but it does not belong there. Yes, it is mentioned in Chapter 12, but it refers to a different event in Daniel. The 1335 days is truly an end time event.

Those are all said to be time of the end in the text.

In Daniel 11-12, the time of the end begins in Daniel 11:36, with the transition verse to the time of the end in Daniel 11:35.

So, one of the very first things maybe to determine how God may have carved up Daniel into those definite periods where He has placed the events and actors found within each verse. Not an easy thing to do which is why there are so many scholars and academics and theologians who have many different interpretations. They can not agree...

The book of Daniel has the phrase "time of the end" to know what events and actions take place in the time of the end.

 

[TrevorHL]

Greetings CTK,

For example, just about everyone places the 2300 evenings and mornings prophecy in the end of times period, but it is not. They also place the 1290 days prophecy in the end times, but it does not belong there. Yes, it is mentioned in Chapter 12, but it refers to a different event in Daniel. The 1335 days is truly an end time event.

I am at a loss as to what is your view of the 2300 and the 1290, 1335 time periods. I am prepared to wait until you give further clarification. I have a strong opinion on the 2300 days and only a tentative opinion on the 1290 and 1335 days. I will wait to see if what you expound will change or modify my assessment of these two aspects.

So, if the prophetic verses are not placed in their proper period (one of the three), it means their interpretation is misapplied and does not mean what it is meant to convey.

Again I am not able to guess what you are driving at by your claim of "three time periods". For example, I accept the following sequence:

1) Babylon
2) Medes-Persia,
3) Greece,
4) Rome -
a) pagan Rome,
b) papal Rome (the divided kingdom).

These four kingdoms are not at all difficult to identify in Daniel, but that cannot be said for identifying those verses that must be placed within these 4 kingdoms and exactly when they placed.

There is sufficient information within Daniel to identify where and when these 4 kingdoms will fall... so, would anyone care to discuss this critical method of unpacking Daniel? What are the 3 time periods in Daniel? Once that is discussed, if interested, we might attempt to place the "major" verses in certain chapters within each of the 4 kingdoms and within their respective time period.

Again, I am at a loss as to your "3 time periods" and I am not sure that your superimposing these time periods on certain parts of Daniel will be correct.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[CTK]

Greetings CTK,

I am at a loss as to what is your view of the 2300 and the 1290, 1335 time periods. I am prepared to wait until you give further clarification. I have a strong opinion on the 2300 days and only a tentative opinion on the 1290 and 1335 days. I will wait to see if what you expound will change or modify my assessment of these two aspects.

Again I am not able to guess what you are driving at by your claim of "three time periods". For example, I accept the following sequence:


Again, I am at a loss as to your "3 time periods" and I am not sure that your superimposing these time periods on certain parts of Daniel will be correct.

Kind regards
Trevor

Greetings CTK,

I am at a loss as to what is your view of the 2300 and the 1290, 1335 time periods. I am prepared to wait until you give further clarification. I have a strong opinion on the 2300 days and only a tentative opinion on the 1290 and 1335 days. I will wait to see if what you expound will change or modify my assessment of these two aspects.

Again I am not able to guess what you are driving at by your claim of "three time periods". For example, I accept the following sequence:


Again, I am at a loss as to your "3 time periods" and I am not sure that your superimposing these time periods on certain parts of Daniel will be correct.

Kind regards
Trevor

Hey Trevor, just wanted to let you know that I completed a response to you last evening ...... but accidentally must have hit a key on the laptop that completely erased everything. I will respond to you later on, but in the meantime, if you want to send me your interpretation om the 2300 days, I would like to see it.... By the way, don't know if it might have been converted into 2300 years and begins in 457 BC to arrive at 1844? Just thought I would ask.

 

[TrevorHL]

Greetings again CTK,

if you want to send me your interpretation om the 2300 days, I would like to see it.... By the way, don't know if it might have been converted into 2300 years and begins in 457 BC to arrive at 1844? Just thought I would ask.

Just briefly, I consider the main fulfilment of the 2300 evening/mornings is from BC 334-333 the defeat of the Medo-Persian Ram by the Grecian Alexandrian Goat to AD 1967 when the Jews recaptured Jerusalem. I will be interested in how you bring in your three time periods (epochs?) to agree with or reject my understanding of this 2300, as I believe that an understanding of this prophecy is based upon the text and context of Daniel 8 and its unique Divine revelation.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[CTK]

Greetings CTK,

I am at a loss as to what is your view of the 2300 and the 1290, 1335 time periods. I am prepared to wait until you give further clarification. I have a strong opinion on the 2300 days and only a tentative opinion on the 1290 and 1335 days. I will wait to see if what you expound will change or modify my assessment of these two aspects.

Again I am not able to guess what you are driving at by your claim of "three time periods". For example, I accept the following sequence:


Again, I am at a loss as to your "3 time periods" and I am not sure that your superimposing these time periods on certain parts of Daniel will be correct.

Kind regards
Trevor

Thank you. I have never heard that interpretation before. I guess the best question to ask is what is to be accomplished during / by these 2300 days? Are they days or years?

Does the fulfillment of the purpose behind this time prophecy require the conversion to years?

Thanks.