BreadOfLife ~ UNPROVEN CLAIMS..

[BreadOfLife]

Yep forgiven...For Having Sin and For Committing Sin...

Yep...I am born of Gods SEED and No More COMMIT SIN.



LOL Dunce...I never said I don't HAVE sin.

You are the one claiming Forgiven Sin means SIN-FREE....
LOL scripture never teaches men "are" presently SIN-FREE....what an utterly ignorant thing for you to say!!

Glory to God,
Taken

Then, why can't you explain to me HOW you still "HAVE" sin when you have been forgiven and no longer soin??

Why is this so difficult for you??

 

[BreadOfLife]

Scripture reveals the KNOWLEDGE, and it is GOOD, and apparently NOT TAUGHT to Catholics.

However no one can UNDERSTAND the KNOWLEDGE "FOR YOU".

1 Cor 15

[42] So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown incorruption; it is raised in incorruption
[53] For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

Glory to God,
Taken

This is talking about the "ROTTING" of the flesh - not sin.
Our glorified body will bot ROT like our mortal body.

yhisd has NOTHING to do with the flesh itself being "sinful" - but being SUBJECT to the consequences of sin.

 

[Taken]

The Bible is CLEAR that we can fall away - even AFTER being born again.

No...the Bible is CLEAR...men are Enlightened hearing Gods Word....men receive measure of Faith From God.

Eph 1
[18] The eyes of your understanding beingenlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints,

Rom 12:3
[3] For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

The understanding is TO KEEP FOLLOWING HEARING, READING, LEARNING....and receiving FAITH FROM GOD........UNTIL the man is prepared IN FAITH, to submit unto thee Lord God....ta da....then the man is Become...IN ""FAITH-FULLNESS"

So...here ya go with your go to copy and past that you think PROVES a man who has RECEIVED the Lords OFFERED GIFT of SALVATION....can then.....as YOU SAID...
Throw it back in the Lord face....

Romans 11:22

“See, then, the kindness and severity of God: severity toward those who fell, but God's kindness to you, provided you REMAIN in his kindness; otherwise you to will be cut off.”
Paul is warning the faithful to REMAIN in God’s favor or they will lose their salvation. How can they lose what they never had?

Romans 11:22 says nothing whatsoever about having RECEIVED Salvation, and then having LOST Salvation. And of course a man WHO NEVER Takes the Offering of the Lords Salvation, (or a quickened spirit)....WILL BE CUT OFF.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

BreadOfLife ~

Hebrews 10:26-27

“If we sin deliberately AFTER receiving KNOWLEDGE of the truth, there no longer remains sacrifice for sins but a fearful prospect of judgment and a flaming fire that is going to consume the adversaries.”
This is a clear warning that falling away from God will result in the loss of our salvation. The Greek ford for “knowledge” used here is NOT the usual word (oida). This is talking about a full, experiential knowledge (epignosei). This verse is about CHRISTIANS who had an EPIGNOSIS of Christ and who can fall back into darkness and LOSE their salvation by their own doing.

Hebrews 10: 26-27 says NOTHING about having RECEIVED Salvation, and then LOSING IT.
It is clearly speaking OF Gods WORD of KNOWLEDGE. Having KNOWLEDGE of Gods Word, is NOT reaching out and TAKING the Lords Offering of Salvation. A man having RECEVIED, KNOWLEDGE through HEARING and READING...is being enLIGHTend....is CLEARLY in the BEGINNING OF learning ABOUT GOD.

Rom 10:17
[17] So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

And absolutely such a man WHO then REJECTS the KNOWLEDGE of Gods Word....is NO LONGER being enLIGHTened and falls back into his WAY of Darkness and IS then subject to JUDGEMENT to forever be Separated from thee Lord God.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

BreadOFLife ~
QUOTE]2 Peter 2:20-22
For if they, having escaped the defilements of the world through the KNOWLEDGE of our Lord and savior Jesus Christ, again become entangled and overcome by them, their last condition is worse than their first.
For it would have been better for them not to have KNOWN the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment handed down to them.
Here, Peter illustrates that those who had a full, experiential knowledge (epignosei) of Christ – CHRISTIANS – who can fall back into darkness and LOSE their salvation by their own doing.

Again...2 Peter 2:20-22 is speaking of "KNOWLEDGE" of the Word of God, being taught receiving the Word of God is the beginning for a men to be lead toward RIGHTEOUSNESS....It says NOTHING about having Received Salvation, and then LOSING their Salvation.

Glory To God
Taken

 

[Taken]

BreadOFLife ~

Matt. 5:13

You are the salt of the earth. But if salt loses its taste, with what can it be seasoned? It is no longer good for anything but to be thrown out and trampled underfoot.
This one is self-explanatory - even to a blind person . . .

Ya well you show your sight is failing you, when you know not the difference between RECEIVING Jesus' OFFERED Gift of Salvation....and receiving Knowledge!...and WHOM is being spoken to BY WHOM.

Mattew the Jewish Disciple, sent By Jesus to LOST JEWS...begins by identifying the SALT of the EARTH...

MATT 5:
[16] And Jacob begat Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ.
[17] So all the generations from Abraham to David are fourteen generations; and from David until the carrying away into Babylon are fourteen generations; and from the carrying away into Babylon unto Christ are fourteen generations.

They are the ONES....Gods People, Hebrews, the 12 Tribes, the Jews...God Chose to Hear, Keep, Distribute the Word of God....and in the NT, the Lost Jews are being INTRODUCED to their Christ Messiah, to Hear, Keep, Distribute the Word of God...and they were WARNED...failure to do so, is likened to the Salt losing it's PURPOSE.

No, that has Nothing with Receiving Salvation and then Losing it!

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

BreadOfLife ~

1 Cor. 9:27

"I pummel my body and subdue it, lest after preaching to others I myself should be disqualified."
Paul is saying that he wrestles with his own fleshly desires so that he might not fall back into sin.

1 Cor 9:27 [27] But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.

Paul is speaking of his BODY...not his soul, not his spirit. It is already established THE BODY STILL "HAS" SIN IN IT....until the day it is Risen UP...and puts on INCORRUPTION and IMMORTALITY.... Teaching others to KEEP their own BODY in Subjection to their "new spirit in their heart", is the same that the Teacher, (Paul the Apostle) must do.... Lest he become a "castaway" .... FROM WHAT?.....His own "students" hearing him preach ONE THING...and then NOT DOING what he preaches.

No, that is NOT Pauls about falling "back" into SIN...
It is teaching about the TEACHER, being an Example to his students (listeners)...so "THEY" will continue to Hear him teaching them the Word of God, and not reject his teaching.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

BreadOfLife ~
QUOTE] 2 Peter 3:17
Therefore, dear friends, since you already know this, be on your guard so that you may not be carried away by the error of lawless men and fall from your secure position.
Peter is warning the faithful not to fall back into sin and lawlessness.

2 Peter 3:17
[17] Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.

Again 2 Peter 3:17 is speaking of KNOWING what the Word of God is saying, and a WARNING to NOT be Lead back into the ways of the wickedness of the world.

It says NOTHING about having RECEIVED Salvation and THEN Losing Salvation.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

BreadOfLife~
1 John 2:24
See that what you have heard from the beginning remains in you. IF it does, you also will REMAIN in the Son and in the Father.
This is an admonition to try to remain faithful.

1 John 2:
[24] Let that therefore abide in you, which ye have heard from the beginning. If that which ye have heard from the beginning shall remain in you, ye also shall continue in the Son, and in the Father.

This is a TEACHING to KEEP the KNOWLEDGE you have HEARD OF the Lord God....and "IF" you do....YOU will remain IN the SON and the FATHER.

This is NOT teaching of receiving Salvation and then Losing it.

This IS Teaching IF YOU KEEP the Word of God, YOU will Continue to BE IN the Lord God.

You do know...Receiving Salvation IS THE Lord...BEING IN THE MAN? Eh?

This says NOTHING about the Lord being "IN THE MAN..."

Glory To God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

BreadOfLife ~
Rev. 3:5
He who overcomes will, like them, be dressed in white. I will never blot out his name from the book of life, but will acknowledge his name before my Father and his angels.
God cannot blot out a name that was never there in the first place. He is talking about CHRISTIANS who are already saved and how they can LOSE their salvation.

Scripture clearly teaches....There are Gods HEAVENLY "B-O-O-K-S".

It is to notify us there ARE Records which WILL SERVE as EVIDENCE...on JUDGEMENT DAY.

Rev 20:
[12] And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

In the Beginning GOD Created mankind...
Every NAME of a naturally born living person IS RECORDED........IN GODS "BOOK OF LIFE".
And Every NAME of a naturally born living person, that KNOWS of GOD, and REJECTS GOD, IS subject to his Name being BLOTTED OUT OF Gods BOOK of Life.

A mans NAME that IS BLOTTED OUT, IS a man WHO SHALL NOT Forever BE "WITH" God and God "WITH" that man.

Rev 13:8
[8] And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

The Lambs BOOK of LIFE...is a BOOK in which a mans NAME BECOMES WRITTEN during the mans natural flesh LIFETIME WHEN?
WHEN a man BECOMES "CONVERTED"...
WHEN a man Comes to the Hearing and Knowledge of JESUS the CHRIST Messiah...
WHEN a man BELIEVES "IN" Jesus the Christ Messiah.
WHEN a mans soul is SAVED, by Jesus the Christ Messiah.
WHEN a mans spirit is QUICKENED, (born again), by the SEED of God, WHO IS Christ, WHO IS Jesus, WHO IS the Lamb of God.

ONCE a man IS Converted...that mans NAME IS WRITTEN in the Lambs BOOK of Life......and that mans NAME "IS NEVER SUBJECT TO BEING BLOTTED OUT"....Because "ONCE" a man IS Saved, IS Born Again....that man IS FOREVER with thee Lord God...and Always thee Lord God IS with that man.

And there IS AN OTHER BOOK...that shall BE OPENED during the BEGINNING of the GREAT Tribulation...(Before Judgement Day)
THIS BOOK has SEVEN SEALS, and Each SEAL that is OPENED, Reveals MORE KNOWLEDGE ABOUT the events DURING The Great Tribulation.

Again YOU are IN ERROR. Every Living natural born persons NAME is Recorded IN Gods Records of EVIDENCE.

God IS JUST. Judgement and Sentencing of Every single person, shall be BASED ON FACTS and accompanied with the Records of Evidence...OF THEIR NAME, and WHAT THEY HAVE DONE.

(Unlike YOUR Un-just judgements of speaking and writing ... FOR others of what they HAVE NOT DONE.)

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

BreadOfLife ~
Rev. 22:19
And if anyone takes words away from this book of prophecy, God will take away from him his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book.
How can God “take away” somebody’s “share” of heaven if they never had it to begin with? This is about CHRISTIANS who may or may NOT make it into Heaven.

Oh good grief BOL....the HOLY CITY described in the BIBLE....IS Jerusalem....NOT HEAVEN!

Jerusalem IS Where the SEAT of David's EVERLASTING THRONE IS.
Jerusalem IS Where Christ Jesus WILL SIT on David's everlasting Throne.
Jerusalem IS within the AREA of Christ Jesus' KINGDOM "ON EARTH"... NOT IN HEAVEN!

SOME of the "occupants" IN Christ Jesus' KINGDOM...SHALL HAVE greater "status and recognition" than OTHERS, "IN" Christ Jesus' KINGDOM.

Jesus' Disciples/Apostles shall have THEIR NAMES on the Walls of Jesus' KINGDOM.

Men with a life long history of Preaching the Word of God....SHALL have a high Status...

Men who came to be IN Christ on their death bed....will ENTER Jesus' Earthly Kingdom...yet with Little status.

It is a matter of Understanding...men who have DONE WELL as a FAITHFUL Servant of the Lord....are Trustworthy to Have more TO DO to serve the Lord IN HIS KINGDOM!

This is Saying NOTHING about Receiving Salvation and THEN LOSING IT.

This is Teaching about...Changing Scripture...
WIll Cause such a person to LOSE position once they are IN Christ Jesus' KINGDOM....
ON Earth!

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

Then, why can't you explain to me HOW you still "HAVE" sin when you have been forgiven and no longer soin??

Why is this so difficult for you??

Not at all difficult for me.
It has been explained to you multiple times.
Your difficulty is YOUR LACK of UNDERSTANDING what is being said TO YOU.

EVERY natural born person with a CARNAL MIND...can understand NATURAL things.

I was naturally born in the Jurisdiction of a soverign state within the US. I KNOW, that state has, keeps, holds RECORDS of my natural birth. And should my body become physically DEAD...whatever Civil Jurisdiction my physical DEATH occurs, THAT Civil Jurisdiction SHALL have, keep, hold an official lawful RECORD of my death.

SPIRITUALLY...I GAVE MY LIFE TO THE Lord.
His Lawful RECORD, has MY BODY...Spiritually Recorded as DEAD...specifically DEAD..."IN" Christ...Because I chose to GIVE MY LIFE TO HIM.

However, Physically MY BODY still is ALIVE...
I was physically, naturally BORN "IN SIN"...

According to Gods RECORDS...my BODY IS DEAD...and a DEAD BODY can "COMMIT" SIN NO MORE.

According to Mans Lawful Records...my BODY IS ALIVE...(and YOU with your Carnal Mindful thoughts think YOURSELF qualified to Pronounce JUDGEMENT, YOU SAYING...that I "CONTINUE" to SIN against God).

At some point YOU are supposed to LEARN the DIFFERENCE...between Carnal Understanding .... and Gods Spiritual Understanding.

Physically, according to the LAW OF NATURE, and Civil Law...MY BODY IS ALIVE.

Spiritually, according to Gods Spiritual LAW...
MY BODY IS DEAD IN CHRIST.

Accordingly...WHEN my physical BODY physically DIES...the LAW of Nature and Civil Law CAN NOT RAISE UP MY DEAD BODY.

Accordingly...WHEN my physical BODY physically DIES...the POWER OF GOD...CAN and WILL Raise UP MY DEAD BODY.

My DEAD BODY will be Rotting, Corrupt, Still with its SIN of having naturally been born IN SIN.

And WHEN the Lord RAISES UP MY BODY...He shall RAISE UP MY BODY....WITHOUT its natural SIN....and instead My Body SHALL be RAISED UP...UN-Corrupted...Raised UP...IMMORTAL...Raised up IN Glory...RAISED UP and NEVER AGAIN "SUBJECT TO" ANY Death.

^^ THAT is going to come to pass. ^^ That has not YET happened. ^^ That SHALL come to pass (for me)...BECAUSE...I elected to to GIVE my Life TO THE Lord....And Because the Lord PREPARED MY BODY...TO BE RAISED, BY Him, IN Glory.

My Spiritually Crucified BODY, is:
Already Forgiven...
Already IN STANDING With the Lord...
Already Cleansed..
Already Sanctified...
Already Justified...

My BODY is ALREADY Spiritually "Prepared" TO BE "REDEEMED"..."Collected"..."Taken" by the Lord on the DAY He comes to "REDEEM" and TAKE HIS CHURCH unto Himself.

I do not WAIT to be Saved;
I do not WAIT to be Quickened (born again)

I WAIT for my Lord, (on the day of His choosing)....to REDEEM ME...by raising up MY BODY incorruptible and immortal unto HIM, Forever.

You teach you are born again, without repentence....AND still Waiting to be saved...
Dependant upon IF you ENDURE...to do good works and continue in belief.

Dude...a man IN Christ...IS a man WHO IS SAVED and BORN AGAIN....

Good Works has not Saved a man or Quickened a man.......Submitting oneself TO Belief IN God and Christ Jesus is HOW a man Receives Salvation of his soul, and Quickening of his spirit...

A man WHO IS saved and born again...CAN NEVER LEAVE thee Lord God.

Don't you KNOW...when a man GIVES HIS LIFE TO BE Crucified with THE Lord....that man is GIVING GOD permission and authority TO USE HIS POWER TO KEEP THAT MAN FOREVER FAITHFUL TO THEE Lord God?

What do you think is the POINT of the Spirit of God to ENTER INTO a saved and born again man? TO sit idle...powerless While the man CONTINUES TO REJECT GOD, speak Against God, encourage others to Reject God, change Gods Word INTO A Lie? Uh no!

Gods Spirit WITHIN A MAN is the Power of God that KEEPS that man (whom such man called on the Lord and ASKED the Lord to KEEP the man UNTO THE Lord Forever)...

And you teach...the man can HAVE invited the Lord INTO THE MAN....but that man has MORE POWER than God...and can then REJECT GOD, stand against God, Sin against God? Uh no...Scripture teaches no such thing.

I am IN Christ and the Spirit of God is IN Me.
It was a SPIRITUAL event in MY LIFE, and had NOTHING to do with YOU.

When you go about making declarations for me THAT DO NOT APPLY TO ME...YOU present yourself as a liar.

YOU should KNOW a man who has GIVEN his LIFE to the Lord....is repentant FOR having been naturally born IN SIN....Against God.

And ONCE that man Repents TO the Lord for having been born AGAINST God...God Forgives that man....ENTERS the man with his SPIRIT of Truth, Power, Light, and COVERS with His LIGHT the mans SIN of DISBELIEF...that the Lord Can no longer SEE or Remember the mans (darkness of sin of having had disbelief)

When you say the truth is not in me...YOU Lie. I have already testified of having chosen to Give my Life to the Lord and Become MADE "converted".

You should know, a Converted man HAS THE SPIRIT OF the Lord God IN Him...which is precisely Gods TRUTH!

When you, to ad nausum repeat and claim I CONTINUE TO COMMIT SIN....that is a Lie.

You should know...I am NOT a Hebrew or Jew that was subject to Mosaic Law, whereby every infraction of man AGAINST man was called a sin.

I am a Gentile. I was NEVER UNDER Mosaic Law. My sin was AGAINST GOD......NOT MEN. My sin was forgiven BY God....NOT MEN.

You keep repeating that YOU "Continue" to Commit SIN....based on What? The basis for SIN of man against man...IS UNDER Mosaic Law...

You say, YOU ARE NOT UNDER Mosaic Law...but you keep pretending you are.
AND think yourself QUALIFIED to be Judge of Others and Dictate....THEY ALSO are LIKE YOU...and Continue to COMMIT SIN...

NO ONE gave you permission or authority to Dictate what applies to OTHER men.

Learn what Scripture SAYS as it APPLIES to you...and stop trying to dictate what applies to other men.

YOU want to BOAST YOU Continue to SIN...
That's YOU.

And I'll Speak what Applies to Me...
My Lords Spirit entered INTO MY BODY...and Gave me HIS SEED, which birthed my "born again spirit"....<--- According to Gods Record....I am a "son of God", Spiritually BORN of "HIS" spiritual SEED.

And NO ONE...who is a "son of God"... Can Ever Again NOT Believe IN God, Reject God, Stand Against God........which is to say...such a man CAN NOT SIN AGAINST GOD...ever again! NO MORE!

And ^ that IS exactly what Scripture teaches and IS exactly what I have claimed Applies TO ME.

Learn what the TRUTH in Scripture Actually SAYS...and stop trying to dictate what YOU "THINK" applies to other people, when it Doesn't!

The ONLY thing a man CAN FORGIVE Me FOR....or that I can FORGIVE an other man FOR........is Trespasses........(NOT SIN) !!!

My SIN IS STILL IN MY NATURAL BODY, from my Natural birth...Until the DAY thee Lord God raises MY body UP in Glory.

My SIN Against God is Resolved BETWEEN thee Lord God and myself. (And has NOTHING to do with you or any other human man).

Any trespasses I do against men or they do against me....is resolved BETWEEN me and the other man or the other man and me.

And IF you stopped pretending everthing that was taught TO Jews, BY Jews apples to you and Everyone else you think it should apply to...
You might rather wisely spend your time learning the TRUTH which applies to Gentiles NEVER having been UNDER Mosaic Law...regarding Behaviors and TRESPASSES between men and what to do about it.

Dude....any human can use their Carnal mind and understand worldly natural things...

However...without the Lord God Himself feeding a man "HIS Spiritual Understanding"....a man is left to his own devises of Understanding VIA his Carnal Mind.

God IS Spirit and WANTS a man to become Converted and WANTS a man to HAVE Gods Spiritual Understanding...

You want to APPLY Carnal Understanding to yourself....So what...People may not agree with you...but don't really care what YOU DO and SAY for YOURSELF.

It's when a person MAKES a Spiritual declaration FOR THeMSELVES...and you butt in TRY to USE Scripture as a WEAPON...by YOU decarling things that DO NOT APPLY TO A CONVERTED man......"AS IF" they do.

You would do well to LEARN MUCH of the NT, was taught BY JEWS TO JEWS, as JEWS were chosen BY Jesus TO go and TEACH the Lost Jews on Behalf of Jesus.

You would do WELL to STOP trying to pretend, WHAT APPLIES TO YOU, according to your Catholic teaching, your Carnal Understanding, and your philosophies and doctrines.......DOES NOT APPLY TO ALL "OTHERS".

What APPLIES TO OTHERS, IS THEIR OWN Beliefs and THEIR OWN Declarations according to WHAT THEY have Chosen and Submitted to...and has NOTHING to do with you.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Taken]

This is talking about the "ROTTING" of the flesh - not sin.
Our glorified body will bot ROT like our mortal body.

yhisd has NOTHING to do with the flesh itself being "sinful" - but being SUBJECT to the consequences of sin.

You are programmed,, as you admit from the cradle....according to Catholic Beliefs of your Catholic fathers.

For the most part, I do NOT agree with what Catholics Teach.....nor do I have to.

Scripture itself teaches...earthly men ARE naturally born in Sin....It matters not to me.....if you Comprehend that, or believe that, or Understand as long as your BODY is physically alive, physically dead.......IT IS CORRUPTED with its natural SIN....

Until the Day THAT BODY IS RAISED...Uncorrupted.

There is NOTHING to argue with you about that.

You can NOT change the TRUTH of Scripture.
You can NOT change my thoughts on Trusting the Truth of scripture.

You can simple say...what you believe and frankly, I have heard you say so many things that Oppose Scripture...that I give Little regard or consideration to what you think, say or believe.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[BreadOfLife]

You are programmed,, as you admit from the cradle....according to Catholic Beliefs of your Catholic fathers.

For the most part, I do NOT agree with what Catholics Teach.....nor do I have to.

Scripture itself teaches...earthly men ARE naturally born in Sin....It matters not to me.....if you Comprehend that, or believe that, or Understand as long as your BODY is physically alive, physically dead.......IT IS CORRUPTED with its natural SIN....

Until the Day THAT BODY IS RAISED...Uncorrupted.

There is NOTHING to argue with you about that.

You can NOT change the TRUTH of Scripture.
You can NOT change my thoughts on Trusting the Truth of scripture.

You can simple say...what you believe and frankly, I have heard you say so many things that Oppose Scripture...that I give Little regard or consideration to what you think, say or believe.

Glory to God,
Taken

And for YOU to imply that human flesh is sinful - is to say that CHRIST is sinful because He was FULLY Man as well as FULLY God.
That is heresy.

If the flesh were sin itself - then murder and abortion would be noble action.
The flesh is subject to the consequences of sin. It is NOT sin itself.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Again...2 Peter 2:20-22 is speaking of "KNOWLEDGE" of the Word of God, being taught receiving the Word of God is the beginning for a men to be lead toward RIGHTEOUSNESS....It says NOTHING about having Received Salvation, and then LOSING their Salvation.

Glory To God
Taken

WRONG.

Knowledge is "Oida" or "Gnosis". the word used here is "EPIGNOSIS". - which is a full, experiential and relational knowledge of Christ.
Here are explanations of the word Epignosis from Protestant scholarship . . .

Richard Chenevix Trench notes, “In comparing epignosis with gnosis, the “epi” must be regarded as an intensive use of a preposition that gives the compound word a greater strength than the simple word alone possesses” (Synonyms of the New Testament, page 300).

Quoting Culverwell, he writes, “Epignosis and gnosis differ. Epignosis is the complete comprehension after the first knowledge (gnosin) of a matter. It is bringing me better acquainted with a thing I knew before; a more exact viewing of an object that I saw before afar off. That little portion of knowledge which we had here shall be much improved, our eye shall be raised to see the things more strongly and clearly” (Synonyms of the New Testament, page 300).

He goes on to say on the same page, “All Paul’s uses of epignosis justify and bear out this distinction. This same intensive use of epignosis is confirmed by similar passages in the New Testament and in the Septuagint. It also was recognized by the Greek fathers. Thus Chrysostom stated: ‘You knew (egnote), but it is necessary to know thoroughly (epignonai).”

J.B. Lightfoot commenting on epignosis, notes, “The compound epignosis is an advance upon gnosis, denoting a larger and more thorough knowledge...Hence also epignosis is used especially of the knowledge of God and of Christ, as being the perfection of knowledge” (St. Paul’s Epistles to the Colossians and Philemon, page 138).

Vine's Expository Dictionary of Biblical Words, “epignosis, akin to A, No. 3, denotes "exact or full knowledge, discernment, recognition,"

The New Thayer’s Greek-English Lexicon (page 237):
1. Precise and correct knowledge
2. Knowledge of things ethical and divine
3. Of God, especially knowledge of His holy will and of the blessings which He has bestowed and constantly bestows on men through Christ
4. Of Christ, i.e., the true knowledge of Christ’s nature, dignity, benefits
5. Of God and Christ, i.e., to keep the knowledge of the one true God which has illumined the soul

Exegetical Dictionary of the New Testament, volume 2, page 25:
1. Knowledge as recognition of the will of God that is effective in the conduct of the one who knows God
2. Christian faith


EPIGNOSIS describes a BORN AGAIN Christian . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

Paul is speaking of his BODY...not his soul, not his spirit. It is already established THE BODY STILL "HAS" SIN IN IT....until the day it is Risen UP...and puts on INCORRUPTION and IMMORTALITY.... Teaching others to KEEP their own BODY in Subjection to their "new spirit in their heart", is the same that the Teacher, (Paul the Apostle) must do.... Lest he become a "castaway" .... FROM WHAT?.....His own "students" hearing him preach ONE THING...and then NOT DOING what he preaches.

No, that is NOT Pauls about falling "back" into SIN...
It is teaching about the TEACHER, being an Example to his students (listeners)...so "THEY" will continue to Hear him teaching them the Word of God, and not reject his teaching.

Glory to God,
Taken

You talk out of BOTH sides of your mouth.
FIRST, you say the flesh is sin - and now you say it's NOT??

Paul is talking about HIMSELF: "...lest after preaching to others I myself should be disqualified."

Paul is talking about mortification of the flesh - which is a very CATHOLIC discipline.
This is the whole reason behind fasting and abstinence. The flesh is subject ti sin and its consequences.
It is NOT sin itself.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Oh good grief BOL....the HOLY CITY described in the BIBLE....IS Jerusalem....NOT HEAVEN!

Jerusalem IS Where the SEAT of David's EVERLASTING THRONE IS.
Jerusalem IS Where Christ Jesus WILL SIT on David's everlasting Throne.
Jerusalem IS within the AREA of Christ Jesus' KINGDOM "ON EARTH"... NOT IN HEAVEN!

SOME of the "occupants" IN Christ Jesus' KINGDOM...SHALL HAVE greater "status and recognition" than OTHERS, "IN" Christ Jesus' KINGDOM.

Jesus' Disciples/Apostles shall have THEIR NAMES on the Walls of Jesus' KINGDOM.

Men with a life long history of Preaching the Word of God....SHALL have a high Status...

Men who came to be IN Christ on their death bed....will ENTER Jesus' Earthly Kingdom...yet with Little status.

It is a matter of Understanding...men who have DONE WELL as a FAITHFUL Servant of the Lord....are Trustworthy to Have more TO DO to serve the Lord IN HIS KINGDOM!

This is Saying NOTHING about Receiving Salvation and THEN LOSING IT.

This is Teaching about...Changing Scripture...
WIll Cause such a person to LOSE position once they are IN Christ Jesus' KINGDOM....
ON Earth!

Glory to God,
Taken

The "Holy City" described is ETERNAL (Heaven).

Rev. 22:19
States emphatically that: ". . . if anyone takes words away from this book of prophecy, God will take away from him his share in the TREE OF LIFE - not just the Holy City - wherever YOU think that is.

This verse is about the possibility of a person HAVING eternal Life - and LOSING it.

 

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And for YOU to imply that human flesh is sinful -

IS: Scriptural;

Gal 5:
[17] For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.

I can not UNDERSTAND FOR YOU, what "CONTRARY" means.

is to say that CHRIST is sinful because He was FULLY Man as well as FULLY God.

Everyone can PLAINLY READ "YOUR WORDS".
Scripture However Teaches;
Human MEN come from the Dust of the Earth.
Christ the Lord Jesus came forth out from God in the "LIKENESS" of a human man.

I can not UNDERSTAND FOR YOU, what "LIKENESS" means.

That is heresy.

Heresy is YOUR TEACHING, that Jesus WAS a Human man.

If the flesh were sin itself - then murder and abortion would be noble action.

You are NOT God, to dictate "IF"..."THEN" FOR God....or anyone else!

The flesh is subject to the consequences of sin. It is NOT sin itself.

The FLESH is subject to the consequences OF THE FLESH"S SIN!

But Again, I can not UNDERSTANDING FOR you the difference Between Scriptural TRUTH of Gods WORD....and YOUR Words which are but FICTION.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

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WRONG.

So, you think it WRONG to believe what I said.....
That receiving KNOWLEDGE of the WORD of God is for a man to be lead Toward Righteousness...

Not a SUPRISE...we disagree! LOL

Knowledge is "Oida" or "Gnosis". the word used here is "EPIGNOSIS". - which is a full, experiential and relational knowledge of Christ.
Here are explanations of the word Epignosis from Protestant scholarship . . .


EPIGNOSIS describes a BORN AGAIN Christian . . .

Epignosis IS the precise and correct KNOWLEDGE of things ethical and divine.

I said KNOWLEDGE of the WORD of God...LEADS a man toward Righteousness.

You said that was WRONG, and then per your USUAL prance off point to talking about "a supposed description of Born Again"....

I am well aware of WHAT the WORD of GOD says on MULTIPLE "things".

And on the specific TOPIC OF MULTIPLE THINGS....I agree with Scripture....and DO NOT AGREE with "YOUR WORDS".

Glory to God,
Taken

 

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You talk out of BOTH sides of your mouth.
FIRST, you say the flesh is sin - and now you say it's NOT??

Ignorant man ~
Gods WORD is out of Gods MOUTH.
Naturally BORN men ARE Corrupt, Mortal, and subject to DEATH.
OBVIOUSLY...
You are ignorant of WHEN and HOW a Naturally BORN man "BECOMES" Supernaturally BORN, INCORRUPT, IMMORTAL, and NO LONGER subject to DEATH.

Paul is talking about HIMSELF: "...lest after preaching to others I myself should be disqualified."

So? That was not disputed!

You have been "TRYING" to teach Paul Paul was "SAVED", and continued to "COMMIT" SIN...

And NOW you are off on a tangent..."TRYING" to teach Paul was speaking of "being DISQUALIFIED" to "KEEP" his "SALIVATION".

No he isn't.
You (per your usual) ignore the FACTS.

The FACT IS, Paul was TEACHING a "group of LISTENERS"...and SAW the IMPORTANCE of Paul himself BEING SEEN "doing" what he was TEACHING,
SO HIS "LISTENERS" would not "DISQUALIFY HIM" as a fraud.

You should BE WELL AWARE, within your own Catholic Denomination....OF your Clerics, (you call Father), when they TEACH ONE THING, and they themselves DO NOT DO WHAT THEY TEACH....the Listeners (ie Congregation)....
DISQUALIFY HIM as a reputable TEACHER! AND THE Listeners GO ELSEWARE seeking AN "OTHER" teacher, they believe "QUALIFIED"...
BECAUSE he himself DOES what he teaches!

OR the "listeners"....can DO WHAT JESUS SAID......to "DO" what the TEACHERS..."SAY"....but "DO NOT" "DO" what TEACHERS "DO", (that is the opposite of what they "SAY").

Poor thing...you fail to comprehend the simplest of things.

Glory to God,
Taken