Calling all Law Keepers.

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Helen

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@bbyrd009 You speak of Judas. Do you see any hope for Judas...?
Someone had to do it..right.
It says "Satan entered into him.." as he went out to do the dirty deed.
Could he have done it if Satan was not empowering him and doing it through him?

Satan is not omnipresent, ...what about Judas after Satan left him?
Judas hung himself in misery...do you see hope for him in having repented as he hung himself? Yet not wishing to stay alive and be known as the one who betrayed Jesus for all his life.
I have hope for Judas. I have hope for all mankind. :)
Just wondering what you see?

 

Helen

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@GodsGrace Okay, so just as you wrote to Amadeus...you are satisfied that you now know what you know from your studies and closed to God showing you anything new.
I thought so. Just hopeful. Much that you write doesn't really make good spiritual sense. But as long as you are happy with it , that's all that matters. x

Ps I don't read "GotQuestions" I like to read the bible.
 

bbyrd009

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@bbyrd009 You speak of Judas. Do you see any hope for Judas...?
Someone had to do it..right.
It says "Satan entered into him.." as he went out to do the dirty deed.
Could he have done it if Satan was not empowering him and doing it through him?

Satan is not omnipresent, ...what about Judas after Satan left him?
Judas hung himself in misery...do you see hope for him in having repented as he hung himself? Yet not wishing to stay alive and be known as the one who betrayed Jesus for all his life.
I have hope for Judas. I have hope for all mankind. :)
Just wondering what you see?
if Peter can be forgiven, then why not Judas? I cannot read a record of Peter repenting, yet Judas' is pretty clear. Judas must stand "condemned" because it is the spirit of Judas that is condemned, so that a believer who recognizes the spirit of Judas in themselves may see, imo. Of course Peter's sin is easy to put ourselves in the place of, while Judas' is more difficult. So note how we have no problem forgiving Peter, who did not repent, but we condemn Judas, who did? Lol. And we have no prob putting ourselves in the place of Peter, even though none of us could really do that, we would all be hiding behind a tree or whatever, but putting ourselves in Judas' place, who does that, mentally?

So, our perceptions are being manipulated here, and we are being invited to reveal ourselves in our interpretations. Is Judas forgiven or condemned? @H. Richard , what do you say here? Do Judas' actions condemn him or not? Did Judas "simply simply" believe in Christ, or no?

See, it is easy to just assume that Judas expected the Sanhedrin to prevail, that he really was just a scoundrel after some silver, but this would be ignoring all of the miracles that Judas witnessed, and likely expected to manifest at the confrontation that evening in Gethsemane, likely right away, right. Iow Judas might also be perceived as fully expecting Christ to prevail, after forcing His hand, see. Having plenty of faith in Jesus, just misdirected.

Judas thought he was leading the Sanhedrin into a trap, and that he could manipulate Jesus into wearing the crown.
 
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GodsGrace

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@GodsGrace Okay, so just as you wrote to Amadeus...you are satisfied that you now know what you know from your studies and closed to God showing you anything new.
I thought so. Just hopeful. Much that you write doesn't really make good spiritual sense. But as long as you are happy with it , that's all that matters. x

Ps I don't read "GotQuestions" I like to read the bible.
I'm not writing this for you but for those who are reading along.

I don't know what you're talking about in your above post.
Maybe you could post what I said to Amadeus so we could all have the joyful experience of knowing what GodGrace believes, including GodsGrace?

Yes. That would be nice.

And if you DID read once in a while, it might help you to undersand things better, like the hypostatic union, for instance.

Isn't it interesting. I'm the one with a closed mind, per YOU, and yet I read and am open to all sorts of ideas.

YOU, the one with an open mind, reads NOTHING but the bible and have closed yourself off to all teaching.

You must be a liberal. You sure think like one.
 

Helen

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@bbyrd009 Good post. I hold out hope for old Judas...
What if we were around back then..what if the lot fell on us to be the one!! Wow.
Judas, Adam, Eve.... If we choose to judge them...who is judging US! :eek:
I wish to point no fingers ...we have not seen the end of their story yet.

To me, Lot was a failure...lived among Sodomites by choice, would have given his daughters to be raped...had sex with his daughters...yep...bleep..Lot failed.
And what did God say about Lot in Hebrews.. "Righteous Lot...blah blah blah..."
No, court is still out on one and all.....
 
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Helen

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I don't know what you're talking about in your above post.
Maybe you could post what I said to Amadeus so we could all have the joyful experience of knowing what GodGrace believes, including GodsGrace?

I have looked but I forget which thread you said it in. It wasn't important enough to make a note of it. Maybe he remembers...you were saying that 40 years ago you were washing dishes at the sink in NY and God came to you...you have not used a dishwasher since. God answered your questions and since then you have no more questions and you are satisfied with what you believe and won't change them.
As you write many posts per day...I obviously could not read them all....
But that was the gist of your post...if not Friday , maybe Thursday or earlier..but within the last few days....maybe one day I will find it again...but I wont waste time looking.
 

VictoryinJesus

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, Lot was a failure...lived among Sodomites by choice, would have given his daughters to be raped...had sex with his daughters...yep...bleep..Lot failed.

ByGrace, any explanation for, Judges 19:25-30 KJV
[25] But the men would not hearken to him: so the man took his concubine, and brought her forth unto them; and they knew her, and abused her all the night until the morning: and when the day began to spring, they let her go. [26] Then came the woman in the dawning of the day, and fell down at the door of the man's house where her lord was , till it was light. [27] And her lord rose up in the morning, and opened the doors of the house, and went out to go his way: and, behold, the woman his concubine was fallen down at the door of the house, and her hands were upon the threshold. [28] And he said unto her, Up, and let us be going. But none answered. Then the man took her up upon an ass, and the man rose up, and gat him unto his place. [29] And when he was come into his house, he took a knife, and laid hold on his concubine, and divided her, together with her bones, into twelve pieces, and sent her into all the coasts of Israel. [30] And it was so, that all that saw it said, There was no such deed done nor seen from the day that the children of Israel came up out of the land of Egypt unto this day: consider of it, take advice, and speak your minds .
 

Helen

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@VictoryinJesus Yep, lust , greed and violence ruled the day.

Joshua was the last truly godly leader..by the time we get to the book of Judges...most were a mess...Gideon was good. and anointed by God...but nothing with Israel lasted...
"to me" the book of Judges is summed up in the verse :-
"In those days there was no king in Israel; everyman did what was right in his own eyes."

They were all substandard Judges. Look at Samson...morally all Israel was a big mess...and violence everywhere...wow, sounds a bit like the day we live in now. ;)
21 Chapters of the book of Judges....being a law unto themselves.
Then we get the sweet story of Ruth...and then Eli and.....
Then God calls in Samuel...and things start to get back on track. Yay!!
 

GodsGrace

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I have looked but I forget which thread you said it in. It wasn't important enough to make a note of it. Maybe he remembers...you were saying that 40 years ago you were washing dishes at the sink in NY and God came to you...you have not used a dishwasher since. God answered your questions and since then you have no more questions and you are satisfied with what you believe and won't change them.
As you write many posts per day...I obviously could not read them all....
But that was the gist of your post...if not Friday , maybe Thursday or earlier..but within the last few days....maybe one day I will find it again...but I wont waste time looking.
I never said any such thing.
BTW, you're so sweet.
 
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Richard_oti

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I already said there is no evidence He did.
In which case, your position begins to crumble from my perspective. However based upon some of your previous replies and what you state further in this reply, I think that you and I may be speaking apples and oranges.

<snip>
so discussion with you is a waste of time.
That is indeed a possibility.


For the 3rd time, I never said Jesus partook of the consecrated Bread and Wine. We don't know. And 4 cups at the seder/Passover matters a great deal.

Nor have I seen you state as much with regard to the "consecrated Bread and Wine" as you put it. Which also, was your opening statement with regard to me, that I was making such a claim. A claim which I did not make nor imply.

As for the "4 cups", they may matter with regard to a "Passover Seder". However, the "Last Supper" was not a "Passover" observance. You can not partake of the sacrifice before it is slain.
 

Richard_oti

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Jesus died on Wednesday? That's absurd. You are inventing your own chronology by cherry picking from 4 different Gospel writers.

Check out the "Long version". It was not cherry picked, it uses all four of the Gospels carefully put together. However, the onus behind it, is haTorah.


First day of the week is Sunday, it always has been.

Indubitably.


Three days and 3 nights is a Hebrew idiom, it is not literal. Like I said, I don't have discussions with post-enlightenment cultists. You have Seventh Day Adventism oozing between the lines.

Sorry, no SDA here.
 

Richard_oti

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Why could Jesus not have eaten the passover meal
And been the Passover
In the same year??

Short version (as if I am capable of such):

The Passover is a sacrifice, it is not a day. It is a sacrifice in an appointed month(s) on an appointed day at an appointed time(frame).

If Jesus is the Passover Lamb and was slain in the appropriate month, on the appropriate day at the appropriate time, then he could not have eaten the "Passover". You can't partake of the sacrifice before it is slain.

If he also ate the Passover, then it would have been to have partaken of a sacrifice that was not done at the appropriate time.


When He held the bread and said This Is My Body...
Was He not " holding his body"?

Isn't it the same?

No, it isn't the same. One can not partake of a sacrifice before it is slain. And the sacrifice must be slain at the appointed time, lest it also falls under the error of Jeroboam.
 

Richard_oti

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Please explain about the last supper being a day too early.
I've read that it was on the 14 th day of Nissan instead of the 15 th.
( I may have that wrong)

You are correct, the "Last Supper" occurred in the "evening" beginning the 14th. The Passover was to be slain on the 14th as the sun was to go down. The same timing as Jesus saying "It is finished".

By the time the Passover was roasted whole, it would have been eaten on the 15th, with the unleavened bread of the "Feast of Unleavened Bread".

The "Last Supper" occurred before the sacrifice was to be slain. Therefore it can not have been the Passover.
 
B

Butterfly

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I never said any such thing.
BTW, you're so sweet.
So sorry GodsGrace, but I was reading a thread yesterday and the post ByGrace is referring to is the following. It stuck in my mind because of you mentioning washing up and never using a dishwasher. I copied and pasted what you conveyed ..........

That came across to me as having a sad note in it. Am I mistaken?
Hey, I go on sometimes too long and too hard. I have you in my prayers for God to have His Way in you and brighten today for you.
No. I didn't mean it in a sad way.
I've known Jesus over 40 years now.
He came to me one day in my Whitstone NY home.
In my kitchen. I was washing dishes at the time.
Have never used a dishwasher since then, even though one of my homes had two.

What I meant is that I won't be learning anything new from now on.
Unless it's some small thought that never came to mind before.
My doctrinal beliefs are set...The house is built on the foundation of Jesus.

God is done with me. Not in a bad way. In a good way.
I've learned in whom I trust.
I've accepted what needs to be accepted.
I no longer question my last question to which there is no answer.

That's all I meant.
But pray for me anyway.
I need it............
 

GodsGrace

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You are correct, the "Last Supper" occurred in the "evening" beginning the 14th. The Passover was to be slain on the 14th as the sun was to go down. The same timing as Jesus saying "It is finished".

By the time the Passover was roasted whole, it would have been eaten on the 15th, with the unleavened bread of the "Feast of Unleavened Bread".

The "Last Supper" occurred before the sacrifice was to be slain. Therefore it can not have been the Passover.
Thanks RO
I'm having some difficulty absorbing this because it's a new idea.
However, I will be looking into it to see if I could understand it better.

I also know that Jesus died at the exact time that the Passover was to be observed. The sacrifice, of course. At 3 P.M. The same time Jesus died. I also know that from the hill where the crucifixion took place, Golgatha, the place (was it the temple?) where the sacrifice was to be made could be seen.

Is this true?
 

GodsGrace

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So sorry GodsGrace, but I was reading a thread yesterday and the post ByGrace is referring to is the following. It stuck in my mind because of you mentioning washing up and never using a dishwasher. I copied and pasted what you conveyed ..........

That came across to me as having a sad note in it. Am I mistaken?
Hey, I go on sometimes too long and too hard. I have you in my prayers for God to have His Way in you and brighten today for you.
No. I didn't mean it in a sad way.
I've known Jesus over 40 years now.
He came to me one day in my Whitstone NY home.
In my kitchen. I was washing dishes at the time.
Have never used a dishwasher since then, even though one of my homes had two.

What I meant is that I won't be learning anything new from now on.
Unless it's some small thought that never came to mind before.
My doctrinal beliefs are set...The house is built on the foundation of Jesus.

God is done with me. Not in a bad way. In a good way.
I've learned in whom I trust.
I've accepted what needs to be accepted.
I no longer question my last question to which there is no answer.

That's all I meant.
But pray for me anyway.
I need it............
My post starts at:
"What I meant..."

Thanks for posting it.
As you and others can see, I did not say I have nothing new to learn.
There's something new to learn all the time. What idiot doesn't know that.

I said MY DOCTRINAL beliefs were set. Doctrinal.
I learn new things all the time concerning some matter or other that is biblical --- but my DOCTRINAL ideas will not change anymore at this point.

If someone can change a DOCTRINAL belief after 40 years of study, it means they are not very set in their beliefs or they were ignorant of something or other before.
 

GodsGrace

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Short version (as if I am capable of such):

The Passover is a sacrifice, it is not a day. It is a sacrifice in an appointed month(s) on an appointed day at an appointed time(frame).

If Jesus is the Passover Lamb and was slain in the appropriate month, on the appropriate day at the appropriate time, then he could not have eaten the "Passover". You can't partake of the sacrifice before it is slain.

If he also ate the Passover, then it would have been to have partaken of a sacrifice that was not done at the appropriate time.




No, it isn't the same. One can not partake of a sacrifice before it is slain. And the sacrifice must be slain at the appointed time, lest it also falls under the error of Jeroboam.

Sorry RO,
It's me again.
You said one cannot partake of a sacrifice before it is slain.
Maybe the Last Supper was a day before so Jesus could be slain at the same time of the sacrifice?

THEN HE would be our sacrifice??
 

Richard_oti

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Yes the Talmud was a later writing when it was written. My own perspective was that even though its time of writing was later it was still a record of what was oral traditions that spanned for centuries before. The Jews were quite good at keeping a record in one form or another right?

I always get a chuckle at the way you phrase certain questions. We also know, that just because it is "tradition", does not necessitate that it is so. <chuckle> The "Fiddler on the Roof" comes to mind.


but in any event this was just my first salvo. I have more cards to play so to speak. Here is the next card in reference to the unleavened bread and the keeping of the yearly festival;

1 Cor5:6Your boasting is not good. Don’t you know that a little yeast leavens the whole batch of dough? 7Get rid of the old yeast, so that you may be a new unleavened batch—as you really are. For Christ, our Passover lamb, has been sacrificed. 8Therefore let us keep the Festival, not with the old bread leavened with malice and wickedness, but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.

Sin is the fermentation of our soul. Like mold to bread, associated with decay.

In 1 Cor 5, Paul is using Passover, the feast of Unleavened Bread as an example, it strikes me that Paul has a two fold reason for this.

Please pardon me if I skip some verses, for I gotta feeling this may get long.

1 Cor 5:1 It is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you, and of a kind that does not occur even among pagans: A man has his father's wife.

Lev 18:8 "'Do not have sexual relations with your father's wife;
that would dishonor your father.


1 Cor 5:2 And you are proud! Shouldn't you rather have been filled with grief and have put out of your fellowship the man who did this?

Lev 18:26 But you must keep my decrees and my laws. The native-born and the aliens living among you must not do any of these detestable things

Lev 18:29 Everyone who does any of these detestable things-such persons must be cut off from their people.


1 Cor 5:5 hand this man over to Satan, so that the sinful nature may be destroyed and his spirit saved on the day of the Lord.

So that the fermentation may be destroyed.

This can be related back to Leviticus chapters 12, 13 and 14 regarding isolating things that are contaminated, so that the contamination is unable to spread. The reason I say this; is that
after isolation, some items were allowed to return, others were destroyed by fire.


1 Cor 5:6 Your boasting is not good. Don't you know that a little yeast works through the whole batch of dough?

Paul is using an earthly example, one that the people should be able to readily understand.


1 Cor 5:7 Get rid of the old yeast that you may be a new batch without yeast-as you really are. For Christ, our Passover lamb, has been sacrificed.

Get rid of the filth, the malice, that which ferments your soul, so that you may be a new people. Without the fermentation that makes you bitter, or causes bitterness. (cf 2 Cor 5:17)


For Messiah, the Lamb of YHVH, has been *slaughtered*. As the blood of the Passover lamb was a covering unto those in Egypt, so that the destroyer would not strike them down, so too
is the blood of the Lamb a covering for us from our past sins.

Sorry, I am getting off topic...


1 Cor 5:8 Therefore let us keep the Festival, not with the old yeast, the yeast of malice and wickedness, but with bread without yeast, the bread of sincerity and truth.

And here is where I see the second side of Paul's reasoning, for he is demonstrating also the keeping of the feast of unleavened with purity, as we remove the yeast from our homes, let us also remove the sin from our lives.


1 Cor 5:13 God will judge those outside. "Expel the wicked man from among you."

While the following speak of something different, I feel the similarity of it is worth noting for the principle is the same...

Deut 17:7b You must purge the evil from among you.

Exo 12:15 For seven days you are to eat bread made without yeast. On the first day remove the yeast from your houses, for whoever eats anything with yeast in it from the first day through
the seventh must be cut off from Israel.


To sum up, yes, Paul is encouraging us to keep the "feast", but he is also using it as an example as I sort of laid out above. Paul was very proficient with regard to haTorah. I am so rusty that it is embarrassing.


Here is the second card;

1 cor 11:27 So then, whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of sinning against the body and blood of the Lord. 28Everyone ought to examine themselves before they eat of the bread and drink from the cup. 29For those who eat and drink without discerning the body of Christ eat and drink judgment on themselves. 30That is why many among you are weak and sick, and a number of you have fallen asleep.

What I discern here is that when the ritual is done correctly at its proper time then those who are not worthy to take it will become sick and could eventually die from it. Now we see the majority who now attempt to do the Lord's supper at every first day of the week being unaffected by their performance of the ritual even though we know that there are a great many who are not worthy to do it.
Here too I feel that what the many are doing is incorrect based on the narrow gate understanding and if their custom is to perform this at every meeting then it is likely an error of interpretation.

I do understand, been there.

1 Corinthians 11:20 When you come together, it is not the Lord's Supper you eat

Lets make a distinction here, the reference here is to the "Lord's Supper". The "Lord's Supper" is not Passover. It is separate and distinct from Passover. For upon the night that the "Lord's Supper" was shall we say instituted, it was not Passover that the Messiah and his disciples ate. The Passover seder would have been the following evening. One can not partake of the sacrifice before it is slain.

1 Cor 11:21 for as you eat, each of you goes ahead without waiting for anybody else. One remains hungry, another gets drunk. 22 Don't you have homes to eat and drink in?

1 Cor 11:23 For I received from the Lord what I also passed on to you: The Lord Jesus, on the night he was betrayed, took bread, 24 and when he had given thanks, he broke it and said,
"This is my body, which is for you; do this in remembrance of me." 25 In the same way, after supper he took the cup, saying, "This cup is the new covenant in my blood; do this, whenever you drink it, in remembrance of me." 26 For whenever you eat this bread and drink this cup, you proclaim the Lord's death until he comes.

1 Cor 11:27 Therefore, whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of sinning against the body and blood of the Lord. 28 A man ought to examine himself before he eats of the bread and drinks of the cup. 29 For anyone who eats and drinks without recognizing the body of the Lord eats and drinks judgment on himself.

Now, take a look at John 18:28, 19:14, 19:31

John 18:28 They lead Jesus therefore from Caiaphas into the Praetorium: and it was early; and they themselves entered not into the Praetorium, that they might not be defiled, but might eat the passover.

John 19:14 Now it was the Preparation of the passover: it was about the sixth hour. And he saith unto the Jews, Behold, your King!

John 19:31 The Jews therefore, because it was the Preparation, that the bodies should not remain on the cross upon the sabbath (for the day of that sabbath was a high day), asked of Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away.


1 Cor 10:15 I speak to sensible people; judge for yourselves what I say. 16 Is not the cup of thanksgiving for which we give thanks a participation in the blood of Christ? And is not the bread that we break a participation in the body of Christ? 17 Because there is one loaf, we, who are many, are one body, for we all partake of the one loaf.

As one knowledgeable in haTorah, Paul would have been all too aware that the "Last / Lord's Supper" was not the Passover.


So Richard just to be clear the HS has not stated directly yet what is correct and I still await that revealing thus, I could still be erring in understanding but, I am forming this understanding based on those things which I have already been confirmed of about God by the HS.

Fully understood and appreciated. As you have told others, do not listen even to me.

For all the "cards" that either of us can play, haTorah remains the "trump".

To be continued.
 

Richard_oti

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Part 2:

Here again I would reference 1 Cor5:6 that directly speaks for the unleavened bread as it is quite probable that translation issues could be in play.

Or, Paul is using this twofold, as an example with regards to the problems that he is writing with regard unto, as well as encouraging them to keep the "Feast" as it was intended.


We know the scripture states;
6 Take care of them until the fourteenth day of the month, when all the members of the community of Israel must slaughter them at twilight.

So Passover sacrifice is the 14th at twilight which begins the day of the 15th.

You use "twilight" a lot. I no longer do so, as I find the term far too confusing and non-specific with regard to such. Granted, you know what you are referring unto, but to the average person, it is not clear enough IMO.

Deuteronomy 16:6b there you must sacrifice the Passover ba-arev ke-vo' ha-shemesh,
(in the evening, as-to_go the-sun) on the anniversary of your departure from Egypt.

If we look to the Exodus itself, we can clearly see the timing thereof:

Shemot 12:29 At midnight YHVH struck down all the firstborn in Egypt, from the firstborn of Pharaoh, who sat on the throne, to the firstborn of the prisoner, who was in the dungeon, and the firstborn of all the livestock as well. 30 Pharaoh and all his officials and all the Egyptians got up during the night, and there was loud wailing in Egypt, for there was not a house without someone dead. 31 During the night Pharaoh summoned Moses and Aaron and said, "Up! Leave my people, you and the Israelites! Go, worship YHVH as you have requested.

BeMidbar further solidifies this: 33:3 The Israelites set out from Rameses on the fifteenth day of the first month, the day after the Passover.

From the Exodus account, we can see that they slew the Passover and applied the blood. Midway through the night, the firstborn were slain. During the night (that very night) Pharaoh summoned Moses and commanded them to leave. According to Numbers, they set out on the 15th, the day after the Passover.

Thus, we have IMO a "fairly" (To me, it is very clear, to others it may perhaps only be 'fairly' clear at this point) clear timeline with regard to the timing of the slaughter of the Passover and when it was eaten. I am more than aware of all the different theories / conjecture / speculation / etc. with regard to this.

To sum up to this point: The Passover lamb was to be slaughtered on the 14th of Aviv (Nisan), as the sun was to go down (just prior to sunset).


My understanding of the Lord's supper is that it was held on the day of the 14th at the beginning of the day which is in fact night time just after the end of the 13th.

Concur.


Remember I noted that in my study on the subject the Jews were holding the sacrifice both at the beginning of the 14th at home and the temple sacrifice at the end of the 14th and they would have already had unleavened bread in play for the 14th.

When was the Passover to be slain? Can one sacrifice the Passover at a time or place which is not lawful?

Devarim 16:5 Thou mayest not sacrifice the passover within any of thy gates, which YHVH 'Eloheyka giveth thee; 6 but at the place which YHVH 'Eloheyka shall choose, to cause his name to dwell in, there thou shalt sacrifice the passover at even, at the going down of the sun, at the season that thou camest forth out of Egypt. 7 And thou shalt roast and eat it in the place which YHVH 'Eloheyka shall choose: and thou shalt turn in the morning, and go unto thy tents.

Further, is that not also adding to the "Instruction"?


So, when Christ made the new covenant celebration he did it on the same day that he would be sacrificed so that the disciples would understand that the old meaning of this days celebration would be redirected to its new meaning since it was from its beginning a shadow of things to come in the first place.
So these are all my cards on the subject.

Fair enough. While I can not satisfactorily directly answer each of your "cards", I shall continue to play the "trump card" which is haTorah. Per the Instruction, there can only be one correct answer IMO.


17 “Celebrate the Festival of Unleavened Bread, because it was on this very day that I brought your divisions out of Egypt. Celebrate this day as a lasting ordinance for the generations to come. 18 In the first month you are to eat bread made without yeast, from the evening of the fourteenth day until the evening of the twenty-first day.

Note that it states the evening or end of the 14th day that unleavened bread must be in play. Thus it would be understood that unleavened bread was in fact eaten on the 14th day as it transitions to the 15th. If it had said to eat it from the beginning of the 15th day then we could expect the Lords supper to be normal bread. This is how I discern this point ATM. The 15th is the high holy day that none are to work on so if I have erred in a previous post in some way about this then my apologies. This is the intent that I understand.

No need to apologize. I know and understand your intent, I have been there.

Shemot 12:18 In the first month you are to eat bread made without yeast, ba-`erev (from the evening) of the fourteenth day ba-`arev (until the evening) of the twenty-first day. 19a For seven days no yeast is to be found in your houses.

Is it 7 or 8 days? It is from the "evening" following the 14th, that is, the evening after sunset which is the beginning of the 15th, until the evening ending the 21st, which ends at sunset.

The Passover sacrifice was to be slain on the 14th, as the sun was go to down, not when it was down. By the time it was roasted whole... How long would say it would take to roast a whole lamb?

By the time it was roasted, sunset would have come, and the Passover would have been eaten beginning the 15th, with unleavened bread.

Midway through the night, that very night, the destroyer came through. The Israelites left out the morning of the 15th, in full view of the Egyptians.


Look to Yom Kippurim also regarding "from evening until evening": VaYiqra' 23:27-32.