CALVINISM: The height of Spiritual depravity
- Thread starter Robert Pate
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So then Christ had to die for them as sinners. The Cross is where the elects sins are blotted out Col 2:13-14
13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross
Once you now have acknowledged an application of Christs meritorious saving death was need, you have overturned your own inconsistent argument. No since in continuing this, you cant see your inconsistency.
How does a spiritually dead depraved sinner who hates God, place God into their life ?
Romans 10:17 - So faith comes from hearing, and hearing through the word of Christ. Hebrews 11:6 - And without faith it is impossible to please him, for whoever would draw near to God must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who seek him.
A person can move from a position of hatred.
Thats new to me ! A spiritually dead person moving spiritually from a position of hatred to God, even though hes at enmity against God Rom 8:7-8
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
Correct, a person before they can believe in Christ, because of their spiritual depravity and inability, must be born again, a new creation !
God does not count their sin against them before they reach the age of accountability.
That would be un just.
The god of calvinism is actually the devil..
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
Well as I deal only with the "five points" all other arguments to me are irrelevant.
And that is why (at least in all the circle of believers I have known for over 50 years) Those that do not staunchly hold to all five of either side have come to be known as three point, or four point Calvinists or three or four point armeniasts.
But as each point and its counter point are diametrically opposed to each other- one cannot hold to both corresponding points of Arminianism and Calvinism as the five points of each argue.
Example: Point five or the P of Calvins five point rebuttal says believers once saved have eternal security and cannot lose their salvation. Jacob Arminius said a believer could lose their salvation. There is not someplace to meet in the middle. One is right and one is wrong here!
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
Well according to one on this thread, they have until they are 20 until they are accountable. So if they 18 are years old, and commit a pedophile rape and then murder the child, their sins are not held against them because they have not reached that mythical age of accountability.
Once you brought Christ into the equation, He saves sinners. You are just exalting the flesh ! Babies are born flesh, and need to be born again Jn 3:3-6
3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
No, you cant hear spiritually without spiritual hearing which comes from being born again
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
The sad reality of this line of thinking from th eone you answer, is that each and every person goes throu an Adam and Eve type of trial . they are born "saved" or whatever one wishes to call it and until they reach their 2220th birthday (as the writer you responded openly declared in post 1076) they are ot held accountable for any of their sinful actions.
Ronald Nolette
Well-Known Member
I know that. they want to be able to take some credit for seeing theirselves get saved. The human ego is so connivng! but we must keep bringing SCripture to them for as Paul wrote:
2 Timothy 2:25
In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;
That is the sad art, by accepting the teachings they have, they don't even know that they are harming themselves.
You still have to hear the gospel? That would mean learning it to some degree to have a bit of understanding. Everyone starts off a babe in Christ, it took me until I was 26 to finally turn to the LORD.
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