Calvinism

[John Caldwell]

Ok, where is hell?

California.

Which "hell"?
Scripture refers to two places (depending on the translation). Sheol refers to the grave (where dead souls are). Hell in terms of "the Lake of Fire" is where death and hades (hell) will be cast at the final Judgment. Scripture does not assign a place for either.

 

[Waiting on him]

California.

Which "hell"?
Scripture refers to two places (depending on the translation). Sheol refers to the grave (where dead souls are). Hell in terms of "the Lake of Fire" is where death and hades (hell) will be cast at the final Judgment. Scripture does not assign a place for either.

Looks to me as both are referring to the grave?

 

[Waiting on him]

California.

Which "hell"?
Scripture refers to two places (depending on the translation). Sheol refers to the grave (where dead souls are). Hell in terms of "the Lake of Fire" is where death and hades (hell) will be cast at the final Judgment. Scripture does not assign a place for either.

I have a secret to tell you.

 

[John Caldwell]

I have a secret to tell you.

I am not interested in religious secrets. Scripture is enough for me. But thank you all the same.

 

[Waiting on him]

I am not interested in religious secrets. Scripture is enough for me. But thank you all the same.

Ok

 

[Giuliano]

I am saying Calvinism and predestinationists, believes that an entity created heaven, and earth and mankind. I am not sure if they believe if their god took free-will away from Mankind or they never had a chance. For them a sovereign god means everything is a puppet show. From their Mankind if forced to be good or bad by the will of god, by what they call predestination. In effect this belief puts Satan out of business and their god takes over. Pretty much makes judgment day a mute point, since all judgment occurs before they are born.

If every action and thought is under the control of their god, it nullifies, choice, free-will, belief, faith, scriptures, love, grace, prayers, salvation, and good deeds because all of that was forced on them so none of that is to their merit or free-will. Alternatively this entity forces people to be bad, forces them to sin and then damns them to hell. By no sin of their own they are damned to be tortured forever, no free-will, no escape, no mercy, just predetermined damnation.

Historically those that believe they are the “elect” have committed the worst of atrocities. The term “elect” is used to edify themselves, doctrines to damn others to edify themselves. All Christians that believe, are the “elect” not the few that slander God. Evil lurks on the Internet, this is a warning to those that run into it. They come talking of love and scriptures, but it is all a lie! Who need scriptures if you are forced to believe?

Voltaire, infamous atheist, said, "If God has made us in his image, we have returned him the favor." I can see his point. People often imagine God behaves the way they would if they were all powerful. What we believe about God can say more about us than about Him. Calvin's ideas speak volumes about his character. He slanders God, and he slanders man who is God's creation by imagining God is like him.

 

[John Caldwell]

Looks to me as both are referring to the grave?

No. "Hades" refers to the grave (where both the righteous and wicked went). The "lake of fire" is different (what Scripture refers to as the "second death").

 

[Enoch111]

No. "Hades" refers to the grave (where both the righteous and wicked went).

Not the grave. That's where the body goes. But to Sheol/Hades, where souls and spirits went. The righteous no longer go there, but directly to Heaven (since the resurrection of Christ).

The KJV did a great disservice by calling Sheol the grave, and Hades hell. Hell is the Lake of Fire.

 

[Grailhunter]

Voltaire, infamous atheist, said, "If God has made us in his image, we have returned him the favor." I can see his point. People often imagine God behaves the way they would if they were all powerful. What we believe about God can say more about us than about Him. Calvin's ideas speak volumes about his character. He slanders God, and he slanders man who is God's creation by imagining God is like him.

The religions of the world....religious writings of the world....the acts of those religions. What matters most? The name of the religions? The writings of their religions? The application of their religions? Is that outward face of their religion, the face of their gods.

 

[John Caldwell]

Not the grave. That's where the body goes. But to Sheol/Hades, where souls and spirits went. The righteous no longer go there, but directly to Heaven (since the resurrection of Christ).

The KJV did a great disservice by calling Sheol the grave, and Hades hell. Hell is the Lake of Fire.

I agree (both hell and the grave are poor references for Sheol).

 

[Grailhunter]

I agree (both hell and the grave are poor references for Sheol).

John....please look into if the Jews had a hell. If God was threatening the Jews with hell for bad behavior?
Gathered with their fathers.... Were Jews in a bad place in the spirit world in the Old Testament? You may know all this, but it is a point that many miss.

 

[Giuliano]

The religions of the world....religious writings of the world....the acts of those religions. What matters most? The name of the religions? The writings of their religions? The application of their religions? Is that outward face of their religion, the face of their gods.

Blessed are the pure in heart. . . .

 

[reformed1689]

I am saying Calvinism and predestinationists, believes that an entity created heaven, and earth and mankind. I am not sure if they believe if their god took free-will away from Mankind or they never had a chance. For them a sovereign god means everything is a puppet show. From their Mankind if forced to be good or bad by the will of god, by what they call predestination. In effect this belief puts Satan out of business and their god takes over. Pretty much makes judgment day a mute point, since all judgment occurs before they are born.

If every action and thought is under the control of their god, it nullifies, choice, free-will, belief, faith, scriptures, love, grace, prayers, salvation, and good deeds because all of that was forced on them so none of that is to their merit or free-will. Alternatively this entity forces people to be bad, forces them to sin and then damns them to hell. By no sin of their own they are damned to be tortured forever, no free-will, no escape, no mercy, just predetermined damnation.

Historically those that believe they are the “elect” have committed the worst of atrocities. The term “elect” is used to edify themselves, doctrines to damn others to edify themselves. All Christians that believe, are the “elect” not the few that slander God. Evil lurks on the Internet, this is a warning to those that run into it. They come talking of love and scriptures, but it is all a lie! Who need scriptures if you are forced to believe?

View attachment 7527

It would do you good to learn what Calvinism soteriology actually teaches because you clearly do not know.

 

[Waiting on him]

Not the grave. That's where the body goes. But to Sheol/Hades, where souls and spirits went. The righteous no longer go there, but directly to Heaven (since the resurrection of Christ).

The KJV did a great disservice by calling Sheol the grave, and Hades hell. Hell is the Lake of Fire.

So the lake of fire is cast into the lake of fire?

 

[Waiting on him]

It’s good to know who the weaned are.

 

[Grailhunter]

It would do you good to learn what Calvinism soteriology actually teaches because you clearly do not know.

I know plenty about Calvinists and have put few behind bars. You are little behind on this discussion....you might try to go back to post #800 and work your way forward. This is not about my lack of knowledge it is about the evilness of this religion and that the time is up, you cannot cover it up anymore. The world knows and that it good and bad because it reflects poorly on Christianity as a whole. This is all over the internet...what young people see and they know it is messed up, but then they do not know enough to know that this is really not the Spirit of Christianity but rather the twisted views of those that want to make themselves the elect.

 

[John Caldwell]

John....please look into if the Jews had a hell. If God was threatening the Jews with hell for bad behavior?
Gathered with their fathers.... Were Jews in a bad place in the spirit world in the Old Testament? You may know all this, but it is a point that many miss.

The Jews had various ideas. The Sadducees did not believe in spirits or an afterlife of reward and punishment. Pharisees believed both in the bodily resurrection and an afterlife that included a judgment along covenant lines. But insofar as a Hell, I have not seen Jewish literature indicating a belief in a place of eternal torment. If you have read otherwise I'd be very interested in the references. I have not read extensively on the topic.

 

[reformed1689]

I know plenty about Calvinists and have put few behind bars.

Put a few behind bars? Pretty sure that has nothing to do with Calvinism.

This is not about my lack of knowledge it is about the evilness of this religion and that the time is up, you cannot cover it up anymore.

It is about your lack of knowledge because I read your post, that I originally quoted, and it was full of strawman arguments and not actual beliefs of any calvinist I know, including myself. You really don't know what you are talking about.

 

[Giuliano]

Two quotes from Calvin -- found at John Calvin Quotes – The Calvinism of John Calvin – Are Calvinists REALLY “Calvinists”?:

“…salvation is freely offered to some while others are barred from access to it.” (John Calvin, Institutes of Christian Religion, Book 3, Chapter 21, Paragraph 5)

“We call predestination God’s eternal decree, by which he compacted with himself what he willed to become of each man. For all are not created in equal condition; rather, eternal life is fore-ordained for some, eternal damnation for others.” (John Calvin, Institutes of Christian Religion, Book 3, Chapter 21, Paragraph 5)

 

[Grailhunter]

The Jews had various ideas. The Sadducees did not believe in spirits or an afterlife of reward and punishment. Pharisees believed both in the bodily resurrection and an afterlife that included a judgment along covenant lines. But insofar as a Hell, I have not seen Jewish literature indicating a belief in a place of eternal torment. If you have read otherwise I'd be very interested in the references. I have not read extensively on the topic.

lol I figured you knew all that. I mean in the Old Testament. There are around 400 years between the testaments and that is a whole different field of study. Big changes for the Jews between the testaments.