Can Priests Forgive Sin?

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Johann

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Can Priests Forgive Sin?

The Catholic Church claims that its bishops and priests have inherited from the apostles the power to forgive penitent sinners. Please notice the following:

"Who has the power to forgive sin today?
"All bishops and priests of the Catholic Church can forgive sin." (A Catechism for Adults, p. 85).
"Christ conferred upon the Apostles the power to forgive sins: 'Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven.' (John 20:23). St. Paul mirrors the faith of the Apostolic Church when he writes: 'God hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation' (II Cor. 5:18).
"As the inheritors of the power and authority of the Apostles, the bishops and priests of the Catholic Church exercises the ministry of reconciliation, forgiving penitent sinners in the name of Jesus Christ." (The Faith of Millions, pp. 71-72).
Catholic bishops and priests are claiming a power which the apostles did not possess or exercise. Jesus said to the apostles, "Receive the Holy Spirit; whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them; and whose sins you shall retain, they are retained." (John 20:22-23). Thus, only by the possession of the Holy Spirit would the apostles have the authority to forgive and retain sins. As the Holy Spirit guided them in their preaching and writing, they delivered God's plan for forgiving and retaining sins (Luke 24:45-49; Acts 2:38). This alone was their "power to forgive sins" and how it was exercised.

On one occasion the Scribes and Pharisees reasoned in their hearts concerning Jesus, "Who is this man who speaks blasphemies? Who can forgive sins, but God only?" (Luke 5:21). Their error was in their failure to recognize that Jesus was God in the flesh. If Jesus was not God, they would have been correct in their accusation. God said through the prophet Isaiah, "I, even I, am he that blotteth out thy transgressions for mine own sake, and will not remember thy sins." (Isa. 43:25).

On another occasion the Jews said, "Not for a good work do we stone thee, but for blasphemy, and because thou, being a man, makest thyself God." (John 10:33). Jesus did not deny that it was blasphemous for a man to presume to forgive sins. If the Jews had been right in their premise (that Christ was only a man), they would have been correct in their conclusion. The Catholic priests literally assume the prerogatives of God when they presume to forgive sins.

If Catholic priests have the power to grant absolution from sin, why don't they also possess the power to perform miracles? Jesus said it was just as easy for Him to say, "Arise, and walk," as to say, "Thy sins are forgiven thee" (Luke 5:23). He added, "But that you man know that the Son of man has power on earth to forgive sins--he said to the paralytic--I say to thee, arise, take up thy pallet and go to thy house." (Luke 5:24). Why can't the Catholic priests do the same? Since they cannot, we must conclude they do not have authority to forgive sins.

Some Catholics in effort to evade the blasphemous claim of priests being able to forgive sin, say that the priests only ask God to forgive sin. The following quotes show beyond doubt that the Catholic Church most certainly does claim that its priests can forgive sin.

"In the institution of the sacrament our Lord did not say to His Apostles, 'Whose sins you shall ask to be absolved, shall be absolved,' but he instituted as the form of the sacrament, 'Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them.' These words show that the minister of the Sacrament of Penance does not pray for the absolution of the penitent, but pronounces the absolution as a judicial sentience, as one having judicial authority." (Catholic Dictionary, p. 5).
"Its minister purifies souls from sin by an act of absolution, and as the Council of Trent defined, this absolution is not a mere declaration of what has taken place as effect of other causes, but a real efficacious judicial sentence actually freeing the sinner from guilt." (Legislation on the Sacraments, p. 190).
"Unlike the authority given to the Priests of the Old Law, to declare the leper cleansed from his leprosy, the power with which the priests of the New Law are invested, is not simply to declare the sins forgiven, but, as the ministers of God, really to absolve from sins." (The Catechism of the Council of Trent, p. 175).
Again, Catholic bishops and priests are claiming a power which the apostles neither possessed nor employed. Actually, they are assuming an authority above that of the apostles. When Jesus said, "Receive the Holy Spirit; whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them; and whose sins you shall retain, they are retained" (John 20:22-23), He was speaking to the apostles only. His words were not addressed to Catholic bishops and priests and there is no mention of successors. Furthermore, the power to forgive and retain sins was based upon the expression, "Receive the Holy Spirit." The Catholic writers always fail to quote this important part of our Lord's words, e.g., as in the above quote from the Catholic Dictionary. Only by possession of the Holy Spirit were the apostles able to forgive and retain sins. As the Holy Spirit guided them in their preaching and writing, they delivered the design of God for forgiving and retaining sins (Luke 24:45-49; Acts 2:38). This is how their authority to forgive sins was exercised. For instance, when Simon the sorcerer sinned (Acts 8:18-19), Peter did not say, "I absolve you," or "I forgive you;" instead, he merely revealed to him what he needed to do in order to be forgiven (Acts 8:22).

Language similar to that spoken to the apostles was addressed to Jeremiah the prophet. Jer. 1:9-10 says, "And the Lord said to me: Behold I have given my words in thy mouth: Lo, I have set thee this day over the nations, and over kingdoms, to root up, and to pull down, and to waste, and to destroy, and to build, and to plant." Jeremiah never literally rooted up, pulled down, destroyed, or planted nations and kingdoms. His mission was to declare to the nations the terms on which God would build up or destroy, reward or punish nations. Similarly, the apostles were given authority to declare the terms on which God would forgive and retain sins.

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Confession to priests?
We are taught in the New Testament to confess our sins to God and He will forgive and cleanse us from all iniquity. "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just, and will forgive our sins and cleanse us from all unrighteousness." (1 John 1:9 Catholic RSV). Also, we are instructed that when we sin, Jesus Christ is our advocate with the Father and the propitiation for our sins (1 John 2:1-2). In Heb. 4:14-16, the writer teaches that Christians have full and complete access to God through Jesus Christ and may come boldly to the throne of grace and obtain mercy.

The New Testament teaches that one's confession should be as public as the sin, e.g., "And many of those who believed kept coming, and openly confessed their practices." (Acts 19:18). If the sin was against God only, it needs to be confessed only to God (1 John 1:9). If the sin was committed against one or a number of individuals, it should be confessed to God and to those who have been wronged. James 5:16 says, "Confess, therefore, your sins to one another, and pray for one another, that you may be saved." This means that Christians are to confess to each other and applies to sins committed against each other. It cannot mean that the Christian is to confess to the priest because it would require that the priest confess back to the Christian--"confess your sins to one another."

There is no command or example in the New Testament for Christians to confess sins to a priest to obtain absolution. The Testament gives instructions on every good work imposed upon children of God (2 Tim. 3:16-17; 2 Pet. 1:3), but it doesn't mention a single word regarding "auricular confession" or that which is done in the modern Catholic confessional. There is no allusion or indication, no command, example, or inference in the Scriptures regarding the confessional. In short, there is not the slightest hint concerning that which is done by Catholics today. When one believes or practices something in religion which is not in the written New Testament, all of the following divine principles immediately apply.

It is not a good work (2 Tim. 3:16-17).
It does not pertain to life and godliness (2 Pet. 1:3).
It causes one to not have God (2 John 9).
It is not authorized by Christ (Col. 3:17).
It cannot be done by faith (2 Cor. 5:7; Rom. 10:17).
It is going beyond what's written (1 Cor. 4:6).
It is not as the oracles of God (1 Pet. 4:11).
It is not according to the pattern (Heb. 8:5).
It does not pertain to the seed of the kingdom (Luke 8:11).
It is not of righteousness (Rom. 1:16-17; 10:1-3).
It is of "no such commandment" (Acts 15:24).
It is iniquity (Matt. 7:23).
It is of men (Matt. 15:9; Col. 2:8).
It is not of truth (John 4:24).
It is another gospel (Gal. 1:6-9)
It is adding to the Word of God (Rev. 22:18; Deut. 4:2).
The following quotes from Catholic sources show that the practice of auricular confession slowly and gradually developed.



Since there are no passages in the New Testament authorizing the Catholic confessional, it is a sinful practice. We emphasize again that we cannot go beyond the things that are written and be pleasing to God (1 Cor. 4:6; 2 John 9). When we add the traditions and doctrines of men, our worship becomes vain (Matt. 15:9; Col. 2:8). If we change, add to, delete from, or pervert the gospel of Christ, the curse of God rests upon us (Gal. 1:6-9; Rev. 22:18-19).

Correct me if I'm wrong.
 

Reggie Belafonte

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No Priest can not forgive your Sin, but he can help you along to do such, but that is up to you and God ! and you taking such serious and totally repenting ?
If one fails again going down the same path, then true repenting gives you strength and in time you can build up an immunity against failing again, if you truly do seriously repent !

One first can only drink milk but in time one could eat meat.

Ones failings can ( could ) make one stronger, understanding such failings in depth, as to why one was lead along ?
So once one understands such an issue, they have their radar working to detect such and deal with such by nipping such in the bud before hand.
 

Cassandra

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The veil is rent in twain! We can boldly go to the throne of grace--directly to God in the Name of Jesus!!!!!!

Jesus is our intercessor!!!!!!!!!

Romans 8:34 "Who then is the one who condemns? No one. Christ Jesus who died—more than that, who was raised to life—is at the right hand of God and is also interceding for us."
Heb 7:25 25 "Therefore He is able to save completely those who come to God through Him, because He always lives to intercede for them".

Heb 4:16 " Let us therefore come boldly to the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy and find grace to help in time of need."

I John 2:1-2 "My little children, these things I write to you, so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. 2 And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the whole world."
 

MatthewG

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Hi Johann,

Anyone can forgive that people sin. Jesus done paid the price and was risen again by Yahava. Remember when Jesus which is easier to say your sins are forgiven or pick up your mat and walk? Which do you believe is easier to say today?

Matthew 9:
1 Jesus stepped into a boat, crossed over and came to his own town. 2 Some men brought to him a paralyzed man, lying on a mat. When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the man, “Take heart, son; your sins are forgiven.”

3 At this, some of the teachers of the law said to themselves, “This fellow is blaspheming!”

4 Knowing their thoughts, Jesus said, “Why do you entertain evil thoughts in your hearts? 5 Which is easier: to say, ‘Your sins are forgiven,’ or to say, ‘Get up and walk’? 6 But I want you to know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins.” So he said to the paralyzed man, “Get up, take your mat and go home.” 7 Then the man got up and went home. 8 When the crowd saw this, they were filled with awe; and they praised God, who had given such authority to man.
 
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Johann

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Hi Johann,

Anyone can forgive that people sin. Jesus done paid the price and was risen again by Yahava. Remember when Jesus which is easier to say your sins are forgiven or pick up your mat and walk? Which do you believe is easier to say today?

Matthew 9:
1 Jesus stepped into a boat, crossed over and came to his own town. 2 Some men brought to him a paralyzed man, lying on a mat. When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the man, “Take heart, son; your sins are forgiven.”

3 At this, some of the teachers of the law said to themselves, “This fellow is blaspheming!”

4 Knowing their thoughts, Jesus said, “Why do you entertain evil thoughts in your hearts? 5 Which is easier: to say, ‘Your sins are forgiven,’ or to say, ‘Get up and walk’? 6 But I want you to know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins.” So he said to the paralyzed man, “Get up, take your mat and go home.” 7 Then the man got up and went home. 8 When the crowd saw this, they were filled with awe; and they praised God, who had given such authority to man.
Absolutely-in full agreement.
J.
 
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Bob Estey

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Can Priests Forgive Sin?

The Catholic Church claims that its bishops and priests have inherited from the apostles the power to forgive penitent sinners. Please notice the following:

"Who has the power to forgive sin today?
"All bishops and priests of the Catholic Church can forgive sin." (A Catechism for Adults, p. 85).
"Christ conferred upon the Apostles the power to forgive sins: 'Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven.' (John 20:23). St. Paul mirrors the faith of the Apostolic Church when he writes: 'God hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation' (II Cor. 5:18).
"As the inheritors of the power and authority of the Apostles, the bishops and priests of the Catholic Church exercises the ministry of reconciliation, forgiving penitent sinners in the name of Jesus Christ." (The Faith of Millions, pp. 71-72).
Catholic bishops and priests are claiming a power which the apostles did not possess or exercise. Jesus said to the apostles, "Receive the Holy Spirit; whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them; and whose sins you shall retain, they are retained." (John 20:22-23). Thus, only by the possession of the Holy Spirit would the apostles have the authority to forgive and retain sins. As the Holy Spirit guided them in their preaching and writing, they delivered God's plan for forgiving and retaining sins (Luke 24:45-49; Acts 2:38). This alone was their "power to forgive sins" and how it was exercised.

On one occasion the Scribes and Pharisees reasoned in their hearts concerning Jesus, "Who is this man who speaks blasphemies? Who can forgive sins, but God only?" (Luke 5:21). Their error was in their failure to recognize that Jesus was God in the flesh. If Jesus was not God, they would have been correct in their accusation. God said through the prophet Isaiah, "I, even I, am he that blotteth out thy transgressions for mine own sake, and will not remember thy sins." (Isa. 43:25).

On another occasion the Jews said, "Not for a good work do we stone thee, but for blasphemy, and because thou, being a man, makest thyself God." (John 10:33). Jesus did not deny that it was blasphemous for a man to presume to forgive sins. If the Jews had been right in their premise (that Christ was only a man), they would have been correct in their conclusion. The Catholic priests literally assume the prerogatives of God when they presume to forgive sins.

If Catholic priests have the power to grant absolution from sin, why don't they also possess the power to perform miracles? Jesus said it was just as easy for Him to say, "Arise, and walk," as to say, "Thy sins are forgiven thee" (Luke 5:23). He added, "But that you man know that the Son of man has power on earth to forgive sins--he said to the paralytic--I say to thee, arise, take up thy pallet and go to thy house." (Luke 5:24). Why can't the Catholic priests do the same? Since they cannot, we must conclude they do not have authority to forgive sins.

Some Catholics in effort to evade the blasphemous claim of priests being able to forgive sin, say that the priests only ask God to forgive sin. The following quotes show beyond doubt that the Catholic Church most certainly does claim that its priests can forgive sin.

"In the institution of the sacrament our Lord did not say to His Apostles, 'Whose sins you shall ask to be absolved, shall be absolved,' but he instituted as the form of the sacrament, 'Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them.' These words show that the minister of the Sacrament of Penance does not pray for the absolution of the penitent, but pronounces the absolution as a judicial sentience, as one having judicial authority." (Catholic Dictionary, p. 5).
"Its minister purifies souls from sin by an act of absolution, and as the Council of Trent defined, this absolution is not a mere declaration of what has taken place as effect of other causes, but a real efficacious judicial sentence actually freeing the sinner from guilt." (Legislation on the Sacraments, p. 190).
"Unlike the authority given to the Priests of the Old Law, to declare the leper cleansed from his leprosy, the power with which the priests of the New Law are invested, is not simply to declare the sins forgiven, but, as the ministers of God, really to absolve from sins." (The Catechism of the Council of Trent, p. 175).
Again, Catholic bishops and priests are claiming a power which the apostles neither possessed nor employed. Actually, they are assuming an authority above that of the apostles. When Jesus said, "Receive the Holy Spirit; whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them; and whose sins you shall retain, they are retained" (John 20:22-23), He was speaking to the apostles only. His words were not addressed to Catholic bishops and priests and there is no mention of successors. Furthermore, the power to forgive and retain sins was based upon the expression, "Receive the Holy Spirit." The Catholic writers always fail to quote this important part of our Lord's words, e.g., as in the above quote from the Catholic Dictionary. Only by possession of the Holy Spirit were the apostles able to forgive and retain sins. As the Holy Spirit guided them in their preaching and writing, they delivered the design of God for forgiving and retaining sins (Luke 24:45-49; Acts 2:38). This is how their authority to forgive sins was exercised. For instance, when Simon the sorcerer sinned (Acts 8:18-19), Peter did not say, "I absolve you," or "I forgive you;" instead, he merely revealed to him what he needed to do in order to be forgiven (Acts 8:22).

Language similar to that spoken to the apostles was addressed to Jeremiah the prophet. Jer. 1:9-10 says, "And the Lord said to me: Behold I have given my words in thy mouth: Lo, I have set thee this day over the nations, and over kingdoms, to root up, and to pull down, and to waste, and to destroy, and to build, and to plant." Jeremiah never literally rooted up, pulled down, destroyed, or planted nations and kingdoms. His mission was to declare to the nations the terms on which God would build up or destroy, reward or punish nations. Similarly, the apostles were given authority to declare the terms on which God would forgive and retain sins.

Click to View

Confession to priests?
We are taught in the New Testament to confess our sins to God and He will forgive and cleanse us from all iniquity. "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just, and will forgive our sins and cleanse us from all unrighteousness." (1 John 1:9 Catholic RSV). Also, we are instructed that when we sin, Jesus Christ is our advocate with the Father and the propitiation for our sins (1 John 2:1-2). In Heb. 4:14-16, the writer teaches that Christians have full and complete access to God through Jesus Christ and may come boldly to the throne of grace and obtain mercy.

The New Testament teaches that one's confession should be as public as the sin, e.g., "And many of those who believed kept coming, and openly confessed their practices." (Acts 19:18). If the sin was against God only, it needs to be confessed only to God (1 John 1:9). If the sin was committed against one or a number of individuals, it should be confessed to God and to those who have been wronged. James 5:16 says, "Confess, therefore, your sins to one another, and pray for one another, that you may be saved." This means that Christians are to confess to each other and applies to sins committed against each other. It cannot mean that the Christian is to confess to the priest because it would require that the priest confess back to the Christian--"confess your sins to one another."

There is no command or example in the New Testament for Christians to confess sins to a priest to obtain absolution. The Testament gives instructions on every good work imposed upon children of God (2 Tim. 3:16-17; 2 Pet. 1:3), but it doesn't mention a single word regarding "auricular confession" or that which is done in the modern Catholic confessional. There is no allusion or indication, no command, example, or inference in the Scriptures regarding the confessional. In short, there is not the slightest hint concerning that which is done by Catholics today. When one believes or practices something in religion which is not in the written New Testament, all of the following divine principles immediately apply.

It is not a good work (2 Tim. 3:16-17).
It does not pertain to life and godliness (2 Pet. 1:3).
It causes one to not have God (2 John 9).
It is not authorized by Christ (Col. 3:17).
It cannot be done by faith (2 Cor. 5:7; Rom. 10:17).
It is going beyond what's written (1 Cor. 4:6).
It is not as the oracles of God (1 Pet. 4:11).
It is not according to the pattern (Heb. 8:5).
It does not pertain to the seed of the kingdom (Luke 8:11).
It is not of righteousness (Rom. 1:16-17; 10:1-3).
It is of "no such commandment" (Acts 15:24).
It is iniquity (Matt. 7:23).
It is of men (Matt. 15:9; Col. 2:8).
It is not of truth (John 4:24).
It is another gospel (Gal. 1:6-9)
It is adding to the Word of God (Rev. 22:18; Deut. 4:2).
The following quotes from Catholic sources show that the practice of auricular confession slowly and gradually developed.



Since there are no passages in the New Testament authorizing the Catholic confessional, it is a sinful practice. We emphasize again that we cannot go beyond the things that are written and be pleasing to God (1 Cor. 4:6; 2 John 9). When we add the traditions and doctrines of men, our worship becomes vain (Matt. 15:9; Col. 2:8). If we change, add to, delete from, or pervert the gospel of Christ, the curse of God rests upon us (Gal. 1:6-9; Rev. 22:18-19).

Correct me if I'm wrong.
A question comes to mind: If I know that you are forgiven, and I say, "You are forgiven," then am I forgiving you, or is the Lord forgiving you?
 

MatthewG

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A question comes to mind: If I know that you are forgiven, and I say, "You are forgiven," then am I forgiving you, or is the Lord forgiving you?
If its coming from the spirit of Christ in you, Bob. The message of the great news is that people are forgiven. Now some say wont that lead to more sin? Not if your their friend and set an example of Christ to them… and share the Lord with them, and share even Paul with them.

The scope is you as an individual - not here on a forum website - but out there as an individual who choose to love God and love others… and help, encourage, the right ways by the spirit when its apporiate; without harping and beating them on the head.
 

Bob Estey

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If its coming from the spirit of Christ in you, Bob. The message of the great news is that people are forgiven. Now some say wont that lead to more sin? Not if your their friend and set an example of Christ to them… and share the Lord with them, and share even Paul with them.

The scope is you as an individual - not here on a forum website - but out there as an individual who choose to love God and love others… and help, encourage, the right ways by the spirit when its apporiate; without harping and beating them on the head.
The reason I brought this up, is that Jesus would say, "Your sins are forgiven," if memory serves. Was he then forgiving the sin, or did he just know that the Father in heaven had forgiven the sin?
 
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MatthewG

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The reason I brought this up, is that Jesus would say, "Your sins are forgiven," if memory serves. Was he then forgiving the sin, or did he just know that the Father in heaven had forgiven the sin?
The Father taught him to forgive sin. It leads to love. He spoke out about prideful religous leaders of harden hearts; but he still forgave them. Even his murderers on the cross. And then he was the one paid for sin in all of our places.
 

Johann

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If its coming from the spirit of Christ in you, Bob. The message of the great news is that people are forgiven. Now some say wont that lead to more sin? Not if your their friend and set an example of Christ to them… and share the Lord with them, and share even Paul with them.

The scope is you as an individual - not here on a forum website - but out there as an individual who choose to love God and love others… and help, encourage, the right ways by the spirit when its apporiate; without harping and beating them on the head.
You say: "Without harping and beating them on the head-"

Scripture says-

Eph_5:11 And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.

2Ti_4:2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.

Is sound doctrine-correcting others, including myself-"harping and beating ?"

J.
 
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MatthewG

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Johann, i think many people miss the point…

Im not saying its good to follow someone who says hey lets go murder this homosexual down the road.

Perhaps you dont understand what harping on people means… it means to make someone always be subject to what you believe without letting them have freedom to think and choose for themselves @Johann
 

Johann

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Johann, i think many people miss the point…

Im not saying its good to follow someone who says hey lets go murder this homosexual down the road.

Perhaps you dont understand what harping on people means… it means to make someone always be subject to what you believe without letting them have freedom to think and choose for themselves @Johann
I am only the messenger-working with the Scriptures-I think you may refer to vicarious liability-religious indoctrination.

I have asked you to come back to me re the link I have shared with you-for YOUR edification and growth in Christ Jesus, since you are housebound? Correct?

You never did @MatthewG
J.
 

MatthewG

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I only went there once. Im not so much interested in all of those things J.

All the best, people must do what they feel the need to do.

Was just sharing considered information.

No one should ever trust man. Trust God and follow the spirit… in any given situation, as difficult as that can be when sin gets ahold of our flesh within.
 

Johann

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I only went there once. Im not so much interested in all of those things J.

All the best, people must do what they feel the need to do.

Was just sharing considered information.

No one should ever trust man. Trust God and follow the spirit… in any given situation, as difficult as that can be when sin gets ahold of our flesh within.
All of us must teach every man's teachings by the Scriptures Matthew-Mike Gendor's Scriptural teachings feeds my soul-and how to avoid self deception or being in a state of deception.
But it's OK-that is why I don't share links.
J.
 

MatthewG

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All of us must teach every man's teachings by the Scriptures Matthew-Mike Gendor's Scriptural teachings feeds my soul-and how to avoid self deception or being in a state of deception.
But it's OK-that is why I don't share links.
J.
Hey I love shawn, my teacher but everyone has to listen to the spirit and test all things. Remain in Christ my dude, all the best, and again good to see you.
 
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Reggie Belafonte

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One can forgive another of a Sin that was against you. and that is called Charity !
Forgiveness means that one has Charity.
If one can not forgive another who is worthy of forgiveness, one has no Charity.

One claiming sorry for another has nothing really too do with the one claimed to of done wrong ?
For It's just an opinion of that person and not to mention may be wrong, for they do not fully know what they are on about ? regarding the other person etc that they are claiming saying sorry for or lack depth of such.
So if one was to say sorry on the behalf for another, that does not mean anything truly, but for the one saying such opinion !
You can not say sorry to another on the behalf of another in fact, bar for yourself making a comment on your own position, but that does not cut it regarding the real issue, such is shallow regard of reality and only to do with the one making the comment, it has no real grounds to the original.

So in Australia we had a typical shallow Lefty Government say Sorry for the Aboriginals regarding the past ?
But such was worthless, totally worthless in fact because such was totally shallow intent ! Typical of a Lefty ! no substance at all in fact to the true reality ? but for a childish stance that was ignorance ! such is bliss to a fool who has no true regard to the reality and is just making up a pixie land picture of things for this generation to swallow, who know nothing at all of the reality of the issue of real History, for Lefty's make that up ! For they are not interested in reality but painting their own intent over everyone. They just blank out reality for their own intent, making that the issue. a dips dingbat fairy land concept just out of the Satanic Communist play book. Too harsh a reality for such dingbats to swallow, as reality is to harsh to swallow ! best be under the delusions and deceptions that the Lefty's cherish in being a dingbat, but that's how they see everyone as equal ? equal nothings in fact !
For they cancel anything that they do not promote for you, because they see you are not worthy in fact. That's why they want to keep everyone down and suppress the Truth and reality !

But dingbats swallow the Socialist line because they are so shallow ! not to mention the Line played is tempting to dingbats.
 

Lambano

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dThe reason I brought this up, is that Jesus would say, "Your sins are forgiven," if memory serves. Was he then forgiving the sin, or did he just know that the Father in heaven had forgiven the sin?
We've established that Jesus Himself had authority on earth to forgive sins; see Mark 2:1-12 and synoptic parallels. Then the question becomes, has Jesus delegated the same authority to His representatives on earth until He comes back? The Catholics I've talked to say that Matthew 16:13-20, “I also say to you that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church; and the gates of Hades will not overpower it. I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; and whatever you bind on earth shall have been bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall have been loosed in heaven” does indicate that the Christ, the Son of the Living God has delegated that authority.

Are there alternative ways to interpret Matthew 16:18-19?
 
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Bob Estey

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We've established that Jesus Himself had authority on earth to forgive sins; see Mark 2:1-12 and synoptic parallels. Then the question becomes, has Jesus delegated the same authority to His representatives on earth until He comes back? The Catholics I've talked to say that Matthew 16:13-20, “I also say to you that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church; and the gates of Hades will not overpower it. I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; and whatever you bind on earth shall have been bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall have been loosed in heaven” does indicate that the Christ, the Son of the Living God has delegated that authority.

Are there alternative ways to interpret Matthew 16:18-19?
You say, "We've established that ..." Who is "we"?
 

Lambano

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You say, "We've established that ..." Who is "we"?
Me and my alternate golf personality, Mr. Mulligan? LOL.

Seriously, so far MatthewG, Johann, and I agree that Matthew 9:6, Mark 2:10, and Luke 5:24 all state that Jesus established His authority on earth to forgive sins.

But so that you may know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins,” He said to the man who was paralyzed, “I say to you, get up, and pick up your stretcher, and go home.”

I didn't realize the point was still under dispute.
 
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