Can we know the day and hour of Jesus' return?

[CrowCross]

Can we know the day and hour of Jesus' return?

The bible says...Matt 24:36
“But concerning that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son, but the Father only.

I guess that settles it. Right? For many it does.

BUT

We know the tribulation will be for 7 years...or...2,520 days using a 360 day lunar cycle year or 2,555 days using our 365 day calendar.

We also know the tribulation starts when the anti-Christ incorporates the "peace contract"....So why can't we add 2,520 days or 2,555 days from the moment the peace contract is signed? At that point it's pretty much a 50/50 guess as we don't know what number to use.
But, the bible says the peace contract will be broken after 3 1/2 years. That is 1,277 days or 1,260 days after the contract is signed.
Once the antiChrist declares himself to be God on day 1,277 or day 1,260.....all we have to do is add either 1,277 or 1,260 days to which number turned out to be correct.....and show Matt 24:36 has some problems as the day can be predicted.

BUT. Matt 24:36 can't be predicted...

Knowing Jesus return is imminent....I would suggest of that date no one knows when Jesus will return. This would be the date of the pre-tribulation rapture.

One way we can know the return of Jesus...(the first return)...is pre-tribulation is the mention of what the world will look like when Jesus returns. We know this return isn't speaking about the end of the tribulation because after going through the 7 year tribulation the world will not be rainbows, puppy dogs, butterflies and daisies. People will not be eating and drinking, marrying and being given in marriage, buying and selling, planting and building.
Jesus says the world will look like the days of Noah and Lot when He returns. Those day fit the pre-tribulation description rather than an end of the tribulation world view and economy.

It's amazing just how many people fight against the theology of the pre-tribulation rapture of the church.

One thing about the pre-tribulation rapture is the signs say it's soon....sooner than you think.

 

[The Light]

We know the tribulation will be for 7 years...or...2,520 days using a 360 day lunar cycle year or 2,555 days using our 365 day calendar.

I believe in a rapture before the tribulation, but I am wondering why you would think that the tribulation is 7 years long. And what scripture tells us the Church is raptured before the 7 years?

 

[WPM]

I believe in a rapture before the tribulation, but I am wondering why you would think that the tribulation is 7 years long. And what scripture tells us the Church is raptured before the 7 years?

None, just like there is zero Scripture that teaches any tribulation period after the rapture. It is a man-made lie.

 

[CrowCross]

I believe in a rapture before the tribulation, but I am wondering why you would think that the tribulation is 7 years long. And what scripture tells us the Church is raptured before the 7 years?

You can start with daniel 9 and the message from the angel.
Jesus was cut off at the 69th week with one more to go. You can start with these charts.

There are several verses that tell us Christians are not destined for wrath...there is also the days of Noah as well as no white horse at the ascension of Jesus.
There is also the many mansions verse.....there are several others. You won't find a verse that says out right there is a pre-trib rapture. just as you won't find a verse that says out right there is a post trib rapture.

I know that was short and sweet...

 

[CrowCross]

None, just like there is zero Scripture that teaches any tribulation period after the rapture. It is a man-made lie.

There is ZERO scripture that says there is a post trib rapture.

 

[ScottA]

Can we know the day and hour of Jesus' return?

The bible says...Matt 24:36
“But concerning that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son, but the Father only.

I guess that settles it. Right? For many it does.

BUT

We know the tribulation will be for 7 years...or...2,520 days using a 360 day lunar cycle year or 2,555 days using our 365 day calendar.

We also know the tribulation starts when the anti-Christ incorporates the "peace contract"....So why can't we add 2,520 days or 2,555 days from the moment the peace contract is signed? At that point it's pretty much a 50/50 guess as we don't know what number to use.
But, the bible says the peace contract will be broken after 3 1/2 years. That is 1,277 days or 1,260 days after the contract is signed.
Once the antiChrist declares himself to be God on day 1,277 or day 1,260.....all we have to do is add either 1,277 or 1,260 days to which number turned out to be correct.....and show Matt 24:36 has some problems as the day can be predicted.

BUT. Matt 24:36 can't be predicted...

Knowing Jesus return is imminent....I would suggest of that date no one knows when Jesus will return. This would be the date of the pre-tribulation rapture.

One way we can know the return of Jesus...(the first return)...is pre-tribulation is the mention of what the world will look like when Jesus returns. We know this return isn't speaking about the end of the tribulation because after going through the 7 year tribulation the world will not be rainbows, puppy dogs, butterflies and daisies. People will not be eating and drinking, marrying and being given in marriage, buying and selling, planting and building.
Jesus says the world will look like the days of Noah and Lot when He returns. Those day fit the pre-tribulation description rather than an end of the tribulation world view and economy.

It's amazing just how many people fight against the theology of the pre-tribulation rapture of the church.

One thing about the pre-tribulation rapture is the signs say it's soon....sooner than you think.

The first part is correct--but after the "BUT" most of that is merely the man-made doctrine handed down from the "false teachers" spoken by Peter, who by leaning on their own understanding were snared by the language confused by God to hide the truth from them. Unfortunately, as Paul wrote, "strong delusion" was to follow among many who believed their "lie", which is still the most commonly believed doctrine even today.

Jesus had somewhat against 5 out of the 7 church He named in Revelation, Peter foretold of "false teachers" and their "destructive heresies", and Paul wrote of "strong delusion" as a result, and John said the anti-Christ spirit was "already at work" even then. Sadly, against all that is written, most believe the church is more or less on track...even if they do disagree with each other.

 

[CrowCross]

The first part is correct--but after the "BUT" most of that is merely the man-made doctrine handed down from the "false teachers" spoken by Peter, who by leaning on their own understanding were snared by the language confused by God to hide the truth from them. Unfortunately, as Paul wrote, "strong delusion" was to follow among many who believed their "lie", which is still the most commonly believed doctrine even today.

If you know the details...which we don't right now then the math is simple.
In fact some such as the Essenes knew when Jesus would come and die based upon the Daniel 9 math.

I'm not sure what all this strong delusions and lies you spoke of above are all about.

Jesus had somewhat against 5 out of the 7 church He named in Revelation, Peter foretold of "false teachers" and their "destructive heresies", and Paul wrote of "strong delusion" as a result, and John said the anti-Christ spirit was "already at work" even then. Sadly, against all that is written, most believe the church is more or less on track...even if they do disagree with each other.

 

[ScottA]

I'm not sure what all this strong delusions and lies you spoke of above are all about.

You and most of Christendom.

The "lie" and cause of "strong delusion" perpetrated by the "false teachers" of the early church, spoken of by Peter...was and still is the timing and the manner by which Jesus would return. He said, "soon" and "quickly" , saying "Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and dine with him, and he with Me" as, beginning during the time of that "generation." But they themselves not seeing, although He said, it would "not come by observation", they believed not what He had said, but began to imagine how it might all come about in the future, developing there doctrine of "destructive heresies" still taught and believed unto this present day, among whom are many "savage wolves" also foretold by Peter.

 

[CrowCross]

You and most of Christendom.

The "lie" and cause of "strong delusion" perpetrated by the "false teachers" of the early church, spoken of by Peter...was and still is the timing and the manner by which Jesus would return. He said, "soon" and "quickly" , saying "Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and dine with him, and he with Me" as, beginning during the time of that "generation." But they themselves not seeing, although He said, it would "not come by observation", they believed not what He had said, but began to imagine how it might all come about in the future, developing there doctrine of "destructive heresies" still taught and believed unto this present day, among whom are many "savage wolves" also foretold by Peter.

I'm not going to accept your preterist views...yes, there is false prophets and delusions...but they don't speak of "THE" delusion that is still future.

 

[ScottA]

I'm not going to accept your preterist views...yes, there is false prophets and delusions...but they don't speak of "THE" delusion that is still future.

You have not even accepted the correct definition of Preterism. So it doesn't surprise me that you would also not accept the truth.

As for "still future"--that is the "lie." Now you know and are accountable.

 

[CrowCross]

You have not even accepted the correct definition of Preterism. So it doesn't surprise me that you would also not accept the truth.

As for "still future"--that is the "lie." Now you know and are accountable.

Tell me Scott....when did Rev 8 happen? The answer...it didn't.
Yes, like you I am accountable for the truth. I have presented the truth.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Can we know the day and hour of Jesus' return?

The bible says...Matt 24:36
“But concerning that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son, but the Father only.

I guess that settles it. Right? For many it does.

BUT

We know the tribulation will be for 7 years...or...2,520 days using a 360 day lunar cycle year or 2,555 days using our 365 day calendar.

We also know the tribulation starts when the anti-Christ incorporates the "peace contract"....So why can't we add 2,520 days or 2,555 days from the moment the peace contract is signed? At that point it's pretty much a 50/50 guess as we don't know what number to use.
But, the bible says the peace contract will be broken after 3 1/2 years. That is 1,277 days or 1,260 days after the contract is signed.
Once the antiChrist declares himself to be God on day 1,277 or day 1,260.....all we have to do is add either 1,277 or 1,260 days to which number turned out to be correct.....and show Matt 24:36 has some problems as the day can be predicted.

BUT. Matt 24:36 can't be predicted...

Knowing Jesus return is imminent....I would suggest of that date no one knows when Jesus will return. This would be the date of the pre-tribulation rapture.

One way we can know the return of Jesus...(the first return)...is pre-tribulation is the mention of what the world will look like when Jesus returns. We know this return isn't speaking about the end of the tribulation because after going through the 7 year tribulation the world will not be rainbows, puppy dogs, butterflies and daisies. People will not be eating and drinking, marrying and being given in marriage, buying and selling, planting and building.
Jesus says the world will look like the days of Noah and Lot when He returns. Those day fit the pre-tribulation description rather than an end of the tribulation world view and economy.

It's amazing just how many people fight against the theology of the pre-tribulation rapture of the church.

One thing about the pre-tribulation rapture is the signs say it's soon....sooner than you think.

LOL. Pure comedy. Jesus clearly said that no one knows the day or hour of the future coming of the Son of Man. And He clearly said that will occur "immediately after the tribulation of those days" (Matthew 24:29-31, Mark 13:24-27). There's a good reason why no one believed in this pre-trib rapture nonsense for the first 1,800+ years of the New Testament church. It's not remotely taught in scripture anywhere. The belief in a pre-trib rapture is a complete joke that no one with discernment can take seriously at all.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

There is ZERO scripture that says there is a post trib rapture.

LOL!

Matthew 24:29 “Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 30 Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31 And He will send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will gather together His [a]elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Mark 13:24 “But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; 25 the stars of heaven will fall, and the powers in the heavens will be shaken. 26 Then they will see the Son of Man coming in the clouds with great power and glory. 27 And then He will send His angels, and gather together His elect from the four winds, from the farthest part of earth to the farthest part of heaven.

 

[ScottA]

Tell me Scott....when did Rev 8 happen? The answer...it didn't.
Yes, like you I am accountable for the truth. I have presented the truth.

No, you have not presented the truth. But I leave you to your folly.

 

[The Light]

You can start with daniel 9 and the message from the angel.
Jesus was cut off at the 69th week with one more to go. You can start with these charts.

I looked at several of the 70 weeks charts and the ones I looked at were wrong.

From to decree to rebuild Jerusalem to Messiah the prince is 69 weeks.

After 69 weeks Messiah is cut off. Most charts don't take into account that Jesus ministered for 3.5 years. So there only remains 3.5 years of the 70 weeks. One chart I looked at had this correct; however, they incorrectly viewed the prince that shall come to confirm a 7 year covenant as Jesus.

Conclusion: There are only 3.5 years remaining in the 70th week of Daniel.

This agrees with Daniel 12
Daniel12
6 And one said to the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, How long shall it be to the end of these wonders?

7 And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished.

There are several verses that tell us Christians are not destined for wrath...

There is a problem with this line of thought as the wrath of God is not the same thing as the great tribulation. The wrath of God is the 7th seal 7 trumpets and 7 vials while the great tribulation is over at the 6th seal.

The Church is not destined for the great tribulation and as such will be raptured before the abomination of desolation is set up in the middle of the week................not before the 7 years begins.

The great tribulation is the time of Jacobs trouble as it is for the Jews. However, they are not appointed to wrath either.

there is also the days of Noah

Noah is a picture of the rapture of the Church. Noah is not sealed in the ark by God 7 days before the flood. Noah loads his family and all the animals on the selfsame day which is the first day of the 7. We don't know what day the ark door is shut, but I suspect it was before 3.5 days

You won't find a verse that says out right there is a pre-trib rapture.

Revelation 3
10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

Revelation 2
22 Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds.

The Church will not be cast into the great tribulation. But the great tribulation begins in the middle of the week.

The point being that the Church will still be on the earth at the time the 7 year covenant is made, but will likely not be on the earth when the antichrist confirms it.

So the Church will not be raptured before the final 7 years begins and there is no 7 year tribulation.

just as you won't find a verse that says out right there is a post trib rapture.

Actually, there is a verse that shows there is a post trib rapture. The problem is that the great tribulation is over at the 6th seal. People that think they are post tribbers think there is a rapture before the 7th seal which is the wrath of God. In other words they think the 6th seal is the 7 trumpet which of course does not agree with the Word of God.