CATHOLIC BASHING THREAD TITLES

[BreadOfLife]

Then...you get an F in math...and you can still take it up with Jesus.

No Scott - YOU got got caught in an error of BIBLICAL proportions - and now you're backpedaling.

I pointed out to you that the 7 Churches of Revelation were NOT the only Churches in existence at that time.
Remember - even though the Church was in multiple locations - it was still the SAME Church.
The SAME is true for the Catholic Church today in many different Dioceses and Parishes - LOTS of places - SAME Church.

By contrast, what we have in Protestantism are tens of thousands of disjointed and perpetually-splintering sects, ALL teaching different doctrines - yet ALL claiming to be "The Church."

 

[ScottA]

No Scott - YOU got got caught in an error of BIBLICAL proportions - and now you're backpedaling.

I pointed out to you that the 7 Churches of Revelation were NOT the only Churches in existence at that time.
Remember - even though the Church was in multiple locations - it was still the SAME Church.
The SAME is true for the Catholic Church today in many different Dioceses and Parishes - LOTS of places - SAME Church.

By contrast, what we have in Protestantism are tens of thousands of disjointed and perpetually-splintering sects, ALL teaching different doctrines - yet ALL claiming to be "The Church."

That is not the point, and why you fail at this stuff so miserably.

The point is that Jesus' pick of churches was what was relevant - not what you pick. He was making a point - your point doesn't count. His point was, that 5 out of the 7 He chose to make his point (the majority) were not doing favorably...and that was just in the first century, let alone what has gone on since.

More importantly, His point showed just who was in authority - and it wasn't the church...as you so often claim - it was Him, and still is.

But, the point also is...that these are not my criticisms, they are His.

 

[brakelite]

Or we ALL 'get out of the way' and let God be God and watch Him 'do His thing'!!
Never in my life have I yet ( in the Spirit) seen any man change his mind by the bombardment of fleshly arguments.

We are commissioned to share the gospel. In Revelation it is called the everlasting gospel, (Revelation 14:6-12) to be preached to every kindred, tongue, and nation. If you read what that gospel comprises, you will discover that it includes 3 distinct messages, followed up a little later by a fourth, in Revelation 18:4.
Those messages all are part of the gospel. It is a declaration of the arrival of judgement, a call to worship the true Creator, a declaration of the fall (apostasy) of the church and the reasons for that fall, a warning against false worship, and a call for God's people to come out of that apostate system. These are not 'fleshly' arguments. Exposing the deceptions, the sins, the errors, and abominations that make up the 'wine' of Babylon's cup is part and parcel of the gospel. On the outside that golden cup looks full of promise and reward. But inside is nothing but death and corruption, by which all nations shall be made drunk. This isn't a secular power holding that cup. This isn't a future man who gallops in on his black charger laying waste to Christianity. This is an apostate Christian counterfeit that shall in very short time rule the world. It is comprised not just Catholicism, but also her daughters. In fact a proper exegesis of Revelation 13 reveals that it will be an apostate American Protestant union of church and state that will be the catalyst for the global tyranny, and the enforcer behind the mar of the beast. So this isn't just about Catholicism. This is about false religion of every stripe and hue that will amalgamate into one vast ecumenical despotic power...if Christians who understand these matters are not called to warn the world of these utterly essential matters, then who is? These are not matters of pride or ego; they are not matters of one-upmanship; these are life and death issues affecting every persons destiny on these forums. Sorry, but letting God do His thing means making ourselves available to Him to preach the truth through us as He sees fit. That people will be offended is par for the course. That people will judge the messenger is inevitable. That the messenger will be attacked as being a liar, a deceiver, an apostate himself, even possessed of the devil, is entirely expected. But the message of Revelation 14:6-12 is still the truth.
That message reveals just two sides. Those who sign on to Babylon's lies and deceptions, and a small remnant who keep all God commandments and have the faith and testimony of Jesus, which is the spirit of prophecy. (Revelation 12:17;14:6;19:10). The goats and the sheep.

 

[Philip James]

If you could only get the identity of Babylon right, you might make some headway...

See Jer 50 and 51 for some help

Peace!

 

[brakelite]

ANTI-CATHOLICS.

Again, I do not believe this is valid as a reason people post on these forums...I do not believe anyone here is anti-Catholic. I think that is a beat up on the part of Catholics to shut down dissent...by making it personal it makes these debates appear to be unworthy of support.

These are the people who make up falsehoods to bolster their position. They either invent myths, lies and fairy tales about what Catholics supposedly teach - or they simply regurgitate age-old lies, myths and fairy tales. They refuse to recant those lies - even when they are PROVEN wrong. This is the mindset of the anti-Catholic - and there are MANY on this forum. THIS is what Kepha is describing and NOT the person who simply disagrees.

No-one here is making up lies. Your unbelief does not constitute evidence of anyone lying. Your so called proofs may refute the many straw men you erect, but fail to provide concrete evidence of your church's true stand on certain subjects. Take for example the frequent denials of idolatry It isn't "Catholic-bashing" to expose the adulation offered to statues and those they represent. What was formerly a statue of Jupiter is now dedicated to Peter. The toes are worn off with centuries of repeated kissing. When the commandment clearly and succinctly states that no-one should make any image of anything in heaven or earth or under the earth in order to bow down to them, and we see thousands of people doing that very thing before a statue originally dedicated to a false pagan god, that my Catholic friend is not regurgitating any age-old lies, myths, and fairy tales.
Myths legends and fairy tales are more in keeping with the Vatican's age old attempts to prop up a façade of respectability...for example the nonsense stories that surround Patrick of Ireland...the 'donation' of Constantine...the many frauds that have been perpetuated to support the homage to Mary...the efficacy of scapulas and medallions and penances and self flagellation etc etc. These things are not anti-Catholic...they are anti-Catholicism and are but reasonable and sensible challenges to a system enshrouded in superstition and ritualism.

 

[BreadOfLife]

That is not the point, and why you fail at this stuff so miserably.

The point is that Jesus' pick of churches was what was relevant - not what you pick. He was making a point - your point doesn't count. His point was, that 5 out of the 7 He chose to make his point (the majority) were not doing favorably...and that was just in the first century, let alone what has gone on sense.

More importantly, His point showed just who was in authority - and it wasn't the church...as you so often claim - it was Him, and still is.

But, the point also is...that these are not my criticisms, they are His.

Again, I do not believe this is valid as a reason people post on these forums...I do not believe anyone here is anti-Catholic. I think that is a beat up on the part of Catholics to shut down dissent...by making it personal it makes these debates appear to be unworthy of support.
No-one here is making up lies. Your unbelief does not constitute evidence of anyone lying. Your so called proofs may refute the many straw men you erect, but fail to provide concrete evidence of your church's true stand on certain subjects. Take for example the frequent denials of idolatry It isn't "Catholic-bashing" to expose the adulation offered to statues and those they represent. What was formerly a statue of Jupiter is now dedicated to Peter. The toes are worn off with centuries of repeated kissing. When the commandment clearly and succinctly states that no-one should make any image of anything in heaven or earth or under the earth in order to bow down to them, and we see thousands of people doing that very thing before a statue originally dedicated to a false pagan god, that my Catholic friend is not regurgitating any age-old lies, myths, and fairy tales.
Myths legends and fairy tales are more in keeping with the Vatican's age old attempts to prop up a façade of respectability...for example the nonsense stories that surround Patrick of Ireland...the 'donation' of Constantine...the many frauds that have been perpetuated to support the homage to Mary...the efficacy of scapulas and medallions and penances and self flagellation etc etc. These things are not anti-Catholic...they are anti-Catholicism and are but reasonable and sensible challenges to a system enshrouded in superstition and ritualism.View attachment 2713

Ummmmmm, first of all - the 2nd Commandment was never about creating images or statues. It was about the WORSHIP of them as gods. The Hebrews had just come out of Egypt where this was common practice.

We KNOW that it was never about the creation of images and statues because later, God COMMANDS Moses to fashion Two Golden Cherubim to place on top of the Ark. He again commands Moses to create a Bronze Serpent and place it on a pole so that when the Israelites gazed upon it - they would be HEALED.
Finally - in Solomon's Temple - he festooned it with large statues of angels - and God was PLEASED with the Temple.

The Jews never "Worshiped" these images as god as neither does the Catholic Church worship statues, by dishonest friend.
These myths, lies and fairy tales have been invented by people like YOU who lie about the Church because they HAVE to in order to make their point.

The only "frauds" being perpetuated are the ones YOU invent or regurgitate . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

That is not the point, and why you fail at this stuff so miserably.

The point is that Jesus' pick of churches was what was relevant - not what you pick. He was making a point - your point doesn't count. His point was, that 5 out of the 7 He chose to make his point (the majority) were not doing favorably...and that was just in the first century, let alone what has gone on sense.

More importantly, His point showed just who was in authority - and it wasn't the church...as you so often claim - it was Him, and still is.

But, the point also is...that these are not my criticisms, they are His.

No - the point here is that you LIED - and you got caught.
That's GOTTA be humiliating . . .

You ARE correct about your comment in RED, however.
Tens of thousands of perpetually-splintering Protestant sects that ALL teach different doctrines is bound to look unfavorable to God . . .

 

[brakelite]

It was about the WORSHIP of them as gods.

I agree. Let me ask, how does something become a 'god'? How does something, anything, be it animate or inanimate, become an idol? Is it not by placing said object in a place of reverence above the true God? Above I see a statue formerly dedicated to a false god festooned with papal regalia...much attention, prayers, devotion, expense, and effort is being paid to this object...is it not in the minds of all participating that doing so will bring reward and favour? Is it not true that more attention is being paid to this as a religious icon than the God who created all peoples? While the serpent on the pole was never intended by God that it should be worshiped, it did become an idol and had to be destroyed by Hezekiah. While in the beginning perhaps statues were seen as easy conduits to spirituality for newly converted pagans, that time has long past and their usefulness in that context no longer applicable. They have become idols in their own right.
Anything can become an idol. If it is more important than God, it is an idol. Even your favourite sport can be an idol. Remove the statues from Catholicism and what do you have remaining BoL?

 

[ScottA]

He was somewhat against 5 out of 7 of the churches.

He voted. You lost.

Here is what I was quoting from: Revelation 2-3:22

No - the point here is that you LIED - and you got caught.
That's GOTTA be humiliating . . .

...So...now you are calling me AND Jesus a liar.

Like I said: Way to go. Good Job. You tell Him!

 

[BreadOfLife]

Here is what I was quoting from: Revelation 2-3:22
...So...now you are calling me AND Jesus a liar.
Like I said: Way to go. Good Job. You tell Him!

Not only did I NOT call Jesus a "liar" - I didn't call YOU one, either.
I said that you LIED because you did- and you got caught. The Church was in MANY more places than just those seven.

Add this latest post of your to your list of lies . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

I agree. Let me ask, how does something become a 'god'? How does something, anything, be it animate or inanimate, become an idol? Is it not by placing said object in a place of reverence above the true God? Above I see a statue formerly dedicated to a false god festooned with papal regalia...much attention, prayers, devotion, expense, and effort is being paid to this object...is it not in the minds of all participating that doing so will bring reward and favour? Is it not true that more attention is being paid to this as a religious icon than the God who created all peoples? While the serpent on the pole was never intended by God that it should be worshiped, it did become an idol and had to be destroyed by Hezekiah. While in the beginning perhaps statues were seen as easy conduits to spirituality for newly converted pagans, that time has long past and their usefulness in that context no longer applicable. They have become idols in their own right.
Anything can become an idol. If it is more important than God, it is an idol. Even your favourite sport can be an idol. Remove the statues from Catholicism and what do you have remaining BoL?

You have the Church established by Jesus Christ about 2000 years ago.
You forget that people bowed and prostrated themselves face-doewn in the dirt before the Ark - which was a BOX made of wood and gold. Was this "idolatry" - or was it respect for WHO it represented??

In your desperation as an anti-Catholic - you've attempted to show idolatry, paganism, etc by making ridiculous claims like the ones above. As if the Church has spent "more attention" has been paid to this statue of Peter than to God Himself. That is nothing but hyperbole for the SAKE oif hyperbole. We Christians refer to that as that "Lying".

This is the crux of ALL of your anti-Catholic posts which have become increasing boring as they are desperate . . .

 

[ScottA]

Not only did I NOT call Jesus a "liar" - I didn't call YOU one, either.
I said that you LIED because you did- and you got caught. The Church was in MANY more places than just those seven.

Add this latest post of your to your list of lies . . .

I quoted Jesus. You call it "lies." Nuff said.

 

[brakelite]

You have the Church established by Jesus Christ about 2000 years ago.
You forget that people bowed and prostrated themselves face-doewn in the dirt before the Ark - which was a BOX made of wood and gold. Was this "idolatry" - or was it respect for WHO it represented??

I would have thought a 2000 year old church would have better information on what the ark represented. The Ark did not, nor has it ever, represented a person (Mary), or God. It represented God's throne in heaven. When the sanctuary was built and the furniture placed, it was then, during the time of Moses, a representation of heavenly things. See Hebrews 8:5. Israel were not bowing before the Ark of the Covenant. They were bowing before the presence of God that rested above the mercy seat.
My case still stands. Kissing the foot of a black statue of Jupiter is still idolatry. NO matter how many times it is 'baptised' and regardless of what it pretends to portray. Even if Peter himself was sitting on that seat and his feet being kissed, that would also constitute idolatry.

 

[epostle1]

Which are the seven Churches? They are Ephesus, Smyrna, Pergamus,Thyatira, Sardis, Philadelphia, and Laodicea. (Understand “Church”here as the local Church like a diocese.) Why just Asia Minor? Because that is where Saint John had evangelized prior to Saint Paul. At Smyrna, for example, the Beloved Apostle ordained his disciple Polycarp as the bishop.
The Seven Churches of the Apocalypse

 

[Hidden In Him]

The pervasiveness of anti-Catholicism on the Internet reflects how deeply entrenched, obsessive and normative this prejudice is within contemporary culture. If the Internet is our most contemporary means of communication and information gathering, then anti-Catholicism is entering the new Millenium in a powerful fashion.
Anti-Catholicism on the Internet

Kepha, you should know as well as anyone that you're obsessed with this. No matter what Forum, it's the only thing you ever talk about.

The problem with being completely consumed by an "everybody hates us" mentality is that it becomes impossible for anyone to talk you out of it. You label everyone as haters, and there's nothing anyone can say and nothing anyone can do to "prove" otherwise.

It leaves no room for the Spirit of peace, and not because of them but you. Are there Catholic bashers out there? Certainly. But when you assume everyone who isn't Catholic is automatically a Catholic basher by default, all you do is alienate people from what you believe in. It's not the wisest approach. Instead of drawing people into greater sympathy for your cause, that approach repels them from it.

 

[BreadOfLife]

I quoted Jesus. You call it "lies." Nuff said.

Jesus NEVER said that 65% of ALL of the churches were headed in the wrong direction - YOU did.
Don't put words in the Lord's mouth . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

I would have thought a 2000 year old church would have better information on what the ark represented. The Ark did not, nor has it ever, represented a person (Mary), or God. It represented God's throne in heaven. When the sanctuary was built and the furniture placed, it was then, during the time of Moses, a representation of heavenly things. See Hebrews 8:5. Israel were not bowing before the Ark of the Covenant. They were bowing before the presence of God that rested above the mercy seat.
My case still stands. Kissing the foot of a black statue of Jupiter is still idolatry. NO matter how many times it is 'baptised' and regardless of what it pretends to portray. Even if Peter himself was sitting on that seat and his feet being kissed, that would also constitute idolatry.

WRONG.
The Ark represented the power and Authority of Almighty God.

Within the Ark, there was the Tablets of the Commandments (Authority), Aaron's Rod (Power) and a jar of manna (Bread of Life). ALL of these types were fulfilled by Jesus, who is the NEW Covenant. Mary is the Ark of the NEW Covenant (Rev. 11:19, 12:1-5).

As for the Mercy Seat - God is OMNIPRESENT. He didn't exist solely on or in the Ark.

Finally - as to kissing an object in respect of WHO it represents - NOTHING wrong with this, unless you are worshiping it.
Tell you objections to the soldier who kisses his girlfriend's photograph while he is away at war. Tell that to a woman kneeling in front of her dead husband's casket and kissing it.

Is this an example of the "idolatry" you're talking about? Give it a rest, already . . .

 

[ScottA]

Jesus NEVER said that 65% of ALL of the churches were headed in the wrong direction - YOU did.
Don't put words in the Lord's mouth . . .

He said the words. I did the math.

You did your own math like you know better than He (or I), and you came up with the wrong answer. Go figure.

 

[BreadOfLife]

He said the words. I did the math.
You did your own math like you know better than He (or I), and you came up with the wrong answer. Go figure.

He spoke to the Church in SEVEN locations in Turkey.
NO mention of the Church in ALL of the other cities and countries in the world.

YOU took it upon yourself to apply you flawed math to this small portion of the Church.
But - that is the tragedy of Protestantism - everybody making claims for himself based on his own understanding . . .

 

[ScottA]

He spoke to the Church in SEVEN locations in Turkey.
NO mention of the Church in ALL of the other cities and countries in the world.

YOU took it upon yourself to apply you flawed math to this small portion of the Church.
But - that is the tragedy of Protestantism - everybody making claims for himself based on his own understanding . . .

There you go with your Protestant hate again.

But for you to suggest that Jesus is incapable of coming up with His own choice as a sampling and report of the early churches, as if the other unnamed churches were perfect, and that it is wrong to consider His assessment accurate for all churches...is shameful. That is why I facetiously told you "You tell 'em!" so that you could face your shame with the rightful party, whom is Christ.