Catholics; Do You Believe This?

[Taken]

This is unBiblical fiction.

I've shown you MANY time that the bible warns converted, born again Christians with an "Epignosis" of Christ - that they can fall away and LOSE their secure position - YOUR denials, notwithstanding

Nothing new.
I agree with scripture.
Nothing new.
You repeatedly reveal you misinterpret and misapply Scripture.
Nothing new.
I do not agree with your understanding.

Hebrews 10:26-27
“If we sin deliberately AFTER receiving KNOWLEDGE of the truth...

Nothing new.
Receiving Knowledge does NOT determine Conversion.
Nothing new.
Conversion IS determined VIA Confession of Belief!

2 Peter 2:20-22

For if they, having escaped the defilements of the world through the KNOWLEDGE of our Lord and savior Jesus Christ, again become entangled and overcome by them, their last condition is worse than their first.
For it would have been better for them not to have KNOWN the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment handed down to them.
Here, Peter illustrates that those who had a full, experiential knowledge (EPIGNOSIS) of Christ – CHRISTIANS – who can fall back into darkness and LOSE their salvation by their own doing.

Nothing new.
Another irrelevant Scripture with your commentary falsely implying Knowledge equals Conversion.

1 Cor. 9:27
"I pummel my body and subdue it, lest after preaching to others I myself should be disqualified."
Paul is saying that he wrestles with his own fleshly desires so that he might not fall back into sin.

Nothing new.
Paul is expressly speaking about behaviors between himself A MAN, and other MEN. Behaviors between men are about PRECEPTS, not qualifiers for commission of sin or abstinence from sin.

2 Peter 3:17

Therefore, dear friends, since you already know this, be on your guard so that you may not be carried away by the error of lawless men and FALL FROM YOUR SECURE POSITION.
Peter is warning the faithful not to fall back into sin and lawlessness - or they will LOSE their "SECURE PSITION".

Nothing new.
A Secure position is expressly “IN” Christ.
Nothing new.
2 Pet 3:17 is about men NOT “IN” Christ, but rather men who rely on their power to believe and hope they can endure by their OWN STEDFASTNESS, rather than becoming Converted IN Christ, and His POWER keep them SECURE!

Nothing new.
2 Pet 3:
[17] Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.

Nothing new.
2 Pet 3:17 another WARNING to believers who refuse to Commit...Are at risk of FALLING TO THE WICKED of the world.

Open eyes.
Many “Believers” are scrambling to be first in line to get “A MANS salvation JAB!”

Nothing new.
Still do not agree with your misguidance, misinterpretation, misapplication.

Nothing new.
What you do does not affect me.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Nothing new.
I agree with scripture.
Nothing new.
You repeatedly reveal you misinterpret and misapply Scripture.
Nothing new.
I do not agree with your understanding.

Nothing new.
Receiving Knowledge does NOT determine Conversion.
Nothing new.
Conversion IS determined VIA Confession of Belief!

Nothing new.
Another irrelevant Scripture with your commentary falsely implying Knowledge equals Conversion.

Nothing new.
Paul is expressly speaking about behaviors between himself A MAN, and other MEN. Behaviors between men are about PRECEPTS, not qualifiers for commission of sin or abstinence from sin.

Nothing new.
A Secure position is expressly “IN” Christ.
Nothing new.
2 Pet 3:17 is about men NOT “IN” Christ, but rather men who rely on their power to believe and hope they can endure by their OWN STEDFASTNESS, rather than becoming Converted IN Christ, and His POWER keep them SECURE!

Nothing new.
2 Pet 3:
[17] Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.

Nothing new.
2 Pet 3:17 another WARNING to believers who refuse to Commit...Are at risk of FALLING TO THE WICKED of the world.

Open eyes.
Many “Believers” are scrambling to be first in line to get “A MANS salvation JAB!”

Nothing new.
Still do not agree with your misguidance, misinterpretation, misapplication.

Nothing new.
What you do does not affect me.

And YOUR constant deniuals of Scripture don't makt it "untrue".
Nothing new . . .

The Greek word used in 2 Pet. 3:17 is στεριγμοσ (stay-rig-mos') - which means a "firm condition".
This is the security that Peter is talking about and that ONLY a born again person in Christ can have. Peter warns that they can LOSE it by ther OWN doing.

Your refusal to accept the ramifications of "Epignosis" as opposed to just "Gnosis" is no longer just a matter of your ignorance - because I have explained BOTH definitions to you. As I have proven to you MANY times - Gnosis is an intellectual knowledge.
EPOGNOSIS, on the other hand connotes a full, experiential and relational nowledge. This is NOT about the intellect byt about the relationship.

Hiding your head in the sand doesn't make this all just "go away".
Greater minds than YOURS in the field of Biblical language - especially Greek - have THIS to say about "Epignosis . . .

PROTESTANT SCHOLARSHIP ON THE WORD, "EPIGNOSIS":

Richard Chenevix Trench
“In comparing epignosis with gnosis, the “epi” must be regarded as an intensive use of a preposition that gives the compound word a greater strength than the simple word alone possesses” (Synonyms of the New Testament, page 300).

Quoting Culverwell, he writes, “Epignosis and gnosis differ. Epignosis is the complete comprehension after the first knowledge (gnosin) of a matter. It is bringing me better acquainted with a thing I knew before; a more exact viewing of an object that I saw before afar off. That little portion of knowledge which we had here shall be much improved, our eye shall be raised to see the things more strongly and clearly” (Synonyms of the New Testament, page 300).

He goes on to say on the same page, “All Paul’s uses of epignosis justify and bear out this distinction. This same intensive use of epignosis is confirmed by similar passages in the New Testament and in the Septuagint. It also was recognized by the Greek fathers. Thus Chrysostom stated: ‘You knew (egnote), but it is necessary to know thoroughly (epignonai).”

J.B. Lightfoot
“The compound epignosis is an advance upon gnosis, denoting a larger and more thorough knowledge...Hence also epignosis is used especially of the knowledge of God and of Christ, as being the perfection of knowledge” (St. Paul’s Epistles to the Colossians and Philemon, page 138).

Vine's Expository Dictionary of Biblical Words
“epignosis, akin to A, No. 3, denotes "exact or full knowledge, discernment, recognition,"

The New Thayer’s Greek-English Lexicon (page 237):
1. Precise and correct knowledge
2. Knowledge of things ethical and divine
3. Of God, especially knowledge of His holy will and of the blessings which He has bestowed and constantly bestows on men through Christ
4. Of Christ, i.e., the true knowledge of Christ’s nature, dignity, benefits
5. Of God and Christ, i.e., to keep the knowledge of the one true God which has illumined the soul

Exegetical Dictionary of the New Testament, volume 2, page 25:
1. Knowledge as recognition of the will of God that is effective in the conduct of the one who knows God
2. Christian faith

 

[Taken]

And YOUR constant deniuals of Scripture ...

Nothing new.

Nope....just another LIE...not once have I denied Scripture...

 

[BreadOfLife]

Nothing new.

Nope....just another LIE...not once have I denied Scripture...

That’s a LIE.

I just gave you some of the most respected names in Protestant theology who ALL AGREE that “Epignosis” can ONLY pertain to a born again person.
You have offered ZERO refutation of this and have only given your usual denials.

SO – if you have a valid argument against the scholarly opinions and definitions of “Epignosis” that I presented in post #182 – then let’s HAVE it.
Otherwise – you need to publicly admit that you are WRONG again . . .

 

[Taken]

That’s a LIE.

I just gave you some of the most respected names in Protestant theology who ALL AGREE that “Epignosis” can ONLY pertain to a born again person.
You have offered ZERO refutation of this and have only given your usual denials.

SO – if you have a valid argument against the scholarly opinions and definitions of “Epignosis” that I presented in post #182 – then let’s HAVE.
Otherwise – you need to publicly admit that you are WRONG again . . .

You said I deny scripture. Post # 182

My refutation. I said that is a lie. Post # 183

You lied. Ignored the rest of your post. Don’t owe you anything. Period.

 

[BreadOfLife]

You said I deny scripture. Post # 182

My refutation. I said that is a lie. Post # 183

You lied. Ignored the rest of your post. Don’t owe you anything. Period.

That’s not a refutation – it’s just another pathetic, impotent DENIAL.

I asked for a refutation of the BIBLICAL term, “Epignosis”.
Your refusal to offer a refutation of the overwhelming evidence I presented against you is a mammoth FAIL.

You’ve LOST this argument . . .

 

[Illuminator]

Personally and scripturally, I perceive and believe that no Born again Christian can "fall away" from their faith in Christ. Jude 1:24,

That's because you accept John Calvin's invention of OSAS, yet most Protestants deny Calvinism.

However, those professing christians that do fall away, they never belonged to Christ in the first place, because they remained in the situation of being "half baked".

But you have no way of knowing who is half baked and who isn't. Catholics have more assurance of salvation that those who espouse “once saved, always saved.” This is because the only distinction between a true Christian and a half baked Christian is that the half baked Christian will not persevere to the end – but this is something a Christian cannot know during his life, and this necessarily imposes uncertainty upon him until the end. For Catholics, we know that salvation is ours to lose. For “once saved, always saved” Protestants, they don’t even know whether it is theirs to begin with.

SALVATION - Scripture Catholic

 

[Illuminator]

Eph. 1:5 – Paul teaches that God “predestined” us in love to be His sons through Jesus Christ. “Predestination” means that God knows what we will do before we do it (it does not mean that God determines what we do; otherwise, we would have no freewill). Predestination is taken from the Greek word “prooridzo” which means to know or declare in advance by God’s foreknowledge. See, for example, 1 Peter 1:2 where Peter writes about the “elect according to the foreknowledge of God.” The terms “predestination” and “the elect” always refer to God’s knowledge (not human knowledge) because God is outside of time (and humans cannot predict the future). There are two types of “predestination,” to grace and to glory. In this verse, Paul is teaching about predestination to grace, which means becoming a Christian.

1 Pet. 1:1-2 – Paul teaches about being destined by God for obedience to Christ. This is another example of predestination to grace. But there is also predestination to glory.

Rom. 8:29-30 – Paul also writes that we are predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son. Now Paul is writing about predestination to glory, which means not only becoming a faithful Christian during our lives, but persevering to the end by conforming our will to Christ’s will.

1 Cor. 15:49 – Paul writes that we are conformed in His image at the resurrection, when we shall bear the image of the man of heaven. These are the people who were predestined to glory.

Rev. 3:5 – Jesus warns that He can blot out the names that are in the book of life. This refers to those currently, not ultimately, justified (those who are predestined to grace, but not to glory).

Eph. 1:5; 1 Peter 1:2; Rom. 8:29-30; 1 Cor. 15:49 – therefore, predestination is either to grace (which we could lose) or to glory (which we cannot lose). As alluded to above, some non-Catholics confuse the definition of “predestination” (which means God knows what we will do before we do it) and “predetermination” (the erroneous belief that God determines what we will do). But God does not author evil. We choose evil by our own freewill.

Ezek. 18:23-24, 32 – God takes no pleasure in the death of the wicked. Our death is our freewill, failing to respond to His grace. God does not predetermine certain people to hell. God also does not predetermine certain “elect” people to heaven. We all, as God’s children, have been given the grace we need to be saved, but we can decide to reject God’s grace.

2 Peter 3:9 – God is forbearing toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance. God wills all to be saved, but our salvation depends on our willingness to repent and receive God’s grace.

Matt. 18:14 – Jesus says it is not the will of the Father that any of the children should perish. But He did not make us robots and respects the freewill He has given us. If we did not have this freewill, we would not be able to love, and if we would not be able to love, we would not have been created in God’s image and likeness.

 

[Taken]

That’s not a refutation – it’s just another pathetic, impotent DENIAL.

I asked for a refutation of the BIBLICAL term, “Epignosis”.
Your refusal to offer a refutation of the overwhelming evidence I presented against you is a mammoth FAIL.

You’ve LOST this argument . . .

LOL....there was no argument.
You lied, I refuted your lie. You asked about epignosis. You gave some men’s opinion on epignosis. I did not address your rant. I ignored everything after you Lied.
It’s a lesson for you.
When you begin a post with a lie, no one is obligated to read or answer anything after you lie.

Now you are ranting on about an argument over epignosis, that never took place. LOL

Your reputation proceeded you. You lied. I refuted your lie. Period.

 

[BreadOfLife]

LOL....there was no argument.
You lied, I refuted your lie. You asked about epignosis. You gave some men’s opinion on epignosis. I did not address your rant. I ignored everything after you Lied.
It’s a lesson for you.
When you begin a post with a lie, no one is obligated to read or answer anything after you lie.

Now you are ranting on about an argument over epignosis, that never took place. LOL

Your reputation proceeded you. You lied. I refuted your lie. Period.

You’re absolutely right – there was NO argument.

There was a list of Biblical fats from ME, followed by litany scholarly evidence – and a big fat fail from YOU in the form of yet another denial.
A “refutation” by definition is a presentation of evidence to the contrary. A denial is NOT a refutation, Einstein.

You denied everything and refuted nothing . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

You lied, I refuted your lie. You asked about epignosis. You gave some men’s opinion on epignosis. I did not address your rant. I ignored everything after you Lied.

Now you are ranting on about an argument over epignosis, that never took place. LOL
Your reputation proceeded you. You lied. I refuted your lie. Period.

CALLING someone a "Liar" is NOT a refutation - it's an accusation.
PROVING that someone is a liar is a refutation, Einstein . . .

 

[Taken]

That's because you accept John Calvin's invention of OSAS, yet most Protestants deny Calvinism.

Why lie to what @Earburner said?
Earburner spoke for himself, and gave a verifying Scripture.
Jude 1:
[24] Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,

But you have no way of knowing who is half baked and who isn't. Catholics...

You began you post with a Lie.
@BreadOfLife begins his post with Lies.

Not hard to figure the commonality....both begin posts calling others liars...both Catholic.

Catholics have more assurance of salvation that those who espouse “once saved, always saved.”

LOL

This is because the only distinction between a true Christian and a half baked Christian is that the half baked Christian will not persevere to the end –

A “true Christian and a half baked Christian”....is that Catechism Doctrine?
Because Jesus’ Doctrine speaks of Believers and the Converted.

but this is something a Christian cannot know during his life,

WHAAAAT?
A man DOES NOT KNOW that he Heartfully Confessed True Belief that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the Living God?

and this necessarily imposes uncertainty upon him until the end.

No.

For Catholics, we know that salvation is ours to lose.

Agree. BOL testified He became born of the spirit, at his baby water baptism. That he neither repented or confessed belief.
And right, he did not confess he was saved, which I agree, he was not saved....Nor born or the spirit.

* Salvation of every soul of every Believer’s Christian’s, Catholic’s, Protestant’s Jew’s ....IS theirs to lose, IF THAT ^^^ is all they claim to be!
God Giving His Gift of Salvation has nothing to do with a mans TITLE!

For “once saved, always saved” Protestants, they don’t even know whether it is theirs to begin with.

Ofcourse they do. DID you MISS Jesus’ Offering....to the WHOLE WORLD? Here’s a refresher...

John 6:
[51] I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.

Apparently Catholics are NOT TAUGHT to individually hear, individually learn, individually read, individually verify, individually experience receiving blessing from God for hearing.....and enjoy their blessing enough, for themselves, to call on the Lord God and Heartfully Confess their Belief.

Pretending water Baptism is anything other than a ceremony for joining a particular man-made church is a mischaracterization.

Pretending all children at a certain age are magically prepared to make a life long confession of Belief, is ludicrous.

Think about it. Grown men whose history was steeped hearing about God, spent 3 Years, DAILY, all day, 1,092 days, learning more about God and learning about Jesus....BEFORE they were Prepared to even HEAR, OR Testify “with their word” of ACCEPTING...Jesus IS the Christ, the Son of the Living God.

Compare THAT ^ to a person, particularly a little child, going to a church, say once a week to hear a 1 hour sermon....would need to hear every day from birth to 21 years of age to accomplish 1,092 days of hearing, learning, being prepared to make a life long commitment.

Babies, testifying by their word, and belief...pfff.
Little children prepared to make a life long commitment because they reached a certain age....pfff.

Gods Gift of Salvation was bought and paid for By, through, of Christ the Lord Jesus. It is every mans to Accept or Not.

Scripture teaches TWO express highlights...
Repent for having HAD disbelief....Accept Jesus’ BLOOD for YOUR Forgiveness....Confess your heartful belief... give you body dead crucified with Jesus....and BE Prepared for the Works the Lord God shall DO with..IN you....Because IT IS ONCE and FOREVER!
That expressly applies to OSAS...
That expressly applies to a man IN Christ.
That expressly applies to Gods Spirit (Christ) IN THAT man.

Or
Hear, Believe, and hope you keep believing to the day you physically die, SO then your soul will be Saved!
* Keep sinning Against God, believing, doubting, wondering, believing, vacillating....and not to overlook behaviors among people....attacking others, lying, killing others, cheating, raping children....
Keep repenting over and over....

Not rocket science, to figure out WHO teaches WHAT and WHY, and WHO does WHAT and WHY.

Becoming Converted IS a huge lifelong Commitment.
That even Scripture teaches to BE SURE, before you make such a Confession.

2 Pet 1:
[10] Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:

Ya think a 5,6,7 yr old is giving due diligence to make their life long calling on the Lord and election sure?
Or are little girls looking forward to a fancy dress, new shoes, and ceremony?

 

[Reggie Belafonte]

Catholics, do you believe this from the Catholic Catechism?

No salvation outside the Catholic Church?

Any words in red is not part of the Catholic catechism I am quoting.

"824 United with Christ, the Church is sanctified by him; through him and with him she becomes sanctifying. "All the activities of the Church are directed, as toward their end, to the sanctification of men in Christ and the glorification of God."292 It is in the Church that "the fullness of the means of salvation"293 has been deposited. It is in her that "by the grace of God we acquire holiness."294"

830 The word "catholic" means "universal," in the sense of "according to the totality" or "in keeping with the whole." the Church is catholic in a double sense: First, the Church is catholic because Christ is present in her. "Where there is Christ Jesus, there is the Catholic Church."307 In her subsists the fullness of Christ's body united with its head; this implies that she receives from him "the fullness of the means of salvation"308 which he has willed: correct and complete confession of faith, full sacramental life, and ordained ministry in apostolic succession. the Church was, in this fundamental sense, catholic on the day of Pentecost309 and will always be so until the day of the Parousia.

"Outside the Church there is no salvation"

846 How are we to understand this affirmation, often repeated by the Church Fathers?335 Re-formulated positively, it means that all salvation comes from Christ the Head through the Church which is his Body:

Basing itself on Scripture and Tradition, the Council teaches that the Church, a pilgrim now on earth, is necessary for salvation: the one Christ is the mediator and the way of salvation; he is present to us in his body which is the Church. He himself explicitly asserted the necessity of faith and Baptism, and thereby affirmed at the same time the necessity of the Church which men enter through Baptism as through a door. Hence they could not be saved who, knowing that the Catholic Church was founded as necessary by God through Christ, would refuse either to enter it or to remain in it.336

The irony is how the following quote from the Catholic Catechism has those who do not know about the gospel of Jesus Christ & His Church through no fault of their own are saved.

47 This affirmation is not aimed at those who, through no fault of their own, do not know Christ and his Church:

Those who, through no fault of their own, do not know the Gospel of Christ or his Church, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart, and, moved by grace, try in their actions to do his will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience - those too may achieve eternal salvation.337

And yet

837 "Fully incorporated into the society of the Church are those who, possessing the Spirit of Christ, accept all the means of salvation given to the Church together with her entire organization, and who - by the bonds constituted by the profession of faith, the sacraments, ecclesiastical government, and communion - are joined in the visible structure of the Church of Christ, who rules her through the Supreme Pontiff and the bishops. Even though incorporated into the Church, one who does not however persevere in charity is not saved. He remains indeed in the bosom of the Church, but 'in body' not 'in heart.'"321

Does any Catholic wished they had never heard of the gospel of Jesus Christ & His Church?

The Catholic Church is the only Church in fact.
The C of E and others claim to be the Catholic Church in fact.


Outside of the Church there is no salvation, is a fact ! because one who is of Christ Jesus is the Body of Christ Jesus in fact.

As to the Roman Catholic Church their is divisions, just as it is in any Body of people in any denomination and some within are evil people, we see this in the History of the RCC and all the rest. We see such within the Jews History as well clearly being undermined from within time after time.

Looking back on the Jewish History we see Jesus making claims of who and why it is so, but the Christian Churches do not hold such up as to why and openly point out the problem in the last 30 years or so. It's all there for all to see as to why such is so in the Bible and who it is that is undermining the Church clearly ! but they the Churches are not allowed to bring such up anymore, because they who you are not allowed to mention rule over you.

As to the RCC that Pope Frances is clearly the most anti-Christ full on of this world ! He is claimed by the MSM as the Peoples Pope ! see how the MSM Whore love this Pope ! They call him the Peoples Pope ! haha how pathetic ! The Peoples Pope ? The MSM Pope more like it in fact.

Pope Frances is a curse, he is a religious dupe ? he is not worthy of Christ Jesus at all, as He try's his best not to even mention the name Jesus Christ, so as not to offend his Satanic Islamic and so called Jew religious mates.

Remember how the MSM were on the war path with Pope JP2 for years attacking him full on 24/7 ! just like they were on the war path against D J Trump, playing games full on slandering him in anyway they could play out, with a bag of tricks just like the bastards who came at Jesus Christ back in the days. They are the same people that Jesus warned us about !

To find out who rules over you all, just look to fined out who you can not question.

Outside of the Church is no Salvation ! Pope Frances is clearly outside of the body of Christ in fact. Such people as him are of this world, just religious dupes to the deceptions and delusions of this world !

 

[ChristisGod]

You already know my answer my friend . My answer is salavation is found in Christ alone . AND IN FACT
i say With much urgency and great love , FOR ALL TO FLEE the CC .

Yes free from any man. church, religious organization that claims unless you are a member of them you cannot be saved. That by default makes them a cult. Jesus alone is the way, the truth and the life, no religious denomination can make that claim. That is not to say we should not be connected to a good bible believing church.

 

[amigo de christo]

Yes free from any man. church, religious organization that claims unless you are a member of them you cannot be saved. That by default makes them a cult. Jesus alone is the way, the truth and the life, no religious denomination can make that claim. That is not to say we should not be connected to a good bible believing church.

You should see what is increasing faster than ever my friend . I have a sister in the UK
that is surrouned by people of a church who attacked her for simply bringing scripture that reminds us that homosexuality is sin .
They even attacked the biblical version of charity . The mindset is , GOD ACCEPTS ALL no matter what they do or believe .
This is getting out of control . WE must make our last and final stand now and contend for the truth .
This false unity and false love stuff these churches preached have literally saved none and worse its turned the churches
AGAINST the very truth that could have saved them and the people who bring that truth .

 

[amigo de christo]

Why lie to what @Earburner said?
Earburner spoke for himself, and gave a verifying Scripture.
Jude 1:
[24] Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,



You began you post with a Lie.
@BreadOfLife begins his post with Lies.

Not hard to figure the commonality....both begin posts calling others liars...both Catholic.



LOL



A “true Christian and a half baked Christian”....is that Catechism Doctrine?
Because Jesus’ Doctrine speaks of Believers and the Converted.



WHAAAAT?
A man DOES NOT KNOW that he Heartfully Confessed True Belief that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the Living God?



No.



Agree. BOL testified He became born of the spirit, at his baby water baptism. That he neither repented or confessed belief.
And right, he did not confess he was saved, which I agree, he was not saved....Nor born or the spirit.

* Salvation of every soul of every Believer’s Christian’s, Catholic’s, Protestant’s Jew’s ....IS theirs to lose, IF THAT ^^^ is all they claim to be!
God Giving His Gift of Salvation has nothing to do with a mans TITLE!



Ofcourse they do. DID you MISS Jesus’ Offering....to the WHOLE WORLD? Here’s a refresher...

John 6:
[51] I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.

Apparently Catholics are NOT TAUGHT to individually hear, individually learn, individually read, individually verify, individually experience receiving blessing from God for hearing.....and enjoy their blessing enough, for themselves, to call on the Lord God and Heartfully Confess their Belief.

Pretending water Baptism is anything other than a ceremony for joining a particular man-made church is a mischaracterization.

Pretending all children at a certain age are magically prepared to make a life long confession of Belief, is ludicrous.

Think about it. Grown men whose history was steeped hearing about God, spent 3 Years, DAILY, all day, 1,092 days, learning more about God and learning about Jesus....BEFORE they were Prepared to even HEAR, OR Testify “with their word” of ACCEPTING...Jesus IS the Christ, the Son of the Living God.

Compare THAT ^ to a person, particularly a little child, going to a church, say once a week to hear a 1 hour sermon....would need to hear every day from birth to 21 years of age to accomplish 1,092 days of hearing, learning, being prepared to make a life long commitment.

Babies, testifying by their word, and belief...pfff.
Little children prepared to make a life long commitment because they reached a certain age....pfff.

Gods Gift of Salvation was bought and paid for By, through, of Christ the Lord Jesus. It is every mans to Accept or Not.

Scripture teaches TWO express highlights...
Repent for having HAD disbelief....Accept Jesus’ BLOOD for YOUR Forgiveness....Confess your heartful belief... give you body dead crucified with Jesus....and BE Prepared for the Works the Lord God shall DO with..IN you....Because IT IS ONCE and FOREVER!
That expressly applies to OSAS...
That expressly applies to a man IN Christ.
That expressly applies to Gods Spirit (Christ) IN THAT man.

Or
Hear, Believe, and hope you keep believing to the day you physically die, SO then your soul will be Saved!
* Keep sinning Against God, believing, doubting, wondering, believing, vacillating....and not to overlook behaviors among people....attacking others, lying, killing others, cheating, raping children....
Keep repenting over and over....

Not rocket science, to figure out WHO teaches WHAT and WHY, and WHO does WHAT and WHY.

Becoming Converted IS a huge lifelong Commitment.
That even Scripture teaches to BE SURE, before you make such a Confession.

2 Pet 1:
[10] Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:

Ya think a 5,6,7 yr old is giving due diligence to make their life long calling on the Lord and election sure?
Or are little girls looking forward to a fancy dress, new shoes, and ceremony?

Its real simple really . MAKE your calling and election sure , YA BETTER MAKE SURE ITS THE BIBLICAL JESUS YOU TRUSTING IN
cause any other jesus and any other gosple CANT SAVE . PEROID . FOLKS OPEN BIBLES . LEARN that JESUS
and make sure what men are teaching you AGREES to what JESUS TUAGHT and the apostels .

 

[ChristisGod]

You should see what is increasing faster than ever my friend . I have a sister in the UK
that is surrouned by people of a church who attacked her for simply bringing scripture that reminds us that homosexuality is sin .
They even attacked the biblical version of charity . The mindset is , GOD ACCEPTS ALL no matter what they do or believe .
This is getting out of control . WE must make our last and final stand now and contend for the truth .
This false unity and false love stuff these churches preached have literally saved none and worse its turned the churches
AGAINST the very truth that could have saved them and the people who bring that truth .

Yikes flee

 

[Taken]

Its real simple really . MAKE your calling and election sure , YA BETTER MAKE SURE ITS THE BIBLICAL JESUS YOU TRUSTING IN
cause any other jesus and any other gosple CANT SAVE . PEROID . FOLKS OPEN BIBLES . LEARN that JESUS
and make sure what men are teaching you AGREES to what JESUS TUAGHT and the apostels .

You can give them the knowledge But still they will deny His Power IN them is real.

 

[amigo de christo]

Let all that draws breath praise the glorious Lord . And stay glued in those bibles .

 

[BreadOfLife]

You began you post with a Lie.@BreadOfLife begins his post with Lies.
Not hard to figure the commonality....both begin posts calling others liars...both Catholic.
LOL

Accusiong people of "Lies" without producing ANY evidence to the contrary is not only stupid - it's nothing more than an unsubstantiatted accusation.

You haven't "Refuted" a SINGLE thing regarding the Greek word, "Epignosis" that can ONLY sapply to a born-again person..

Agree. BOL testified He became born of the spirit, at his baby water baptism. That he neither repented or confessed belief.

James 5 ALSO speaks of salvation without repentance - in the Anointing of the Sick:
James 5:13-15
Is anyone among you in trouble? Let them pray. Is anyone happy? Let them sing songs of praise. Is anyone among you sick? Let them call the epresbyters lders of the church to pray over them and anoint them with oil in the name of the Lord. And the prayer offered in faith will make the sick person well; the Lord will raise them up. If they have sinned, they will be forgiven.

The pathetic little god YOU'VE invented for youerself may be unmerciful - but the God of Scripture is INFINITELY merciful . . .