Catholics

[Marymog]

Jesus never knelt before images.

My dear Job,

Jesus never gave us a list of books that are in our bible but we still have a bible. So how do you KNOW which books belong in the bible that you read?

Curious Mary

 

[BreadOfLife]

Okay...this is the big problem:

1. Jesus asked all his disciples about who people said He was.
2. Peter had the correct answer.
3. And our Father in heaven was accredited for how the answer came to Peter.

• The subject was: “Who do men say that I, the Son of Man, am?” (Christ).
• The compound (secondary) subject was how Christ would build His church.
• The means by which His church would be built was stated to be specifically NOT by "flesh and blood" (eliminating Peter and all men), but as "revealed" by "My Father in heaven."
• Which leaves Peter...simply "blessed."

WRONG.
Jesus was talking about the revelation of who He was when He said it was not by flesh and blood.
He wasn't talking about the means of building His Church - until He told Peter that He was building it on HIM.

Not in light of the true subject, compound subject, and means (above).

Uhhh, no - in light of t ALL, He gave Peter the Keys to the Kingdom - and Peter ALONE.

If that were true...the first Pope should have been John the baptist:
Matthew 11:11
“Assuredly, I say to you, among those born of women there has not risen one greater than John the Baptist; but he who is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.

This is an ignorant and self-defeating claim.
R*E*A*D the verse you just posted:

Matt. 11:11
“Assuredly, I say to you, among those born of women there has not risen one greater than John the Baptist; but he who is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.

HOW would this make John the Baptist the first Pope??
He who serves everybody and makes himself the least - their SERVANT is greater than John the Baptist.

 

[BreadOfLife]

You are not paying attention - it is quoted above.

Jesus singled out Peter and gave him the title of "Kepha".
Jesus never singled Peter out and called him "Apostle" as YOU claim.

 

[ScottA]

WRONG - and I proved this in my last post (#701).

And I just proved you wrong in post #737.

 

[ScottA]

Hi ScottA,

You dared God to answer you? How do you KNOW that it wasn't the antichrist answering you? When God is speaking to you directly how do you KNOW it is the spirit of Truth or God answering you? How can you be SURE it is not the spirit of falsehood? (1John 4)?

Sounds like you are a prophet who has been given a special gift by God since God has revealed to YOU what is error and what isn't error in denominational teachings. Do you consider yourself a prophet? Prophet defined: a person regarded as an inspired teacher or proclaimer of the will of God

Catholics, Methodist, Lutheran's etc. believe that Christ lives in them also. Their beliefs are different than yours. How do you KNOW that your belief is The Truth and their belief is in error? Are you suggesting that God is not revealing the truth to them, only you?

In a different post you said, “I am no respecter of persons” when you were asked about respecting martyrs (who are persons). The Apostles were persons AND martyrs. Do you not respect the Apostles or the Apostolic Fathers?

I agree with you that HE is not wrong. We are not talking about Him, we are talking about YOU. You have admitted that you are not perfect. Since you are not perfect could you be wrong when you tell BreadOfLife or ME or the Methodist or the Lutherans that their teachings are in ERROR? Or are you always right when you tell us we are in error?

Curious Mary

I know because I called Him by name, and because He confirmed everything.

I consider myself in His service.

God is in charge of who he uses for his own purpose, and who remains in slumber and confusion, until the times of the gentiles are fulfilled.

If I were a respecter of person, I would respect the martyrs and apostles...but I am not. I do love them, however. Which is a good point: I love Peter and Catholics too, and not so much my enemies, but I do try.

I was wrong to the core. But, no, if we are talking about me, we shouldn't be. It is no longer i who live, but Christ who lives in me. If that were not true...then you should believe no one, not your leaders, not the Pope, no one. But we live with the promise that God is working all things together for good for those who love Him.

 

[aspen]

BreadofLife never says anything contrary to the Church, and is exercising his right to express his faith within his level of competence, which we all do.
There is nothing in the catechism forbidding anyone to attend any church. If you are Catholic, you would be well advised to be well grounded in the faith so as to not be caught up in errors. If you are Catholic, you cannot partake in their communion.

Hi Kepha,

I am well grounded in the Catholic faith and doctrine. I am an active oblate of Mt Angel Monastery in my parish, as well. Quakers do not practice baptism or communion. I only receive the Eucharist.

 

[Job]

ou posted a picture of the Pope kneeling in prayer. Jesus knelt in prayer.

Not to images.

 

[Job]

Jesus never gave us a list of books that are in our bible but we still have a bible. So how do you KNOW which books belong in the bible that you read?

Regardless of the book you read, you won't find any examples of Jesus kneeling to images.

 

[ScottA]

WRONG.
Jesus was talking about the revelation of who He was when He said it was not by flesh and blood.
He wasn't talking about the means of building His Church - until He told Peter that He was building it on HIM.

I have broken the matter down for you in simple English sentence structure. I did not add or take away, nor did I change the subject or topic(s) - but you have.

It is not good that we should go on quarreling. I will try to address you other points briefly - but otherwise, I turn you over to God.

 

[ScottA]

Jesus singled out Peter and gave him the title of "Kepha".
Jesus never singled Peter out and called him "Apostle" as YOU claim.

No, "My Father in heaven" singled out Peter - but not to build Christ's church, but rather to reveal the means by which Christ would build His church.

As for Christ calling the apostles, His apostles...I quoted you the scripture - and still you do not believe.

Take it up with God.

 

[BreadOfLife]

And I just proved you wrong in post #737.

Uhhhh, no, you didn't.
Besides - I destroyed that notion in post #742.

 

[aspen]

As I've stated many times now - if you don't want to be humiliated - then don't tell lies.
Job, bbyrd, Sword and mrhlth are gluttons for humiliation because they don't seem to have any self-control when it comes to lying..

This has nothing to do with "ego" - and everything to do with truth.

Just try being honest and we'll have a nice, charitable conversation.
Keep spewing lies - and I'll expose you for them . . .

Yet, no human can create truth - all we can do is interpret truth and comment on it. Even citing scripture without commentary is reproducing a commentary on truth.

All commentary involves interpretation. All interpretation involves ego.

 

[BreadOfLife]

I have broken the matter down for you in simple English sentence structure. I did not add or take away, nor did I change the subject or topic(s) - but you have.

It is not good that we should go on quarreling. I will try to address you other points briefly - but otherwise, I turn you over to God.

Translation: "You have backed me into a corner and I can't explain my way out of this."

 

[ScottA]

FOR THE RECORD:

I love the Catholics, and I especially love Peter. But I love God more - and I take Him at His word, which I have clearly quoted and explained in simple English.

This is not that difficult. The apostles struggled with wanting to be appointed with great honor, and as a man, I would place them above all others. But in answering them, Christ as much as turned the tables on them, and insisted that they be "like children", and "servants", certainly not royalty in robes.

So, was it wrong for the Catholics to revere Peter above a "servant" and "child" put into service to "feed His sheep?" Yes, of course! They assumed that Peter was the most important thing that Jesus was talking about, and for doing so, have been blinded to the greater truth ever since. And now the children of their folly have children, as it has been for many generations. But if anyone wants to go back and get the words as they were spoken, they can, and should. Because, as much as Peter was "blessed" in that exchange of scripture - he was not the focus.

 

[BreadOfLife]

No, "My Father in heaven" singled out Peter - but not to build Christ's church, but rather to reveal the means by which Christ would build His church.

As for Christ calling the apostles, His apostles...I quoted you the scripture - and still you do not believe.
Take it up with God.

No - the Father singled out Peter by revealing to him who Jesus was.

JESUS singled out Peter by giving him the title of "Kepha", by telling him that He would build His church upon him (Peter) - and by giving him the Keys to the Kingdom and by.

Get your facts straight . . .

 

[ScottA]

Translation: "You have backed me into a corner and I can't explain my way out of this."

I have spoken to you in spirit and in righteousness, and you dis' me, which is allowed among men, but not in the spirit. I caution you.

 

[Marymog]

I know because I called Him by name, and because He confirmed everything.

I consider myself in His service.

God is in charge of who he uses for his own purpose, and who remains in slumber and confusion, until the times of the gentiles are fulfilled.

If I were a respecter of person, I would respect the martyrs and apostles...but I am not. I do love them, however. Which is a good point: I love Peter and Catholics too, and not so much my enemies, but I do try.

I was wrong to the core. But, no, if we are talking about me, we shouldn't be. It is no longer i who live, but Christ who lives in me. If that were not true...then you should believe no one, not your leaders, not the Pope, no one. But we live with the promise that God is working all things together for good for those who love Him.

Did Christ live in the Apostles?

I also called Him by name and He confirmed everything with me also, however, what you believe/preach/teach is different then what I believe/preach/teach. Have I been deceived? Are you THE ONE that God is working in for good?

Why do you believe yourself but no one else? You SERIOUSLY don't respect the Apostles?

There are about 7-8 questions in my post that you didn't answer. Those questions are based on what you said. Can you answer those questions?

 

[Marymog]

Not to images.

Neither did the Pope

 

[aspen]

one of my favorite prayers in the Divine Chaplet

 

[Marymog]

Regardless of the book you read, you won't find any examples of Jesus kneeling to images.

As usual you did not answer my question.

If you were willing to engage in a conversation I believe you would come to realize how your statements are void of logic and can not be backed up by scripture.

However, you probably realize you have been painted into a corner and if you were to engage in a honest conversation all your fantasies and theories about scripture and Christianity would vaporate in front of your eyes. IMO you are not an honest person in your debates or discussions.

I wish you luck in your search for the Truth. My prayers are with you.

Love, Mary