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Cessastionism ,What is it?
- Thread starter Anthony D'Arienzo
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That happens a lot here. Hey, as long as God told them so it must be legit, who needs the support from scripture? (clearly being sarcastic)
YeshuaFan1
Active Member
There are no scriptures that state that God cannot use dreams and visions to confirm to Muslims that the Lord Jesus is God and that the message of the Cross is true! Would be confirming to them as he did to the Jews in Acts!
These scriptures teach the only way the gifts (miraculous) were passed from person to person was by the laying on of the apostles hands.
Ac 6:6 Whom they set before the apostles: and when they had prayed, they laid their hands on them. (Acts 6:6)
Ac 8:18 And when Simon saw that through laying on of the apostles' hands the Holy Ghost was given, he offered them money, 19 Saying, Give me also this power, that on whomsoever I lay hands, he may receive the Holy Ghost.
This being true, miracles ceased soon after the apostles died?
Miracles ceased around the end of the first century. (Zech 13:1-3) (Eph.4:11-15) (1Cor.13:8-10).
I will leave you with (1Cor.2:4).
1Co 2:4 And my speech and my preaching was not with enticing words of man's wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power:
Another way of defining (so called) Cessationism is to ask: Is the revealed Word of God sufficient?
Answer (2Tim. 3:14-17) (2Peter 1:3).
2Pe 1:3 According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness.
2Ti 3:14 But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them;
15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
YeshuaFan1
Active Member
Yes, I would agree that the signs and wonders Apostolic Gifts ceased when John died away, but that does not mean God Himself cannot choose to still do them in order to fulfill His plans and purposes!
Do we not still pray over and for the sick to have the lord heal them in whatever way he chooses, even if that includes to die?
Were Miracles to Continue?
Listen to Paul as he discusses this subject with the Corinthians: "Love never fails. But whether there are prophecies, they will fail; whether there are tongues, they will cease; whether there is knowledge, it will vanish away. For we know in part and we prophesy in part. But when that which is perfect [complete] has come, then that which is in part will be done away" (I Corinthians 13:8-10).
God's will was revealed by the Holy Spirit only a part of the time, "bit by bit." A full and complete revelation was not made known to the apostles at once. Miraculous powers such as prophecies, foreign languages and supernatural knowledge, were some of the means by which the gospel was revealed and confirmed. But when the gospel system was completely revealed, miracles had served there purpose and came to an end.
But it is observed that the "perfect" to which Paul refers does not mean the will of God, but the coming of Jesus Christ, who is the "Perfect One." But this is not the case. When Paul said "When the perfect—to teleion is come," he used the neuter gender. Jesus Christ is not neuter gender. He is masculine. In speaking of the will of God in Hebrews 10:9, 10, the inspired writer employs the neuter gender. "He taketh away the first that he may establish the second. By that will [to thelma] we have been sanctified …" The word for perfect means "brought to completion; fully accomplished, fully developed, complete, entire, as opposed to what is partial and limited" (I Corinthians 13:10, Analytical Greek Lexicon). So, when God's revelation to man was completed, "fully developed, entire," there was no further need for miracles. They had served their purpose and come to an end—were "done away." We now have the perfect law of liberty (James 1:25).
Read more here.
What Was the Purpose of Miracles?
YeshuaFan1
Active Member
Do you hold then that God cannot do any miracles or healings now period? I am not stating that Apostolic Gifts did not cease, but did God cease from doing any of that any more?
God is able to do miracles.
Why did the Lord do miracles?
Answer - To confirm the word of God (Heb. 2:3,4) (Mark 16:20).
Today we have the completed revelation of God and there is no need to confirm the word (2Peter 1:3) (2Tim. 3:14-17).
Once the word has been confirmed there is no reason to confirm it again.
Now we just open our bibles to test bible teachers and preachers (1Jn 4:1) (Acts 17:11).
What Was the Purpose of Miracles?
YeshuaFan1
Active Member
Could he not be just doing that right now among Muslims, as the Gospel has been extremely hard and slow to gets into Islamic lands until now?
Joh 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day. 45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me. 46 Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father. 47 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life. 48 I am that bread of life.
Joh 17:17 ¶ Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.
Eph 3:3 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,
4 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)
Abraham explained if people reject the truth even a miracle will not convince them. (Luke 16:19-31).
Truth draws men to God. (Jn 6:44,45) (Jn 14:26 ; 16:13) (Heb. 1:1-3 ; 2:1-4) (Acts 2:38,47 ; 8:5,12,13,26-40 ; 22:16)
Do not reject truth. (Jn 12:48)
Truth sanctifies and cleanses the soul of sin (Jn 17:17)
YeshuaFan1
Active Member
Why would God not be able to confirm to thr Muslims the true Jesus and Gospel message just as he did to the Jews in Acts?
YeshuaFan1
Active Member
So are all of the ex muslims claiming to have seen Jesus by dream or vision liars then?
They may have had a dream but God did not speak to them in a dream.
The lord uses "WORDS" to communicate His message to men.(Acts 2:40 ; 10:33 ; 11:14) (Jn 6:44,45) (Mt. 28:18-20)
The revelation was complete (perfect). (2Tim. 3:14-17) (Jas. 1:25) (2Peter1:3)
God has spoken through Jesus. (Heb. 1:1-3) (2:1-4)
God has said all he is going to say according to (2Peter 1:3).
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