Christianity, Judaism, Christianity

[Templar81]

The churches together group in my area includes 3 Anglcian chruches, 2 Methodist chruches, 1 Baptist Church, 1 Catholic and Charismatic group called fern fellowship. There is one group of strict and peculiar (sorry particular) Baptists that won't join in because they won't be part of a group that has Catholics in, there is also Mormons who won't join in either.
We have quite a lot of services that are interdenominational as wella s study courses, lectures, social events and the Nativity play.

We do have Pentecostals in the UK but I've never met one and as for Lutherans, they are very rare and presbitarians tend to mostly live in Scotland. There used to be an Orthodox congregation near us but they moved further afield. I think if I was ever to leave the Church of england I would seeriosuly consider going Orthodox. I went to a Divine Liturgy once, the Priest was English and an ex-Anglican but all the congregation were Eastern European. It was two hours long and you have to stand the whole time and they cross themselves the other way round, the choir was the most angelic I've ever heard and the service was done in a mixture of English and Greek. There were no hymnals or even servicebooks, everyone had to know the prayers off by heart and the Priest would point at people in the congregation and they would say the creed out loud on thewir own and ten they did the same iwth the Lord's prayer. He didn't pick me out as I couldn't have said the Nicene creed without a service book then. Ican now though in English and Latin.

Sorry, I digressed. It has been predicted that churches will have to come together, it has happened already. I know of a group of Methodists that closed their church and joined an Anglican congregation and worship with them wiht a team of clergy consisting of both Anglican Priests and Deacons and Methodist ministers. That is the church I went to on rememberance day. A beatiful servie ruined by Muslim prayer. Where I live there used to be a lot more than 2 methodist churches, I think that in just less than a 4 mile radius there were about 8 Methodist chruches Methodism was very big in this part of Yorkshire and with falling attendance was hit the hardest of any denomination. As a result they have had to merge where they can. I also know of n Anglican church that took on a Bpatist congregation.

 

[aspen]

Well. it sounds great to me - I am glad to hear it,

 

[JarBreaker]

Sorry to be so cynical - it is a beautiful idea.

Yeah but didnt the pope (whichever one, waaaay back when) have it first ?

As for Christian unity, that is one thing that is possible in Britain. This is because the chruchgoing population is dwindlign to the point where we will before long ahve to unite togetheer in order for Christianity to still exist.

Templar, wasnt there just something yesterday to happen along these lines ? some "unity / defense of" thing ?

 

[JarBreaker]

The churches together group in my area includes 3 Anglcian chruches, 2 Methodist chruches, 1 Baptist Church, 1 Catholic and Charismatic group called fern fellowship. There is one group of strict and peculiar (sorry particular) Baptists that won't join in because they won't be part of a group that has Catholics in, there is also Mormons who won't join in either.

I used to be very VERY leery of any sort of interfaith meetings or conferences --- looking at them in light of what man might eventually do, make all their differences disappear and cook up one big weak pot of soup with no mention of sin or the messiah's suffering and atonement ....

But, now I am starting to see that I was looking at things from the fear of man, and what man might be able to do --- were there time.

I really thank you for this report Templar. For in Britain's case I feel it is really neccessary to forsake differences and band together to withhold what may soon disappear altogether --- we here in America are not as threatened by muslims and sharia, it may take your example to make us open our eyes.

And after all, we none of us have the full revealed undiluted truth to ourselves ... or any one denomination. To separate based on any dividing doctrine means you are calling yourself YHWH and claiming that brother from another denomination has no possible way of hearing from Him. And we do not have the ability to search the hearts and kidneys.

I first became aware of Him calling on Jesus's name 18 days after the fear of Yah came into me on 9/11. Seeing that 2nd plane fly from left to right on the TV screen as it happened in front of my eyes ... and the world's.

I then almost immediately stumbled upon some groups teaching the Hebrew names --- and other messianic or Hebrew roots lines of thought --- so my faith did not develop in any church or any denomination. As such, I felt the same need to further divide His body and separate myself from others who He did not reveal Himself to, the way He had to me.

Britain may be a beacon to the whole world of standing before this persecution and remaining steadfast that differences can be overcome and no matter what --- His words will never fail to be heard in all the earth.

 

[Templar81]

Just remember though that this is not interfaith it is interdenominational, I'm not saying all churches are going to join together at a certain time. Only that it is a process that is happenning with the mixed congregations I mentioned but there will be major changes unless new converts are made and go into any English church and you will see that the vast majority of worshippers will be over 60 a few will be over 80 and there might be a handful of people in the 40s and a couple of people in their 20s and a few children but never enough for a Sunday school. This is more the case of traditional churches like the Church of England or the Methodist/Weslyain churches. The Roman Catholic church has much better attendance and more young people as do Baptist churches, the Pentecostals and the more modern charismatic Evangelicals. For now we are jsut about keepiong our heads above water but in another generation I think the chruches are going to have to blend. It's not something I'm keen on it could certainly happen later in this century and I think it has already started. At one time, say before the 1960s people of different denominations didn't meet together a member of one church wouldn't even set foot in another chruch. I've heard of Cathlics who wouldn't attend their own daughter's wedding bcause it was in an Anglican church and a young woman who became Catholic was turfed out of her home by her Protestant parents. My own grandfather was excommunicated for marrying a nonCatholic and only reconciled after Vatican II. I have another relative who left the Catholic church to become an Anglican and the priest came round to her hosue to tell her she was going to Hell. So you can see that thee was very little tolerance, it was very much us and them.

 

[JarBreaker]

Thank you Templar, for the lesson in church history. I find I was not comfortable with learning what has passed but sometimes we must have an understanding of it to see where we may turn off wrong in the future.

"those who forget the mistakes of the past are condemned to repeat it"


or.


"a dog returns to his vomit and a pig to his splashing in the mud"

 

[Templar81]

It's a good thing that CHristians all have a lot more tolerance towards oneanother and concentrate on the fact that we all preach the same message no matter how some might dress it up. This tolerance has only come about because numbers are so low.

Mosque attendance figures on the other hand are a differnt story as Islam spreads like wildfire. The USA isn't under as big a threat as us but there is still some threat. The Mosque at ground zero is proof that something is going wrong. Obama seems too much to be a sympathiser to Muslims, I believe his father is still a practising Muslim, though he himslef is a Seventh Day Adventist. I often find myself thinking; would this happen under Raegan, Clinton or the Bush's, probably not.

I must say that I am genuinely mistified as to why anyone would convert to Islam post 911 but all accross America black celebrities and prisoners are converting to Islam and I just don't get it.

 

[John Zain]

I must say that I am genuinely mistified as to why anyone would convert to Islam post 911 but all accross America black celebrities and prisoners are converting to Islam and I just don't get it.

Have you read and forgotten, or read and not believed, that ...
Satan is the "god of this world", "the ruler of this world", etc.
and that ...
Satan is the greatest liar and deceiver ever in the history of the world
(and he is an enormous part of our history).

I tell Mulsims that they really don't know anything about
the one-and-only Living GOD, Satan, and man.

 

[Templar81]

Have you read and forgotten, or read and not believed, that ...
Satan is the "god of this world", "the ruler of this world", etc.
and that ...
Satan is the greatest liar and deceiver ever in the history of the world
(and he is an enormous part of our history).

I tell Mulsims that they really don't know anything about
the one-and-only Living GOD, Satan, and man.

Your a braver man than me if you'd say it to their faces because they are not a peaceful people.

Have you ever hear od the sataninc verses, a book by Salman Rushdie that talks about Mohammed being decieved by satan (Shaitan they call him, but same thing) into allowing people to still venerate idols whilst still being able to be Muslims? The Muslim world went berzerk back in the mid 80s about it and the book was banned, I'd like to read it but I's never get hold of a copy. TYhe Ayatolah (excuse s[pelling) put out a fatwa agaisnt him and they said that even if he repents and asks for forgiveness in front of the whole Islamic world the fatwa still stands and he can lawfully be killed by any Muslim.

Our government protected him for years because the Muslims would ahve torn him lib from limb if they ever got hold of him.

And do you know the funny part? All he did wrong was insinuate that Mohammed could be decieved by the evil. In Islam a person can discuss God all they want but they cannot debate anything about Mohammed and yet Mohammed wasn't like Jesus, he wasn't part of the Trinity and son of God, he was just a man and to them a Pophet. It seems silly though because if you ask a Muslim if he worships Mohammed he will say no. He will tell you he worships Allah but he can';t say the name Mohammed without saying, "may peace be yupon him." If Mohammed is so great then why should people need to say that unless they doubt that peace is in fact on him at all. I have a pretty shroud idea of where Mohammed might end up and it is n''t Heaven.