Christians have Freedom to Fail?

[robert derrick]

All sin past, present, future has been forgiven. God isn’t angry or mad at a person just because they sin. They have the choice to come to God and ask for help to overcome things that may do by and through their flesh; with help by the spirit.

Now that's a no condemnation god, that every New Age Divine could love.

Since your god does not condemn something, then why should man? Who are you to suggest that anyone should try to 'overcome' anything? Overcome what? When something is forgiven, it is forgotten and is not sin anymore, so you shouldn't even be speaking of something to be overcome, as though it was condemned sin or something.

Your gospel is that all the world are already forgiven, saved, uncondemned, and so have no need of repentance from sinning.

Therefore, who are you to suggest others ought be changing and doing anything different? Afterall, it can't get any better than being forgiven with no sin to be condemned by.

The gospel of your christ is simple: Everyone is now saved, and so don't repent, just believe it.

 

[PinSeeker]

All sin past, present, future has been forgiven. God isn’t angry or mad at a person just because they sin. They have the choice to come to God and ask for help to overcome things that may do by and through their flesh; with help by the spirit.

Hey, Matthew, you really should just walk away from Robert, as he is so obsessed with the completely wrong-headed idea that God does not condemn sin itself and somehow overlooks or even encourages sin. This is what he foists onto Christians ~ those in Christ ~ who understand, in stark contrast to that, that God does not condemn Christians anymore because of their sin. But that's exactly what Paul says, as I'm sure you know, in Romans 8:1, that "there is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus."

Some folks are just so intransigent that all you can do is give them up to their own ignorance.

I would disagree with you, if this is indeed what you're saying ~ that God never gets angry at people because of their sin. I mean, it's a righteous, holy anger, but yes, God hates sin, as Solomon says in Proverbs 6:16-19. But He is merciful and gracious, slow to anger and abounding in steadfast love and faithfulness, as we see in several places in Scripture, like Exodus 34, Numbers 14, Psalm 86, Psalm 103, and Psalm 145, to name a few. But even His righteous and holy anger is a grace, because He doesn't leave us in our sin, but in His kindness and by His Spirit leads us to repentance and back into Jesus's righteousness.

Grace and peace to you. And to Robert, too... :)

 

[MatthewG]

Now that's a no condemnation god, that every New Age Divine could love.

Since your god does not condemn something, then why should man? Who are you to suggest that anyone should try to 'overcome' anything? Overcome what? When something is forgiven, it is forgotten and is not sin anymore, so you shouldn't even be speaking of something to be overcome, as though it was condemned sin or something.

Your gospel is that all the world are already forgiven, saved, uncondemned, and so have no need of repentance from sinning.

Therefore, who are you to suggest others ought be changing and doing anything different? Afterall, it can't get any better than being forgiven with no sin to be condemned by.

The gospel of your christ is simple: Everyone is now saved, and so don't repent, just believe it.

People come to God once they realize that he is no longer angry at them. Some people come to God out of fear (not the awe) kind of fear, but out of fear with going to hell in a hand basket if they don’t believe.

I believe Jesus has conquered over all things, death, sin, the devil, and Sheol/hades/hell.

Most people don’t, they say you have to do this and do that to be saved when God is pleased with and by faith.

If a person is feeling guilty or hurt they should turn to God for his guidance and care by and through the Holy Spirit.

 

[MatthewG]

Hey, Matthew, you really should just walk away from Robert, as he is so obsessed with the completely wrong-headed idea that God does not condemn sin itself and somehow overlooks or even encourages sin. This is what he foists onto Christians ~ those in Christ ~ who understand, in stark contrast to that, that God does not condemn Christians anymore because of their sin. But that's exactly what Paul says, as I'm sure you know, in Romans 8:1, that "there is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus."

Some folks are just so intransigent that all you can do is give them up to their own ignorance.

I would disagree with you, if this is indeed what you're saying ~ that God never gets angry at people because of their sin. I mean, it's a righteous, holy anger, but yes, God hates sin, as Solomon says in Proverbs 6:16-19. But He is merciful and gracious, slow to anger and abounding in steadfast love and faithfulness, as we see in several places in Scripture, like Exodus 34, Numbers 14, Psalm 86, Psalm 103, and Psalm 145, to name a few. But even His righteous and holy anger is a grace, because He doesn't leave us in our sin, but in His kindness and by His Spirit leads us to repentance and back into Jesus's righteousness.

Grace and peace to you. And to Robert, too... :)

Cool, I believe God was pleased with the blood sacrifice of Christ. Sin was taken care of…

If God is mad and angry at you because you failed … by having sinned… what good does that do?

 

[PinSeeker]

Cool, I believe God was pleased with the blood sacrifice of Christ.

Absolutely.

Sin was taken care of…

Well, our redemption was accomplished, yes. But sin will not be absolutely "taken care of" until Jesus comes back. But... it's going to happen. :)

If God is mad and angry at you because you failed … by having sinned… what good does that do?

On a human level, Matthew, is a parent not angry ~ in a loving way, hopefully ~ when his or her child disobeys or misbehaves? Well, of course he/she is, and disciplines, hopefully in love. On a much higher level, of course ~ in a completely righteous and holy, and faithful and loving way ~ so it is with the Father.

Grace and peace to you.

 

[Behold]

those running the race for Christ, have the 'freedom to fail'.

Reader,

Anyone who has every confessed a sin has failed to run the race, perfectly.
But here is the thing.
The race is not our Salvation, its only our discipleship., and we are in the race because we are already become: "the righteousness of God in Christ".

Like this..

"as Jesus is, so are the born again, in this world"...

See, Our Salvation is Christ on the Cross and He didn't Fail.
In fact, before we started the race (discipleship) , we were re-created "in Christ", born again as God's very righteousness, having received the "gift of righteousness and the gift of Salvation".

So, on Discipleship DAY 1, = we are already righteousness......and then we begin the race (discipleship) finished already as a "new creation in Christ", "made Righteous, having BECOME..... born again as...>>"The righteousness of God, in Christ".

 

[MatthewG]

Absolutely.


Well, our redemption was accomplished, yes. But sin will not be absolutely "taken care of" until Jesus comes back. But... it's going to happen. :)


On a human level, Matthew, is a parent not angry ~ in a loving way, hopefully ~ when his or her child disobeys or misbehaves? Well, of course he/she is, and disciplines, hopefully in love. On a much higher level, of course ~ in a completely righteous and holy, and faithful and loving way ~ so it is with the Father.

Grace and peace to you.

I’m okay with chastising from God.

It’s just seems people really don’t believe sin was taken care of for the whole world already…

Since 2000 years ago. His blood wiped away sin, and that right there is a freeing notion. All of the sins people commit, Jesus done paid for them.

It’s up to the individuals if they will seek out Christ or not… it’s totally up to them. Sin has been take care of, even though our flesh naturally sins. It’s about going towards the new earth and new heaven living by the spiritual economy not the material aspects of if you don’t do this or if you don’t do that God doesn’t love you.

 

[Behold]

It’s just seems people really don’t believe sin was taken care of for the whole world already…
Since 2000 years ago. His blood wiped away sin, and that right there is a freeing notion. All of the sins people commit, Jesus done paid for them.
.

God "made Jesus to be sin"...."for us".......

How many sins did Jesus become???
= All. "the one time eternal sacrifice for SIN".... Plural....all.
See,..... if its not all then Salvation is useless, as if ALL our SIN is not dealt with then we are still sinners who have some sin, and sin separates us from God and we are back to Adam.
But we are not.
We the born again exist in 2nd Adam. "IN whom there is no sin".

The Good News ?
= Jesus became our sin, and our born again Spirit became HIS Righteousness.
The bible term for this understanding is..>"IN Christ"., as this is where the born again exist, having become "the righteousness of God in Christ"

Where is Jesus?
He is in Heaven, Seated at the right hand of God, and "Christ IN YOU the hope of Glory" (Glory is Heaven).
So, because Christ is down here in us, and up there, also........... = so are the born again who are "seated in heavenly places IN CHRIST".

Then you read..

"As Christ is, so are the born again in THIS world".


THE GIFT OF Salvation : is amazing, and its a bit mysterious, as we can't see it, but it has happened to us, the instant we gave God our faith in Christ.

 

[robert derrick]

People come to God once they realize that he is no longer angry at them. Some people come to God out of fear (not the awe) kind of fear, but out of fear with going to hell in a hand basket if they don’t believe.

As I said, this is the teaching of your christ and his fear, not that of the Lord Jesus Christ.

The fear of the Lord is not awe of silly children, but is the mature fear of righteous judgement and wrath for them that do evil:

Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God; Who will render to every man according to his deeds:

To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life: But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath,

Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile.

And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

I believe Jesus has conquered over all things, death, sin, the devil, and Sheol/hades/hell.

Overcoming the world is one thing, already forgiving the world is delusional.

This teaching is for the god of this world, who never was and never shall be angry or wrathful against sin. He loves all sinning, being the first one to rebel against the true God.

If a person is feeling guilty or hurt they should turn to God for his guidance and care by and through the Holy Spirit.

So Jesus can burp the little baby, who's feelings are hurt, but never to repent nor confess sinning to be forgiven and reconciled to God.

This teaching is a lie that sears the conscience against the Spirit's conviction for sinning. If any man is already forgiven, then he should never allow any conviction for sinning, and so preforgiveness before and while committing fornication turns conviction of the Holy Spirit into guilt-tripping by man and the devil.

You can dress up your conscience-searing teaching with all the pretty flowers of speech you like, but you will be judged for it in that day to come:

Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols.

And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not.

And nothing of this is intended nor expected to correct you and others like you, but only warn them that have yet to be persuaded against their own souls like you.

No one that swallows the lie of already being forgiven and uncondemned for anything we will do and are doing, has any truth in them to reason with whatsoever. If any man is already forgiven, then there is no need for forgiveness, and where there is no forgiveness needed, then there is no sin to confess, no matter what that man has done or is doing:

If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

These Scriptures are for them that sin and have sinned, and yet say they have no need to confess and be forgiven: that is the reprobate results of teaching of preforgiveness of all sinning in life.

 

[MatthewG]

As I said, this is the teaching of your christ and his fear, not that of the Lord Jesus Christ.

The fear of the Lord is not awe of silly children, but is the mature fear of righteous judgement and wrath for them that do evil:

Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God; Who will render to every man according to his deeds:

To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life: But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath,

Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile.

And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

Overcoming the world is one thing, already forgiving the world is delusional.

This teaching is for the god of this world, who never was and never shall be angry or wrathful against sin. He loves all sinning, being the first one to rebel against the true God.



So Jesus can burp the little baby, who's feelings are hurt, but never to repent nor confess sinning to be forgiven and reconciled to God.

This teaching is a lie that sears the conscience against the Spirit's conviction for sinning. If any man is already forgiven, then he should never allow any conviction for sinning, and so preforgiveness before and while committing fornication turns conviction of the Holy Spirit into guilt-tripping by man and the devil.

You can dress up your conscience-searing teaching with all the pretty flowers of speech you like, but you will be judged for it in that day to come:

Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols.

And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not.

And nothing of this is intended nor expected to correct you and others like you, but only warn them that have yet to be persuaded against their own souls like you.

No one that swallows the lie of already being forgiven and uncondemned for anything we will do and are doing, has any truth in them to reason with whatsoever. If any man is already forgiven, then there is no need for forgiveness, and where there is no forgiveness needed, then there is no sin to confess, no matter what that man has done or is doing:

If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

These Scriptures are for them that sin and have sinned, and yet say they have no need to confess and be forgiven: that is the reprobate results of teaching of preforgiveness of all sinning in life.

I didn’t take time to read this.

Sorry man I don’t care believe what you will.

To me God has reconciled the world unto himself through Christ by having sin taken care of.

 

[Behold]

You can dress up your conscience-searing teaching with all the pretty flowers of speech you like, but you will be judged for it in that day to come:

You have the seared conscience.....
You are the very person who does not believe that Jesus keeps you saved.
See, a person who understand's God's Grace, understands that the Same Jesus who saved you, keeps you saved.
Someone like you, who can't believe this, is trying to work your way into heaven.
And you'll find the judgment due that "error of cain", unless you turn from it, and to real Faith in Christ.

 

[robert derrick]

I didn’t take time to read this.

Sorry man I don’t care believe what you will.

To me God has reconciled the world unto himself through Christ by having sin taken care of.

As I said. The truth is nothing to you, and so I don't teach it to you.

But at least now we see a real person talking, rather than all that phony niceness pretense of a little boy. Man.

 

[MatthewG]

Hey we all have flesh that falls short.

You fail just like I do and no one here better than the other.

Just believe what your going to because you won’t stop that.

Isn’t it good news that Jesus has taken away the sin of the whole world? Man… how amazing.

 

[L.A.M.B.]

I have trouble with ppl that are ALWAYS attacking another's dogma in repeated multiple post.

When any are constantly watching the brethren to see who stumbles and falls, then YOU have NOT the love of Christ !

How many new post or new ways can a person say something against another?

There is Much in God's word, much. Yet it appears babies ye still are, squabbling over toys. Lol....the joke is on you for children are innocent and more forgiving; they either let go, fight to keep or just get another toy.......BAD ADULTS!!!! Jesus said we are to become like children in trusting, forgiving, and loving not strife , envy, and fighting.

A holy chaistisment is needed but probably useless to the babies who never grow up.

I like your post @PinSeeker
Appropo!

 

[robert derrick]

Hey we all have flesh that falls short.

You fail just like I do and no one here better than the other.

Just believe what your going to because you won’t stop that.

Isn’t it good news that Jesus has taken away the sin of the whole world? Man… how amazing.

Now, you're just a liar like all other OSAS accusers. I am not you, nor anything like you. But, as I say, at least your little smiling nice boy game is gone. That was a pretty pathetic show of the flesh.

 

[MatthewG]

Yes you are @robert derrick youre a human being.

 

[robert derrick]

I have trouble with ppl that are ALWAYS attacking another's dogma in repeated multiple post.

Tell it to Peter and Paul and Jesus:

But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed. For do I now persuade men, or God? or do I seek to please men? for if I yet pleased men, I should not be the servant of Christ.

So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.

 

[L.A.M.B.]

Reader,

Anyone who has every confessed a sin has failed to run the race, perfectly.
But here is the thing.
The race is not our Salvation, its only our discipleship., and we are in the race because we are already become: "the righteousness of God in Christ".

Like this..

"as Jesus is, so are the born again, in this world"...

See, Our Salvation is Christ on the Cross and He didn't Fail.
In fact, before we started the race (discipleship) , we were re-created "in Christ", born again as God's very righteousness, having received the "gift of righteousness and the gift of Salvation".

So, on Discipleship DAY 1, = we are already righteousness......and then we begin the race (discipleship) finished already as a "new creation in Christ", "made Righteous, having BECOME..... born again as...>>"The righteousness of God, in Christ".

You are another one that lacks love & forgivness, so WHERE does that put you? Move forward with the cross, you are stagnant.

If you want to preach or teach salvation then do so, even if most of your posts have it very understated.

Better yet switch to discipleship, let us see how you view that!

You are a one horned instrument sounding like tinkling cymbals and rusted brass. NOBODY IS LISTENING ANYMORE !
IF a new reader comes along you do not edify as you are incomplete in your dogma.

 

[robert derrick]

Yes you are @robert derrick youre a human being.

But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light.

You can stick with just being human, while teaching the gospel of this world, where the god of this world has forgiven the whole world of any sinning it has done or may do in the future.

As I said, there is nothing near the truth in you to reason with.

 

[L.A.M.B.]

Tell it to Peter and Paul and Jesus:

But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed. For do I now persuade men, or God? or do I seek to please men? for if I yet pleased men, I should not be the servant of Christ.

So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.

Let me say it this way ,Robert. As the sons of Sceva said, " Paul I know and Peter I know ( 1 step further, I most certainly know JESUS) but WHO ARE YOU ?