jiggyfly
New Member
Paul's point was simple. He was pushing the point that the resurrection is a reality, and is going to occur upon Jesus return, and that even the pagans believe this, otherwise why do they (pagans) baptize for the dead?
He was referring to the pagan act of baptism for the dead to make His point about belief in the resurrection. He didn't mention the actual pagan belief, but the pagans of a city near Corinth, called
Eleusis was the home of a pagan religion where baptism in the sea was practiced to guarantee a good afterlife. Homer mentioned it in his 'Hymn to Demeter'. Corinth was a major hub and was heavily influenced by many customs and religions. It is highly likely that the Corinthians were being influenced by what the pagans in Eleusis practiced, which was a baptism for the dead.
Paul used this example from the pagans in 1 Cor. 15:29, when he said, "...if the dead are not raised, then why are they baptized for the dead?" Paul did not say 'we'.
OK where is your scripture to prove that Paul was speaking of pagan baptism. Angelina requested that you post scriptures to back up your earlier post, where are they?
Do you understand the purpose of context. Where does Paul mention Pagans within this context that he could refer "they" as being pagans???
You are right Jiggy. There are many Churches out there that actually baptize on behalf of the dead. I just read an article recently about baptizing by proxy on behalf of a family members parents who had died after the Holocaust...
http://news.yahoo.co...-162346450.html
But this scripture has been misinterpreted...
1 Corinthians 15
[sup]12[/sup] But if it is preached that Christ has been raised from the dead, how can some of you say that there is no resurrection of the dead? [sup]13[/sup] If there is no resurrection of the dead, then not even Christ has been raised. [sup]14[/sup] And if Christ has not been raised, our preaching is useless and so is your faith. [sup]15[/sup] More than that, we are then found to be false witnesses about God, for we have testified about God that he raised Christ from the dead. But he did not raise him if in fact the dead are not raised. [sup]16[/sup] For if the dead are not raised, then Christ has not been raised either. [sup]17[/sup] And if Christ has not been raised, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins. [sup]18[/sup] Then those also who have fallen asleep in Christ are lost. [sup]19[/sup] If only for this life we have hope in Christ, we are to be pitied more than all men.
The verse above speaks of those who believe that there is no resurrection from the dead...the argument here is that...if Christ has not been raised from the dead, we are still in our sins...those who preach Christ risen and God raising him from the dead are also preaching something that is useless to those who believe and the faith they have in Jesus becomes futile. Those who have fallen asleep [dead] in Christ are also lost. ....Keep those thoughts in mind...
[sup]20[/sup] But Christ has indeed been raised from the dead, the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep. [sup]21[/sup] For since death came through a man, the resurrection of the dead comes also through a man. [sup]22[/sup] For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive. [sup]23[/sup] But each in his own turn: Christ, the firstfruits; then, when he comes, those who belong to him. [sup]24[/sup] Then the end will come, when he hands over the kingdom to God the Father after he has destroyed all dominion, authority and power. [sup]25[/sup] For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. [sup]26[/sup] The last enemy to be destroyed is death. [sup]27[/sup] For he “has put everything under his feet.”[sup][c][/sup] Now when it says that “everything” has been put under him, it is clear that this does not include God himself, who put everything under Christ. [sup]28[/sup] When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all.
[sup]29[/sup] Now if there is no resurrection, what will those do who are baptized for the dead? If the dead are not raised at all, why are people baptized for them?
Verse 29 then goes back to the first argument about those who believe that there is no resurrection...
"What will those do who are baptized for the dead?
meaning - Christ, if he has not risen [assuming that he is dead]
If the dead are not raised at all, why are people baptized for them?" using again, their belief that there is no resurrection...the question asked is - "why are people being baptized for those who are dead.?" [that is...if the dead are not raised - like Jesus]
[sup]30[/sup] And as for us, why do we endanger ourselves every hour? [sup]31[/sup] I die every day—I mean that, brothers—just as surely as I glory over you in Christ Jesus our Lord. [sup]32[/sup] If I fought wild beasts in Ephesus for merely human reasons, what have I gained? If the dead are not raised,
Paul then goes on to say that it would have been pointless for them to have endured so much hardship and danger if the message that they bought were not true..."If the dead are not raised"
Romans 6 says:
[sup]3[/sup] Or don’t you know that all of us who were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? [sup]4[/sup] We were therefore buried with him through baptism into death in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, we too may live a new life.
[sup]5[/sup] If we have been united with him like this in his death, we will certainly also be united with him in his resurrection. [sup]6[/sup] For we know that our old self was crucified with him so that the body of sin might be done away with, that we should no longer be slaves to sin— [sup]7[/sup] because anyone who has died has been freed from sin.
Blessings!!!
Hey Angelina, just noticed your post. I understand that this passage is difficult for those who believe in endless torment and that it must be complicated and have a different meaning than what it literally conveys. As you said context is very important and I look at it in context too, but come to a different understanding because I look at it simply the way it is worded and see no conflict with the rest of scripture. Thanks for your response.
