Church

[BreadOfLife]

@bol, this will also answer your John 14:23 question,
Jesus replied: "If anyone loves me, he will obey my teaching. My Father will love him and WE will come to him and make OUR home with him".

Yup - "WE" implies more than ONE Person.
It doesn't imply 1 Person with multiple personality disorder as you Modalists believe.

 

[101G]

first thanks for the response, second when did the Father come and dwell in the believers?.

 

[epostle1]

Not speed dial, but on time, see, he's an on time God, all the time. "We have a way of dealing with liars". WE, WE, WE?. it's called excommunication? who gave you that authority? is this like the JW in shunning?.................. LOL.

The practice of excommunication arose in the early Church. In his First Letter to the Corinthians, St. Paul castigated that community for tolerating the practice of incest– “a man living with his father’s wife” (I Corinthians 5:1). He admonished the Corinthians for not removing the offender from their midst. St. Paul said, “I hand him over to Satan for the destruction of his flesh, so that his spirit may be saved on the day of the Lord” (5:5). St. Paul further warned against associating with anyone who bears the title “brother” (indicating being a believer and part of the Church) but who is immoral, covetous, an idolater, an abusive person, a drunkard, or a thief. He then closed the passage by quoting from the Torah, “Expel the wicked man from your midst” (Deuteronomy 6:13).
The JW's do not follow Paul's teaching, and excommunication is a developed term for "I hand him over to Satan for the destruction of his flesh, so that his spirit may be saved on the day of the Lord” (5:5). I can elaborate further if you do not understand.

 

[BreadOfLife]

I guess you must have not been reading my posts. especially after that poor performance yesterday.

well lets see about that. John 14:16-18 "And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for HE dwelleth with you, and shall be in you. I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you".

this is the Lord Jesus himself. he said that he would come to them, this is audience relevance. what the Lord is teaching them is that HE IS THE HOLY SPIRIT WITHOUT FLESH AND BONE. now are you prepared to defend against the Lord Jesus teaching?. just say yes or no.

Jesus is God.
The Holy Spirit is God.
He is telling His followers that God will come to them.

"And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you ANOTHER Comforter"
This word in Greek means, “another of the SAME kind.”

Keep studying . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

hmm, lol. When you do get it--if you do get it, ever--it might be characterized as "lightning flashing, from East to West."
it happens "in an instant," yes?

Sure - lies and misconceptions come in many forms.

 

[101G]

Yup - "WE" implies more than ONE Person.
It doesn't imply 1 Person with multiple personality disorder as you Modalists believe.

when did the Father come and dwell in the believers?.

 

[BreadOfLife]

when did the Father come and dwell in the believers?.

He didn't.
The SON came down and said, "I and my father are ONE" (John 10:30).

The Holy Spirit dwells in all true believers.

 

[101G]

He didn't.
The SON came down and said, "I and my father are ONE" (John 10:30).

Glad you said that..... (smile). ERROR ON YOUR PART,scripture, John 14:23 "Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him". since you said that the Father and the son are ONE, listen, 1 John 3:24 "And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us”. who "GAVE" the Spirit? answer, John 14:16 "And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever". now if it's it the Spirit that dwells in us and your doctrine says the Spirit is not the Father, and the Son is not the Spirit then you just made a big BO=BO. for it is the Spirit according to 1 John 3:24 that dwells in us and again your doctrine states that the Father is not the Holy Spirit. so please explain......

 

[amadeus]

Tut tut...play nice now.
The false preachers corrupt our souls and the souls of the genuine young seekers. Whereas the cop shows which I love...only steal our time and turn our brains to mush. For sure you not comparing "apples to apples"

( as for TV portraying the law as good...we should all know by now, that anything on the screen and internet are all fantasy and illusion...entertainment...= The art of not thinking!! lol )

While I don't watch too much TV like my wife does, but I do get into books at times which are fictional. The difficulty is always finding something that is interesting without stepping over the wrong lines. What are the lines? I would suspect that they are different from person to person according to that person's walk with God and his/her own experience in the carnal world of men.

 

[amadeus]

@BreadOfLife

Amadeus said:
That is exactly what I mean!

"And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive:
For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them." Matt 13:14-15

BreadofLife said:
This verse has absolutely nothing to do with what we're talking about.
It's about the Jew's rejection of Jesus - not a self-proclaimed Christian's lack of faith and rejection of the Triune Godhead.

The written Word of God was NOT given to us so that we could individually decide for ourselves what was to be believed and what was to be rejected.
It was given to His Church to teach each generation until His return.

We obviously are in disagreement here. You have me as someone outside of the church which is your foundation, while I have you as one of the blind and the deaf to the things of God. May God shows us both the Door to enter in with Him.

 

[101G]

let me make it very clear to you. the Lord Jesus said, and he cannot lie, that he and the Father will come and make their abode in us. so the Father came or the Lord Jesus lied, God forbid. you said that the father didn't come, but the Lord Jesus said that he did. so when did he, the Father come? please answer. i'll be waiting for that answer.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Glad you said that..... (smile). ERROR ON YOUR PART,scripture, John 14:23 "Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him". since you said that the Father and the son are ONE, listen, 1 John 3:24 "And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us”. who "GAVE" the Spirit? answer, John 14:16 "And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever". now if it's it the Spirit that dwells in us and your doctrine says the Spirit is not the Father, and the Son is not the Spirit then you just made a big BO=BO. for it is the Spirit according to 1 John 3:24 that dwells in us and again your doctrine states that the Father is not the Holy Spirit. so please explain......

First of all - what is a "BO-BO"??
I've never heard of this term before, so please explain.

Secondly, this passage is a perfect illustration of the Trinity. It shows how the Holy Spirit proceeds from both the Father and the Son, as described in the Nicene Creed.

As I showed you before - the Greek word used here for "Another" means "another of the SAME KIND."
ALL 3 Persons of the Trinity are the same KIND - but 3 different Persons.

1 What.
3 WHOs

 

[BreadOfLife]

We obviously are in disagreement here. You have me as someone outside of the church which is your foundation, while I have you as one of the blind and the deaf to the things of God. May God shows us both the Door to enter in with Him.

You are in rebellion against His Church. You have invented a different god than the God of Christianity.
How could you possibly consider yourself to be a "part" of it?

In 2000 years of Church history - please show me a Church teaching about the nature of God that is in line with yours.

God will not be mocked.

 

[101G]

Ephesians 2:18 "For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.
ERROR the Holy Spirit is a separate person according to your doctrine. John 15:26 "But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me" how can a separate person who is according to you is co-equal be the same PERSON as the Father?. please explain

 

[amadeus]

Thanks for the post, I agree with you to a point about the old TV shows. some do condition our mind. but on the flip side. there was some that helped me understand the bible. example Bonanza, this show help me grasp the understanding of the difference between us and the angels in respect to sons vs servants. or like Gunsmoke that gave me insight on the woman Rehab. I do agree that there are bad and good tv shows, but we must allow the Holy Spirit discern them for us.

There is indeed good and bad in them. What needs to be avoided is something we know is likely to lead us away from God or toward sin, which is likely the same thing. But each person's besetting sins or most attractive temptations are likely different.

There is one episode of Gunsmoke in which an outlaw asks why Matt or Doc was willing to lay down his life for the other. They actually quoted this scripture:

"Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends." John 15:13

 

[bbyrd009]

Wrong.
Faith begins with God - but if we don't cooperate with that grace, it dies.

True faith requires our cooperation and obedience.

ah, i came back to tell you that this study will not work for you right now; but i guess that would become obv soon enough anyway.

Uhhh, no.
You are outside of Christ's Church because you have rejected it.

It's never too late to come home as long as you have breath in you.

have a nice evening, judge.

 

[amadeus]

You are in rebellion against His Church. You have invented a different god than the God of Christianity.
How could you possibly consider yourself to be a "part" of it?

In 2000 years of Church history - please show me a Church teaching about the nature of God that is in line with yours.

God will not be mocked.

I did not invent. God led me when I needed Him and called out to Him. The Catholic Church proved itself too far away from where God wanted me to walk. For others it may still be a good place [that is not for me to judge], but for me it would cause stagnation.

 

[BreadOfLife]

ah, i came back to tell you that this study will not work for you right now; but i guess that would become obv soon enough anyway.
have a nice evening, judge.

I don't judge anybody - just their fruits.

 

[BreadOfLife]

I did not invent. God led me when I needed Him and called out to Him. The Catholic Church proved itself too far away from where God wanted me to walk. For others it may still be a good place [that is not for me to judge], but for me it would cause stagnation.

God doesn't lead people to error.
He can only lead a person to Truth. This is evident by the fact that you say that you "could be" wrong about some of your beliefs.

God does not take people out of the Light and into darkness.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Ephesians 2:18 "For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.
ERROR the Holy Spirit is a separate person according to your doctrine. John 15:26 "But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me" how can a separate person who is according to you is co-equal be the same PERSON as the Father?. please explain

See what happens when you reject the Triune Godhead?
Nothing but confusion that leads you to invent a different God that appeals to your idea of what He should be . . .