As I see it, the Spirit's circumcision and baptism of the heart and soul is necessary for salvation and justification in the New Covenant of Christ Jesus. Physical circumcision was for physical part with the children of Israel, and water baptism is for participation and fellowship in the churches of God. Physical circumcision and baptism never have anything to do with the covenants of God, other than as signs only. Only the Spirit's work in and through us is power to become sons of God. As Paul would say in Romans 2, disobedience to God is the power of sin to make our circumcision and baptism, uncircumcision and unbaptized.
Circumcision and Baptism of the Spirit and Body
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Eternally Grateful
Well-Known Member
Col 2: 11 In Him you were also circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body [h]of the sins of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ, 12 buried with Him in baptism, in which you also were raised with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead. 13 And you, being dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He has made alive together with Him, having forgiven you all trespasses, 14 having wiped out the handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross. 15 Having disarmed principalities and powers, He made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them in it.
its all a work of God.. the symbols can not save us and have no part in our salvation. they point to Christ
its all a work of God.. the symbols can not save us and have no part in our salvation. they point to Christ
Behold
Well-Known Member
Let me show you something that you can study.., as its what you are trying to understand.
Colossians 2:11
"""When you came to Christ, you were “circumcised,” but not by a physical procedure. Christ performed a spiritual circumcision—the cutting away of your sinful nature.""""
And the question is......where did the sinful nature go, after God cut it away?
A.) "The old man is crucified with Christ".
What is left?
"A new Creation, IN Christ"......"made righteous"....>"One with God"....... "Having Eternal Life'
That's right. The physical things of our faith are all for a witness and testimony to others with acceptance in the church congregation. That makes them important and necessary to good fellowship. Only spiritual corruption and disobedience to God have power to undo our relationship covenant with Jesus. There are churches that demand and forbid certain things to be a member in good standing, and they don't all agree with one another. So being accepted in a church is good and healthy for faith, but not necessary to be saved.
Eternally Grateful
Well-Known Member
Yes. Without physical circumcision the Israelite was cut off from the people by law. Water baptism properly is necessary to be accepted by the people. That's not so prevalent in churches anymore. It's now treated more like encouragement than a commandment. Spiritual circumcision and baptism are the same work of Christ that saves us inwardly. All physical things are a witness of saving faith in the heart and soul. Outward corruption can alienate us from others and even be cause to refuse fellowship. Only inward corruption can alienate us from Christ. It's why we need to be saved by Jesus in the first place. We can't purify our hearts without Him. Spiritual circumcision was always the need of sinful man. The Lord commanded it in His first and second covenants.
We only have fellowship with Jesus through spiritual purity. We must exercise His faith and power to remain pure of heart and love God. He purifies us from the corruption and lust of the world. We must not allow ourselves to be lusting with the world again but hold onto Jesus with the Spirit.
Eternally Grateful
Well-Known Member
I am saying it is impossible to please God without faith from from the heart, and only the pure of heart love Him and have fellowship with Jesus in His light. How you want to relate that to salvation is your business. Unless there is Bible verses saying something specific, then we can interpret these things as we want. Do you have any Bible saying specifically one way or the other being saved is the same as being pure in heart and fellowshipping with Jesus? Any Bible saying being saved is while sinning or not?
Eternally Grateful
Well-Known Member
I was just asking a question so I did not misunderstand you
I agree.. its impossible to please God apart from Faith.
Remember we love because he first loved us. We will not be pure in heart in this lifetime.. No matter how hard we try. That is why we need faith in this lifetime.. not in self. But in God. Because only then can we please him.
1stCenturyLady
Well-Known Member
Hi Behold,
God has recently revealed to me what the "foreskin" represents of His circumcising us without hands. What do you think is in what is cut off?
1stCenturyLady
Well-Known Member
1stCenturyLady
Well-Known Member
Behold
Well-Known Member
Initially this was a type of covenant between the Jew male and God.
It was symbolic of this... that was to come... by the Cross and the New Birth 'in Christ'
Colossians 2:11
""In Him also you were circumcised with a circumcision not made with hands, but in a [spiritual] circumcision [performed by] Christ by stripping off the body of the flesh (the whole corrupt, carnal nature with its passions and lusts).""""
What is that?
That is the "Old man that is crucified with Christ'.
Romans 6:6
1stCenturyLady
Well-Known Member
Yes. but what was in the "old man" that is not in us as born again Christians? Read further verses in Colossians 2. I just made a post on this in Bible Study. Go there.
Behold
Well-Known Member
GRACE ambassador
Well-Known Member
op: circumcision and baptism of the spirit and body?
1) Spiritual Circumcision "without hands" is necessary:
Salvation and Justification According To God's "Revelation Of The Mystery" (Rom-Philemon)
Current Dispensation of Pure Grace
Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15) From “Things That Differ” (online)
prophecy/law/OT-NT covenants for twelve tribes of Israel
( Confusion Avoidance never mixes them Up with the Body ):
1) Repent (change mind about sin/agree With God "it is Wrong!") or perish
(Luk 13:3,5 Mar 1:4 Luk_3:3, 24:47}
+
2) believe the gospel of the kingdom (Mat 4:23, 9:35, 24:14; Mar 1:14,15)
+
3) be baptized "For the remission of sin" (Mar 1:4 Luk 3:3, 7:29:30, 24:47;
Act 2:38)
+
4) "show works meet for repentance" (Mat 3:8), because,
+
5) "to the twelve tribes of Israel," "faith Without works is dead"
(Jam 1:1, 2:17,26)
+
6) "keep the commandments" to "enter life" (Mat 19:17)
+
7) "one thing thou lackest...sell ALL/take up cross/follow Jesus"
(Mar 10:17-23)
8) Hebrews belongs here: "faith PLUS works!"
9) Keep the law (Matthew 23:1-3 cp Acts 21:20; 22:12):
earthly prophecy/LAW/covenants ( Previous / Future dispensations of God... )
These dispensations should never be Mixed Up With God's Current Dispensation,
As "The Revelation Of The Mystery" is Not Equal to prophecy/law/covenants.
Amen.
Actually, for us, The Body Of Christ, Under Grace ( not covenants ), God's Word Of Truth, Rightly Divided:
1) Spiritual Circumcision "without hands" is necessary:
"And ye are complete in Him, which is The Head of all principality and power:
In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands,
in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:"
(Colossians 2:10-11)
2) ONE ( and Only ONE! ) [ Spiritual ] Baptism Is necessary: "For by ONE Spirit are we all Baptized into ONE Body, whether we be Jews or
Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into
ONE Spirit." (1 Corinthians 12:13 cp Ephesians 4:5; Galatians 3:27, Romans 3:4-6 =
no water, No water, NO water, no Confusing symbolism of anything = ONE Spiritual Baptism ) Salvation and Justification According To God's "Revelation Of The Mystery" (Rom-Philemon)
Current Dispensation of Pure Grace
Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15) From “Things That Differ” (online)
prophecy/law/OT-NT covenants for twelve tribes of Israel
( Confusion Avoidance never mixes them Up with the Body ):
1) Repent (change mind about sin/agree With God "it is Wrong!") or perish
(Luk 13:3,5 Mar 1:4 Luk_3:3, 24:47}
+
2) believe the gospel of the kingdom (Mat 4:23, 9:35, 24:14; Mar 1:14,15)
+
3) be baptized "For the remission of sin" (Mar 1:4 Luk 3:3, 7:29:30, 24:47;
Act 2:38)
+
4) "show works meet for repentance" (Mat 3:8), because,
+
5) "to the twelve tribes of Israel," "faith Without works is dead"
(Jam 1:1, 2:17,26)
+
6) "keep the commandments" to "enter life" (Mat 19:17)
+
7) "one thing thou lackest...sell ALL/take up cross/follow Jesus"
(Mar 10:17-23)
8) Hebrews belongs here: "faith PLUS works!"
9) Keep the law (Matthew 23:1-3 cp Acts 21:20; 22:12):
earthly prophecy/LAW/covenants ( Previous / Future dispensations of God... )
These dispensations should never be Mixed Up With God's Current Dispensation,
As "The Revelation Of The Mystery" is Not Equal to prophecy/law/covenants.
Amen.
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Removal of the diseased, dying and dead parts of the heart? The foreskin of the heart?
Deut 10:16 Circumcise therefore the foreskin of your heart, and be no more stiffnecked.
1stCenturyLady
Well-Known Member
Well, the Deut 10:16 associates foreskin of the heart with being stiff-necked, so I would expect circumcising it would make us sensitive to the Holy Spirit's prompting - having hearts of flesh rather than calloused, hardened stone hearts. In the New Testament, we find He indwells us.
Our actions would be aligned with being alive from within, rather than dying from within.
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