Dead in Sin !

[DNB]

If it hasn't happened to you, then maybe you should clear your mind of all your past denominational dogmas and start over, asking the Father, the Author of His Word, to reveal the meaning of every verse He authored. I did, and He has been faithful to teach me the true meaning of His Words. My understanding has exploded, and yours can too.

You don't have much time to overcome before the Great Tribulation starts, so if I were you, I'd humble myself and start praying and listening. You have so much to learn, and not a lot of time to overcome.

I know what the promises are, and I agree with you on that. But, acquiring them is something entirely different, it's conditional. This should be obvious for just as much, salvation is conditional. We understand how the wording is expressed in the Bible, in that at times, it sounds like universalism - meaning that no more effort is required on the redeemed one's part. But, we know that this is not true, repentance and conviction is required, and all that these two dispositions imply. Same with receiving the gift of the Holy Spirit, not all that were converted in the NT, had either the same gifts, or any gifts, at least that were recorded.
Both anecdotally and Scripturally, we witness a contingency upon receiving the Spirit.

 

[DNB]

Are you saying you never had an instant heart change . Man i once was truly dead in my sins
and loving to wallow in them . Sadly i could still say JESUS saves etc , BUT i did not know HIM , Follow HIM . I loved sin .
But i remember so clear that day in late may of two thousand and six , may thirtieth .
A small stirring began in my conscious and i remembered again the gospel i had heard from my youth .
AND suddenly all i had was the desire , a strong desire to truly seek after GOD .
WHOLE new desires , and sin was so dead and empty to me .
GOD DID that . ITS called the new birth . AND believe me , It was by the grace of GOD . HE changed my heart
desires from the evil sin i loved , RIGHT TO LOVING TRUTH .

I have never witnessed what you described from myself, nor from any other Christian that I know. I've heard people profess how zealous that they are for the Lord, but have not seen the proof in their claim. To me, wisdom changes one's heart, the more that we read, and hopefully comprehend God's Word, yes, things suddenly dawn on us as to appear out of nowhere. But, there is never some inexplicable change of heart that occurs within one's mind, that he cannot rationalize or appreciate. Meaning, he can easily trace the steps and the rationality, as to why he acts in a way that he didn't even desire before.
I look back at my past life and yes, am ashamed of my ways, and that is still going on. But, it's natural progression that even atheists experience. Even an alcoholic will one day wake up and just throw the bottle out the window, as all his past struggles due to the alcoholism culminate in his mind. One experience, led to the other. This, to me, is the Christian walk, God does not possess anyone that he changes them either beyond their understanding, or beyond their will.

 

[justbyfaith]

My onw personal experience is that I almost sold my soul to the devil...but remembered from a church service the verse that says, "What shall it profit a man if he shall gain the whole world and yet forfeit his soul?"

I couldn't sit on the fence any longer.

I said to God, "God, I don't know if You're even real; but I'm going to start reading Your word and doing what it says; and I know that if You're real You will reveal Yourself to me."

He didn't even wait two seconds. Suddenly His Spirit came upon me and I felt as though it were waves of liquid love flowing through my soul...such joy unspeakable and full of glory and such peace that passes understanding that I will never be the same even after having been medicated for 30 years of my life afterwards because of a chemistry accident that altered my chemical balance...and I am not just using that terminology because it is in the Bible...it was my very real experience.

 

[brightfame52]

That does not say that God will do something that He does not have to do since He has already done it.

Man is still dead in sin by nature and can't do anything about it.

 

[brightfame52]

777

One is indeed dead in sin, but whom the Son sets free is free indeed.

Yes and one of the ways He sets free is by quickening, making alive Spiritually, hence until He does that, man Spiritually towards God is as dead as a corpse, to use that analogy.

 

[CharismaticLady]

I know what the promises are, and I agree with you on that. But, acquiring them is something entirely different, it's conditional. This should be obvious for just as much, salvation is conditional. We understand how the wording is expressed in the Bible, in that at times, it sounds like universalism - meaning that no more effort is required on the redeemed one's part. But, we know that this is not true, repentance and conviction is required, and all that these two dispositions imply. Same with receiving the gift of the Holy Spirit, not all that were converted in the NT, had either the same gifts, or any gifts, at least that were recorded.
Both anecdotally and Scripturally, we witness a contingency upon receiving the Spirit.

I understand and agree. It IS conditional. I never received the Spirit in the first 30 years of going to church, but always claimed to be a Christian. Looking back, I wonder if I would have died, would I have gone to heaven during that period? Considering Romans 8:9, I don't think so.

I'm a writer and I can send you the chapter on my testimony if you care to read how I finally received the Holy Spirit and got on the path to salvation. Just ask.

 

[ChristisGod]

I understand and agree. It IS conditional. I never received the Spirit in the first 30 years of going to church, but always claimed to be a Christian. Looking back, I wonder if I would have died, would I have gone to heaven during that period? Considering Romans 8:9, I don't think so.

I'm a writer and I can send you the chapter on my testimony if you care to read how I finally received the Holy Spirit and got on the path to salvation. Just ask.

shaky ground when one is in agreement with both unitarians and kenosis false teachers. this speaks volumes. scripture condemns false teachers and you agree with them. things that make you go hmmmmm

 

[DNB]

I understand and agree. It IS conditional. I never received the Spirit in the first 30 years of going to church, but always claimed to be a Christian. Looking back, I wonder if I would have died, would I have gone to heaven during that period? Considering Romans 8:9, I don't think so.

I'm a writer and I can send you the chapter on my testimony if you care to read how I finally received the Holy Spirit and got on the path to salvation. Just ask.

No, I'm ok CL, you explained it to me when you sent me an private msg. I don't believe that you really justified your perfect faith, though?

 

[justbyfaith]

Man is still dead in sin by nature and can't do anything about it.

Then how is he able to ask the Lord to quicken him?

 

[CharismaticLady]

No, I'm ok CL, you explained it to me when you sent me an private msg. I don't believe that you really justified your perfect faith, though?

That would be because I'm not perfect, but working on it. LOL

 

[DNB]

That would be because I'm not perfect, but working on it. LOL

But, that is the only way that one could possibly have 'every prayer answered'. God would never respond to anyone that prayed without humility and faith.

 

[justbyfaith]

But, that is the only way that one could possibly have 'every prayer answered'. God would never respond to anyone that prayed without humility and faith.

Perfection is not the requirement.

If we come to God based not on our own merits but on the basis of His merits and on the basis of his shed blood, then imputed righteousness will carry our prayers right into the throne room.

Of course, if you deny that Jesus is the Lord God, that righteousness isn't imputed to you; you will die in your sins if you die in such a state of unbelief.

 

[CharismaticLady]

But, that is the only way that one could possibly have 'every prayer answered'. God would never respond to anyone that prayed without humility and faith.

I don't sin, but being perfect in fruit as well takes a lifetime. 2 Peter 1:5-7

1 John 3:21-24.
21 Beloved, if our heart does not condemn us, we have confidence toward God. 22 And whatever we ask we receive from Him, because we keep His commandments and do those things that are pleasing in His sight. 23 And this is His commandment: that we should believe on the name of His Son Jesus Christ and love one another, as He gave us commandment.

24 Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.

 

[DNB]

Perfection is not the requirement.

If we come to God based not on our own merits but on the basis of His merits and on the basis of his shed blood, then imputed righteousness will carry our prayers right into the throne room.

Of course, if you deny that Jesus is the Lord God, that righteousness isn't imputed to you; you will die in your sins if you die in such a state of unbelief.

I never said perfection, who were you responding to?

 

[DNB]

I don't sin, but being perfect in fruit as well takes a lifetime. 2 Peter 1:5-7

1 John 3:21-24.
21 Beloved, if our heart does not condemn us, we have confidence toward God. 22 And whatever we ask we receive from Him, because we keep His commandments and do those things that are pleasing in His sight. 23 And this is His commandment: that we should believe on the name of His Son Jesus Christ and love one another, as He gave us commandment.

24 Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.

Oh, but you do sin - for he who claims to have no sin, makes God out to be a liar!

 

[justbyfaith]

I never said perfection, who were you responding to?

.
.
.

That would be because I'm not perfect, but working on it. LOL

But, that is the only way that one could possibly have 'every prayer answered'. God would never respond to anyone that prayed without humility and faith.

 

[justbyfaith]

Oh, but you do sin - for he who claims to have no sin, makes God out to be a liar!

That is talking about indwelling sin, not practical sinning.

1 John 1:8 does not say, "If we say that we do not sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us."

Read it again.

Also, if it says that, then it is in direct contradiction to 1 John 3:9, as well as 1 John 3:6 w/ 1 John 2:17.

 

[DNB]

That is talking about indwelling sin, not practical sinning.

1 John 1:8 does not say, "If we say that we do not sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us."

Read it again.

Also, if it says that, then it is in direct contradiction to 1 John 3:9, as well as 1 John 3:6 w/ 1 John 2:17.

No, you need to read it again, ...and your whole Bible while you're at it - like an NIV or NASB, or ESV, or NET etc...

 

[justbyfaith]

No, you need to read it again, ...and your whole Bible while you're at it - like an NIV or NASB, or ESV, or NET etc...

How do you explain the apparent contradiction if it does in fact say what you think it says?

 

[justbyfaith]

No, you need to read it again, ...and your whole Bible while you're at it - like an NIV or NASB, or ESV, or NET etc...

1Jo 1:8 (niv), If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us.

1Jo 1:8 (esv), If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

1Jo 1:8 (nasb), If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us.

1Jo 1:8 (nlt), If we claim we have no sin, we are only fooling ourselves and not living in the truth.

All of these translations are in conjunction with my doctrine on this matter.