Did Christians invent the Trinity-2

[Reggie Belafonte]

If there had been no Jews there would be no Christians. We owe everything to them. They are God's chosen people we are only grafted on. Why do you think I would endorse something like that?

What of us who are of the Hebrew blood line and came to Christ Jesus ? we are the Chosen people ? are we grafted in ?
What of them Disciples who when Jesus went to Heaven ? what of them ! are they grafted in ? I thought they were the First Christians in fact and not the Goyim that idiots claim were the first Christians !
So the Disciples of Jesus were worthy of Israel and became the Christians and all the Jews who were fooled by the workings of this world were not worthy of God in fact ! so that counts them out as worthy of God in fact ! Just as the history of the Jews many failed to be worthy to God in fact, so they failed and the Jews as a Nation failed every time they turned their backs to God in fact.
So it comes down to who is Worthy or not regardless ! so fact remains is one must truly be born again of the Holy Spirit and abide in Christ Jesus in fact ! or you are not worthy of God in fact regardless.

 

[RLT63]

Thanks.

My quota is full. He’s one of yours @RLT63.

I'm in the midst of interviews and tours looking for another job, considering options and worrying about those things I don't have much energy left to debate right now. I have done some more research thanks to you and learning a lot

 

[Matthias]

I'm in the midst of interviews and tours looking for another job, considering options and worrying about those things …

I hope you succeed in landing the job you’re looking for.

…I don't have much energy left to debate right now.

I gave up debating in the early 00’s. It’s a lose-lose proposition, as far as I’m concerned. Dialogue, in my opinion, is the way to go.

I have done some more research thanks to you and learning a lot

I’m happy to hear that. That’s a win-win proposition in my book.

 

[theefaith]

Let’s at least agree to stick with BC before Christ and AD year of our Lord and not the atheists CE common era!

 

[theefaith]

Jesus is Lord!

If Jesus is Lord but not God, not divine then there would be two Lords!

Deut. 6:4 Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord:

The mystery of the holy trinity!
The father is God!
The son is God!
The Holy Spirit is God!

But there are not three God’s but one God!

The father is Lord!
The son is Lord!
The Holy Spirit is Lord!

But there are not three Lords but one Lord!

 

[Matthias]

Jesus is Lord!

If Jesus is Lord but not God, not divine then there would be two Lords!

Deut. 6:4 Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord:

The mystery of the holy trinity!
The father is God!
The son is God!
The Holy Spirit is God!

But there are not three God’s but one God!

The father is Lord!
The son is Lord!
The Holy Spirit is Lord!

But there are not three Lords but one Lord!

There are two Lords - The Lord God (Yahweh) and the Lord Christ (Jesus of Nazareth).

“Yahweh said to my lord, …” (Psalm 110:1).

 

[Matthias]

Let’s at least agree to stick with BC before Christ and AD year of our Lord and not the atheists CE common era!

CE doesn’t belong to the atheists.

Frequent question: Why does the common era begin with the birth of Jesus?

 

[Matthias]

God is the Father, Christ is the Word made flesh, and the Holy Spirit is them both.

@RLT63 do you recognize this as a valid description of the Trinity?

 

[RLT63]

God is the Father, Christ is the Word made flesh, and the Holy Spirit is them both.

@RLT63 do you recognize this as a valid description of the Trinity?

Somewhat but not exactly.

 

[Matthias]

Somewhat but not exactly.

That’s interesting.

You know I’m not a trinitarian. Here’s what I believe:

God is the Father, Christ is the word made flesh, and the Holy Spirit is both of them.

 

[Matthias]

Somewhat but not exactly.

It’s being taught as trinitarianism by someone on the forum who self-identifies as trinitarian.

It isn’t what the doctrine of the Trinity teaches.

A. God is the Father, Christ is the Word made flesh, and the Holy Spirit is both of them.

B. God is the Father, Christ is the word made flesh, and the Holy Spirit is both of them.

They look similar but they’re different.

A. is binitarian; B. is unitarian.

 

[theefaith]

Ex 20:3-5
3 Thou shalt have no other gods before me.

4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.

5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the Lordthy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;

Only God may be worshipped!


Matthew 2:11
And when they were come into the house, they saw the young child with Mary his mother, and fell down, and worshipped him: and when they had opened their treasures, they presented unto him gifts; gold, and frankincense and myrrh.

Matthew 8:2
And, behold, there came a leper and worshipped him, saying, Lord, if thou wilt, thou canst make me clean.

Matthew 9:18
While he spake these things unto them, behold, there came a certain ruler, and worshipped him, saying, My daughter is even now dead: but come and lay thy hand upon her, and she shall live.

Matthew 14:33
Then they that were in the ship came and worshipped him, saying, Of a truth thou art the Son of God.

Matthew 15:25
Then came she and worshipped him, saying, Lord, help me.

John 9:38
And he said, Lord, I believe. And he worshipped him.

 

[Matthias]

Ex 20:3-5
3 Thou shalt have no other gods before me.

4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.

5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the Lordthy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;

Only God may be worshipped!


Matthew 2:11
And when they were come into the house, they saw the young child with Mary his mother, and fell down, and worshipped him: and when they had opened their treasures, they presented unto him gifts; gold, and frankincense and myrrh.

Matthew 8:2
And, behold, there came a leper and worshipped him, saying, Lord, if thou wilt, thou canst make me clean.

Matthew 9:18
While he spake these things unto them, behold, there came a certain ruler, and worshipped him, saying, My daughter is even now dead: but come and lay thy hand upon her, and she shall live.

Matthew 14:33
Then they that were in the ship came and worshipped him, saying, Of a truth thou art the Son of God.

Matthew 15:25
Then came she and worshipped him, saying, Lord, help me.

John 9:38
And he said, Lord, I believe. And he worshipped him.

God is the Father, Christ is the Word made flesh, and the Holy Spirit is both of them.

I don’t believe that. Do you?

I’m just looking for a simple yes or no answer from you, if you feel you can.

 

[theefaith]

For those who believe no explanation is necessary/ for those who do not no explanation will suffice!

My God I believe, adore, hope and love thee!
I implore pardon for those who do not!

 

[Matthias]

For those who believe no explanation is necessary/ for those who do not no explanation will suffice!

My God I believe, adore, hope and love thee!
I implore pardon for those who do not!

Thanks. I didn’t think a simple yes or no answer was likely, but I thought it possible.

The proposition I asked about in post #253 isn’t trinitarianism. It doesn’t appear to me that you were able to recognize that it isn’t.

 

[theefaith]

Ex 20:3-5
3 Thou shalt have no other gods before me.

4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.

5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the Lordthy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;

Only God may be worshipped!


Matthew 2:11
And when they were come into the house, they saw the young child with Mary his mother, and fell down, and worshipped him: and when they had opened their treasures, they presented unto him gifts; gold, and frankincense and myrrh.

Matthew 8:2
And, behold, there came a leper and worshipped him, saying, Lord, if thou wilt, thou canst make me clean.

Matthew 9:18
While he spake these things unto them, behold, there came a certain ruler, and worshipped him, saying, My daughter is even now dead: but come and lay thy hand upon her, and she shall live.

Matthew 14:33
Then they that were in the ship came and worshipped him, saying, Of a truth thou art the Son of God.

Matthew 15:25
Then came she and worshipped him, saying, Lord, help me.

John 9:38
And he said, Lord, I believe. And he worshipped him.

Matt 4:6 And saith unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down: for it is written, He shall give his angels charge concerning thee: and in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone.

7 Jesus said unto him, It is written again, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God.

8 Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them;

9 And saith unto him, All these things will I give thee, if thou wilt fall down and worship me.

10 Then saith Jesus unto him, Get thee hence, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve.

Either Jesus is God or a blasphemer and false prophet for allowing himself to be worshipped!

 

[Matthias]

Ex 20:3-5
3 Thou shalt have no other gods before me.

4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.

5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the Lordthy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;

Only God may be worshipped!


Matthew 2:11
And when they were come into the house, they saw the young child with Mary his mother, and fell down, and worshipped him: and when they had opened their treasures, they presented unto him gifts; gold, and frankincense and myrrh.

Matthew 8:2
And, behold, there came a leper and worshipped him, saying, Lord, if thou wilt, thou canst make me clean.

Matthew 9:18
While he spake these things unto them, behold, there came a certain ruler, and worshipped him, saying, My daughter is even now dead: but come and lay thy hand upon her, and she shall live.

Matthew 14:33
Then they that were in the ship came and worshipped him, saying, Of a truth thou art the Son of God.

Matthew 15:25
Then came she and worshipped him, saying, Lord, help me.

John 9:38
And he said, Lord, I believe. And he worshipped him.

Matt 4:6 And saith unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down: for it is written, He shall give his angels charge concerning thee: and in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone.

7 Jesus said unto him, It is written again, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God.

8 Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them;

9 And saith unto him, All these things will I give thee, if thou wilt fall down and worship me.

10 Then saith Jesus unto him, Get thee hence, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve.

Either Jesus is God or a blasphemer and false prophet for allowing himself to be worshipped!

Jesus isn’t a blasphemer. He is the Messiah, the Son of God.

Jesus worships his God, not the Trinity.

 

[theefaith]

God is the Father, Christ is the Word made flesh, and the Holy Spirit is both of them.

I don’t believe that. Do you?

I’m just looking for a simple yes or no answer from you, if you feel you can.

yes

 

[Matthias]

yes

Thanks. Then you either fail to see that it isn’t the trinitarianism taught by the Catholic Church or you fail to believe the trinitarianism taught by the Catholic Church.

The Shield of the Trinity prohibits it.

 

[Matthias]

The Father is the Holy Spirit - no, says trinitarianism.

The Son is the Holy Spirit - no, says trinitarianism.

The Father and the Son are both the Holy Spirit - no, says trinitarianism.