Did Jesus say that adultery is grounds for divorce? - Nope.

[pandaflower]

The position of the church and society at large is mistaken as to what Jesus was quoted as saying in the gospels. IMHO
Let's discuss.

Questions:
1) What did Jesus actually say?
2) Why did he say it?
3) If we got this wrong, where do we go from here?

The position of the church and society at large is that adultery (sexual immorality) is grounds for divorce.
And they will quote Jesus as an authority on this. But is Jesus being misquoted? Yes, I believe so.
The biggest problem is the disconnect we have with the culture that Jesus was speaking to.

The church teaches that the only grounds for divorce is adultery. (sexual immorality)
But that is not what Jesus actually said.

The basis for this teaching is found in Matthew 19:9
See the NIV translation below, taking note of verse 10 as well as verse 9. (at the very bottom of this post)
Then compare the KJV below that. Note the use of the word "fornication" which matches the NT Greek.

This makes a HUGE difference, especially when considering the cultural setting of the Israelites under the law.
Jesus was saying that the only grounds for divorce is fornication, which is sexual intercourse before marriage. (not after)
What does this mean? Both in the historical context and to the misinterpretation assigned by the church today. ???

For the Israelites, a bride's parents presented her as a virgin to her husband-to-be. The law of Moses made a provision for this.
If the husband-to-be discovered that he had been given a bride that was not a virgin, he could divorce her. (for fornication)
Unfortunately, some new husbands were making false claims in order to divorce their new brides. The fornication loophole.
Parents were allowed to challenge this claim if it was false. See Deuteronomy 22:16-18

Therefore, the KJV translation is correct and the church got it wrong.
Jesus said there is no grounds for divorce except for fornication. Now read verse 10 again.
Better not to marry? Indeed. Not if you have ANY plans to divorce.

Matthew 19:8-10 NIV
Jesus replied, “Moses permitted you to divorce your wives because your hearts were hard. But it was not this way from the beginning.
9 I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, and marries another woman commits adultery.”
10 The disciples said to him, “If this is the situation between a husband and wife, it is better not to marry.”

--- COMPARE ---

Matthew 19:8-10 KJV
He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives:
but from the beginning it was not so.
9 And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication,
and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.
10 His disciples say unto him, If the case of the man be so with his wife, it is not good to marry.

/

However, we don't expect our spouse to commit adultery when we agree to marry them.

Yes,adultery is grounds for divorce.

 

[St. SteVen]

However, we don't expect our spouse to commit adultery when we agree to marry them.

Yes,adultery is grounds for divorce.

What God has put together, let no person put asunder.

Adultery in grounds for forgiveness.

[

 

[soberxp]

The position of the church and society at large is mistaken as to what Jesus was quoted as saying in the gospels. IMHO
Let's discuss.

Questions:
1) What did Jesus actually say?
2) Why did he say it?
3) If we got this wrong, where do we go from here?

The position of the church and society at large is that adultery (sexual immorality) is grounds for divorce.
And they will quote Jesus as an authority on this. But is Jesus being misquoted? Yes, I believe so.
The biggest problem is the disconnect we have with the culture that Jesus was speaking to.

The church teaches that the only grounds for divorce is adultery. (sexual immorality)
But that is not what Jesus actually said.

The basis for this teaching is found in Matthew 19:9
See the NIV translation below, taking note of verse 10 as well as verse 9. (at the very bottom of this post)
Then compare the KJV below that. Note the use of the word "fornication" which matches the NT Greek.

This makes a HUGE difference, especially when considering the cultural setting of the Israelites under the law.
Jesus was saying that the only grounds for divorce is fornication, which is sexual intercourse before marriage. (not after)
What does this mean? Both in the historical context and to the misinterpretation assigned by the church today. ???

For the Israelites, a bride's parents presented her as a virgin to her husband-to-be. The law of Moses made a provision for this.
If the husband-to-be discovered that he had been given a bride that was not a virgin, he could divorce her. (for fornication)
Unfortunately, some new husbands were making false claims in order to divorce their new brides. The fornication loophole.
Parents were allowed to challenge this claim if it was false. See Deuteronomy 22:16-18

Therefore, the KJV translation is correct and the church got it wrong.
Jesus said there is no grounds for divorce except for fornication. Now read verse 10 again.
Better not to marry? Indeed. Not if you have ANY plans to divorce.

Matthew 19:8-10 NIV
Jesus replied, “Moses permitted you to divorce your wives because your hearts were hard. But it was not this way from the beginning.
9 I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, and marries another woman commits adultery.”
10 The disciples said to him, “If this is the situation between a husband and wife, it is better not to marry.”

--- COMPARE ---

Matthew 19:8-10 KJV
He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives:
but from the beginning it was not so.
9 And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication,
and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.
10 His disciples say unto him, If the case of the man be so with his wife, it is not good to marry.

/

It is always there another opinion.

Forgive each other, so things will become simple and light.

 

[soberxp]

What God has put together, let no person put asunder.

Adultery in grounds for forgiveness.

[

What God has put together,
It is not something as the world,
It's not that two people in the mundane world fall in love, date, get married.
It is something else.can't be separated by wealth,poor, quarrels, temptations.....etc.

 

[pandaflower]

What God has put together, let no person put asunder.

Adultery in grounds for forgiveness.

[

Not according to Jesus.

 

[Muna]

Hebrews 13:4 Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled:
but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge.

 

[pandaflower]

“You shall not commit adultery."

 

[soberxp]

“You shall not commit adultery."

Hebrews 13:4 Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled:
but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge.

Do you believe in forgiveness? Divorced people, forgive each other.

 

[shepherdsword]

The position of the church and society at large is mistaken as to what Jesus was quoted as saying in the gospels. IMHO
Let's discuss.

Questions:
1) What did Jesus actually say?
2) Why did he say it?
3) If we got this wrong, where do we go from here?

The position of the church and society at large is that adultery (sexual immorality) is grounds for divorce.
And they will quote Jesus as an authority on this. But is Jesus being misquoted? Yes, I believe so.
The biggest problem is the disconnect we have with the culture that Jesus was speaking to.

The church teaches that the only grounds for divorce is adultery. (sexual immorality)
But that is not what Jesus actually said.

The basis for this teaching is found in Matthew 19:9
See the NIV translation below, taking note of verse 10 as well as verse 9. (at the very bottom of this post)
Then compare the KJV below that. Note the use of the word "fornication" which matches the NT Greek.

At Robertson's interpretation disagrees with you:

This makes a HUGE difference, especially when considering the cultural setting of the Israelites under the law.
Jesus was saying that the only grounds for divorce is fornication, which is sexual intercourse before marriage. (not after)
What does this mean? Both in the historical context and to the misinterpretation assigned by the church today. ???

For the Israelites, a bride's parents presented her as a virgin to her husband-to-be. The law of Moses made a provision for this.
If the husband-to-be discovered that he had been given a bride that was not a virgin, he could divorce her. (for fornication)
Unfortunately, some new husbands were making false claims in order to divorce their new brides. The fornication loophole.
Parents were allowed to challenge this claim if it was false. See Deuteronomy 22:16-18

Therefore, the KJV translation is correct and the church got it wrong.
Jesus said there is no grounds for divorce except for fornication. Now read verse 10 again.
Better not to marry? Indeed. Not if you have ANY plans to divorce.

Matthew 19:8-10 NIV
Jesus replied, “Moses permitted you to divorce your wives because your hearts were hard. But it was not this way from the beginning.
9 I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, and marries another woman commits adultery.”
10 The disciples said to him, “If this is the situation between a husband and wife, it is better not to marry.”

--- COMPARE ---

Matthew 19:8-10 KJV
He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives:
but from the beginning it was not so.
9 And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication,
and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.
10 His disciples say unto him, If the case of the man be so with his wife, it is not good to marry.

/

You are ignoring a powerful exception that the Lord himself presented:

 

[Aunty Jane]

Do you believe in forgiveness? Divorced people, forgive each other.

Sometimes the hurt is so deep that there can be no forgiveness...infidelity is used in the Bible by God himself as something that can happen ‘spiritually’, when the worship of false gods was tolerated among his people. Israel did this and it angered God...he wanted a divorce, but because his promise to Abraham had to be fulfilled, (to bring Messiah into the world through Abraham’s seed) God kept taking them back until that promise was kept. The final act of treachery was in the murder of his son, sent to save them, but they rejected him and had him murdered.

Then Jehovah got a divorce, and provided a new bride for his son....spiritual Israel, who were made up of both Jewish and gentile worshipper of Jehovah through becoming disciples of his Christ. (Gal 6:16)

There is no mandate to forgive adultery.....it is the ultimate betrayal, just like Israel betrayed their God by having spiritual intercourse with other gods. The only two grounds to end a marriage with a view to remarriage is adultery (porneia with all of its definitions) or death.

 

[soberxp]

Sometimes the hurt is so deep that there can be no forgiveness...infidelity is used in the Bible by God himself as something that can happen ‘spiritually’, when the worship of false gods was tolerated among his people. Israel did this and it angered God...he wanted a divorce, but because his promise to Abraham had to be fulfilled, (to bring Messiah into the world through Abraham’s seed) God kept taking them back until that promise was kept. The final act of treachery was in the murder of his son, sent to save them, but they rejected him and had him murdered.

Then Jehovah got a divorce, and provided a new bride for his son....spiritual Israel, who were made up of both Jewish and gentile worshipper of Jehovah through becoming disciples of his Christ. (Gal 6:16)

There is no mandate to forgive adultery.....it is the ultimate betrayal, just like Israel betrayed their God by having spiritual intercourse with other gods. The only two grounds to end a marriage with a view to remarriage is adultery (porneia with all of its definitions) or death.

So even repentant people need to face judgment.
So divorced people can not repent? Only remarriage is repentance?
Super complex.

It is always there another opinion.

Forgive each other, so things will become simple and light.

 

[pandaflower]

Do you believe in forgiveness? Divorced people, forgive each other.

Well,of course they do.

 

[Muna]

Do you believe in forgiveness? Divorced people, forgive each other.

You can read Deut 24:1-4 Where Moses allowed what Jesus said was not so from the beginning where we see someone who is divorced from her husband (for whatever reason, which should not be Mark 19:8) and she leaves having received a bill of divorcement and remarrys.

So the next husband is marrying her that is now divorced, whereas Jesus said, " and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery."

But anyway, she departs and becomes this other man's wife.

As it is written here

Deut 24:3 And if the latter husband hate her, and write her a bill of divorcement, and giveth it in her hand, and sendeth her out of his house; or if the latter husband die, which took her to be his wife;

But that is followed up by this verse

Deut 24:4 Her former husband, which sent her away, may not take her again to be his wife, after that she is defiled; for that is abomination before the LORD: and thou shalt not cause the land to sin, which the LORD thy God giveth thee for an inheritance.

In the context of divorce and remarrying Jesus says this here

Matt 5:32 But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.

That would go for one that remarrys and returns to her former husband after he is dead or a divorce

Which is probably why Paul wrote,

1 Cr 7:10 And unto the married I command, yet not I, but the Lord, Let not the wife depart from her husband:

1 Cr 7:11 But and if she depart, let her ***remain unmarried,*** or be reconciled to her husband: and let not the husband put away his wife.

Even if there might be forgiveness between the two of them, I cannot find the permission to remarry in the former case. But only in 1 Cr 7:11 where she might be recconciled against to her husband there.

 

[soberxp]

You can read Deut 24:1-4 Where Moses allowed what Jesus said was not so from the beginning where we see someone who is divorced from her husband (for whatever reason, which should not be Mark 19:8) and she leaves having received a bill of divorcement and remarrys.

So the next husband is marrying her that is now divorced, whereas Jesus said, " and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery."

But anyway, she departs and becomes this other man's wife.

As it is written here

Deut 24:3 And if the latter husband hate her, and write her a bill of divorcement, and giveth it in her hand, and sendeth her out of his house; or if the latter husband die, which took her to be his wife;

But that is followed up by this verse

Deut 24:4 Her former husband, which sent her away, may not take her again to be his wife, after that she is defiled; for that is abomination before the LORD: and thou shalt not cause the land to sin, which the LORD thy God giveth thee for an inheritance.

In the context of divorce and remarrying Jesus says this here

Matt 5:32 But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.

That would go for one that remarrys and returns to her former husband after he is dead or a divorce

Which is probably why Paul wrote,

1 Cr 7:10 And unto the married I command, yet not I, but the Lord, Let not the wife depart from her husband:

1 Cr 7:11 But and if she depart, let her ***remain unmarried,*** or be reconciled to her husband: and let not the husband put away his wife.

Even if there might be forgiveness between the two of them, I cannot find the permission to remarry in the former case. But only in 1 Cr 7:11 where she might be recconciled against to her husband there.

It sounds like one falls and all falls. I remember I read this in the Bible before.but I can't find the sentence anymore.

One divorces and people divorce, for whatever reason.

Skin for skin, what a smart serpent!

 

[pandaflower]

Maybe what's not clear is the meaning of fornication.

A marriage can be ended,a divorce, if the wife commits adultery. Because it is she that could be at risk of conception in that act. And therein corrupt the blood line of her children by her husband.

There's no mention of adultery by the husband as grounds for the wife to divorce. Even though God's commandment is not gender specific.

So the exception for the wife being divorced and yet able to remarry is if she'd committed fornication with another man.

 

[Muna]

It sounds like one falls and all falls. I remember I read this in the Bible before.but I can't find the sentence anymore.

One divorces and people divorce, for whatever reason.

Skin for skin, what a smart serpent!

Same hard-heartedness it would seem

 

[Aunty Jane]

So even repentant people need to face judgment.
So divorced people can not repent? Only remarriage is repentance?
Super complex.

It is always there another opinion.

Forgive each other, so things will become simple and light.

Better to have nothing that needs forgiving in the first place....adultery or immorality is a betrayal that is made by choice....
No one commits sexual sin accidentally.....so if we are aware of the first steps, as Jesus taught, we will not commit adultery, even “in our heart”. (Matt 5:27-28) As one of the 10 Commandments states, they were not to covet their neighbor’s wife or any of his possessions, because the eyes are the things that prompt the actions. Like Eve in seeing that the forbidden fruit “looked pleasing to the eye”...that was just one step away from death.

Forgiveness doesn’t mean that you have to stay married to an adulterer. You can forgive by not letting the hurt destroy your inner peace....you are free to fill that space in your life with someone who values Christian principles.

 

[pandaflower]

It sounds like one falls and all falls. I remember I read this in the Bible before.but I can't find the sentence anymore.

One divorces and people divorce, for whatever reason.

Skin for skin, what a smart serpent!

He was. Lucifer was also once a beautiful Cherubim.
Ever wonder when God cursed the first couple he put enmity between the seed of both Eve and the serpent?

What would their seed ever have in common?
Do angels have testicles?

 

[TLHKAJ]

Do you believe in forgiveness? Divorced people, forgive each other.

Forgive each other? Absolutely! But restoration depends on both parties surrendering to God and fully committing to faithfulness, and ending their abusive behaviors.

 

[Aunty Jane]

But anyway, she departs and becomes this other man's wife.

As it is written here

Deut 24:3 And if the latter husband hate her, and write her a bill of divorcement, and giveth it in her hand, and sendeth her out of his house; or if the latter husband die, which took her to be his wife;

But that is followed up by this verse

Deut 24:4 Her former husband, which sent her away, may not take her again to be his wife, after that she is defiled; for that is abomination before the LORD: and thou shalt not cause the land to sin, which the LORD thy God giveth thee for an inheritance.

Under the Law a husband could divorce his wife for something ‘indecent’ on her part. This, of course, would not include adultery, because it carried a death penalty. (Deut 22:22)
Therefore it might be for such offenses as great disrespect for the husband or for the house of his father, or something bringing reproach upon his household. The husband was required to provide her with a written certificate of divorce, which implies that in the eyes of the community he had to have sufficient grounds on which to divorce her.
The certificate being a legal document, meant that there was the implication that it involved consultation with the older men or authorities of his city. The woman could then remarry, the certificate protecting her from any later charge of adultery. (Deut 22:13-19)

After a divorce if a woman married another man and this man later divorced her or died, the original husband could not marry her again. This worked to prevent any scheme to bring about a divorce from the second husband or perhaps even his death so the original couple might remarry.

Any man having pre-marital sex with a woman was compelled to marry her and could never divorce her all his life.....that would have made any man think twice before committing fornication....(Deut 22:23-24)

In the context of divorce and remarrying Jesus says this here

Matt 5:32 But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.

That would go for one that remarrys and returns to her former husband after he is dead or a divorce

Yes, there was the proviso that if a man divorced his wife on other grounds, whoever married an ‘unscripturally’ divorced woman would commit adultery, because she would still be scripturally married to the first husband.
Having had relations with another man would defile her, and taking her again as a wife would defile him.

God’s laws on marriage and divorce were very strict. Many Christians in our day have lost sight of the seriousness and sanctity of marriage, and have turned it into a pretentious sham. Like all things acquired selfishly, when it’s no longer of any use......you just throw it away and get a new one.