Do Men Have Authority Over Women?

[Bob Estey]

Did it say church building? No. You added that in and are completely oblivious to the cultural/historical context of the passage.

Here again are Paul's words:

[33] For God is not a God of confusion but of peace. As in all the churches of the saints,
[34] the women should keep silence in the churches. For they are not permitted to speak, but should be subordinate, as even the law says.
[35] If there is anything they desire to know, let them ask their husbands at home. For it is shameful for a woman to speak in church. ! Corinthians 14:33-35 RSV

 

[Bob Estey]

No, I have spoken truth. There is a difference. If you were insulted, that's because you do not like the light of the truth.

Note how I am able to disagree with you while treating you with respect.

 

[reformed1689]

I don't think so. The Bible has all kinds of valuable stuff, but I think the Word of God are just those instances God and Jesus are quoted.

Heresy

 

[reformed1689]

Here again are Paul's words:

[33] For God is not a God of confusion but of peace. As in all the churches of the saints,
[34] the women should keep silence in the churches. For they are not permitted to speak, but should be subordinate, as even the law says.
[35] If there is anything they desire to know, let them ask their husbands at home. For it is shameful for a woman to speak in church. ! Corinthians 14:33-35 RSV

I know what Paul said. I also know it was written in the 1st Century and their context not in 2022. You ignore that.

 

[reformed1689]

Note how I am able to disagree with you while treating you with respect.

I have not treated you with disrespect. If I was disrespecting you, you would know it.

Did Jesus disrespect people when he called them a brood of vipers?

 

[amadeus]

well, its a Book about the spiritual realm, huh? And i dont know why, but for whatever reason it started with the Esau/Jacob thing for me, with Jacob “inheriting,” but Esau getting all the material stuff, and Jacob being the one who had to leave? It kinda forced a perspective change in me

you might try yourself as Adam and Eve, fwiw (divided, and the two shall become one)
of course im not “married” (little joke there) to any of these, even seek passages that reject them as analogies, but when i cant find any after a while…

A little joke that is no joke when it comes down to it... but who understands that?
Who is God's wife?
Who is the wife/bride of Christ?
Who that is dead would like to Live?
How many dead, do not know that they are dead?

I am only asking questions.
Who knows all of the answers?
Many, it seems, do not even know what the questions are!

 

[Lifelong_sinner]

Heresy

yes!!!!! This^^^^^

 

[Lifelong_sinner]

God is never wrong, but I think occasionally Paul was wrong.

keyword is “occasionally” as in not just once, but often. Who else do you disagree with? Peter? John? James?

 

[Bob Estey]

Heresy

The Lord led me to repent of sin I was committing, and I have found peace. I think few find, in this lifetime, what I have found. When I try to explain it to them, they, "Impossible!"

 

[Bob Estey]

I know what Paul said. I also know it was written in the 1st Century and their context not in 2022. You ignore that.

You know what Paul said, but instead of accepting it, you "interpret" it to fit your theology, don't you?

 

[bbyrd009]

God is never wrong, but I think occasionally Paul was wrong.

He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters. His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction,

i know this might sound a bit absolutist, but i suggest that Paul’s writings may have been intensely…by corroboration, many, many hours spent getting the wording just so, likely in company of many rabbis, and meant to be deceiving, to the deceived. The alt seems to be that--as you say—the Bible is wrong?

 

[Bob Estey]

I have not treated you with disrespect. If I was disrespecting you, you would know it.

Did Jesus disrespect people when he called them a brood of vipers?

You've insulted me several times.

 

[Bob Estey]

keyword is “occasionally” as in not just once, but often. Who else do you disagree with? Peter? John? James?

I think Paul and Peter both maintained men should have authority over women - I disagree with that. Paul says the one commandment is to love your neighbor as yourself, while Jesus said the great and first commandment is to love the Lord with all you heart, mind, and soul.

 

[Bob Estey]

He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters. His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction,

i know this might sound a bit absolutist, but i suggest that Paul’s writings may have been intensely…by corroboration, many, many hours spent getting the wording just so, likely in company of many rabbis, and meant to be deceiving, to the deceived. The alt seems to be that--as you say—the Bible is wrong?

It isn't that the Bible is wrong. The men who decided on the Bible's canon included letters by Paul. Paul had great wisdom and we can learn a lot from him. I think it is a mistake, though, to think Paul was perfect.

 

[Michiah-Imla]

I think it is a mistake, though, to think Paul was perfect

“no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.” (2 Peter 1:20-21)

While they were inspired in writing God’s word they were perfect!

 

[bbyrd009]

It isn't that the Bible is wrong. The men who decided on the Bible's canon included letters by Paul. Paul had great wisdom and we can learn a lot from him. I think it is a mistake, though, to think Paul was perfect.

well, fwiw i would seize upon his apparent contradictions as being deliberate keys to understanding him, although admittedly it takes a while. I suspect Paul’s letters are by committee, as i said, and also some of the highest form of literary art. The man is endlessly quoted as saying “to be absent from the body is to be present with the lord” when he never said that, Bob, i mean how strong is that? He unobscurely reworded “eating the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil” and meat-eaters boldly apply it to themselves, with pride. HA! keep an open mind @ Paul imo Bob

 

[Bob Estey]

well, fwiw i would seize upon his apparent contradictions as being deliberate keys to understanding him, although admittedly it takes a while. I suspect Paul’s letters are by committee, as i said, and also some of the highest form of literary art. The man is endlessly quoted as saying “to be absent from the body is to be present with the lord” when he never said that, Bob, i mean how strong is that? He unobscurely reworded “eating the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil” and meat-eaters boldly apply it to themselves, with pride. HA! keep an open mind @ Paul imo Bob

I would think Paul's letters are authentic letters written by Paul.

 

[Bob Estey]

well, fwiw i would seize upon his apparent contradictions as being deliberate keys to understanding him, although admittedly it takes a while. I suspect Paul’s letters are by committee, as i said, and also some of the highest form of literary art. The man is endlessly quoted as saying “to be absent from the body is to be present with the lord” when he never said that, Bob, i mean how strong is that? He unobscurely reworded “eating the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil” and meat-eaters boldly apply it to themselves, with pride. HA! keep an open mind @ Paul imo Bob

I would think Paul's letters are authentic letters written by Paul.

Paul's letters say they are from Paul. If they are not from Paul, then the Bible is lying, and I know the Bible doesn't lie.

 

[reformed1689]

You've insulted me several times.

Truth hurts.

 

[reformed1689]

You know what Paul said, but instead of accepting it, you "interpret" it to fit your theology, don't you?

No, I interpret it in the light of its original audience. You are the crazy one here that thinks women cannot even speak in a building due to what Paul wrote. Nonsense.

 

[reformed1689]

The Lord led me to repent of sin I was committing, and I have found peace. I think few find, in this lifetime, what I have found. When I try to explain it to them, they, "Impossible!"

That still does not change the fact that you actively hold to heresy.