Do you believe that ALL babies that die go to Heaven or only "the elect"?

[Truther]

Conjecture. Go figure.

If you cannot tell someone how to scripturally be saved. You are likely not saved.

 

[ScottA]

Nope it’s sin that keeps on out period. Otherwise you must condemn every mentally handicapped person to hell because the have a pagan sin nature invented by augustine. And all the aborted babies have as well since they have a sin nature but never sinned. That god is a monster created by augustine and revived during the reformation.

As for the mentally handicapped, aborted babies, and the like..

As I said, the idea that they have a pass and can inherit the kingdom of God only being born of the flesh such as they are, is simply a misunderstanding. In God's reality, all who are born of the flesh are indeed condemned to die--BUT. But, do not continue to misunderstand: This does not mean eternal condemnation--but is rather by the mercy of God, an invitation to the judgement according to that same mercy under which they were first born, with His good intention of seeing them through--such as they are...to salvation and heaven by His judgement.

Biblically, that is called "election." It is not a curse, but a blessing.

 

[ChristisGod]

As for the mentally handicapped, aborted babies, and the like..

As I said, the idea that they have a pass and can inherit the kingdom of God only being born of the flesh such as they are, is simply a misunderstanding. In God's reality, all who are born of the flesh are indeed condemned to die--BUT. But, do not continue to misunderstand: This does not mean eternal condemnation--but is rather by the mercy of God, an invitation to the judgement according to that same mercy under which they were first born, with His good intention of seeing them through--such as they are...to salvation and heaven by His judgement.

Biblically, that is called "election." It is not a curse, but a blessing.

So you believe God elects/predestines others to damnation ?

 

[Truther]

As for the mentally handicapped, aborted babies, and the like..

As I said, the idea that they have a pass and can inherit the kingdom of God only being born of the flesh such as they are, is simply a misunderstanding. In God's reality, all who are born of the flesh are indeed condemned to die--BUT. But, do not continue to misunderstand: This does not mean eternal condemnation--but is rather by the mercy of God, an invitation to the judgement according to that same mercy under which they were first born, with His good intention of seeing them through--such as they are...to salvation and heaven by His judgement.

Biblically, that is called "election." It is not a curse, but a blessing.

The "kingdom of God" is not the "kingdom of heaven".

 

[ScottA]

That was you spin on the passage not what the passage means as its talking about the resurrection body that will be changed from mortal to immortal, perishable to imperishable. We need new bodies for eternity not ones that die.

No, the spin is that you assumed that not all who are born of the flesh cannot inherit the kingdom of God, by making your own heartfelt exception against what the scriptures actually say.

 

[ScottA]

So you believe God elects/predestines others to damnation ?

No, and apparently you have a comprehension problem. I said nothing of the sort.

 

[ScottA]

The "kingdom of God" is not the "kingdom of heaven".

Quotable (for the record) but wrong.

 

[ChristisGod]

No, and apparently you have a comprehension problem. I said nothing of the sort.

you mentioned election not me those were your words not mine.

 

[ChristisGod]

The "kingdom of God" is not the "kingdom of heaven".

the kingdom of God and heaven are synonymous.

Matthew 19:23-26
23 And Jesus said to His disciples, “Truly I say to you, it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven.24 Again I say to you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.”25 When the disciples heard this, they were very astonished and said, “Then who can be saved?”26 And looking at them Jesus said to them, “With people this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.”

 

[JunChosen]

Those who believe like me? (bigotry?)

If God ONLY redeemed "the sins of all those He elected", then he ALSO predestined everyone else to destruction, right?

You will never find language in the Bible that God "predestines people for destruction!" I just knew your theology was suspect.

Yes, I believe I am part of "the Elect", those who find Christ in this lifetime.
I can't undo that by disagreeing with you. Not by doing anything actually.
We cannot undo what only God could do in the first place. IMHO

Like I said, your salvation is suspect because salvation is a free gift.

That saw cuts both ways.
Did you know that God has the best interests in mind for ALL of humankind?

No I didn't know. Is that why we read in Scripture about "hell," "Lake of fire," "their worm die not?" Another example of your word "ALL" as per 1 Corinthians 15:22? You never did "get it" about 1 Corinthians 15:22 have you? Perhaps if you ask I'll be glad to expound the verse for you.

Let's talk definitions.
Mercy is when we don't get the bad thing we deserve.
Compassion is when we get the good thing we didn't deserve.
They are both positive actions,

What does Romans 9:15-16 have to do with your comment above?

 

[Truther]

Quotable (for the record) but wrong.

If the kingdom of God is only for the born again per John 3, then what about Abraham?

He cannot see it, correct?

 

[Truther]

the kingdom of God and heaven are synonymous.

Matthew 19:23-26
23 And Jesus said to His disciples, “Truly I say to you, it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven.24 Again I say to you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.”25 When the disciples heard this, they were very astonished and said, “Then who can be saved?”26 And looking at them Jesus said to them, “With people this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.”

Hint, to get to the kingdom of heaven one must qualify for the kingdom of God....


21 Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

 

[ScottA]

you mentioned election not me those were your words not mine.

That's not the problem.

 

[St. SteVen]

You will never find language in the Bible that God "predestines people for destruction!" I just knew your theology was suspect.

Language in the Bible? - LOL
If you believe that the Elect are predestined for life, you also believe that everyone else is predestined for destruction.
Unless you have a workaround for that?

 

[St. SteVen]

Like I said, your salvation is suspect because salvation is a free gift.

PARODY

Person #1: I have a free gift for you.
Person #2: No thanks.
Person #1: I said it was free.
Person #2: There must be some strings attached.
Person #1: Well, of course.
Person #2: I'm not interested.
Person #1: You better take it, or else.
Person #2: Say what?
Person #1: There are consequences for not receiving the free gift.
Person #2: Like what?
Person #1: You will be incinerated.
Person #2: What sort of free gift is that?

Indeed.

Is the "free gift" of salvation really free? - Honestly?

This is the evangelical bait-and-switch. Where's the ethics in that? Should people be tricked into the kingdom? Do we lead someone to Christ and then cut them loose? Nope. They need to be discipled, right? So we pile on the expectations. - Daily Bible reading and prayer. - Regular church...

www.christianityboard.com

 

[ScottA]

If the kingdom of God is only for the born again per John 3, then what about Abraham?

He cannot see it, correct?

That is not and accurate description of the circumstances.

To the contrary, all in Christ (including the dead of Israel, "the dead in Christ") "were" crucified and raised up with Christ; and if you can receive it, just as He was [actually] slain before the foundation of the world, the same is true of all who are ever "in Christ" ("the dead and the living") and our ascension into the presence of God the Father.

So, yes, Abraham having been crucified and raised up with Christ--as we too who "are alive and remain" "were", also first received new birth when "in Him" the dead also received the Holy Spirit who remained upon Christ. Thus, Jesus told the disciples of Israel, "You have been washed clean."

 

[St. SteVen]

St. SteVen said:

Let's talk definitions.
Mercy is when we don't get the bad thing we deserve.
Compassion is when we get the good thing we didn't deserve.
They are both positive actions,

What does Romans 9:15-16 have to do with your comment above?

None as blind... _________________________ (fill in the blank)

 

[Truther]

That is not and accurate description of the circumstances.

To the contrary, all in Christ (including the dead of Israel, "the dead in Christ") "were" crucified and raised up with Christ; and if you can receive it, just as He was [actually] slain before the foundation of the world, the same is true of all who are ever "in Christ" ("the dead and the living") and our ascension into the presence of God the Father.

So, yes, Abraham having been crucified and raised up with Christ--as we too who "are alive and remain" "were", also first received new birth when "in Him" the dead also received the Holy Spirit who remained upon Christ. Thus, Jesus told the disciples of Israel, "You have been washed clean."

You squeezed Abraham into this?...


3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

Being born again is the exception, right?

 

[JunChosen]

tell me how a 3 month old infant can sin

I'll give my answer scripturally, so you know it's coming from God.

The heart is deceitful above all things and desperately wicked; who can know it? (This includes babies) Jeremiah 17:9.

As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one. (including babies).
Roman 3:10.

3 The wicked are estranged from the womb: they go astray as soon as they be born, speaking lies.
4 Their poison [is] like the poison of a serpent: [they are] like the deaf adder [that] stoppeth her ear;
5 Which will not hearken to the voice of charmers, charming never so wisely.
6 Break their teeth, O God, in their mouth: break out the great teeth of the young lions, O LORD.
7 Let them melt away as waters [which] run continually: [when] he bendeth [his bow to shoot] his arrows, let them be as cut in pieces.
8 As a snail [which] melteth, let [every one of them] pass away: [like] the untimely birth of a woman, [that] they may not see the sun. Psalms 58:3-8

To God Be The Glory

 

[JunChosen]

St. SteVen said:

Let's talk definitions.
Mercy is when we don't get the bad thing we deserve.
Compassion is when we get the good thing we didn't deserve.
They are both positive actions,

None as blind... _________________________ (fill in the blank)

Are we now playing T.V. games?